Minecraft Forums

Quote from qazplm601

i would recommend it be optional.

Of course. There needs to be a way to turn off fancy things on underpowered systems.

Quote from Wulf_Jarlson

Will your system allow some colors of wool/clay to have different properties than other colors? Will wool blocks react differently to the Thrust physics if they are made watertight or whatever? Can non-wool blocks be configured to provide thrust? Could some block type be configured to provide high thrust when in the water like a ship's screw? Each night as I lay me down to sleep. I count green resoved issue tags and have sweet dreams of the next version. Keep up the good work... And, of course thank you again.

Different colors are indistinguishable by the block properties system. That means yellow wool will have the same properties as red wool. Thrust from sails is not configurable in the block properties system. In the code, the block properties and the propulsion system are completely different. It's possible for other mods to add new propulsion types using an API, but that will require writing code to describe the necessary logic. The idea of a propulsion type is very open-ended in the code, so other modders can dream up all kinds of wild and fantastical systems without too many barriers getting in the way of creativity. It's too big of a job for config files.

Quote from Silentscope88

Question: Will you be able to raise the block cap in the upcoming 0.9? If so, to what limit will it soar? I ask this because my old galleon, Elizabeth's Crusade, is a whooping 7,000+ blocks.

I'll raise the block cap to at least 8k in the next version, or possibly more depending on my performance testing.

Quote from Hawker_Typhoon

however, WHILE she floats, i see some water temporarily dripping/shining through on the inside, in the hold, towards the rear.

This bug is fixed in the upcoming v0.9.

Quote from Martititi

Cuchaz, how is the coding going? I mean, do you think you will be able to release airships soon, or do you still let me time to rebuild another one before the implementation?

We're still a long way from airships, but getting closer all the time. I need to get surface ships working well first. And I need to end this damn beta so I can update to 1.7.x.

Quote from Wulf_Jarlson

Oars/sweeps on larger vessels would require multiple players or npcs to function properly and would not be needed on a ship powered by sails. Unless someone has come up with a weather/wind mod that implements the doldrums where Cuchaz's thrust detection will not work.

These kinds of things should be possible in other mods with the propulsion system API.

Quote from foreck

Man you really have something nice here, at this time this is the first ship mod that have no water in the ship and have that buoyancy mechanic and the collisions!!!! and... and... this is awesome, keep up the good work

Thanks! I'm rather proud of it myself. =)

Quote from 4HeadTiger

Cube shaped planets should be more than feasible with M3L [+ Tall Worlds with some adjustments]. To make the planet work, one would just need to change a couple of classes here and there, rotating the camera, change gravity directions according to where the player is on the planet. As far as I can tell, the major requirements are; - Generate cube of stone+ores+caves, then paste Minecraft terrain onto faces - Change gravity direction according to where player is on cube - Rotate camera and player to account for gravity Various other requirements; - Replace fluids with rewritten variants which can deal with changes in gravity direction - Rewrite parts of rewritten lighting system (light always comes top-down relative to face etc) - Adjust mob path-finding to accommodate for edges of planet-cube - Some various minor tweaks (redstone, grass & plants, etc) Anyway, if M3L lets you make all of the changes that you're making in Tall Worlds, it should theoretically let another modder make all of the changes required to make a cube shaped planet.

Sounds like a good idea for a mod! Someone should give it a shot. Sky lighting might be tricky though.

Quote from Master_Hill_

Well done Cuchaz! Your mod's thread is becoming so popular that the idiots have started crawling out of the woodwork! You know you've done something right when that starts happening to your thread.

Lol!

In other news, we'd like to do something to increase the view distance, but that will come much later.

Good news everyone!

The block properties are completely configurable now! You can set the mass, displacement, watertight-ness, and is-part-of-a-ship settings for each block. All of the vanilla blocks are defined by default, and the code makes some attempt to guess properties for mod blocks based on known materials. Mod authors now have an API to define block properties. And server operators can define properties that override everything in a configuration file that looks like this:

tile.stone=4,1,true,false

Just put the file at: .minecraft/config/shipBlockProperties.cfg

If you want your server to be the uber-cheating central station and make all your iron blocks have negative eleventy billion mass, go for it!

If you want to pretend that things made out of brick are actually ultra light because you think the blocks look pretty on ships, go for it!

Or you can just keep using the defaults which are somewhat reasonable.

It all happens in the upcoming v0.9 beta. =)

Quote from devinvaughn

cuchaz, there is a bit of a problem, I don't have any recording softwares to sho how bad it lags, the fps Is 2 fps

That sounds pretty bad, but without any kind of information about what's causing this, I don't have any way to fix it. Even if I knew what caused it, without a way to reproduce the problem on my computer, I'll never know if I actually fixed it.

Quote from Silentscope88

I've been spending the past four months trying to convince GenerikB to add this to the Attack of the B-Team mod pack.
No replies, yet

Probably because I won't let anyone add Ships Mod to a mod pack until after the beta. =P

Quote from devinvaughn

as I turn the ships or sail the ship at angles, it does lag.

