I think a great thing to come out of minecraft was redstone. This has allowed complex and useful utilities which have worked out those problem solving muscles. I enjoy watching brilliant people make complex systems to ease their lives and live in excess. When watching it i get excited that this sort of mentality can blend into the real world. Here is some thoughts related
# Solutions
## Replanting seeds
At the moment harvesting crops has a pretty decent solution with water. However, replanting requires trapping a villager and controlling when they can leave and when they come back. This has ugly historical implications.
While piston walkers are interesting, that is not the purpose of a piston leaving players in a situation where a solution requires an individual to break rules of expected physics (which minecraft is already quite leanient with).
Inorder to support a more realistic approach, a solution can be related to minecarts
- new blocks
- - minecart planter - will plant a seed in an adjacent block
- - a minecart walker - when hit with a signal moves the minecart 1 block forward
- solution
- - put a planter in a minecart
- - have system to load up dispenser with items
- - when the loading is complete
- - a redstone signal causes a sticky piston to push another piston up and another signal makes that piston push the minecart forward.
- - the minecart hits a track plate
- - A vertical piston in front to stop the minecart
- - a redstone signal causes the dispenser to plant a seed
- - release the vertical piston
- - get another piston push from behind with the sticky piston setup similar to the dispenser
- solution
- - this piston setup can be sidestepped by creating a motor or walker that can be toggled by redstone
## Breeding
While the door concept is humorous, in general farming animals and villagers leads to quite exploitive strategies which are often reflect in the real world. There are many that view seeing people and animals happy as more important than profit and productivity. Ways to minimize exploitive tactics can be
- require a minimum block radius for two anything to mate
- - if two animals would mate, they look for an area where they are at least x distance from any other mobs/players. Otherwise they do not
- - to avoid ai issues, first they look for a mate, then one follows the other until they find space
- require a bed for mating for villagers
- - if they mate on that bed it is now their bed
- - unless one of the villagers passes, no one else can use that bed
- - bed should be in enclosed space and only 1 bed per enclosed space
- - this programming could be later be used for birds
# Opportunities
## Redstone circuit board
- new blocks
- - circuit board
- - - accepts input in one of four directions
- - - sounds outout in one of four directions
- - - use logic gates which already exist in Minecraft
- - - can weave or combine redstone cross sections
- opportunity
- - devboard - with rasberry pi and Arduino being so popular, there is a proven consumer for this type of product. By making the two as one to one as possible, there is an opportunity to bring the fun ingame, out of the game as well
quote=S986S
I think a great thing to come out of minecraft was redstone. This has allowed complex and useful utilities which have worked out those problem solving muscles.
On these points we are in agreement; RS geatly extends what is possibel in MC and offers its practicioners a whole toolbox of toys :>:
RE: ## Replanting seeds
The described piston set-up clearly illustrates the need for the "minecart walker". (This strikes me as more akin to the stepper motors found in disk drives with the functionality of both being to move the 'head' one functional unit.)
Even with a 'walker', however, a minecart planter would be able to reach only one (possibly two, were it double-sided) block.
This makes using these to auto farm so expensive that only those with an overwhelming concern about "ugly historical implications" would be likely to use them in preferrence to "villager-tech".
[While I am strongly in favor of additional options, I prefer those options to be more generally viable within the in-game economy...
…and I quite prefer to keep "social justice" out of my gaming.]
Recommendation: Modify the proposal so that the resource expense of a mincart planter/harvester sytem is competitive with the set-up irritation expense of working with villager-tech.
[As philisophical reasoning, you might consider that there is no virtue in avoiding that which is prohibited: give the players a choice and let them work out there own issues, if any.]
RE: ## Breeding
Putting aside a number of cultural assumptions you've made even allowing per argumentum villagers are considered as human equivalents and the fact that animal behavior is frequently far different from what you describe…
Minecraft has provided fairly comprehensive "lampshading" for this topic (any remaining difficulty arising from varying human cultural norms being effectively a sunk cost at this point).
Any attempts at greater 'realism' in this area are probably best left to mods.
RE: ## Redstone circuit board
The introduction of one-block logic gates for RS ahs been proposed (more-or-less, to varying degrees) before.
