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Feb 1, 2014Minecraft name: Code_Name_DPosted in: PC Servers
Previous bans: None
Why ShadowCraft: Tired of playing single player. I want to see what server play is like. Something friendly without getting the pressure from PvP. And this place looks as good a place to start as any other.
What client mods do you use? None.
Oct 20, 2013Posted in: WIP Mods
I feel like this is a solution in search of a problem.
No, this is a solution to a very specific problem, the boring nature of space. The idea of folded space is to make getting from point A to point B more interesting than… well, getting from point A to point B.
The main problem with space is that… well, that there is nothing in space. Imaging we have to fighters who are dulling to the death with machine guns. Now we put them in a featureless desert. There are no shrubs to hind behind, not that they would offer much concealment or protection, no hills, rocks, or trees, no nothing.
Our duel would end up being rather anti-climatic. You just run towards each other and open fire once you are in range. It's then a mater of who can deal the most damage in the shortest amount of time.
At least in this scenario, our fighters still have to aim and have a chance of missing. In future craft, unless you plan on adding a noise factor, their aim will be pretty much dead on every time.
To have an interesting and especially epic fight, you need an epic terrain. Stuff to move around, smash into, duck behind, hid in, launch ambushes from, terrain that offers its own hazards. Heck, just getting from point A to point B may be an adventure in and of it self and hold its own rewords.
4+ dimensional objects are difficult to simulate and non intuitive to interact with, and I strongly doubt this can be visualized without going over budget on the rendering pipeline.
But I am not proposing dealing with 4th dimensional objects, but three dimensional objects that exist relative to each other along a 4th axis. Other ships and objects just fade in and out. So apart from the transparency aspect, no additional tools are required.
If you want secret dimensions, the place to do it is between star gates which don't need to follow any conventional rules. In the solar system there are too many other things which need to work together. It's an interesting idea, but I think it is too impractical for this mod.
Fair enough. There is a problem with interfacing folded space with real or "surface space". Using stargates might be a way of solving this problem. The only real issue is then how one gets from point A to point B until the stargates are built, but this is a small issue.
Besides, we are already planning to use warped space bubbles to facilitate fast travel. The difference here is that these bubbles are sized in relation to proximity to other gravity wells, with the practical purpose being the avoidance of high speed collisions.
But it still leaves you with the original problem I was attempting to solve, the boring nature of empty space.
Oct 19, 2013Posted in: WIP ModsQuote from sonyaxe
Oh my God...
Frostbyte, please add this after you get FTL engines done!
Is this a good thing? Or did I miss the sarcasm light? It still needs work, I admit. I still need to work out the distance thing. There also needs to be some interfacing between folded space and real space.
Oh, side note. Try reducing the 360 variable, you get this gnarly saw-tooth pastern.
Oct 19, 2013Folded Space in FuturecraftPosted in: WIP Mods
Okay, I have been giving folded space some thought here. As I said, I can’t do any of the code – but I can play around with the math to give a coder a better idea of what I am thinking of.
But before we get into that, let’s review the concept of the 4th dimension. You will need a sheet a paper and a pencil for this.
We start off with a dot, zero dimensions. Nothing can exist in this space because there is no dimension for any thing to exist in.
Draw a line from that dot. We now have one dimension. Any point on that line can be expressed with a single number, so many units positive or negative from our origin point. A space ship in one dimensional space will also have orientation, in this case weather it is pointed forward, or backwards.
Draw a second line 90 degrees from the first.
Now we have two dimensions. A ship can be described with two coordinates, usually expressed as (X, Y). Orientation also becomes more complex, with a circular number indicating which direction it is heading.
Draw a third line 90 degrees from the first and the second. But you can’t do this on your sheet of paper. Hold your pencil vertically above the origin point.
Now we have three dimensions with the coordinates described thus (X, Y, Z). Our ship’s orientation also becomes more complex. In addition to heading, we also have pitch and role. Giving us our six axis of freedom we are trying to achieve.
Now, draw a forth line that is perpendicular to the first, second, and third lines. You can’t do it because we are stuck in three dimensions. (Excluding time.) But math says that it’s still possible.
