• 0

    posted a message on Blockology - The study of the world of Minecraft
    Quote from PisuCat»

    Well at the moment we really have no basis for the existence of separate "id" and "other" (for lack of a better term) numbers. Until it becomes important to actually distinguish the two, I think we should just refer to them as a single "Type". That crossed my mind as well. Perhaps what I've been calling "data" is actually a non integer value, so while white wool might have a type 17, blue might be 17.1.

    Now for some more ideas:
    Some basic properties for blocks that I propose are:
    The Sufflocube - A thin cubic surface within the block's grid location where Sufflamism occurs, and prevents entities from entering.
    The Agocube - An area within the block's grid location where when an entity enters, it reacts. What do you mean by "reacts"? Like pressure plates?
    The Pellocube - An area within the block's grid location that reacts to a player breaking or using it.
    The Oculocube - The appearance of a block.
    The Evasocube - An area within the block's grid location that entities will evade from when they enter. Evade? Evasitism comes from the latin root to evict.

    On simple blocks, the Sufflocube, Pellocube and Oculocube may be identical, and the Agocube may also be identical. The Evasocube is typically slightly smaller than the Sufflocube. Not necessarily true. I don't see any reason why Evasitism can't reach to the surface of a block. In that case you would just have Sufflamism and Evasitism both acting on the entity. Some of these properties may be "null" or empty. Torches have a null Sufflocube, Agocube, and Evasocube, for example.

    Entities also have properties of their own, the ones I propose are:
    X, Y and Z - Three coordinates that locate the entity. Blocks do not need this as the locations are represented as grid locations.
    X motion, Y motion and Z motion - Three values that contain an entities current velocity. These may not exist.
    The Cessocube - A cube that interacts with the Sufflocube of blocks. Wouldn't this be identical to the Evictocube? And the Pellocube for that matter? I don't think we need to differenciate them.
    The Pellocube - The part of an entity that reacts to a player breaking or using it.
    The Oculocube - The appearance of the entity.
    The Evictocube - A cube that defines the edge of that entities Evictism.

    Also, to help distinguish between block Evasitism and entity Evasitism, I decided to rename entity Evasitism "Evictism" (I think that entities evict other entities from their Evictocubes, rather than entities evading other entities' Evictocubes, but block Evasitism seems more like entities evading the Evasocube of a block. I agree that entities and blocks "evasitism" works slightly differently. For now, until we can reconcile those differences, I agree that they should be seperated. But come on! You broke the latin naming scheme! For shame! Jk. On a more serious note though, since both evasitim and evictism both basically mean a property that evicts, can I suggest changing evictism Trudism (coming from Latin "trudo" meaning "to push out, to shove")?

    Also, blocks and entities may contain additional properties. Some I thought of:
    Collectio - The inventory of a block or entity (most notably players, chests, minecarts with chests, horses). Due to the potentially large amount of information needed for these, these may not be stored in the grid in the case of blocks. I suppose they're called "block entities" for a reason.

    Also, I kind of made a mistake by calling the block updates "signals", as it is very likely not the only type of signal there is. So, they are now called "Update signals"
    Posted in: Discussion
  • 0

    posted a message on Blockology - The study of the world of Minecraft
    Quote from Emerald_God»

    I want to analyze this closely, So I have my answers in bold.

    Overall a good idea, and explains stuff pretty well. How is it called?

    I'll just answer your questions in order:

    I'm not really sure how to answer this question. If we accept Notch Grid Theory, then it kind of upends a lot of things, including pondity to a degree. The grid I'm talking about is based off of grids we've talked about before, but its kind of a different idea than the others.

    Thanks for the correction there. Metadata or just data can replace the term damage. I'm not sure I understand what you're talking about with the logs. I like the term "claim", as it pretty intuitively describes what is happening. Basically, at each position where a block can exist, there is an ID:data value, so two blocks can't exist in the same space because blocks are simply a feature of the grid, not separate objects. This is actually pretty convenient, because the term "entity" (basically anything that's not a block) means a thing with a distinct and independent existence. I think the devs were in line with our thinking.

    F3+H... yeah, didn't think about that. Things get a bit sticky here, because if we accept F3+H, then we have to accept all other debug tools, as well as chat, which has already come under scrutiny. My idea here was that the ID's that exist in the game code don't necessarily need to be the same as the ones we come up with. Because of this, I suggest we disambiguate the two by renaming our "Id's" to "Types" and "data" to... "sub-type"? I have no idea, does anyone have better ideas for names?