While I am in agreement that this would open up whole new vistas of what could be done [by allowing circuitry to fit into places where it currently cannot], the resulting advantage is [IMO] outweighed by the countervailing disadvantage of removing the need to understand the functioning of the construicted logic gates to which it would be an alternative.
The already extant complaints that RS is complex enough / too complex / too modern are not something I agree with, but pushback from those holding these veiwpoints would be a practical consideration in attempting to implement any higher level components such as these. [At least in survival, the command blocks seem to have acquired a considerable (and vocal) group of supporters.]
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"Why does everything have to be so stoopid?" Harvey Pekar (from American Splendor)
WARNING: I have an extemely "grindy" playstyle; YMMV — if this doesn't seem fun to you, mine what you can from it & bin the rest.
RE: [while i am in favor of additional options, I prefer those options to be more generally viable within the in-game economy...
...and I quite prefer to keep "social justice" out of my gaming.]
I think this is a great game for children. Perhaps your cynicism has skewed your priorities. Respecting life, in a virtual or real setting, should not be considered label/stamped and tossed aside. Villagers being considered tech is misleading and disregards they represent a sentient lifeform with the ability to serve their own best interest and build for the group. If we are to consider economic viability, perhaps we should talk about real world economics as well
Cost of life
- food - food is perishable so buying in bulk requires long term storage
- water
- escretions - many times animals are not responsible with their own poop
- cleaning - keeping an animal clean is often cheaper than taking them to a doctor
- doctoring - if an animal gets sick, they will need to be taken care of
- time as an opportunity cost - every moment an individual has to spend with the animal, they arent marketing the product
- space as an opportunity cost - every acre used for grazing isnt being used for crops
- work ethic - often relates to an individuals desire to work and age. This desire is often influenced by the manager. Age is something there hasnt been a viable fix for
Cost of machines
- fuel-unless its based of renewables or pulls power from the grid
- replacement parts
- fixing - ideally a consumer can fix themselves
- routine maintenance - often cleaning is associated
- work ethic - is related to age of parts which can be replaced
RE: redstone circuits
I think you missed the part about the dev board.
While i appreciate your doubting thomas mentality, i would hope you think of solutions to problems rather just defend a status quote which has room for improvement
I think a great thing to come out of minecraft was redstone. This has allowed complex and useful utilities which have worked out those problem solving muscles. I enjoy watching brilliant people make complex systems to ease their lives and live in excess. When watching it i get excited that this sort of mentality can blend into the real world. Here is some thoughts related
# Solutions
## Replanting seeds
At the moment harvesting crops has a pretty decent solution with water. However, replanting requires trapping a villager and controlling when they can leave and when they come back. This has ugly historical implications.
While piston walkers are interesting, that is not the purpose of a piston leaving players in a situation where a solution requires an individual to break rules of expected physics (which minecraft is already quite leanient with).
Inorder to support a more realistic approach, a solution can be related to minecarts
- new blocks
- - minecart planter - will plant a seed in an adjacent block
- - a minecart walker - when hit with a signal moves the minecart 1 block forward
- solution
- - put a planter in a minecart
- - have system to load up dispenser with items
- - when the loading is complete
- - a redstone signal causes a sticky piston to push another piston up and another signal makes that piston push the minecart forward.
- - the minecart hits a track plate
- - A vertical piston in front to stop the minecart
- - a redstone signal causes the dispenser to plant a seed
- - release the vertical piston
- - get another piston push from behind with the sticky piston setup similar to the dispenser
- solution
- - this piston setup can be sidestepped by creating a motor or walker that can be toggled by redstone
## Breeding
While the door concept is humorous, in general farming animals and villagers leads to quite exploitive strategies which are often reflect in the real world. There are many that view seeing people and animals happy as more important than profit and productivity. Ways to minimize exploitive tactics can be
- require a minimum block radius for two anything to mate
- - if two animals would mate, they look for an area where they are at least x distance from any other mobs/players. Otherwise they do not
- - to avoid ai issues, first they look for a mate, then one follows the other until they find space
- require a bed for mating for villagers
- - if they mate on that bed it is now their bed
- - unless one of the villagers passes, no one else can use that bed
- - bed should be in enclosed space and only 1 bed per enclosed space
- - this programming could be later be used for birds
# Opportunities
## Redstone circuit board
- new blocks
- - circuit board
- - - accepts input in one of four directions
- - - sounds outout in one of four directions
- - - use logic gates which already exist in Minecraft
- - - can weave or combine redstone cross sections
- opportunity
- - devboard - with rasberry pi and Arduino being so popular, there is a proven consumer for this type of product. By making the two as one to one as possible, there is an opportunity to bring the fun ingame, out of the game as well
quote=S986S
I think a great thing to come out of minecraft was redstone. This has allowed complex and useful utilities which have worked out those problem solving muscles.