To describe where our ship is, we need four coordinates, (W, X, Y, Z) with W representing our “fold depth.” Orientation also becomes more complex. In addition to heading, pitch, and role, there will be additional axis of freedom to consider. I think their will be two or four additional values. This gives us a grand total of eight to ten values need to describe our ship.
I don’t think we need to go full hog here. Navigating in three dimensions is hard enough, But navigating in there dimensional is not a new problem and there are plenty of existing tools to help with the calculations.
To navigate using ten axis of freedom requires an entirely new math. So unless one of you out there is a super-math genius who is constantly grousing that dynamic geometry is just not challenging enough – I think we need to dumb this down a bit.
We will keep our three axes of orientation, heading, pitch, and role. And we will use W only as a variable to define our three dimensional environment in relation to other three dimensional environments to each other. What this means is that if we have ships and objects that occupy the same space in W, then our three dimensional relationship will be indistinguishable between normal spaces. It's when we have differences in W between ships and objects that we need to figure out.
Two ships passing in folded space.
Let’s say we have two ships, both are at the exact same W, say at 20.0 fold. Both ships will be “in phase”. This means that we have 100% accuracy on our scanners and can see the other ship in crystal clarity, discounting any distance we have between X,Y, and Z coordinates or any other obstacles or forms of interference. (I will talk about interference later.)
Being in phase means that our two ships occupy the same W space, and if they are also close in XYZ space, then we can see them, interact, and exchange weapons fire, and what not. All interactions will be at 100%.
Now let’s move one of the ships along the W axis. And it ascends (or descends,) the phase relationship diminishes. Eventuality, it will fade away to nothing. Meaning we will have 0% visibility, 0% sensor return, and 0% weapons effectiveness.
But I am going to throw in a wrinkle here. In electro magnetic theory, there is this thing called a harmonic. It’s kind of cool, really. Let’s say I have a frequency at 98.5 MHz. Well I can tune to 49.25 MHz or 197 MHz and pick up that frequency’s harmonic. If the main carrier is strong enough, I can actually listen in. So if I have a scanner, I will see the main carrier at 98.5 MHz and harmonics on either side that are being broadcast at diminishing amplitudes.
I am not going to use the math of harmonics, but simply take the idea.
So as our two ships continued to move apart in W, we actually see the ship appear back on our scopes again. The signal will get stronger and stronger, but never get to 100 % it will eventually die out again. As distances increase, we will see these peeks diminish until nothing is seen at all.
Here is the formula I have.
D = fold distance between two ships
R = range of horizon in folds
If R is greater than D, than efficiency factor equals:
(cosin of((D – integer of D)*360)/2+0.5) * ((R-D)/R)
… if not, than efficiency factor equals:
For those of you, who have Excel, try this: (Row is assumed to be 2)
Column A = Range (any number, use 4 for now)
Column B = Distance (Start at zero and then count up in tenths, drag it down to 5.0)
Column C =IF(A2>B2,(COS(RADIANS((B2-ROUNDDOWN(B2,0))*360))/2+0.5)*((A2-B2)/A2),0)
Use the last column to make a line chart.
You should see a sign wave which starts and one, falls to zero, should clime up to about 0.833, then fall back down to 0, and up to 0.666 and so on.
You can also use different ranges for different effects. For example, visual range, the distance you can see a ship with the naked eye or optical scanner could be short, say at about 4. And echo scanner (an active scanning device) might have a range of about 10. A detection scanner may only have a range of 6. Weapons may only have a range of 0.5.
Things to bump into in the night
Okay, this is just a first stab at this. What is to follow is not vary Minecrafty (what ever that is), but is more of a starting point.
Think of folded space like a layer cake. Each layer will offer obstacles of a different nature. But all work on the same principle. I like to call them "stones".
During terrain generation, we not only create terrain in the conventional XYZ grid, but also in W. To start off, each stone is a simple sphere of a given radius. A ship can not pass through a stone in any of the four axis. So if a stone is shallower than you, you can not ascend any further without moving in the XYZ first.
Stones do not work like ships in that they appear in or out of phase with our self. They are either in our W plane, or they are not. But while our ship can only exist in one W plane, stones will exist across a span of W planes depending on how big it is.
