Ok, I should have expected as much knowing how terrible the minecraft community is, but I digress. Clearly your ignorance is blocking my points and facts from getting by in any way, so seeing as that completely nullifies any point in arguing, I will refrain from doing so, and I hope you till too, (although, again knowing the minecraft community, that's like asking vegetarian to eat a steak).
So one person disproving what you said = minecraft community is terrible? Okay.
If this community is so bad, why are you still here? Why are you still spamming upvotes to everyone who supports the idea? Hell, why do you have herobrine slapped all over your profile? You got some serious growing up to do.
So one person disproving what you said = minecraft community is terrible? Okay.
If this community is so bad, why are you still here? Why are you still spamming upvotes to everyone who supports the idea? Hell, why do you have herobrine slapped all over your profile? You got some serious growing up to do.
Did I ever say the minecraft community is terrible because of one person? I don't believe I did. As to why I am still here I am supporting this idea and defending it against ignorant people who fail to see the facts. And about herobrine? So what if I have it as my avatar, does that change anything? "You got some serious growing up to do". I'm sorry, I didn't know that you are the authority on what my age is, and how mature I am. My deepest apologies.
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When you get screwed by admins but you can't do anyhting because they are admins. That feeling of injustice.
Awesome! Would add more to my minecraft world, and'd be cool for multiplayer pvp encounters. Support.
Also, it'd be awesome to trade outside of villages.
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", cursive">Call me Izanami, Izanamix, IZANATRAILMIX! ", cursive">.
Yeah, there it is. "Oh wait, is someone daring to argue with me? Yeah, community is terrible." No, it's not the community, it's you.
I'm arguing with someone who has Herobrine in his avatar and sig. If you're gonna defend yourself, do it, don't do the "yeah the community is ignorant so um i'm just gonna not say anything anymore." That's cowardice backpedaling. Your post on comparing horses to this idea was stupid.
If you really wanna prove us wrong, go make those mobs you said you could in a few hours.
Again, did I ever say the community is terrible because of ONE PERSON? I did not. And why is everyone so focused on my avatar? Is it really that big of a deal that back in the day I thought it would be funny to support the herobrine meme? And how I decided to stop arguing about the idea is due to the fact that it was going NOWHERE, because people wouldn't see my points. And I will prove you wrong, and I will make that mob, you have my word.Since everyone seems so fixated on my avatar, I will change it to stop the useless comments about it.
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When you get screwed by admins but you can't do anyhting because they are admins. That feeling of injustice.
I know. This mob, in regards to an RPG, does not create problems. It is a mob with an RPG-ish overtone, like the game itself. The reason I said that they're not very frequent is the fact that the only way for it to start making it an "RPG problem" is if the mob spawned everywhere and you were getting "'quest' requests" all the time and such.
That's true. Mostly anyways. The quests argument is getting real old, so I'll move onto something else. These travelers being human mobs - another things that's frowned upon. Minecraft has thrived extremely well on the whole "you're alone and very close to being the only human around". And these travelers kind of spoil that. Not to mention these travelers are very similar to players and villagers mashed together.
Even if the suggestion creates no problem and can be avoided with no effort, that doesn't act as a saving grace. For example: I suggest a floating ghostly clown face that descends from the sky every now and then. Sometimes the face can appear in your house. It doesn't do anything and it barely blocks your view.
Chances are, the clown face would still be a rejected thing as it's not very fitting. Not that I'm saying your idea is that ridiculous though. But you know what I'm driving at.
This is the most valid argument to me. Could you state some ways it could be exploited please? I'll see if I can tweak the mob to fix it.
Looks like you fixed a lot of those exploit issues already, but there are still some other issues and possible exploits.
The chance thing. That's an annoying thing to memorize, and even more so since different travelers have different chances to do something. Another minus is that they could suddenly attack you because some small reason.
Simple trapping. There's infinite possibilities in trap making, and it wouldn't be hard to just leave some around for these travelers to get stuck so "they can come to you", rather than you seeking out them so much.