I don't notice any lag when I sail at angles. I can't reproduce the problem, so I have no hope of fixing it. If you gave me more information, that might help. Ideally, you could send a video that clearly shows the lag happens when you sail at angles, and it doesn't happen when you sail straight.

Quote from devinvaughn

as I add more sails to the Alicorn, the block amount being read by the ship block decreases (I think I could make some simple math for counting the ships block amount once im done with the last 3 sails.

You won't be able to do anything with ships over the block cap. They're not supported.

Quote from thebaum64

could you please release a 1.6.4 version?

Sorry, not going to happen.

Quote from Razaekel

You are correct, they're not per 1 sec, they're per 100 ms. So the numbers in my post should be multiplied by 10 for the correct cubes per second count.

Yeah, it's only 10 times faster since our tick budget is too long right now. Actually, I'll go drop it to 40ms now...

Quote from mtyacorn

Even if you are unable to solve the problems that other attempts have come across with shadows, I would love to see this mod have an option to be deeper rather than tall. My vision of a great mod pack would contain Metallurgy 3 where tartarite becomes more and more common the closer you get to the nether which, by the way, would actually be accessible by just digging deeper like the achievement says. So many things you could do with this even with shadows from the sky disabled after y=0.

Quote from Razaekel

In regards to lighting, this mod only affects how it is calculated, not how it is rendered. I leave the question regarding shadows and lighting to Cuchaz, since he wrote the code that handles it, and knows it far better than I do.

As far as I know, the lighting engine in this mod should be able to handle lighting correctly (including sky light) at depths below y=0. I posted some screenshots earlier in this thread to show it.

Quote from Razaekel

Let me divert for a second and do a brief explanation on the cube processors: In vanilla, chunks are generated as an atomic (or roughly so) operation. This means that when the world asks for a chunk that doesn't exist from the chunk provider, then chunk provider has to go and generate the entirety of the chunk in one go, which includes the terrain, the surface block replacement, the caves, ravines, trees, ores, etc., etc. Cuchaz has taken this, and broken it down into separate processors. There is currently a TerrainProcessor, which generates the actual, raw terrain (you can see pictures from when this was the only part working much earlier in the thread. The only blocks being made at this time were Stone and Air.), a BiomeProcessor, which replaces the surface block plus a few blocks underground with the biome's blocks (i.e. Grass and Dirt, or Sand and more Sand, plus Sandstone at the bottom.), a FeatureProcessor, which currently handles the caves and ravines (shout out to Barteks2k for getting this working!), and will also handle villages, strongholds, mineshafts, and additional features (little structures like desert temples or witches huts, although you could put stuff like volcanos or meteorite craters in here as well), a PopulationProcessor (which will handle the trees, grasses, mushrooms, plants, etc.), and then a LightingProcessor, which does the lighting calculations. These generators make up the generation pipeline, which is broken into 1 second ticks. A cube moves from one stage to the next in the pipeline, and the pipeline processes as much as it can in each in each tick for each stage, in sequence.

This is basically how our new terrain generator is structured. We re-organized how chunk generation works so that it happens asynchronously instead of synchronously. This lets us distribute the workload of generating cubes over multiple ticks. If we try to do too much work in a single tick, that's what causes the lag spikes on the server. The terrain generation lag spikes are caused by the server trying to do 2s worth of work in a 50ms time slot. Obviously, that's not going to work well. Right now, our new generator pipeline is actually allowed 100ms of time each tick (instead of 1s) to generate cubes, but we should probably lower it to around 40ms. If the server is expected to maintain the usual 20 ticks per second, that only leaves 50ms of processing time per tick.

Quote from Razaekel

For example, in regards to the terrain generation alone, I imported the vanilla terrain generation system with it's noise generators and all that stuff, and modified it just enough to work with this mod. The number of cubes that the pipeline could process with the vanilla terrain generation was 60-140 per second. With the current terrain generation process, it doesn't drop below 100 cubes per second and can run up over 400 for groups with lots of air cubes. The lighting averages about 400-500 cubes/sec, but that is very dependent on the terrain. For worlds were the terrain is very convoluted or I messed up on a part of the terrain generation, it could go as slow as 10-20 cubes/sec. It can alternatively run as high as 1500 cubes/sec. Cave generation is part of the FeatureProcessor, which runs around 300 cubes/sec, so it's not a slowdown. The slowest part of the entire pipeline is the initial terrain generation.

That's pretty cool. Are these /sec measurements, or are they actually /tick? If you're reading those numbers from the console spam, then they should be /tick measurements, which means converting them to /sec measurements makes them 20 times faster. =)

Quote from Razaekel

Here is a screenshot in regards to Mtyacorn's question: The cubes at the top of the image haven't been rendered yet, but they have been generated, and used for the lighting calculations before being sent to the client and rendered. From what I can determine from the code, cubes do not have their lighting calculations done unless all cubes surrounding them have already been generated and had their terrain populated. And cubes are not sent to the client unless their lighting calculation is completed.

