• 2

    posted a message on The Piston-Launch Petition
    Quote from fluid781

    Since you're not listening to us, here it is

    Its not in the spirit because they ****ing said so.

    Which is incredibly out of touch and lame reasoning. "Because I said so" is never and has never been a legitimate argument. In fact it is often used by people that don't really have a valid reason (or are unable to articulate it) for what they are doing. They want the game to be less then it can be because they want it that way.

    Minecraft has taken on a life of its own, the inclusion of the community during development has created a unique situation that allows the game to grow in a way that no other has, despite this the devs behind the game seem completely resistant to this growth.

    They are not obligated in any way to do anything other then what they want, just as any other game development studio. But it would be such a shame for something with as much potential as Minecraft has to never fulfill it simply because they wanted to make a traditional adventure/rpg with traditional elements while turning it's far more interesting aspects into essentially a gimmick.
    Posted in: Redstone Discussion and Mechanisms
  • 1

    posted a message on Why Mojang is going ad infernum.
    Quote from fluid781

    (I omitted the top part of this quote because it was valid and I kinda agree, but this bit is where I have to step in)

    So, by jeb adding pistons, and Me defending him in doing such, I'm "pigeon-holing it into an existing, far less interesting, genre to realize this"?

    I can only assume that the people arguing that it would somehow destroy or is not int he spirt of the game must view the game as a stereotypical hack-n-slash adventure game. There is no logical argument you can make against virtually any type of content being added to a game in which you can as soon as you log in create anything from an entire modern city-scape to computer components to spacecraft to nightclubs and enormous mob farming mechanisms.

    Assuming you use no mods, your only limit on what you can create is your own imagination and the speed at which you gather materials.

    Minecraft is the very essence of an emergent sandbox game. It has no inherent time-period, setting or theme, because you can radically alter the landscape of the world and turn it into literally anything. While it does start out with the trappings of a fantasy game with undead mobs and swords, you can immediately dispel that flimsy setting by building yourself a modern or even futuristic home.

    I suppose I just don't understand why they don't develop Minecraft as a sandbox a la little big planet. It practicaly begs for such a development path, and I think it's potential if it were to go that direction is remarkable. But instead everything I read from the Devs make it seem as though they just want it to be yet another RPG.
    Posted in: Discussion
  • 1

    posted a message on Why Mojang is going ad infernum.
    Quote from Rickkity-T

    ...What? Are you kidding me? You're joking, right? Did you forget the fact that they actually included the mod in the game? How could you say they don't listen to us when they literally took the mod and copied the code and put it in the game? That's the most a developer has ever done for their fanbase, as far as I know. You honestly cannot say they don't listen when they obviously do.

    Maybe so, but they clearly have never heard the expression "If it's not broken don't fix it". If all they had done was copy paste it into their game these threads wouldn't exist. The problem is they decided to change its rudimentary functionality in a completely arbitrary way.

    People wanted Pistons because they allow tons of fun and awesome things to be built, and they wanted the advantages that Pistons no longer being a mod would bring. Instead, the majority of people who wanted this mod added are still going to have to use the original mod because whats being added isn't nearly as useful.


    From the first day we said we were interested in incorporating the piston mod in the official game, we explained that we would modify it to fit better in the game world. If you look at other features in Minecraft, it doesn't seem right that you would add a block that gives you close-to-flying abilities.

    In general, it's better to tone down features when they are first released, and add new functionality later on. Doing it the other way can be a mess, just look at water ladders and the minecart booster glitch. Don't misunderstand me though, we have currently no plans to re-introduce the launchpad effect of the pistons.

    I may sound "snobby," and for that I am sorry, but the launchpad effect has been suggested to us, we have tested it, discussed it and made a decision.

    What was the point in adding it at all then. As I said earlier, completely out of touch. :rolleyes:
    Posted in: Discussion
  • 1

    posted a message on Why Mojang is going ad infernum.
    Quote from KSMF

    Not at all, he wrote "Launch pads are NOT in the spirit of Minecraft" nothing vague about that, and I have to agree with him.

    If you want the old feature, use the mod.