Mob grinding. You can trap the travelers somewhere as well as hostile mobs, and the travelers will finish off the hostile mobs so you can come in and sweep the drops. Though the traveler still has a chance of getting killed himself.
The joining part. We have enough helping mobs. An iron golem on a lead is way more than enough for us.
The "defend" part. It's still possible to surround them in something, kill the mobs, and bam, easy reward. I don't think there's a solution to that, but I hope I'm wrong there.
The dialogue options. Worded dialogue + Minecraft = still no. I know I've said a lot of times now.
The "acquaintance" stage thing. That seems to be more mechanics than what's really necessary. They also take "breaks". Note how iron golems and wolves can just keep going forever without the worry for that stuff.
Supplying the travelers. You have to worry about not only their health (as normal) but you gotta manage there armor too. More micromanaging. Not so fun. They also act like mobile chests which can be overpowered.
"Well, it would stick out." Not really. It fights the same, trades the same, etc. It depends on if you like the mobs having an extremely basic act pattern.
The fighting and trading parts is not what sticks out, it's everything else that does.
Also, how do we not need any more helpers? Yes, it is not necessary, but it's also not redundant. We have three helpers: Snow Golems, Iron Golems, and tamed wolves. This mob is unique.
You forgot Ocelots, which aren't the most useful things in the world, but hey. Your mob is only fractionally unique, as again, it has the abilities of players and villagers mashed together. The traveler as an ally is also a complete upgrade from a wolf.
Again, did I ever say the community is terrible because of ONE PERSON? I did not.
You didn't need to. 0_Zippy attacked some of your points, and instead of correcting him or defending yourself, you jumped straight "AUGH THIS COMMUNITY AUGH!!" and said nothing else. Regardless of whether he was right or wrong, 0_Zippy doesn't represent an entire forum.
And I will prove you wrong, and I will make that mob, you have my word.
I would actually love to see that. We're talking exactly how the OP described the mob? Not even Mojang gave us anything that detailed. Dude, if you pull that off, I will remove all my rebuttal posts and give you constant upvotes for like a week.
You didn't need to. 0_Zippy attacked some of your points, and instead of correcting him or defending yourself, you jumped straight "AUGH THIS COMMUNITY AUGH!!" and said nothing else. Regardless of whether he was right or wrong, 0_Zippy doesn't represent an entire forum.
I would actually love to see that. We're talking exactly how the OP described the mob? Not even Mojang gave us anything that detailed. Dude, if you pull that off, I will remove all my rebuttal posts and give you constant upvotes for like a week.
I never said I hate the community because Of someone arguing. I simply said I should have expected as much knowing the community. On your point about making the mob, I assure you it will happen (although the constant upvotes aren't necessary), although not for a month or so as I try to figure some thinks out first with my computer.
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When you get screwed by admins but you can't do anyhting because they are admins. That feeling of injustice.
Great idea. It looks quite good and i think that it fits quite well into the current minecraft. You could create some probability trees so people won't have to read everything as the first thing. A probability tree would have made it a lot easier for me to start reading this post.
Netherless, nice and neat idea, create those probability trees and I'll give you my support
I think I will make one of those to depict the mob for an easier way to understand. Good idea.
EDIT: Okay, maybe I won't... Unless somebody could show me a program/site where it's really easy to make a tree diagram, this will take me forever!
Looks like you fixed a lot of those exploit issues already, but there are still some other issues and possible exploits.
The chance thing. That's an annoying thing to memorize, and even more so since different travelers have different chances to do something. Another minus is that they could suddenly attack you because some small reason. It has a lot of outcomes/possibilities, but I think that's pretty cool. It's spontaneous. Also, them attacking you means you should be on the edge when dealing with them, which, again, is spontaneous and fun.
Simple trapping. There's infinite possibilities in trap making, and it wouldn't be hard to just leave some around for these travelers to get stuck so "they can come to you", rather than you seeking out them so much. Yeah... that is a flaw with the mob that I'm not sure how to handle.