    The adding things up was just to clarify what I was talking about, not to actually suggest that adding works. Although, it might if we uses the type system.

    Because Tritron theory was a theory to describe the behavior of blocks, which Notch Grid Theory also tries to do.

    Notch Grid Theory for now. "Notch" referring to the "Notch length", "Grid" referring to... well, I bet you can't guess that one.
    Posted in: Discussion
  • 0

    posted a message on Blockology - The study of the world of Minecraft
    Quote from PisuCat»

    A different test that maps between time and distance produced these results:


    0 0

    1 0.0784
    2 0.233652
    3 0.46415937
    4 0.7684762025

    Again, it's in ticks and blocks


    On the second one, which column is which?
    Posted in: Discussion
  • 0

    posted a message on Blockology - The study of the world of Minecraft
    Quote from 7101334»

    Biomes are listed as having certain temperatures, and if we assume Minecraft cactus grows under similar conditions as real cactus (not a huge leap, imo, or they would've named it something besides "cactus"), then those temperatures would need an atmosphere to exist in. Also, rain and water suggest an atmosphere, since it doesn't all evaporate into space.

    Then again, water doesn't evaporate even if it's in a metal cauldron in the desert sun, so who knows?

    I'll have to disagree there. We call it a cactus because it looks similar to one. But they really don't behave similar to real cacti as they need know water and they grow a meter in an instant. Also, where are you getting these "temperatures". Using the wiki is not scientific.
    Posted in: Discussion
  • 0

    posted a message on Blockology - The study of the world of Minecraft
    Quote from Hexalobular»

    I think you've made a mistake somewhere,
    how can it start with a speed of nearly 1 m/s when it takes 4 seconds to get the first meter? That's 0.25 m/s.
    Even at 10 seconds the velocity is only 0.5 m/s or so.

    With your values it should take more than 72 seconds to reach a velocity of 2 m/s but the table shows a terminal velocity of 3.33 m/s after 60 seconds or so.

    All I did was plug his values into my calculator (subtracting two from the time, and reversing the distances to get distance from ground level as opposed to distance from drop height) and run a QuadReg. The position time graph it gives you is roughly y=-0.1
    3938x^2+-0.947207x=256.280767. It fits the plot points pretty well, so I'm not sure. I agree something is off here, am I interpretting the data wrong? does it take 109 seconds to get to a height of 250? that would seem strange to me.
    Posted in: Discussion
  • 0

    posted a message on Blockology - The study of the world of Minecraft
    Quote from PisuCat»

    Just some random ideas.


    About the new grid:
    The new grid, which rather than being a grid in which certain objects conform to, is a grid containing id's, which may explain why we can't have a vertical slab, despite it having faces that touch the grid, because vertical slabs don't have an id:damage value.



    About Evasitism/Sufflamism:

    Interestingly, at the center of a mob, there is a spot where Evasitism does not apply. Evasitism also does not apply near the surface of a block, leaving a border where neither Sufflamism, nor Evasitism, apply.


    Also, if blocks and entities are completely separate, then block evasity may be different from entity evasity. This allows for differences between block evasity and entity evasity. Block evasity has a peculiar push pattern and only applies to players, items and XP orbs. Entity evasity has an area in the middle where it doesn't apply.


    About Ponditism:

    I got these results from dropping a Pig from a certain height. The left column is the time it takes, the right column is the height. You might want to subtract 2 from the time before using it. Note that other entities may differ as they have different pondity values. Also, like with Evasitism, there might be more than one type of Ponditism for certain types of Ponditism affected entities. Blocks do not seem to be able to leave the grid on their own, so I think Ponditism is an entity only thing.


    109 250
    106 240
    103 230
    100 220
    97 210
    94 200
    91 190
    88 180
    85 170
    82 160
    78 150
    75 140
    72 130
    68 120
    65 110
    61 100
    58 90
    54 80
    50 70
    46 60
    41 50
    37 40
    31 30
    25 20
    18 10
    17 9
    16 8
    15 7
    14 6
    13 5
    11 4
    10 3
    8 2
    6 1
    2 0


    About "signals":
    Looking at sand and gravel, they seem to align to the grid sometimes, and not align at other times. It may be possible that we are looking at two different things, sand, and "falling sand", where falling sand is an entity. TNT works in a similar fashion, where it acts like a block, until it gets a redstone signal, and then it becomes an entity. It is possible that sand also acts the same way, receiving a signal. Bits of floating sand can sometimes spawn, and when they are given a block update, they fall, so block updates are that signal.