Lets say we have a stone existing at WXYZ say at (50, XYZ), with a radius of a thousand meters. If we are at 50 W, then we see a sphere two thousand meters across. As we assent or decent; the stone will shrink in portion to our depth relative to the stone.
Now above and below the stone is something I call a sand bar. This is to solve a problem I ran across. Let's say we are traveling in XYZ space at some given W. But there is a stone just at the edge of our plane. It might be very small, perhaps only a meter across. But running into it might be like running into a wall. This wouldn’t just make navigating a bit more hazardous than we might want, but it might also create some issues with coding.
The solution is to create a kind of resistance space both above and below the stone that slows your approach to the stone along the W plane, as well as along the XYZ plane. You would be like a ship, suck in a sandbar.
The deeper you go into the sandbar, the more resistance you encounter, but also the more energy it will take to escape.
Layers simply dictate how the terrain generation will randomly generate stones. The upper layer is called "aggregate space". Stones close to normal s pace will be quite small, but will become larger and more common as we descend.
Then we come to coulomb space. These are basically stones that are strung together, making long snake like columns and coils.
Then we have sponge space. Basically these are the opposite of stone bur negative stones; the ship can only move inside these negative stones. We will move through winding maze like tubes that get smaller as we go deeper.
And last we have pocket space, the very deepest parts of folded space. While here traveling a short distance can translate into vast distances in normal space, but basically pocket space are like negative stones. Once you find your way into one, there is a fundamental limit to how deep you can actually go.
But you might find some surprises here. It seems that there was an ancient technological race that had mastered such technology that they thought to survive the collapsing of the universe into a singularity, by building metropolises of untold scale in pocket space. For some reason, they perished. Nearly all of their technology as turned into dust, leaving behind only buildings and some interesting building materials. There are mobs here to; perhaps they destroyed the ancient ones. Or perhaps the ancient ones evolved into these mobs. But there are fortunes to be had here if you can find one.
Oct 8, 2013Posted in: WIP Mods
I guess since this is total conversion tier, starting somewhere other than planetside is not out of the question, but I think most people will still be interested in building their way up to the space stage rather than starting there. A lot of work is going into planets. It would be nice if players spent some time on them.
Different players are going to have different ideas. Some may want to work their way up to space. Others are going to be lining up at the space dock right out of the spawn point.
But that is one of the great things about this system is that we don't have to make that decision. It will all evolve organically. It's the job of the game-creator to provide the fertile field for such ideas to take root.
Oct 5, 2013Posted in: WIP ModsQuote from etechman18
Yeah your right but the point still stands. You start off in the middle of space next to a big shop. You have no idea who made it and no idea why you have a spaceship core in your inventory. Its not like in minecraft how you have to mine resources and eventually get to space travel. Also I have a question about if there will be a tech tree and if so what will it be like?
Why not start out in a hanger, with the core of a ship around you and some lockers full of used parts? You can even set up some lore. If you are a newbie, you are basically hired to run some one else's ship. The idea is to earn enough money or prestige to buy out your contract and become your own person.
Your owner then gives you assignments to accomplish. You are free to follow those assignments, or strike out on your own. One of your assignments (if you are in MMP mode) is to find other newbie's that fail to make payments to their ship-lords and get the money out of them.
Eh, just thinking aloud.
Sep 23, 2013Posted in: WIP ModsQuote from funfight22
I have been meaning to write a science fiction book, would you mind if I use something similar to this sort of interstellar drive? Also, I think this is a great idea, a small cargo/fighter would be able to go many folds deep and hardly work to dodge the debris, while a larger ship with more efficient engines would go faster, but because it can not go as deep it arrives later. Unless it has auto turrets or something to allow the larger ship to remove, block or dodge the debris.
Well, as Keybound noted, this is not my idea. But its not commonly used. By all means, have fun.
Sep 23, 2013Posted in: WIP ModsQuote from sonyaxe
That... sounds.... AMAZING! Have you coded any of it?
Sorry, not that kind of experimentation. I worked on this idea for a science fiction story. I had set up an action sequence where the protagonists needed to dive into folded space in order to escape pirates. The pirates gave chase and dove down after them. Our our hero/pilot opened up a can of awesome. Something along the lines of the asteroid seine in Star Wars, Empires' Strikes back.