That's right. At first, I thought this screenshot was a bug in the lighting system, but the more I look at it, it actually seems to be working as intended. As long as the unloaded cubes above the shadowed terrain are a shelf which blocks the sunlight, then this lighting is both awesome-looking and correct.

Quote from aBitterMelon

Hey guys! Im just wondering, in the future, how compatible do you think this mod will be with other simple mods such as optifine or too many items? Do you think that compatibility will be one of your future goals?

Inter-mod compatibility is a huge problem with Minecraft mods right now. This is the exact problem my new mod loader, Magic Mojo Mod Loader (or M3L) is trying to solve. Then end goal is to have every mod be compatible with every other mod (to the extent that mods are not mutually exclusive). Making that actually happen requires changes at the mod loader level (ie, M3L) and also requires that modders stop making core mods or otherwise making mod-specific APIs on top of vanilla Minecraft using bytecode transformation tools. Once all the mods are using standard APIs, then we can solve the inter-mod compatibility problems.

Quote from MineCrak

That you guys have already redone the generation code in a way that speeds it up at a fundamental level is an unexpected and exciting revelation!

We didn't really make chunk generation any faster. We just re-organized how the workload is distributed over time using asynchronous programming tricks so the server doesn't lag.

Quote from Mark3146

Ahoy Mateys, I have followed this thread silently for a while now. I know, creepy, but since the cap is increased to 4000 blocks I tried my hand on a ship: The Lady Washington.

Wow, great-looking ship!

Quote from devinvaughn

I am happy to report that I found out why the ships were lagging so much for me, I forgot to uninstall the previous version, and mixing the previous version and the latest version made it lag.... I know because my ship that I launched had 1600 blocks, more than the galleon..... but also it does lag when I turn it and I had a bug to report. once I took off the 0.7 verson I launched the ship and it spawned a ghost ship thing, half of it was gone, the entyti phased through it and when I right clicked the blocks it deleted itself

I'm glad you got it working. =)

Quote from Wulf_Jarlson

Cuchaz, I am encouraged to see all the green resolved tags on the .9 to do list. Improved sail/trust physics and configurable properties will be a grand improvement. Not to mention the 8K+ max... Soon this mod will be in every modpack in every let's play vidio that is worth watching. Once M3L and Tall Worlds and air ships/submarines These mods may well take over MineCraft... Or at least Dominate the world generation/exploration.

=D

Quote from Hawker_Typhoon

because Cuchaz has not implemented the physics yet. Buoys and Boah-eyancy modding is to be available from 0.9 onwards. ?

lol!

Quote from mtyacorn

Speaking of which, are you planning on making this a community-driven, open-source project?

This mod is already an open-source project with multiple developers contributing code.

Quote from 4HeadTiger

It is open source though, and the M3L wiki page thing seems to imply that when M3L is functional, the community may be able to make their own hooks etc.

That's right. Once I do some more work to finish the initial release of M3L, it will be opened up for everyone to use to make mods. It should also be relatively easy to make new hooks and modify the modding API in M3L in response to changes from Mojang, and also modder creativity. =)

Quote from MineCrak

How smooth is the initial mega-terrain generation at this point? It's a LOT of computing going on compared to the mostly flat terrains (comparitively speaking) in vanilla. And how is the cave generation issue I was talking with you about in PM? [EDIT] It would be incredibly advantageous to the uptake of this mod, especially for server use, to include an option that would greatly increase initial playing speed in a new cubic world by pre-building and populating all chunks within a user-defined x.y.z3 area. It could be in the World Generation options with a default pre-build range that they can select or alter. Then they can set it loose and go watch a movie or whatever. Afterwards when they start playing they will never have that initial terrain build lag every few steps, which can get far worse with huge terrain. You could even have an option to use quiet background cycles to pre-build other defined ranges while they are playing, up to a max folder size if desired, or only start new background pre-building after a player reaches within a certain distance of the current edge of the initial build-out (in any direction, vertically or horizontally). That way the odds are better that they may never actually experience initial terrain-build lag. This would go a loong ways towards making the game smoother as well as minimizing the lag effects of mega-terrain generation.

Terrain generation is pretty fast. It takes roughly 20 seconds to pre-build the spawn area for a new world on my computer. Also, we've restructured how world generation is executed, so it causes virtually no lag on the server. There shouldn't be any reason to pre-generate large portions of the world, as long as players aren't moving across cubes faster than the terrain generator can generate them.

Quote from 4HeadTiger

Plus, more in regards to retaining vanilla features; the nether could be placed at the core of the planet and provided it was set up properly, the whole "you move further in the nether" would work exactly as originally intended...
Noting that the distance thing in the nether is most likely supposed to emulate said effect.

For something like this to work, the shape of the world would have to be spherical. Minecraft's chunk loading system right now can only handle planar worlds, so there's basically no way to do this without building a completely new engine.

Quote from Martititi

Is it me, or do these forums send Emails a day after the posts are written?

I know, right? The email notices are basically useless because they're so delayed.