    I decided to generalise both redstone signals and block updates into a single "signal", based on how pistons behave.


    Most of the times when a block location in the grid changes it's id:damage value, it will send a signal to it's 6 immediate neighbours. The blocks at those locations react to this signal in various ways. Redstone activated blocks somehow "check" to see if, at certain locations, a certain amount of redstone power exists. If this check is successful, the block will turn on, otherwise it will turn off. Redstone wire "conducts" this signal by changing the id:damage at it's location when it receives the signal, which causes the grid to send a signal to it's neighbours, propagating the signal. Essentially, when a redstone signal changes, a new "signal" propagates from the source of the change to the destination.


    Yeah, that was my idea with the grid. Thanks for clarifying.

    I'm interested in what kind of setup you used to find those values. Also, I'm assuming time is in seconds and distance in meters (blocks) correct? I plugged the values (subtracting two from the times) into a graphing calculator and got a quadratic regression, but the results are little weird. According to those values, entities (or at least pigs), should accelerate at a rate of one hundredth (0.013938, to be more precise) of a meter per second per second downward. However, it also said that the pig basically started with a velocity of 0.947207 m/s downward, so that's weird. Could you maybe repeat the test a couple of times to see if you get the same answer? I'm not sure what setup you're using, but that doesn't seem to make a ton of sense.

    I like the idea of signals. Perhaps time works a bit strangely in the Minecraft universe, and time only ticks for certain things under certain conditions. For instance, when some blocks are updated. Perhaps this "signal" is a sort of wave that goes through the grid? I couldn't think of any instances when a "signal" affects an entity, so that's where that idea comes from. Also, I guess entities would have to interact with the grid to some degree, but only under very specific circumstances like the sand/gravel thing or pressureplates.
    Posted in: Discussion
  • 0

    posted a message on Blockology - The study of the world of Minecraft

    So new theory on blocks and the "grid": its a bit of a cop out I guess, but I think it could work. Most blocks in the game have only two values to them, an id and a damage value (damage does things like changing the color of wool, weird term, but it is also used for durability on tools, so thats why its called that).


    So my idea is that the universe, or at least from y=0 to 255, there is a sort of grid that is able to have these properties. Basically, at each location, there is a quantum of space, one singular unit where something can exist. Its a similar concept to the Planck length IRL (yes, I know we have already talked about that, but bear with me here). Previously, we tried to debunk the idea of a "Notch length" being one block, but here is my idea. Blocks and Entities are two completely different things, and many rules that apply to one, don't apply to the other. I don't yet know why that is, but it has to work that way. Another problem we had with the one block "Notch length" was the existence of partial blocks like slabs and torches. However, I think that these properties could be explained by the "energy levels" of "id" and "damage". You never see a brick slab and a stone one inhabiting the same Notch length, do you? So the different sizes and positions of slab like blocks could simply be a manifestation of these two properties.


    Now, keep in mind that of course the wiki is banned, so we have no way of knowing what these "id's" actually are, but we can find that out experimentally (they don't need to be the actual id values). My question now is if there are any interesting interactions between the id's. For instance, if you combine two blocks, do the id's add up?


    This theory would basically replace Tritron theory.

    Posted in: Discussion
  • 0

    posted a message on Blockology - The study of the world of Minecraft
    Quote from Emerald_God»

    I wanted to add: I am pretty sure I have proven sufflaism (Kinda)


    So, from what I recall, Evatism keeps you from getting inside blocks, but if you do, sufflaism takes over while you're inside of the block. I have also understood that sufflaism is stronger when ontop of a block, or that sufflaism only acted ontop of the block, keeping you from falling in it.


    So, I was once parkouring in a map, and I jumped early and hit the block infront perfectly diagonally. I thought I was gonna fall, but something really interesting happened. I went a little ways inside the block, and got pushed upwards on it. All of my momentum and speed was mantained, and I could make the next jump. I have seen this happen many times, actually. So my guess is, that the top corners of the block are evatism's borders, or the line between evatism and sufflaism, and as sufflaism is stronger than evatism, it pushed me upward.


    Great, huh?


