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    posted a message on YOUR SHITTY ARGUMENTS
    Quote from Sacheverell »
    I'm sure you mean well with your gun analogy, but it's a flawed argument.


    I'm not going to quote your whole response, but I promise you I read it. The gun analogy is a weak argument, I agree; however I couldn't come up with something that would resonate with the players who currently feel that beds are fine the same way those beds do for players who feel they are imbalanced.

    You have to realize that throughout all of these threads I've been trying to play Devil's advocate, because minus a few posters (you being one of them) the threads were basically repeating themselves. I'm glad I could bring a little bit of a debate to the situation as opposed to one-line comebacks. That aside, I don't think the beds in their current state are a problem, and I think a lot of the players that dislike them are overreacting. However, I think the problem comes in when you see the community's response to some players disliking an addition. Granted, this one can simply be ignored, but I'm afraid the same responses would come up if something that were gamebreaking to a certain type of player's playstyle were added.

    Don't get me wrong in that. I don't mean that I know "the One True Way™" to play this game, or am trying to find it. That would be stupid. What I'm saying is that it's in everybody's best interest to try and tailor the game to as many playstyles as possible. So should an addition "ruin" (I don't think beds really did, tbh) any type of playstyle, there should be an attempt to find alternatives that make everybody reasonably happy.

    That isn't what you're seeing in these threads, though. You're just seeing the same people pipe up with "Don't like it, don't use it!" Instead of trying to find a happy middle-ground, and that's what's worrying. Even though beds aren't a big deal, you might get a very similar response with something that is a big deal a little way down the line. Even though the heart of Minecraft is singleplayer (imo), that doesn't mean that we should just add things without thinking of the repercussions it has on other players. If anything, that's the first thing we should think of.
    Posted in: Survival Mode
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    posted a message on YOUR SHITTY ARGUMENTS
    Quote from brendanan »
    Also, I don't think discriminating because of age is appropriate. It just shows you are as immature as all of the "3rd graders". There are many people that are just not as well educated as other people in literature, or maybe english is their second language, and the way they get their point across sounds much more immature


    Whoa, don't get me wrong here man. I wasn't trying to bash anybody or anything, I just said 3rd graders because most of the adults I know of don't constantly scream at the top of their lungs. However, I have met quite a few children of that age group that do almost exactly that. Their education has nothing to do with the amount of respect they show towards other people's opinions. I couldn't care less if the person saying "then don't use it" was from the U.S, Russia, or Nigeria. I don't care if they dropped out of highschool, or have their masters in aeronautical engineering.

    It really doesn't matter, because regardless of who says it the argument still indirectly belittles the original problem. Rather than trying to figure out ways that beds could be changed in order to tailor to more playstyles, people just spew not to use them. That doesn't feel like the way forward to me.

    Quote from judasremains »
    I wouldn't say that the issue is a lack of understand, but more of a lack of options. If it is to be simply considered two sides, you've got the Pro-Choice side and the Anti-Bed side, which kind of leaves one half in a lurch, as far as names go. The Pro-Choice side are happy with how things are, they don't want to take anything away from anyone, and in all honesty, the 1.3 update shouldn't have taken anything from anyone, whereas the Anti-Choice people want the beds nerfed, or taken out of the game. You've got one said that is saying "Eh, is okay." and another that wants to take something away from the community.

    Essentially, at least in my opinion, the Anti-Choice folks just don't have much of an argument, because they are actively advocating for the removal or unnecessary nerfing of content from a game that we all paid for, whereas the Pro-Choice lot are asking them to simply adjust.

    Another issue, which does relate to a lack of understanding is that many of the Anti-Choice people seem concerned with the vague concept of "the game" I.E "The first night of the game will be too easy with the bed" which completely overlooks many gameplay styles, and the fact, unless they've done a great deal of research, nobody that is actually experiencing their first night will know how to make a bed or why they should.

    Personally, I didn't know about crafting until I'd owned the game for almost a week and I googled to find out what the quiver was for.

    In the end, it doesn't matter, because everyone is only concerned about their game, but while one side wants to cost the other side actual content, the other is simply happy with how things are.


    Wow! Thanks for actually taking the time to come up with an intelligent response rather than just telling me to stuff it. I think you have a good point in saying that the anti-bed side is being quite a bit more aggressive, but I think that's for a good reason. If you think about it from their side, this kind of seems like a dangerous slope. Something gets implemented that you dislike, you make a logical (not all of them were, don't get me wrong there) post about why you dislike it, and you get told to adjust. What happens if Notch decides to get rid of mobs (I don't think that will happen)? Will they get told to simply adjust? I don't think that's fair.