    What "spirit" is that though? Minecraft is not a typical game. It has no typical genre. It's a game in which, using no mods at all, you can build a small medieval castle or make a 1:1 replica of the USS Enterprise. You can build the World Trade Center, a scale model replica of New York City itself or a 1:1 reproduction of the Lord of the Rings city of Minas Tirith. You can build a 5x5 wooden shed, or reproduce the basic functioning components of a CPU in game using redstone.

    Mods make all of these easier, but they can all be built in the basic game. So again, I ask you what exactly is this "Spirit" that physics enabled pistons would totally destroy, what portion of a game that allows you to simultaneously build mythological castles or enormous spacecraft does this violate?

    Minecraft is becoming a victim of it's own success I think, it single handedly helped invent a new genre. But it's own developers and many so called "fans" are to busy trying to pigeon-hole it into an existing, far less interesting, genre to realize this.
    Posted in: Discussion
  • 2

    posted a message on should there be balls in minecraft?
    Quote from MineCrak

    Yeah, kinda funny how people seem to forget all of that...

    btw: I want smooth pyramids in my world!

    Look up the Kaevator Super Slopes mod. It introduces all kinds of different angled and sloped blocks.
    Posted in: Discussion
  • 1

    posted a message on Of Mods, Minecraft, and Notch
    Quote from GearMarkerStats

    How dare you take what he said and twist it like all the other idiots with the actual content argument. I mean really!

    There's no reasonable argument against increasing content in the game. Just because you personally may not like that content does not mean that a game in Beta should freeze development and cease adding new features. Many of the things added by these mods are not only reasonable, but things that the basic game should honestly have had by now to begin with. Mods exist to fill gaps in the games features that people desire, many of these are fine staying mods. But some of these features, such as having more then 10 or so animals/monsters in a world that can be 1/8th the size of the earth, should have been included in the core game long ago.

    A lot of people seem blow some internal gasket whenever someone suggests incorporating mods like Mo Creatures ( why I have no idea). What I think they don't bother considering before they pop off at the mouth is that just because a mod is incorporated doesn't mean what gets added is identical in every way. Mo creatures for instance has many mobs that don't make much sense, but it also adds just as many basic animals to the game.

    The Minecraft world is very empty, nearly barren of any life. We have had the same set of mobs since Alpha started. The only new additions were wolves (something just as many people seem to get upset over for no apparent reason) and squid. I can only assume that this is due to some innate fear of change, as there is no reasonable logical argument that can be made against adding say - birds, or boars, polar bears or fish in the sea.

    The same is applied to something like vertical redstone which does nothing but help reduce the restrictions on one of Minecrafts most dynamic features. Fancypack adds much needed Furniture to help decorate the countless empty rooms we have (or replace the need to create fake chairs/couches out of stairs with signs on the side).

    Minecraft is the quintessential modders game, it's almost as if it were built to be modded. Modders have done a lot to promote this games success, imo they have added more interesting content in the last couple months then Notch has since Beta started. Yet despite this, there is some very perplexing and irrational vehemence towards mods.
    Posted in: Suggestions
  • 4

    posted a message on Pirated Minecraft
    Quote from Kyle Crafty

    You assume I'm over privileged. I admit I am more privileged than some. I am VERY aware of the budget problems many people face today. The only work I can get is every thursday, for four hours, I am a busboy at a Mexican Food resturaunt, I know at a very personal level how hard it is to get work. Currently I am forced to live with my single mother and two sisters, each month we are behind anywhere from 100 to 200 in bills. Most of the money I make goes to my mother, I save about 10% for myself to relieve stress as you stated. And your "food budget" thing can easily be fixed with food stamps, it's amazing how many people have food stamps and make more than the "$20 food budget" families.

    What I'm getting at is, I too have an extremely hard financial life, but at least I was able to pay for a game instead of deprive the creator. Yes it "increases the audience" but think about this, 100 people NOT buying the game is $2,000 lost, and I guarantee you more than 10,000 people have pirated the game, $200,000 right there, which could be spent on improving the offices etc and hiring a whole slew of coders. I can even go as far to say that over 100,000 people have pirated the game, $2,000,000 lost and I'd bet my life that more than that have pirated minecraft.

