Mod: Before you react to this topic, please read this post.
First off, I kind of have a feeling this post is going to get a lot of hype, seeming a lot of people in this community come from a place where the dislike of Americans is pretty high.
I just have a question.
Why?
In 1775 we declared war on the British Empire, in the year 1783 we won the war and became our own free country, we were a Democratic Republic. I see a lot of people claiming that the USA is an Empire. We are of no such thing. We are still a Democratic Republic, not a monarchy or an oligarchy.
In the following years we had a Civil War, the Union was victorious, setting all the black slaves free, but our racism and "Jim Crow" laws didnt end untill the 80's or 90's. We got over that problem, up to that point, we are still a Democratic Republic.
On the date 12,7,41 we where obliterated at Pearl Harbor, our Pacific fleet destroyed, open for attack. The next day, war was declared between the USA and the Axis powers, the US once again in another World War to help out their Allies.
But before the second world war, there was a first. And if an event never happened, we would never have joined the Allies. In the teens we were more likely to enter on the axis side. This all changed when The sinking of the Lusitania cruise ship by a German submarine and the Zimmermann note.
The Lusitania was a passenger ship that a German torpedo hit and sunk, killing about 100 US passengers. This ignited the US to join the allies.
Imagine the US joining the Axis, and then again in WWII. If you look at it, there would be no France, there would be no UK, there would be no Russia, hell, even the US wouldn't exist. But we helped the right people, and we won.
Let's not forget the D-Day landings and paradroppings behind enemy lines the night before. Without the Ameicans the landings would have been a terrible slaughter for the Allies.
In the 60's we went to Vietnam to help out the French and the South Vietnamese, we were abandoned and sent to fight a force that memorized the land like we memorize our rooms. The US never lost a battle in Vietnam, we just lost the war with our week politics, just like always.
The United States is a very important contributor to medicine aswell. Without us, you would still be searching for a cure for Small Pox. We have made HUGE advancements in medical science and Military technology. And without us, there would be a Soviet flag on the moon, and the Soviets would still be in the Middle east, and they would have a huge hand in everything. There would still be a communist Soviet Union.
Now please, i'm not looking for a flame war, i just want a simple explanation, i have nothing against anyone of another country. If you have anything to say just comment back.
Lastly, today, from all the bs we recive from ourselves and others. We are STILL a Democratic republic, we STILL have loyal citizens, we STILL have an amazing Armed Force, and we are STILL on this planet. That is all i have to say.
I think they will demolish themselves through a nuclear war with vaults being built for people to survive and wait until all the radiation goes off to make the lands grassy and lively again with some little case...
oh wait
:sleep.gif: Riight...
But seriously, the system here sucks.
Educational system.
Law system.
Political system.
And then there are the Americans.
I have no idea why any of the things in the OP's post would make up for the fact that we're still a nation riddled with ridiculous problems. A sizable chunk of our population thinks that Glen Beck is an A-OK guy whose opinions are worth listening to, that Sarah Palin is worthy of speaking for our nation, and that being willfully ignorant is better than being an intellectual. What a mess.
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Quote from Hotels »
Persevering businessmen like myself will not be dissuaded by such baseless criticism and naysaying.
Imagine the US joining the Axis, and then again in WWII. If you look at it, there would be no France, there would be no UK, there would be no Russia, hell, even the US wouldn't exist. But we helped the right people, and we won.
What the hell? The USA played a very small role in WWII, and had it joined the Axis, it would have been obliterated. First of all, all their trade with Canada (their biggest trade partner) and the other allies would have been cut off, starving them of resources. The US would have had no oil, cars, or any other vehicles. Also, are you forgetting the Soviet Union, which was pretty much the sole reason that Germany fell? To think that after taking out Germany they would not have finished off a last pest is absurd. And don't even try to say that America would have nuked other countries instead of Japan, because that is not true, either. America only got nukes because of the work of scientists who fled from Germany because of the Nazis. If the US had joined the Axis, then these scientists would have fled to other countries, such as England or Canada. Those countries would have been the ones to develop nuclear weapons, which would have then been used against America.
Quote from zehive »
Let's not forget the D-Day landings and paradroppings behind enemy lines the night before. Without the Ameicans the landings would have been a terrible slaughter for the Allies.
D-Day was an unnecessary attack on Germany, whose only use was to grab as much land as possible, since it was evident that the Soviet Union was going to win. It is another display of American greed.
Quote from zehive »
The United States is a very important contributor to medicine aswell. Without us, you would still be searching for a cure for Small Pox.