    I think one of the big problems comes from why Minecraft is so great: It's a true sandbox. There are so many different ways to play this game that every little addition has a ripple effect throughout all of them. In that respect, the two "sides" of the argument begin to blur. The only difference between them is that one likes this current update, and the other one doesn't. If we all just tell the side that doesn't like something to adjust, then nobody will be happy because everybody will eventually have things in the game that aren't fun for them.

    It's very important, especially in the development of a game, to know how the playerbase feels about changes and to look for the best way to make everybody as happy as possible. I don't feel as if asking them to adjust is necessarily the best way to go about it.
    Posted in: Survival Mode
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    posted a message on YOUR SHITTY ARGUMENTS
    Although I think a lot of people are overreacting to the whole bed thing, the "don't like it, don't use it" argument is extremely weak. I like to think what would happen if Notch added guns to the game. They would be unquestionably better than the bow and swords, along with being made of readily available materials (just as the bed is easily made and unquestionably better than just waiting). A lot of the people currently using that argument would come and complain about that, I'm sure, because it doesn't fit their playstyle. The sad part is, they would probably get the same "then don't use it" argument stuffed in their face.

    It's just ridiculous how blind a large amount of this community is when it comes to understanding the way that other people play the game. These forums kind of make me think of a room full of 3rd graders who just cover their ears and scream constantly. Every so often a kid or two stops and tries to say something, but nobody can hear them anyways.

    Disclaimer: I know Notch isn't adding guns, but it's an example that shows the two apparent sides to the argument; those who play minecraft for building, and those who play it for combat.
    Posted in: Survival Mode
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    posted a message on "Minecraft is based on survival"
    Quote from He Is Alive... »
    Too many people bought the game without playing creative.

    They don't know that survival is the second play mode.

    Noobs establish their dominance by creating the norm.


    Second? Yes. That doesn't necessarily mean worse. Elitism in a sandbox is a little on the silly side, btw.
    Posted in: Survival Mode
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    posted a message on Minecraft Performance.
    That integrated card is what's killing you, bro.
    Posted in: Survival Mode
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    posted a message on "Minecraft is based on survival"
    You're right. "Survival Mode" isn't strictly about survival; it's about gathering resources and thriving whilst surviving.
    Posted in: Survival Mode
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    posted a message on Nerf Everything
    Although I do agree with a few posters in saying that the argument is a logical fallacy, I can also see the humor in it. Unfortunately, this is probably going to get locked unless a mod finds it absolutely hilarious.

    Edit: There's no need to flame Trunks for saying the post was reductio ad absurdum, because it was. That isn't necessarily a bad thing. In fact, it proves what side of the argument he's on and (shocker) it's the same as yours.
    Posted in: Survival Mode
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    posted a message on [THOUGHT] Beds and Mob Spawning
    I don't think that's the case. In my house (I'll be editing with SS), I have MULTIPLE openings to the room but it's well lit enough that mobs don't spawn. I think it's more a matter of your lighting than having to close off the entire area.



    That room to the left is an enclosed greenhouse. It is fairly dark, however. That's why I'm confused as to why mobs aren't waking me up, considering the horror stories I've heard on here. The door is always open as well.



    This is from the other side, which has an open staircase that goes straight up to my roof. The roof is spider proof, but has only a couple torches and has multiple dark spots on it. I have slept in this bed with this exact setup about 5 times now, and not once have I been woken up prematurely by a mob. Just thought I would share my results.
    Posted in: Survival Mode
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    posted a message on Torches light up while in hand.
    Only once torches have a limited life span, and not a moment before. That being said, yes. I think it could be a pretty nice idea.
    Posted in: Suggestions
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    posted a message on No More Item Despawn!
    PEBKAC
    Posted in: Suggestions
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    posted a message on Map conversion
    Just a note here, though:

    There have been a very small number of people who have had their saves corrupted while they converted. I would suggest making a backup or the original just in case, though that is kind of self explanatory.
    Posted in: Survival Mode
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    posted a message on F3 and the Red Bars of Evil
    There sure is a lot of jelly up in this thread. It really doesn't make sense to me. I purchased a premade ASUS laptop about a year and a half ago with 4g ram, 2.2ghz dual core (not overclocked), 320m vid card (1g ded), and a widescreen res. Only 320g of hd space, but that doesn't bother me. I can delete things.

