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    posted a message on [1.2.5] Equivalent Exchange 2 - v1.4.6.7
    Then again the nearly, if not, 1400% ROI (EMC-wise) using IC2 Nuclear Reactors (Breeder and High EU Output) with Mass Fabricators producing Glowstone is probably the only exploit I would use, because I'd feel the risk/effort involved with running/setting it up justifies the reward.

    GeneralSCpatton's post on determining a reasonable EMC value for Uranium Ore:
    http://www.minecraft...st__p__13597529

    My near unintelligible post correcting a few things I thought were wrong and pulling numbers out of thin air without showing how I got them:
    http://www.minecraft...st__p__14904734

    My breeder design (Please note there are exactly 11 flowing blocks of water in the design, along with the 1 ice block per second after an initial 5 lava buckets. It doesn't have to be 6-chamber just makes for a cleaner layout. 5 chambers is minimum for breeding 24 at once I believe, which needs 13 flowing blocks of water and minimum 1 ice block per second to run properly):
    http://www.talonfire...7gw9nm3pvjon8sg

    "My" 2070 EU/t output design (Please note the minimum 7 ice blocks per second with an initial 64 ice blocks in each position, the water cooling is actually optional with this design since 7 blocks of ice will cool 2100 heat/s, or up to 2100 EU/t worth of heat):
    http://www.talonfire...vzsl2igt76w1w00
    Posted in: Minecraft Mods
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    posted a message on [1.2.5] Equivalent Exchange 2 - v1.4.6.7
    IC2 Compressor + 3 Netherrack (3 EMC) -> 1 Netherbrick (4 EMC), ~33.3% ROI. 54 Copper + 18 Tin (9198 EMC) -> 72 Forestry Bronze Ingots (9216 EMC) -> 8 IC2 Bronze Blocks -> 72 IC2 Bronze (18360 EMC), ~99.6% ROI. Gotta love potential exploits, not really a problem in SSP since you get the choice, but in SMP I *guess* people have to think about these things. But yes... the Blaze Rod thing is probably the "best" I've seen, good find (IC2 Macerator + 1 Blaze Rod (1536 EMC) -> 5 Blaze Powder (3840 EMC).150% ROI).

    My personal favorite "exploit" (that doesn't use EE) is painfully slow for how much of a gain it is. Use Forestry to feed Wood to a bunch of Coke Ovens, then the Charcoal to some Blast Furnaces , craft Railcraft's standard tracks, then burn them in the Alloy Furnace from RedPower 2. Works out to be something like: 18 iron -> 48 standard rail -> 128 track -> 48 iron, ~166.7% ROI of Iron invested.
    Posted in: Minecraft Mods
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    posted a message on [1.2.5] Equivalent Exchange 2 - v1.4.6.7
    Quote from Sgtchuckle117

    I have to wonder, Pahimar, what in the bloody hell are you going to do when 1.3 rolls around and villagers have trading? I mean, the prices they have are the utter opposite of equivalent exchange, there are so many exploits possible that the mod will be more broken than.... I don't know, actually. EE will set a new record for brokenness when 1.3 updates.


    Minecraft itself is approaching EE's level of "brokenness" with the trading as implemented in a way. given that you can create mob farms for rotten flesh and ender pearls to trade for Emeralds to trade for almost everything else you might want. I wouldn't say it's opposite EE at all, just requires a different form of "energy collectors" for the same result, and impossible to fully automate.
    Posted in: Minecraft Mods
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    posted a message on [1.2.5] Equivalent Exchange 2 - v1.4.6.7
    Quote from iJames
    ...
    It comes up as Error from EE and Forestry. I dont see how i can fix this, because they are all the recommended Version and only ones ported on bukkit. When i try using Other Foresty mods (earler versions) i cant spawn or make the apiary or any of the machines from Foresty. But the bees generate into the map and i can make the Bags/bees/honey. but nothing else like the farms or treetaps, etc.


    You have to wait for EE's bukkit port to be updated to resolve that error. Most importantly the error doesn't seem to actually cause any problems so far as I can tell, Forestry items just don't have EMC values. About the crafting issue with Forestry (even 1.4.6.1r5), I don't think it has anything to do with EE, but there seems to be a problem with the Bukkit port of Forestry at the moment, crafting anything that shares an ID with the Forester crafts into a Forester.
    Posted in: Minecraft Mods
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    posted a message on [1.2.5] Equivalent Exchange 2 - v1.4.6.7
    Quote from iJames

    Nevermind, i got it to work.

    It seems that 4096-Fix-v4.0-mc1.2.5 isn't supported.