I wasn't happy with it and made some changes to focus less on visual action, and more along the lines of deep-submerine pressure/crush sort of tension that works better for prose.
What I mean by hopping to contribute would be to suggest game rules that would make for something that is both interesting and challenging to play. And not just for the guy who happens to be driving the ship, (What is every one else doing, twiddling their thumbs?) but for the whole crew. Being a science fiction writer gives me some insight into this that I hope might be of some use here.
Otherwise, I keep making these cool suggestions, only to find out that frostbite has not only already thought of it... but has already started coding on something that is about ten times the awesome.
Sep 23, 2013Posted in: WIP ModsThe current way orbiting mechanics work is that everything in a region moves according to a single point of reference, complete with top speeds and drag. Near planets, stable regions form in rings and natural satellites can exist in these rings. In deep space, regions form wherever two unaligned ships intersect, and the frame of reference moves as the average of their velocities. Ships can move at warp speeds while outside of these regions, but must use conventional engines while in them. The lore reason for this has something to do with gravity wells (think hyperspace rules in Star Wars), but the practical reason is we don't want things crashing into one another at 10 km/sec.
Yay! Something I can actually help out with,
Years ago, I experimented with something I called a folding drive. The problem I wanted to address was the fact that space travel is so boooooooring. I mean, there is nothing out there, nothing to do, nothing to see, just a whole lot of nothing, followed by a whole lot more nothing. Do you think the stars are pretty? Good, because that’s the only thing you are going to see for the next four years – nothing but stars. So I needed to make it more interesting.
The folding drive folds space, reducing it by some factor for each fold you pass through. One fold can not interact with another. So to engage a ship, you have to be at the same fold as it is. To see or detect a ship you have to be in an adjacent fold, either above or below.
But the way I wrote it was that as you descended through folds, it was a lot like submerging in the ocean in a submarine. You know… Aroooooga Aroooooga! Dive Dive Dive!! That is a tad bet more interesting than Zzzzzzzzzz.
But as you descended into folds, the nature of space geometry begins to change. You now have a kind of folded landscape, things to fly around, to avoid, to hide behind. The deeper you go, the busier your pilot needs to be or risk crashing on the rocks. You can start to include stuff to make space interesting. Things to look at. You might have eddy currents that sweep you in a direction, making for a short cut from point A to point B, or risk getting you completely lost.
The deeper you go, the faster you can travel with the same amount of fuel, but the riskier the navigation becomes.
At some point, you find your self flying through worm-holes that snake and bend and spiral. The ship shakes and rocks, steel girders grown from the stresses applied to the ship.
But this is where you go if you need to play cat and mouse. Shhh! No one make a sound so the enemy doesn’t hear us. Even as you strain to hear something, any thing, through the void, just something to shot at.
Sep 22, 2013Posted in: WIP ModsQuote from zoroark333
What if a troll came and interacted with every asteroid?
That is clearly a troll that doesn't have a life.
Actually, all asteroids might disappear if they are not visited every so often. The idea is that it simply gets lost in the field and you can never find it again. Unless you mark it with a homing signal. Basically, you turn the asteroid into another ship, just one made out of rock and little else. Only that would remain permanently in the game.
I can also see different biomes for asteroid fields (AFS for short for now on.) Imagine my ship entering into a AFS and slowly moving deeper. We start out with just the occasional single block asteroids. As we move in deeper, they start to become bigger and denser, but still uniform in shape. Deeper still and we find the first of our really big ones, with lots of little ones drifting near by.
One will have to rethink some physics here. What if I approach a small one and hit it with a pick ax. Do we go flying off in opposite direction in micro gravity? I would think I would need a thruster suit to compensate.
Lets say I attempt to build a base in a large one. How do we handle the vacuum of space? How do I pressurize the new fort so I can live in it without a space suite? And what if a hole get's poked in the side, how will the air bleed out?
One could use some paint programs and simple physics, but you would need to rethink how empty blocks work in terms of air, water, and vacuum.
Each empty block might have two values, one that represents air pressure and the amount of air in the block, and a second that represents the percentage of water that fills the block. You could use that sub-rotten you already mentioned used to determining when you have a block above you or not to avoid the X-rays and use that to do a quick calculation for water pressure.
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