    For all that, it was only $675, which is bad considering it wasn't on sale or anything. It's a nice little budget gaming laptop that I can use when I travel. Hell, if I tweak a few things I can even run BFBC2 with a pretty steady 30fps.

    It really makes me wonder how much people actually payed for some of their rigs, considering I get a constant 50-60fps with the new lighting on and have it capped in options to not go above that.

    Edit:

    Quote from Terrier »

    I'm wondering, is it cheaper to get a desktop computer or to attempt to upgrade my already desk bound laptop?

    CPU: 1.86GHz
    RAM: 0.99GB
    and I have no idea what graphics card, I think it's just integrated.


    *Can't sell one to fund the other, need a mobile net-book AND would like a decent PC


    Trash it. Unless you're extremely fond of it for some weird sentimental reason, you can easily get a new laptop for the price that it would cost you just to upgrade any of that. Plus, as a standard, laptops are normally much more expensive than equal-efficiency desktops simply because of the mobility and how compact they are. Unless you're actually traveling a lot, get a desktop.

    Also, if you have a friend or family member who can assemble a desktop for you (it really isn't that hard) you can easily cut off 2/3rds the price of premade computers. A ridiculous amount of those are labor. I was recently in the UK for a few months and put together a desktop for my girlfriend. Cost me about 400 quid for all the parts, but if you went to buy the same rig premade you would pay about 1200.
    Posted in: Survival Mode
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    posted a message on Slimes will come back on 1.3
    Quote from Figfewdisgewd »
    I doubt anyone here has really seen a slime since they first broke and odds are Notch didn't really mean what he said. Every video of slimes post-broken-slime are either from old, unused worlds or people with the SPC mod on. Seriously just about every video with them in it includes other mods or texture packs, showing they know mods exist and that they know slime spawning most likely doesn't.


    I'm inclined to agree. It seems like given the current errors in the code, the chances of a slime actually spawning are borderline astronomical. Then you have to take into account the chances that the person is actually looking, or being in the right place to see it before it despawns. Then they have to record or SS for proof.

    Lucky for us, though, that's being fixed. :tongue.gif:
    Posted in: Survival Mode
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    posted a message on So, what will the beds do?
    Quote from Proyce »
    Yes the last bed you sleep in if you die you will be there, and it will also let the night time go away.


    Wait. So if I die during the night, it respawns me on the bed after night has passed (speeding it up, of course)? If that's the case, then what happens to my items if I drop them? Would they disappear, or is the timer on dropped items in real-time?

    Edit: Wow, nevermind. Misread the post. My bad guys. :x
    Posted in: Survival Mode
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    posted a message on Slimes will come back on 1.3
    Ho boi, I really didn't want to get into this. I didn't mean anything serious with my comment, and I don't mean any disrespect. I just wanted to point out how, from where I'm sitting, it seemed -really- hypocritical. I'm sure that you can admit that if you read the set of words I quoted after the set before it you can get a good chuckle out of it. Here, let me quote it again and point out why I wrote what I did:

    Quote from Pattoe »
    And "Derpy" Isn't even a word... And if it was, I doubt it would mean making thorough and civilised arguments in online forums, taking other peoples beliefs and countering them with your own in a mature and civilised way, which is what I have been doing.

    If derpy was a word, it would probably relate to your behaviour, completely ignoring and disregarding other people's opinions and trying to say that what you know is fact and insulting others for what they believe.

    Seriously, get some manners, learn how to conduct yourself. Just because people disagree with you gives you no right to call them "Derpy" or insulting them in any other way.



    So you start by stating that "Derpy" isn't a word. It may or may not be, I have no idea. You then state that even if it were, what you're doing would not be the definition of it. Then, you say that you've been taking other people's beliefs and "countering" them in a mature and civilized way.

    Then, you go ahead and bash him by saying that if anything, he would be "derpy". After that (and this is my favorite part), you accuse him of:

    completely ignoring and disregarding other people's opinions and trying to say that what you know is fact and insulting others for what they believe.


    Isn't that what you just did? Honestly. You said he was wrong, called him derpy, and then glorified your statement by saying that you "counter" his argument. That's like saying a five year old who covers his ears and screams counters his mother's argument. He doesn't, he just ignores it.

    And then, to top the whole thing off, you tell him to get some manners and that he has no right to call other people derpy when you just did exactly that.

    TL;DR:
    He says "No!", and he's simply disregarding or ignoring your argument.
    You say "No!", and you're countering his argument in a civilized and mature way.



    -Duba

    Edit: Added TL;DR
    Posted in: Survival Mode
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