    Good to know... I'm reluctant to use those sorts of patches anyway, it will eventually get "fixed" properly I assume. I was setting up a Bukkit server/client pair just to test your issue, even though you didn't give much information to go on (was just going to try the mods I normally use). As long as I loaded RedPower last with the client everything worked without trying there, and for the server, I had to make sure anything that included the IC2 api was loaded after IC2 so that it would work. But yeah... I guess I'll try stuff out on the install for the fun of it, might be able to help someone with some other issue at some point.
    Posted in: Minecraft Mods
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    posted a message on [1.2.5] Equivalent Exchange 2 - v1.4.6.7
    Quote from iJames

    Im sorry to post AGAIN about this issue. But i am still having trouble and i seem to have not gotten an answer. thanks.


    You need to extract the .zip file for that version, check the contents it should make more sense.
    Posted in: Minecraft Mods
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    posted a message on [1.2.5] Equivalent Exchange 2 - v1.4.6.7
    I can confirm Loot Balls are not expanded when picked up by Black Hole Bands inside of Alchemical Chests/Bags and Energy Condensers. I'm not sure where else this can happen, it does however expand the Loot Balls when the Black Hole Band is in your primary inventory.
    Posted in: Minecraft Mods
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    posted a message on [1.2.5] Equivalent Exchange 2 - v1.4.6.7
    Quote from kylania

    Why would you want to use such an ancient version of Minecraft?


    For the nostalgia of it, sometimes it's fun to just see the old world generation (remember "404"?).
    Posted in: Minecraft Mods
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    posted a message on [1.2.5] Equivalent Exchange 2 - v1.4.6.7
    Quote from FnordMan

    CASUC reactors, uu-matter and scrap. look back a few pages, someone has the math on why 6 diamond worth makes sense.


    Their math was a little bit off, but I "corrected" a few of their numbers in my post, I just didn't complete their lava in geothermal generators versus nuclear reactor comparison of EU output with the new "correct" and "maximal" numbers. Mostly because their conclusion that you get about 12 times EMC return if you both breed the uranium and run it in high output configurations wasn't that far off (it was closer to 15 times as I have things set up).
    Posted in: Minecraft Mods
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    posted a message on [1.2.5] Equivalent Exchange 2 - v1.4.6.7
    Quote from Pahimar

    ...
    I tracked down where it's doing the dimension scanning in EE in SMP only.. It does this to check for the various power item abilities for players in all dimensions, and since MystCraft registers all dimensions to itself, well that explains the out of memory. As for a fix, this is something kind of tied deep in EE2 so it's something I'll keep in mind when building EE3 (I'm trying to limit the work done on EE2 now so I can focus all my dev time on EE3).


    Thanks for taking the time to figure out why it was happening. Looking forward to the eventual compatibility, I'm thinking you might want to talk to XCompWiz about things he might want to do differently, or maybe some forge changes to help both sides deal with it. In the meantime it will be like the "needed" wait on using EE that I've always felt gameplay would benefit from, slow technological advancement just feels better.
    Posted in: Minecraft Mods
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    posted a message on [1.2.5] Equivalent Exchange 2 - v1.4.6.7
    Quote from gigantictragedy

    hello im just curous if anyone else if having trouble with the tablets holding what you learn, i keep restarting every 5 to 7 days now. Ive been learning everything and converting to emc just to have my tablet forget everything. minecraft is getting frustrating, nice to have all these mods to do different things but nothing seams to ever actually work for a reasonable amount of time.


    If you change between "playing offline" and not your player name changes and EE will use a different set of files for the memory for everything in the mod. Check your save folder for anything with "Player" in the file name, that will be what it uses in Offline Mode, and the corresponding files with your Minecraft username are what it uses when it's "Online" (I'm using quotes because I think you can force the player name by passing it as an argument to Minecraft.exe). Hopefully that helps.
    Posted in: Minecraft Mods
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    posted a message on [1.2.5] Equivalent Exchange 2 - v1.4.6.7
    Quote from DevJRoc

    My understanding is that people believe this has something to do with EE2 polling each possible dimension for chunk updates or something along those lines. An easy fix/bandaid solution would be to only check the vanilla dimensions, and possibly restrict EMC generation to these worlds. A more extensive fix would probably require Mystcraft-specific code to see which dimensions have been created. I am eager as the others to see this resolved, but of course nobody expects it to happen over night.