Mob grinding. You can trap the travelers somewhere as well as hostile mobs, and the travelers will finish off the hostile mobs so you can come in and sweep the drops. Though the traveler still has a chance of getting killed himself. I think it'd die before he could clear a load of mobs (or enough for the player to really benefit from the drops).
The joining part. We have enough helping mobs. An iron golem on a lead is way more than enough for us. I don't know, man. I think the mob is unique enough the have.
The "defend" part. It's still possible to surround them in something, kill the mobs, and bam, easy reward. I don't think there's a solution to that, but I hope I'm wrong there. I still need to fix this. But I'm sure I will come up with something.
The dialogue options. Worded dialogue + Minecraft = still no. I know I've said a lot of times now. I might get rid of the dialogue.
The "acquaintance" stage thing. That seems to be more mechanics than what's really necessary. They also take "breaks". Note how iron golems and wolves can just keep going forever without the worry for that stuff. The Traveller is, in many ways, more powerful than these mobs (trading, different types of attacks [for example, you have an archer], etc.). So these things help to balance it out.
Supplying the travelers. You have to worry about not only their health (as normal) but you gotta manage there armor too. More micromanaging. Not so fun. They also act like mobile chests which can be overpowered. The inventory of the Traveller can only hold certain items, like a lot for food, slot for a weapon, armour, etc.
I like most of it. The main thing I disagree with is the fact that there is a 20 block limit in which the villager will follow you. I don't think there should be a raidus limit, only a time limit as the chances of a traveler spawning within 20 blocks of your base seems a bit unlikely given the statistics provided in your post.
Hmm, I see. I should change that. What were you thinking about the time limit?
It has a lot of outcomes/possibilities, but I think that's pretty cool. It's spontaneous. Also, them attacking you means you should be on the edge when dealing with them, which, again, is spontaneous and fun.
I understand what you're driving at here. You're going for something that gives different outcomes so it has that "replay value". For lack of a better term. But what you described is still kind of an opinion thing. Yes, some people could see this as a fun on-the-edge thing.
However, others could see it as an unpredictable, unfun nuisance. Especially the parts where your travelers could start attacking you for very minuscule reasons, which would add to the nuisance part.
What if a traveler is passing by and I don't care about him, then a troll skeleton shoots and knocks me within "aware" range of the traveler, and I get that 10% chance that the traveler attacks me? Not the best example, but again, you know where I'm going.
I think it'd die before he could clear a load of mobs (or enough for the player to really benefit from the drops).
See, again. You aren't thinking of the near infinite possibilities here. The traveler could be trapped with just one zombie. Maybe two zombies. Maybe one enderman. Maybe one slime and two zombies. The list goes on forever...
I still need to fix this. But I'm sure I will come up with something.
The only option I see there is to remove the quest. Unless the traveler had more complex backbreaking amounts of code that "detected" if he was barricaded, but that'd make no sense because the traveler would want to be barricaded. He wouldn't go "no, that's cheating! i choose to not be protected to make this quest more fair!!"
The Traveller is, in many ways, more powerful than these mobs (trading, different types of attacks [for example, you have an archer], etc.). So these things help to balance it out.
Oh wow, so this thing is actually more overpowered than an iron golem on a lead. I'm sorry, there is not a snowball's chance in hell this is balanced at all. Not if you can give it diamond armor and a diamond sword and such. On top of that, this thing is still a walking chest.
Overall, there is too much grey area for this mob. What I mean is, you have Problem A, so you give it Solution A. But Solution A now creates Problem B and C. So you come up with Solution B and C and now created Problem D, E and F. This mob is complex enough that there doesn't seem to be a happy medium unless some things get removed outright.
I'm gonna have to side with Proiclan on this thing being an ally mob part. Take a good look how at how the current helper mobs are balanced. I'll try to make it look interesting.
Iron Golems - Do lots of damage, have lots of health. But they don't care to follow you and you can't exactly choose who they attack as they do it by proximity. Yes, leads do help big time, but they can still get quirky and not do exactly what you want.