I hope you're joking. The smallpox vaccine was invented by Edward Jenner, a BRITISH man.
Quote from zehive »
We have made HUGE advancements in medical science and Military technology.
Thanks America, without you, we wouldn't be able to kill as many people as we do today! What a wonderful benefactor!
Quote from zehive »
And without us, there would be a Soviet flag on the moon,
Holy ****. You mean to say that a tiny square of cloth on a dry rock orbiting around our planet would have a DIFFERENT PATTERN? GOD BLESS AMERICA FOR SAVING US FROM THAT THREAT.
Quote from zehive »
and the Soviets would still be in the Middle east,
And why were the Soviets in Afghanistan? To save them from the corrupt government, rebuild the country and create new buildings for the people, and eradicate the Taliban. The very Taliban that the United States created in order to fight back against the Soviet Union. And the very Taliban that now kills countless people every year and presents a threat to most large countries. God bless America.
Quote from zehive »
and they would have a huge hand in everything. There would still be a communist Soviet Union.
Oh NO! Communism? That's always bad! A political system where everybody gets equal rights and everything is shared among everyone must be BAD. We NEED inequality, racism, sexism, and the such to bolster the economy, as well as homeless and starving people to lower populations!
Quote from zehive »
Now please, i'm not looking for a flame war, i just want a simple explanation, i have nothing against anyone of another country. If you have anything to say just comment back.
Looks like you hated on the Soviet Union pretty bad.
I am no stranger to the oppressive Stalinist regime. One of my relatives was executed by the government in the 1940s because he was high up in the army (general or commander or something) and suggested that the government improve their weapons technology.
But the problem with your argument is confusing the Stalinist and Mao regimes for true Communism. Neither of those countries were Communist, nowhere close. Tying the actions of crazy, paranoid dictators to the political systems they pretended to support is absurd and irrelevant.
Want me to start pulling numbers from African and Middle Eastern genocides and start tying those to Capitalism?
Its just because America has a lot of say. The fact that the economic drop we had ****ed everyone else up should tell you something. Its also because of the American mindset. We don't really keep the rest of the world in mind and our older history is boring or nonexistent (Referring to pre-colonization).
We're also just easy to make fun of. Like how the French are always cowards (despite the fact that french citizens fought for their life after its army gave up in WWII). Americans are considered all fat, despite reports showing a few other countries being worse off and our education system, which needs some sort of work.
Then again, its not like its hard to troll Europeans either, just post a stereotypical "American opinion" and they get all mad.
really makes it sound like you want a communist regime in this world. Which is a terrible, terrible idea. Because as nice as the ideals of soc/comm are, when put into practice, people die by the millions, because of the crazy dictators that never fail to pop up. Dictatorship and genocide are tied to communism. It's just how things tend to work out when theory is turned into practice.
I do not want a Communist regime in the world, but I do want true Communism. Under true Communism dictators cannot exist, since that creates inequality. In a Communist system, all decisions are made democratically. There are no leaders of any sort.
Quote from Eln »
Well thought out arguments as to why Communism is a preferable system
I know nothing about Communism, but from what I've heard from Glenn Beck, it's pretty bad for some reason. But, once again, I know nothing about it so I cannot write an argument proving my point. To compensate for my lack of knowledge, I am going to write "No." and pass myself off as someone who thinks the matter is silly and sees himself as too superior to partake in this intelligent discussion, when in reality I am just making up for not knowing enough about my unjustified opinions.
I don't like America because it has too much influence on the world. It sticks it's nose in other peoples business, but is ignorant about it.
America seems to have this idea that it is the forefront of everything, it controls the world. It's stupid, the only thing I'm thankful for is the fact that because of the US, the western world can hold a democracy without being assaulted by dictatorial countries.
You missed a lot of the worst things that the US has done. These include things like:
1. Cuba, we really ****ed it up. If you wonder why Castro doesn't like the US, look up the Bay of Pigs Invasion.
2. We did something similar in Venezuela in 2002.
3. We staged a coup against an Iraqi leader we didn't like. The replacement was the Baathist party.
4. We supported both sides of the Iraq-Iran war.
I could go on, but the point is that we have a very long history of ****ing around with the politics of other countries. This behavior mostly started in the 1950's, replacing anti-American regimes with pro-American ones. We continue such behavior to this day with "Operation Iraqi Freedom". This is what leads people to call us imperialistic. It's because we are. We want to make the entire world love the US, even if it involves beating them into submission.