    Yeah.. in all honesty it seems like this should be an easy fix IF (big if) it really is something EE is doing. it shouldn't be doing anything that requires the loading of dimensions, it only provides items and blocks that have to be created and/or placed to have any effect on the world, nothing that should have anything to do with generation. My best guess would be there might be some code that iterates through crafting recipes... causing thousands of descriptive books to be instantiated somehow... it seems a bit of a stretch that EE is the actual cause, but I have no idea. The only reason I'm asking that Pahimar look into it as well is that it's the only one of the seven major mods I use seeming to cause the issue when used with Mystcraft, even when by itself (EDIT: only Mystcraft and EE) with a fresh world. Also, if there is something that might cause this behavior then it would likely increase future compatibility with other dimension creating mods, so that would be good :)
    Posted in: Minecraft Mods
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    posted a message on [1.2.5] Equivalent Exchange 2 - v1.4.6.7
    Quote from Vagrant0

    Have you already looked to make sure that there isn't some automated process for creating descriptive books somewhere? I believe that each time a book is created, even if not used, it creates an age definition. Maybe descriptive books in an alchemy bag?

    Some information as to what conditions need to be present to replicate the bug would probably help.


    It was a brand new server, empty world folder, no one had logged on, and in fact the server is sluggish and unresponsive (only giving clues that it is in fact generating dimensions by way of "Unable to find spawn biome") , but seemingly only when EE is also installed, remove it and start from an empty world folder, no problem. It's more than just me with this problem, again I still haven't checked the *very* latest EE so it is possible it's already fixed I suppose.
    Posted in: Minecraft Mods
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    posted a message on [1.2.5] Equivalent Exchange 2 - v1.4.6.7
    Oh and Pahimar if you haven't already could you please look into an issue with EE seemingly causing "infinite" dimension generation on server startup when using the latest Mystcraft (http://www.minecraftforum.net/topic/918541-125-mystcraft-083/), I have yet to try it with EE 1.4.4.1, but 1.4.4.0 seems to have this problem, and there was no mention of it in the change log.
    Posted in: Minecraft Mods
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    posted a message on [1.2.5] Equivalent Exchange 2 - v1.4.6.7
    Quote from GeneralSCpatton

    ...
    I believe the most efficient conversion from EU to EMC is 833,333 EU to make 5 UU-Matter (assuming limitless Scrap with negligible cost), arranged in a plus sign to make 2 gold Ore. Maceration or RM Furnace gets you 8,192 EMC, for a ratio of 101.7252604 EU/EMC produced.
    ...
    Now, if we consider splitting Refined Uranium into 8 Near-Depleted Cells and run them through a Breeder Reactor (ignoring cost), assuming the hypothetical max Reactor efficiency of 5 (impossible to actually achieve), that's a theoretical upper-bound of 40,000,000 EU per Uranium, which can produce 393,216 EMC.
    ...


    On the first part the best rate of exchange I've found (without being exhaustive) is 6 UU-matter -> 8 Glowstone giving 1 UU-matter = 2048 EMC. On the second part the theoretical upper bound you came up with is off by a factor of two, 10000 (seconds/Uranium Cell) * 20 (ticks/second) * 10 (EU/t) * 5 efficiency * 8 (Uranium Cells/Uranium Ore) = 80,000,000 EU/Uranium Ore. I don't want to think about how this affects the rest of your analysis, but it's an interesting comparison to make. I usually just do nuclear just because it's "dangerous".

    When I did some quick comparisons using the best breeder and high EU/t reactor designs I know, also considering scrap as negligible I ended up seeing approximately a 15x ROI EMC-wise with the 49152 EMC/Uranium Ore cost.

    I was considering that two breeding cycles (~10,000s) with my ice-fed breeder design where 24 Depleted Isotope Cells per breeding cycle and 6 Uranium Cells per two breeding cycles, effectively 108 Coal and 54 Uranium Cells or 6.75 Uranium Ore costing 345600 EMC to produce 48 fully charged Uranium Cells (ignoring initial non-bred uranium cells). Which if you then run a 2070 EU/t ice-fed (which I'm thinking only actually outputs 2048 EU/t, but hey) which requires 47 Uranium Cells to produce 414,000,000 EU (70,468,085 EU/Uranium Ore, which is why I noticed you were off by a factor of two on the theoretical maximum) resulting in approximately 422,808,510 EU or approximately 2536 UU-matter with negligible scrap production being worth approximately 5195470 EMC/345600 EMC invested giving approximately 15x ROI. There might be something wrong with my logic at some point with chain breeding, but I think the near-depleted uranium you get from running the high output reactor might offset or even improve the rate of return.

    I hope people can follow what I mean by all that, all in all a fun exercise and what I feel is a fair return given the amount of time and resources you would have to invest to get it down perfectly.
    Posted in: Minecraft Mods
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