    As I said, some Pirates will eventually buy legit. However most Pirates won't, and they never would have bought it to begin with. There is no lost profit there, because no purchase was ever going to be made. This line of reasoning has been used by Notch himself in interviews about Piracy, he doesn't believe that people Pirating MC has had any effect at all on the game or his company because he doesn't consider those so called "lost sales" as ever existing. Ont he reverse however, the Pirates that due end up buying - the try-it-before-I-buy-it group if you will - may only have bought the game because of Piracy.

    This phenomenon is best represented by a relatively recent New York Times best seller list "children's" book entitled "Go the **** to Sleep" (kid you not, it's a tongue in cheek "children's book for adults" written by an exasperated father). It topped the NYT best seller list a month before it was on bookshelves because a PDF version of the book was leaked and Pirated. The author himself has acknowledged that the almost viral success of the book was directly related to the accidental PDF leaking. Add to this story the number of "Torrent-only" movies and webshows, even an indy band achieved viral status after offering ads for it's free bit-torrent debut album on torrent hosting sites and clients.

    The music, movie and game industries are all clinging desperately to old business models and treating the rise of Bit-Torrent "piracy" as their Arch-nemesis. The result is lawsuits against innocent people based on flimsy circumstantial evidence, ISP companies imposing brash restrictions on Bit-Torrent traffick of all kinds (even legit traffic), Anti-piracey Startups using border-line illegal methods to obtain personal data from search engines. And cripplingly intrusive DRM mechanics in software (prime example, certain EA titles requiring an internet connection to work, and disc based software only allowing installation a few times).

    P2P is the future and some companies are starting to realize this, mostly it's the indy companies or startups that are latching on to these ideas for wide spread self promotion. Minecraft itself could be considered a good example of this, we have a game that is very very simple to Pirate due to it consisting of only a few key files alone with no DRM. The game is not even released yet and is already a multi-million dollar success. Even if Notch is wrong and Piracy has hurt his sales (an idea which I don't personally hold to) it clearly hasn't hurt it very much.

    To bring this back to where it started, while I watched my friend suffer through those months of complete uncertainty about whether or not they'd even have a home by the next week, I can say that I was all for the brief gaps of enjoyment garnered through Bit-torrent. Life can be miserable enough as it is without falsely condemning another person for not contributing to some CEO's solid gold Humvee fund.
    Posted in: Discussion
  • 3

    posted a message on Pirated Minecraft
    Quote from Kyle Crafty

    Ok for crying out loud, I'm sick of these people who haven't purchased the game but instead pirated a $20 game, 20 bucks isn't that much, if you don't have money, ask your mom for a couple bucks here and there and then finally say "Yo mom! I have 20 bucks get me this game!"

    Or even worse, the people who DO have jobs but don't want to dedicate 3 hours of a single shift to purchase minecraft.

    This needs to be dealt with, I KNOW that pirated jars get a message saying that it hasn't be downloaded, which means that the ABILITY to be stopped is out there. I know that there is no STOPPING pirating, but at least make it harder!

    I mean come on guys, how hard is it to raise 20 bucks, I work 4 hours a week as a busboy and can get this in a single days work. I actually bought it when it was 10 bucks back in creative mod, and I didn't have a job then, just change I would find lyin around and selling old unused video games.

    For some people, 20 bucks is a months food budget. And I'm not talking about homless bums, I'm talking about college students and fresh grads - people who ride the red line because they actually have bills to pay and loans to deal with. Not to mention the number of people who have been laid off for months due to the economy. It's easy to feel holier then thou toward pirates when you've always been over-privileged or simply lucky enough to actually have a job.

    When dad and mom pay for your meals it's very easy to think of 20 bucks as chump change but I hate to burst your bubble - that's not how the real world works. One of my very best friends, who graduated with an advanced degree in technology now has a six figure salary but while they were in school and even for months afterward they were living with only pennies in the bank due to bills and student loans.

    If Pirating a game can bring a little joy into a life of stress and worrying about how you're going to make rent, I support it.