Even their space shuttle (The buran, which actualy worked, but the soviet union dissolved before it was used more than once) looks cooler
Never mind that it's clearly a knock-off of the American design (since it took the US 4 years to work out the shape of the orbiter) with a few alterations (mainly the propulsion systems and the nose cones of the boosters, which is really the only difference most people would ever notice). And I'm not sure what your definition of "worked" was. The system was launched once and orbited Earth twice and the life support system and software wasn't fully installed.
Of course, you're judging on looks, not capability. MrQuizzles already pointed out some less shallow and actual objective problems. You know...arguments that don't rely on you going "look, they made the nose cones of their boosters touch the external tank! That makes it cool!"
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Never attribute to malice what can adequately be explained by incompetence.
Let me list all the things that the US had done wrong.
1. For a while your country was not even democratic, as black people could not vote
2. You came so late into WWI that it made very little difference, as the Axis had already made a huge tactical error that left them with a weak spot.
3. You barely did ANYTHING in WWII, more Romanian soldiers dies than US soldiers. If anything, you were a letdown at D-Day, as your Omaha beach was the only one that had serious trouble, not because of it being more defended, but because of US tactical errors.
4. Russians singlehandedly could of won WWII.
5. China did most of the work for the US in the pacific war
6. More British troops fought in the pacific than US troops. (Defending a colony)
7. the US was just like '**** this war, i have physics' and nuked japan.
8. The cold war, there was no reason for it
9. They stereotype communism as dictatorship. Communism does not have to be a dictatorship
10. Desperation just cause; you go and shoot the **** out of panama just because they (the large majority of people in the country) wanted a Communist government. The REAL reason you shot it up was so that you could control the panama canal.
11. Lured the soviet union into attacking Afghanistan, so that you could go in all heroic and ****.
12. REALY BIG ISSUE, the US runs as more of a tiered democracy than a true democracy, as you elect senators, who elect the president (As far as I know)
13. Your not even a republic, your a FEDERATION
14. You get all worked up when a few people from the middle east attack you (9/11), the REASON they attack you is because you have been bombing and attacking the middle east and supporting the greatest enemy of most of the middle east (israel)
15. You are racist towards Muslims.
16. You put more money into funding your military than every other nation on earth combined, this scares me, your a stable country with peaceful neighbors, WHY WOULD YOU NEED SUCH A LARGE MILITARY?
17. Since WWII, the US has caused 30 million civilian deaths in other countries, in their random attacks.
18. Won the space race, seriously, soviet space tech looks SO MUCH COOLER
Even their space shuttle (The buran, which actualy worked, but the soviet union dissolved before it was used more than once) looks cooler
1. The USA is a republic. It isn't a democracy.
2 & 3. The less people that die in a war, the better.
4. But they didn't.
5. Yeah, because 1 war where one country does better than another is bad.
6. See 2 & 3.
7. What's wrong with that? Japan REFUSED to surrender and the USA screwed with them. That just showed how powerful the USA is, and your complaining. Yet in the rest of the way you're complaining because the USA isn't powerful enough.
8. I think there was. The USSR needed to be brought down. If they continued we likely wouldn't be in the same world today.
9. No, it doesn't . But there are next to none non-dictatorship communist states.
10. I think we already controlled the Panama canal then. And we signed it away. Which was a stupid mistake.
11. I think this is an extremely smart move. Again, you're condemning us for not fighting and we when pull a smart move you don't change?
12. No. No. No. And no. We are a republic. Not a democracy. NOT AT ALL.
13. We are a republic.
14. What's wrong with supporting somebody? Yeah. So you hate Israel too? And Iraq is a lot better place now.
15. No, we're not. It just so happens the enemy we're fighting is a Muslim enemy. And if you're talking about the mosque at ground zero, we're not racist for that. It is not appropriate for that certain person who's building it to build it at that location.
16. So what if we have a huge military? Our military isn't even a draft, it's an open joining. It just shows how many people are patriots in this country. I don't see you screaming at China for taking people from their home and sending them to the army.
17. Right. And you didn't even list other countries in that. If you added other countries to the equation, then you would find that that number is relatively small.
18. That looks exactly the same as our shuttles. And it isn't about things looking cool, it's about things WORKING well.
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"Tell me this, when in the world did virtual posts gain the ability to crap?" -Monork2 on ROBLOX.com
A republic refers to any country not ruled by a monarch, even dictatorships can be republics.
Dictators and monarchs are one in the same. It's a single person with absolute control over the country. This makes dictatorships mutually exclusive from Republics, in which the people have some amount of control over the government.
