I'm opening myself up as flame bait here by agreeing with the OP, but... well, I agree with the OP.
I would also contribute that since 1.3_01, there has been a bit of talk about the fact that the increased slime spawns, coupled with an apparently very old slime bug, has resulted in QUITE a bit of aggravation. I had hoped that this might get a quick bit of attention in this update, but from the look of it, they got off on the wolf tangent, realized April 1 was shortly to arrive, threw in the April Fools joke, and hurried an incomplete update out the door.
In short, wolves and airships and mod integration are wonderful things, but I really wish that Mojang would focus on bug fixes (at least for more prevalent and/or detracting bugs) BEFORE adding new content. Heck, they have an entire community bug hunting for them, right?
I think he has "overdone" it by the ability of taming more than one wolve.
If you had only one the pathfinding wouldnt be so bad and it would teleport so annoyingly.
Also you would have a closer relationship to it.
I think he has "overdone" it by the ability of taming more than one wolve.
If you had only one the pathfinding wouldnt be so bad and it would teleport so annoyingly.
Also you would have a closer relationship to it.
You are correct.
Also the ability to have a bunch of wolves in multiplayer could provide huge griefing potential. I think the ability to tame more than one should be given a second thought.
At op and Wingnut.
I disagree but nice argument you have there.
Here why i do disagree:
In this case, I think an idea has been suggested that is totally secondary to the core gameplay of Minecraft, which to my mind revolves around exploration and construction. Wolves have nothing to do with either of these. They are entirely secondary to the core gameplay experience.
Monster behavior are a core element of survival because without them, survival simply become creative with tedious and repetitive work for ressource. The wolves is probably one of the best mob to create first in my view. The code of their behavior and the new pathfinding will permit to create alot of different friendly, neutral and hostile mob.
Here an exemple, the pathfinding will permit hostile mob, at term, to follow you around without being stuck in tree or are able to find hole in your defense system.
The OP is completely right in the fact that to get them to that point, they are going to require one of the most code-heavy overhauls that Minecraft has ever seen. To this date, there has been nothing like it. All of the current mobs use the same AI, but to develop the wolf (which, I believe notch will do, because as stated before, pets are a whole new can of worms) weeks, if not months of development time is going to have to be devoted to them. This effectively delays the development of new mobs, monster villages, and any other pipe dreams out there.
And how the hell will he add new mobs and monsters villages without alot of work done on AI? By having 50 differents monsters and all the village inhabitant wandering around like sheep ?
No thanks, AI is a core feature of all game, it is, in fact amazing that we are even in beta without atleast an half-decent ai.
They needed to start somewhere, why not wolve ?
Only an idiot code all monsters seperatly without taking code from the previous one for the behavior that are the same.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Quote from Noofertonson »
"Oh lol i was building and a creeper went SSSS OOH LOL! DEY ALWAYS EXP{OLEDE YOUR STUFFZ!!"
I understand wolves aren't doing anything for you and your playstyle, but if you take anything from my post just have an open mind before completely ignoring everything the wolves add just because you want this game to invoke feelings of loneliness just like it did when you first started playing. Multiplayer alone should show you that the lonely feeling you got from playing is NOT the only feeling that this game should give.
I am certainly not discounting Tamagotchi as a valid form of gameplay, and I hear you on the lonliness.
However, I will ask you if having a half brain-dead mongoloid following you through an otherwise lonely world helps to ease that loneliness or increase it? Somehow, it makes me think of the plot to "Of Mice and Men". If you have something rediculously stupid following you around reminding you that you are in an artificial world (or that you are otherwise "different"), doesn't it just increase your sense of loneliness and isolation?
So, in other words, for the wolves to help with the lonliness, they have to be at least somewhat smart, which I think returns us to my original point about them requiring decent pathfinding and a wide range of behaviors to be convincing. You can't really compare a simple AI entity to playing with other (hopefully) intelligent people on a multiplayer server.
Tamagotchi-type games offer a great gameplay experience, and one that enjoy myself. However, there is a HUGE reason why these kinds of games focus entirely around the pets themselves. It takes a huge amount of development effort to create a convincing pet.