    Also, Notch is a Pirate. He's a member of the Pirate party and has been an out spoken advocate of free p2p media for a long time.

    Do I think it's unseemly to pirate an indy game (setting aside the fact that MC isn't really indy anymore)? Yes.
    Do I condemn those who did? No, not at all. Some will eventually buy it legit, others who don't never would of bought it anyway so it's not a loss to Mojang - if anything it increases their audience.

    Free P2P exchange of ideas and media is the future. I don't necessarily condone all Piracy, but I damn well encourage it.
    Posted in: Discussion
  • 1

    posted a message on Desired mods not working with 1.6, where to re-download 1.5??
    Quote from BC_Programming

    No, I mean mods like Mo' Creatures that add pointless mobs that have only somewhat sensible drops, have only mediocre model design and textures probably stolen by cutting a little bit of of an image from google images. How the **** is a werewolf something that fits with the others? Was the person designing it on ****ing crack? "OH hey, we have bears, and we have birds... and **** IT LET'S ADD WEREWOLVES" What's ****ing next? Vampires? We already have ****ing ogres. Why don't they just call it "random mob pack"? And this is ignoring the fact that the only time I've ever had Minecraft crash is from that mod, so that sort of calls into question whether they are better suited being java instructors rather than actually working in java to any degree.

    As for More creeps and weirdos. That's just ****ing stupid. May as well call it the ****ing Dr.Suess pack of crazy nonsense ****.

    As for the "better wood" pack- realistically it makes no sense. Wood from poplar trees isn't white, it's wood. Wood from birch trees isn't dark, it's ****ing WOOD. it's all the same god damned colour. I mean, sure, if he had specific tree types like cherry or mahogany, but right now their colours would be so close that having a mod called "better wood" that basically makes the woods less realistic for the purpose of allowing you to use different colours is misleading. It ought to be called "pointlessly recolored planks and other wooden materials" because anybody whose ever actually gone outside and SEEN these trees and cut them down or seen them cut down knows they are the same god damn colour inside. Pine trees aren't dark brown inside- except maybe specific varieties, but now we're entering into the domain of a mod that doesn't actually make the wood better it just makes it less generic. Possibly good, certainly some appeal, but there is absolutely no reason to assert that all of these features should be in the vanilla game. If I was going to install a mod that tried to make things "better" in that fashion (coloured stairs, planks, and whatnot) I would personally go for something using dyes as a stain. Did I mention that almost all wood looks nearly the same colour before you apply stain? I mean, sure, that mahogany desk is a different colour from your balsa wood skull, but that mahogany desk is still a hell of a lot different in colour from mahogany straight from a tree. Stains make more sense because that's the way the wood for the various items that are recolored by the mod are colored in real life.

    Again, I really don't care that people use these mods. Good for them. but when people start saying "OMFG this **** should be in the vanilla game" they really ought to learn to take off their rose-tinted glasses and actually look at the mod objectively. Personally I prefer minecraft not crashing every 20 minutes, but apparently others using Mo' Creatures disagree (or probably have better luck with the mod for no reason, just as I for some reason have better luck with Vanilla MC not crashing).

    To each their own, my only response to your fairly bizarre hostility towards these mods is enjoy the swarms of hundreds of brain dead sheep and cows that make up the "variety" in vanillas world :rolleyes:. I'll just be over here breeding horses for fast traveling along my roads, finishing my shark/dolphin aquarium and adding more tamed birds to my (rather lovely) aviary/garden that I built using more then one ubiquitous color of wood among other materials.
    Posted in: Discussion
  • 1

    posted a message on Desired mods not working with 1.6, where to re-download 1.5??
    Quote from BC_Programming

    The answer is because those mods are terrible. And even conceding that, not everybody wants what they offer. And no, making them an "option" isn't a good idea either. That's a terrible justification for either adding or removing a feature.

    You mean the mods that have added more to the game since they came out then Notch has since the nether update? Yeah, truly terrible, how dare they add more then 8 monsters to the game. Or fix blocks to work as they should have all along.. :rolleyes:
    Posted in: Discussion
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