On these points we are in agreement; RS geatly extends what is possibel in MC and offers its practicioners a whole toolbox of toys :>:
RE: ## Replanting seeds
The described piston set-up clearly illustrates the need for the "minecart walker". (This strikes me as more akin to the stepper motors found in disk drives with the functionality of both being to move the 'head' one functional unit.)
Even with a 'walker', however, a minecart planter would be able to reach only one (possibly two, were it double-sided) block.
This makes using these to auto farm so expensive that only those with an overwhelming concern about "ugly historical implications" would be likely to use them in preferrence to "villager-tech".
[While I am strongly in favor of additional options, I prefer those options to be more generally viable within the in-game economy...
…and I quite prefer to keep "social justice" out of my gaming.]
Recommendation: Modify the proposal so that the resource expense of a mincart planter/harvester sytem is competitive with the set-up irritation expense of working with villager-tech.
[As philisophical reasoning, you might consider that there is no virtue in avoiding that which is prohibited: give the players a choice and let them work out there own issues, if any.]
RE: ## Breeding
Putting aside a number of cultural assumptions you've made even allowing per argumentum villagers are considered as human equivalents and the fact that animal behavior is frequently far different from what you describe…
Minecraft has provided fairly comprehensive "lampshading" for this topic (any remaining difficulty arising from varying human cultural norms being effectively a sunk cost at this point).
Any attempts at greater 'realism' in this area are probably best left to mods.
RE: ## Redstone circuit board
The introduction of one-block logic gates for RS ahs been proposed (more-or-less, to varying degrees) before.
While I am in agreement that this would open up whole new vistas of what could be done [by allowing circuitry to fit into places where it currently cannot], the resulting advantage is [IMO] outweighed by the countervailing disadvantage of removing the need to understand the functioning of the construicted logic gates to which it would be an alternative.
The already extant complaints that RS is complex enough / too complex / too modern are not something I agree with, but pushback from those holding these veiwpoints would be a practical consideration in attempting to implement any higher level components such as these. [At least in survival, the command blocks seem to have acquired a considerable (and vocal) group of supporters.]
RE: [while i am in favor of additional options, I prefer those options to be more generally viable within the in-game economy...
...and I quite prefer to keep "social justice" out of my gaming.]
I think this is a great game for children. Perhaps your cynicism has skewed your priorities. Respecting life, in a virtual or real setting, should not be considered label/stamped and tossed aside. Villagers being considered tech is misleading and disregards they represent a sentient lifeform with the ability to serve their own best interest and build for the group. If we are to consider economic viability, perhaps we should talk about real world economics as well
Cost of life
- food - food is perishable so buying in bulk requires long term storage
- water
- escretions - many times animals are not responsible with their own poop
- cleaning - keeping an animal clean is often cheaper than taking them to a doctor
- doctoring - if an animal gets sick, they will need to be taken care of
- time as an opportunity cost - every moment an individual has to spend with the animal, they arent marketing the product
- space as an opportunity cost - every acre used for grazing isnt being used for crops
- work ethic - often relates to an individuals desire to work and age. This desire is often influenced by the manager. Age is something there hasnt been a viable fix for
Cost of machines
- fuel-unless its based of renewables or pulls power from the grid
- replacement parts
- fixing - ideally a consumer can fix themselves
- routine maintenance - often cleaning is associated
- work ethic - is related to age of parts which can be replaced
RE: redstone circuits
I think you missed the part about the dev board.
While i appreciate your doubting thomas mentality, i would hope you think of solutions to problems rather just defend a status quote which has room for improvement
Thst sounds solid!