I thought you'd contracted a disease that gave you the same metabolism as an oak tree - Maggarg II
It heals all of your goddamn hearts! - kittensamurai
First off, I kind of have a feeling this post is going to get a lot of hype, seeming a lot of people in this community come from a place where the dislike of Americans is pretty high.
I just have a question.
Why?
In 1775 we declared war on the British Empire, in the year 1783 we won the war and became our own free country, we were a Democratic Republic. I see a lot of people claiming that the USA is an Empire. We are of no such thing. We are still a Democratic Republic, not a monarchy or an oligarchy.
In the following years we had a Civil War, the Union was victorious, setting all the black slaves free, but our racism and "Jim Crow" laws didnt end untill the 80's or 90's. We got over that problem, up to that point, we are still a Democratic Republic.
On the date 12,7,41 we where obliterated at Pearl Harbor, our Pacific fleet destroyed, open for attack. The next day, war was declared between the USA and the Axis powers, the US once again in another World War to help out their Allies.
But before the second world war, there was a first. And if an event never happened, we would never have joined the Allies. In the teens we were more likely to enter on the axis side. This all changed when The sinking of the Lusitania cruise ship by a German submarine and the Zimmermann note.
The Lusitania was a passenger ship that a German torpedo hit and sunk, killing about 100 US passengers. This ignited the US to join the allies.
Imagine the US joining the Axis, and then again in WWII. If you look at it, there would be no France, there would be no UK, there would be no Russia, hell, even the US wouldn't exist. But we helped the right people, and we won.
Let's not forget the D-Day landings and paradroppings behind enemy lines the night before. Without the Ameicans the landings would have been a terrible slaughter for the Allies.
In the 60's we went to Vietnam to help out the French and the South Vietnamese, we were abandoned and sent to fight a force that memorized the land like we memorize our rooms. The US never lost a battle in Vietnam, we just lost the war with our week politics, just like always.
The United States is a very important contributor to medicine aswell. Without us, you would still be searching for a cure for Small Pox. We have made HUGE advancements in medical science and Military technology. And without us, there would be a Soviet flag on the moon, and the Soviets would still be in the Middle east, and they would have a huge hand in everything. There would still be a communist Soviet Union.
Now please, i'm not looking for a flame war, i just want a simple explanation, i have nothing against anyone of another country. If you have anything to say just comment back.
Lastly, today, from all the bs we recive from ourselves and others. We are STILL a Democratic republic, we STILL have loyal citizens, we STILL have an amazing Armed Force, and we are STILL on this planet. That is all i have to say.
I see things.
We are all equal.
It's just that some are more-so than others.
This country needs to be run by supercomputers.
Or Peri.
This country is so racist and unequal it's not even funny.
:sleep.gif:
Riight...
But seriously, the system here sucks.
Educational system.
Law system.
Political system.
And then there are the Americans.
What the hell? The USA played a very small role in WWII, and had it joined the Axis, it would have been obliterated. First of all, all their trade with Canada (their biggest trade partner) and the other allies would have been cut off, starving them of resources. The US would have had no oil, cars, or any other vehicles. Also, are you forgetting the Soviet Union, which was pretty much the sole reason that Germany fell? To think that after taking out Germany they would not have finished off a last pest is absurd. And don't even try to say that America would have nuked other countries instead of Japan, because that is not true, either. America only got nukes because of the work of scientists who fled from Germany because of the Nazis. If the US had joined the Axis, then these scientists would have fled to other countries, such as England or Canada. Those countries would have been the ones to develop nuclear weapons, which would have then been used against America.
D-Day was an unnecessary attack on Germany, whose only use was to grab as much land as possible, since it was evident that the Soviet Union was going to win. It is another display of American greed.
I hope you're joking. The smallpox vaccine was invented by Edward Jenner, a BRITISH man.
Thanks America, without you, we wouldn't be able to kill as many people as we do today! What a wonderful benefactor!
Holy ****. You mean to say that a tiny square of cloth on a dry rock orbiting around our planet would have a DIFFERENT PATTERN? GOD BLESS AMERICA FOR SAVING US FROM THAT THREAT.
And why were the Soviets in Afghanistan? To save them from the corrupt government, rebuild the country and create new buildings for the people, and eradicate the Taliban. The very Taliban that the United States created in order to fight back against the Soviet Union. And the very Taliban that now kills countless people every year and presents a threat to most large countries. God bless America.
Oh NO! Communism? That's always bad! A political system where everybody gets equal rights and everything is shared among everyone must be BAD. We NEED inequality, racism, sexism, and the such to bolster the economy, as well as homeless and starving people to lower populations!