    Right idea, but a bit off on the terminology. Evasitism (coming from the same latin root as "evict") is a force that acts on objects inside of blocks, pushing them in horizontal directions toward the outside of the block. Sufflamism works in full 3d, not just horizontally, and is much stronger than evasitism, stopping anything from entering in the first place.
    Posted in: Discussion
  • 0

    posted a message on Blockology - The study of the world of Minecraft

    Here is my theory on Moon Phases: Perhaps the moon, if it is some sort of celestial body, has a dark side and a light one (Maybe something happened in its past like a large collision that darkened half the body), so as it rotates on its 8 day cycle, we see alternating colors. It has nothing to do with light hitting one surface or another, its simply the color of that surface.


    The idea with spacetime contraction in the nether is interesting, but unfounded. Its a huge leap to assume that general relativity works in Minecraft like it does IRL. We've already established pretty well that time dilation doesn't work, but distance dilation is more plausible.


    I'm still confused how daylight works though. I suppose we can assume that by some coincidence the sun rises at the same time as the light comes, but where does that light come from? Why does the sky turn blue (IRL it would be because of the Rayleigh Effect, light scattering off the particles in our atmosphere, but so far we have no proof of atmosphere, or that light would scatter in it for that matter).


    Another interesting idea would be that the overworld doesn't really interact with the sun and moon, but that they interact with each other and the overworld is coincidentally in the middle? A bit of a stretch, but I'm just throwing ideas out there.


    I completely agree with the observer dependent universe. Time doesn't pass unless a player is nearby, as well as other effects.

    Posted in: Discussion
  • 0

    posted a message on Blockology - The study of the world of Minecraft
    Quote from Emerald_God»



    EDIT: Plyb don't you DARE kill the thread!


    Sorry! I've been pretty busy lately. I'll try to get things going here.
    Posted in: Discussion
  • 1

    posted a message on [New World !]Best Vanilla Server ever!|Survival| NO PVP| NO Griefing|
    Quote from Wizkof»

    IGN(in game name): Wizkof
    Age: 16
    Planet: Earth
    Have you ever been banned?: Nope
    What are you looking for in a Minecraft SMP server?: A good community, making big projects with other people.
    What are you hoping to avoid?: Griefers
    Why do you want to join this server?: I want to know more people to play that are not cheaters or griefers
    Tell us something about yourself (the more you tell us, chances of been accepted increase): I played in this server before, but there where some renovations i guess and I am not whitelisted anymore :(
    Do you know whats Team speak (if not just ask, will help you get, it is free)? I do


    Readded. Welcome Back! :D
    Posted in: PC Servers
  • 0

    posted a message on [New World !]Best Vanilla Server ever!|Survival| NO PVP| NO Griefing|

    Welcome to all new players :D

    Posted in: PC Servers
  • 0

    posted a message on I want to make a new minecraft game
    Quote from jcm2606»

    Factor in time, effort, complexity, the time it takes to learn everything you need to know, legal issues and ramifications, community backlash (I wouldn't approach the Forge team with this idea), and other things and it quickly becomes pretty near to impossible unless you dedicate yourself to the project, don't care about legal issues, know everything (and/or are willing to dedicate more time to learn everything), plan everything out to manage complexity, keep this hush-hush to avoid community backlash, etc.

    What community backlash are you talking about?
    Posted in: Discussion
  • 0

    posted a message on Blockology - The study of the world of Minecraft

    I'm considering totally reworking the OP. I will do away with the "law, hypothesis, theory" thing. The new one will have some basic information, a section on mostly accepted theories (pondity, tritrons, some parts of relation), and a section on the newer and less accepted ideas (how the sun works, MDNA, etc.). Let me know what you think. I will also get rid of the "description, evidence, predictions, problems" format.

    Posted in: Discussion
  • 0

    posted a message on Blockology - The study of the world of Minecraft

    Weird idea on the generation of ores. During the big bang of relation (the name now seems unfitting. I don't have a better suggestion atm, but "relation" doesn't really describe what's happening), there are small pockets of something created. Small anomalies that cause changes in how the world is created. Some of these anomalies are affected more by pondity than others, and hence, some move closer to the bottom of the world. During the relation epoch, these anomalies are able to mutate the tritrons, causing them to change color. Some anomalies cause the tritrons relatively mixed stone to turn red and white creating andesite (or alternatively, they could simply destroy the blue and green tritrons). Some would cause tiny pockets (this is more on the subblock scale) to turn almost entirely blue, creating diamond, but these anomalies have high pondity, so are only found near the bottom of the map. Probably not a good theory, but I figured I'd throw it out.

    Posted in: Discussion
  • To post a comment, please or register a new account.