I can't think of a single game that has been successful in just "tagging on" a pet to a design that was really about something else entirely. Again, Peter Molyneux is notorious for doing exactly that (which is one of the reasons I think he may be the developer behind this suggestion), and his most successful attempt, by far, was probably Black & White, which was more a game about a pet with other aspects added on, than a game about other aspects that had a pet tagged on. Fable II had a somewhat decent dog, but in the end, how much did it really add to the game, and how much development time had to go into it to get it to the point where it was?
And how the hell will he add new mobs and monsters villages without alot of work done on AI? By having 50 differents monsters and all the village inhabitant wandering around like sheep ?
No thanks, AI is a core feature of all game, it is, in fact amazing that we are even in beta without atleast an half-decent ai.
A valid argument, indeed. Perhaps this will turn out for the best.
Regardless, time will tell. Either notch will use Wolves as a stepping stone for more advanced AI, or they will remain a unimportant (albeit cute) secondary feature. As I said before. we shall see.
Wait, you're saying that it's a good thing mobs have been stupid and predictable enough to be easily farmed with some exploits?
Nobody said that.
Actually, I think he's referring to what I was saying about the rather stupid creatures resulting in emergent gameplay with players building mob-traps in my OP.
And yes, I do think that's a good thing, and do not consider the traps to be exploits.
At a certain point in the game, you are inevitably looking for cool stuff to build, and new projects to undertake. The possibility of mob traps opens up a whole range of different projects to play with.
I know I must have spent a good 20 hours of play time experimenting with different mob traps, and building a maximum height tower (all ligit), and I still focus most construction and mining efforts around the area of the trap as I am slowly lighting up every cave and piece of terrain within the spawning area to maximize the effeciency of that trap.
I have had a lot of fun doing this, and yes, I think the game would suffer if the AI were "fixed" to not make this possible.
I agree 100% with OP, and it's pretty obvious which morons went "TL;DR" and completely missed OP's point.
I'd much rather Notch work on weather (I can has falling snow back please? D: ), Minecart stuff, redstone stuff (though I admittedly barely know anything about redstone mechanics, the entire concept is awesome and I have loads of respect for the people who churn out amazing redstone stuff) than dump tons of resources into pet AI. It's a cool idea, but let's be frank, the AI in this game is incredibly stupid so I imagine it will take a lot of time and effort to make pet AI even remotely intelligent.
At the moment I can't play more than 5 minutes without crashing, but I doubt that I will bother with wolves apart from the initial novelty factor. I really like the feeling of loneliness I get when playing SSP, and wolves just take away that kind of experience imho.
EDIT: Seriously, though, when am I getting my falling snow back? My very first alpha world was a snow one and I really really miss it. Snow worlds were magical.
Either way, I'm completely against wolves because they're taking time away from developing much more important things in the game.
Excuse me, but you're the only one here who thinks that.
I was just about to mention that you appear to be a very poorly skilled troll.
I would also contribute that since 1.3_01, there has been a bit of talk about the fact that the increased slime spawns, coupled with an apparently very old slime bug, has resulted in QUITE a bit of aggravation. I had hoped that this might get a quick bit of attention in this update, but from the look of it, they got off on the wolf tangent, realized April 1 was shortly to arrive, threw in the April Fools joke, and hurried an incomplete update out the door.
In short, wolves and airships and mod integration are wonderful things, but I really wish that Mojang would focus on bug fixes (at least for more prevalent and/or detracting bugs) BEFORE adding new content. Heck, they have an entire community bug hunting for them, right?
There's nothing wrong with being flamed if it's coming from a bunch of incompetent children, which is almost always the case.
Hah... Hah hah... I see what you did there.
If you had only one the pathfinding wouldnt be so bad and it would teleport so annoyingly.
Also you would have a closer relationship to it.
You are correct.
Also the ability to have a bunch of wolves in multiplayer could provide huge griefing potential. I think the ability to tame more than one should be given a second thought.
Nobody said that.
I disagree but nice argument you have there.
Here why i do disagree:
Monster behavior are a core element of survival because without them, survival simply become creative with tedious and repetitive work for ressource. The wolves is probably one of the best mob to create first in my view. The code of their behavior and the new pathfinding will permit to create alot of different friendly, neutral and hostile mob.