Looks like you hated on the Soviet Union pretty bad.
But the problem with your argument is confusing the Stalinist and Mao regimes for true Communism. Neither of those countries were Communist, nowhere close. Tying the actions of crazy, paranoid dictators to the political systems they pretended to support is absurd and irrelevant.
Want me to start pulling numbers from African and Middle Eastern genocides and start tying those to Capitalism?
Come live in Australia, it's where all the cool kids are.
Or don't, we don't need your crap. :happy.gif:
We're also just easy to make fun of. Like how the French are always cowards (despite the fact that french citizens fought for their life after its army gave up in WWII). Americans are considered all fat, despite reports showing a few other countries being worse off and our education system, which needs some sort of work.
Then again, its not like its hard to troll Europeans either, just post a stereotypical "American opinion" and they get all mad.
No.
I do not want a Communist regime in the world, but I do want true Communism. Under true Communism dictators cannot exist, since that creates inequality. In a Communist system, all decisions are made democratically. There are no leaders of any sort.
Okay.
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Curse PremiumAmerica seems to have this idea that it is the forefront of everything, it controls the world. It's stupid, the only thing I'm thankful for is the fact that because of the US, the western world can hold a democracy without being assaulted by dictatorial countries.
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Retired StaffI goddamn hate this country. We make the stupidest descisions.
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Retired Staff1. Cuba, we really ****ed it up. If you wonder why Castro doesn't like the US, look up the Bay of Pigs Invasion.
2. We did something similar in Venezuela in 2002.
3. We staged a coup against an Iraqi leader we didn't like. The replacement was the Baathist party.
4. We supported both sides of the Iraq-Iran war.
I could go on, but the point is that we have a very long history of ****ing around with the politics of other countries. This behavior mostly started in the 1950's, replacing anti-American regimes with pro-American ones. We continue such behavior to this day with "Operation Iraqi Freedom". This is what leads people to call us imperialistic. It's because we are. We want to make the entire world love the US, even if it involves beating them into submission.
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Retired StaffNever mind that it's clearly a knock-off of the American design (since it took the US 4 years to work out the shape of the orbiter) with a few alterations (mainly the propulsion systems and the nose cones of the boosters, which is really the only difference most people would ever notice). And I'm not sure what your definition of "worked" was. The system was launched once and orbited Earth twice and the life support system and software wasn't fully installed.
Of course, you're judging on looks, not capability. MrQuizzles already pointed out some less shallow and actual objective problems. You know...arguments that don't rely on you going "look, they made the nose cones of their boosters touch the external tank! That makes it cool!"
1. The USA is a republic. It isn't a democracy.
2 & 3. The less people that die in a war, the better.
4. But they didn't.
5. Yeah, because 1 war where one country does better than another is bad.
6. See 2 & 3.
7. What's wrong with that? Japan REFUSED to surrender and the USA screwed with them. That just showed how powerful the USA is, and your complaining. Yet in the rest of the way you're complaining because the USA isn't powerful enough.
8. I think there was. The USSR needed to be brought down. If they continued we likely wouldn't be in the same world today.
9. No, it doesn't . But there are next to none non-dictatorship communist states.
10. I think we already controlled the Panama canal then. And we signed it away. Which was a stupid mistake.
11. I think this is an extremely smart move. Again, you're condemning us for not fighting and we when pull a smart move you don't change?
12. No. No. No. And no. We are a republic. Not a democracy. NOT AT ALL.
13. We are a republic.
14. What's wrong with supporting somebody? Yeah. So you hate Israel too? And Iraq is a lot better place now.
15. No, we're not. It just so happens the enemy we're fighting is a Muslim enemy. And if you're talking about the mosque at ground zero, we're not racist for that. It is not appropriate for that certain person who's building it to build it at that location.
16. So what if we have a huge military? Our military isn't even a draft, it's an open joining. It just shows how many people are patriots in this country. I don't see you screaming at China for taking people from their home and sending them to the army.
17. Right. And you didn't even list other countries in that. If you added other countries to the equation, then you would find that that number is relatively small.
18. That looks exactly the same as our shuttles. And it isn't about things looking cool, it's about things WORKING well.
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Retired StaffDictators and monarchs are one in the same. It's a single person with absolute control over the country. This makes dictatorships mutually exclusive from Republics, in which the people have some amount of control over the government.
I'm moving to New Zealand.
It heals all of your goddamn hearts! - kittensamurai