Here an exemple, the pathfinding will permit hostile mob, at term, to follow you around without being stuck in tree or are able to find hole in your defense system.
And how the hell will he add new mobs and monsters villages without alot of work done on AI? By having 50 differents monsters and all the village inhabitant wandering around like sheep ?
No thanks, AI is a core feature of all game, it is, in fact amazing that we are even in beta without atleast an half-decent ai.
They needed to start somewhere, why not wolve ?
Only an idiot code all monsters seperatly without taking code from the previous one for the behavior that are the same.
I am certainly not discounting Tamagotchi as a valid form of gameplay, and I hear you on the lonliness.
However, I will ask you if having a half brain-dead mongoloid following you through an otherwise lonely world helps to ease that loneliness or increase it? Somehow, it makes me think of the plot to "Of Mice and Men". If you have something rediculously stupid following you around reminding you that you are in an artificial world (or that you are otherwise "different"), doesn't it just increase your sense of loneliness and isolation?
So, in other words, for the wolves to help with the lonliness, they have to be at least somewhat smart, which I think returns us to my original point about them requiring decent pathfinding and a wide range of behaviors to be convincing. You can't really compare a simple AI entity to playing with other (hopefully) intelligent people on a multiplayer server.
Tamagotchi-type games offer a great gameplay experience, and one that enjoy myself. However, there is a HUGE reason why these kinds of games focus entirely around the pets themselves. It takes a huge amount of development effort to create a convincing pet.
I can't think of a single game that has been successful in just "tagging on" a pet to a design that was really about something else entirely. Again, Peter Molyneux is notorious for doing exactly that (which is one of the reasons I think he may be the developer behind this suggestion), and his most successful attempt, by far, was probably Black & White, which was more a game about a pet with other aspects added on, than a game about other aspects that had a pet tagged on. Fable II had a somewhat decent dog, but in the end, how much did it really add to the game, and how much development time had to go into it to get it to the point where it was?
Did you miss the part where I stated I was putting things in terms you might be able to understand?
Double-pwned.
A valid argument, indeed. Perhaps this will turn out for the best.
Regardless, time will tell. Either notch will use Wolves as a stepping stone for more advanced AI, or they will remain a unimportant (albeit cute) secondary feature. As I said before. we shall see.
-J
I think your efforts to communicate with this being are futile. Best to just ignore it.
Actually, I think he's referring to what I was saying about the rather stupid creatures resulting in emergent gameplay with players building mob-traps in my OP.
And yes, I do think that's a good thing, and do not consider the traps to be exploits.
At a certain point in the game, you are inevitably looking for cool stuff to build, and new projects to undertake. The possibility of mob traps opens up a whole range of different projects to play with.
I know I must have spent a good 20 hours of play time experimenting with different mob traps, and building a maximum height tower (all ligit), and I still focus most construction and mining efforts around the area of the trap as I am slowly lighting up every cave and piece of terrain within the spawning area to maximize the effeciency of that trap.
I have had a lot of fun doing this, and yes, I think the game would suffer if the AI were "fixed" to not make this possible.
I'd much rather Notch work on weather (I can has falling snow back please? D: ), Minecart stuff, redstone stuff (though I admittedly barely know anything about redstone mechanics, the entire concept is awesome and I have loads of respect for the people who churn out amazing redstone stuff) than dump tons of resources into pet AI. It's a cool idea, but let's be frank, the AI in this game is incredibly stupid so I imagine it will take a lot of time and effort to make pet AI even remotely intelligent.
At the moment I can't play more than 5 minutes without crashing, but I doubt that I will bother with wolves apart from the initial novelty factor. I really like the feeling of loneliness I get when playing SSP, and wolves just take away that kind of experience imho.
EDIT: Seriously, though, when am I getting my falling snow back? My very first alpha world was a snow one and I really really miss it. Snow worlds were magical.
PAIN FOREST, THE BIOME FOR MEN
Hehe...yes, futile, but really really funny :smile.gif:
I think it injects a bit of levity into an otherwise serious thread :wink.gif:
Total tangent, but can someone fill me in on what "TL;DR" is supposed to mean?
I must have skipped that class of "internet jargon 101" :smile.gif:
It means 'Too Long, Didn't Read'. For those who can't be bothered to devote time to something as boring as 'reading'.