Wolves - Do mediocre damage and have mediocre health, but they always attack attacked you and you have much more control over what they do.
Ocelots - Not exactly little feline tanks, but they do ward off the most destructive mob in the Overworld.
Snow Golems - Underpowered, but are still worth making distractions. Maybe.
Now onto your traveler.
Traveler- Has it's own inventory. Can hold weapons. Can have armor. You can direct them as easily as the wolf. So they have the direct attention of wolves and can do/sustain more damage than or equal to an iron golem. This mob completely breaks the balance barrier.
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The Unofficial Suggestion Guide - Everything you need to know to not make goofy mistakes in a suggestion! Honestly though, you should really go there.
Okay, guys. This time, I actually have been thinking about the issues. I am removing a huge portion of the Traveller mob.
The points made by users such as Theriasis, Proiclan, and 0_Zippy are very valid. The mob would suffer from various issues such as, but not limited to:
Exploitation
Being incongruous (very complex mob, while many other mobs are extremely basic)
Balance issues
Before somebody says this, no, I'm not "cracking under pressure" because I got some negative posts. I was admittedly a little soaked up in my mob idea, but now I'm accepting many of the arguments. They are true.
I thank everybody that has commented so far. To the supporters, thanks, and I hope you'll continue to support. To the criticizers, thank you, too. I actually like this mob more now. It is much easier to grasp, and I don't know, it just makes more sense.
Also, to the supporters: we need to think about how this could be applied to vanilla Minecraft. AI problems in general, it being way more complex than other mobs and not fitting in, fulfilling a similar purpose to Iron Golems and such, etc., all make this vanilla idea farfetched. As a mod, sure. Mods don't have to be fitting to vanilla. When you start thinking about it, the flaws in this mob will become much more apparent.
I'm not finished tweaking this mob. I'm, of course, still open to criticism, and I will be changing things as time goes on. I'm also in a little bit of a rush, so I haven't done a lot of changes to the changed post yet. It probably still needs some refinement. For example, I'm thinking about only having one or two types of Travellers (the Survivalist is... meh).
He's doing the smart thing. He's listening and making improvements instead of going "omg my idea is gooood you guys jus dun't understand shut uuuppppp!!!!!"
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Hey, you there. Yes, you! Are you thinking about posting a suggestion on the forums anytime soon? If so, please read this before doing so.
He's doing the smart thing. He's listening and making improvements instead of going "omg my idea is gooood you guys jus dun't understand shut uuuppppp!!!!!"
I was making a joke. You don't need to become all defensive and getting involved with things that don't involve you.
So one person disproving what you said = minecraft community is terrible? Okay.
If this community is so bad, why are you still here? Why are you still spamming upvotes to everyone who supports the idea? Hell, why do you have herobrine slapped all over your profile? You got some serious growing up to do.
Did I ever say the minecraft community is terrible because of one person? I don't believe I did. As to why I am still here I am supporting this idea and defending it against ignorant people who fail to see the facts. And about herobrine? So what if I have it as my avatar, does that change anything? "You got some serious growing up to do". I'm sorry, I didn't know that you are the authority on what my age is, and how mature I am. My deepest apologies.
Also, it'd be awesome to trade outside of villages.
", cursive">Call me Izanami, Izanamix, IZANATRAILMIX!
", cursive">.
Again, did I ever say the community is terrible because of ONE PERSON? I did not. And why is everyone so focused on my avatar? Is it really that big of a deal that back in the day I thought it would be funny to support the herobrine meme? And how I decided to stop arguing about the idea is due to the fact that it was going NOWHERE, because people wouldn't see my points. And I will prove you wrong, and I will make that mob, you have my word.Since everyone seems so fixated on my avatar, I will change it to stop the useless comments about it.
That's true. Mostly anyways. The quests argument is getting real old, so I'll move onto something else. These travelers being human mobs - another things that's frowned upon. Minecraft has thrived extremely well on the whole "you're alone and very close to being the only human around". And these travelers kind of spoil that. Not to mention these travelers are very similar to players and villagers mashed together.
Even if the suggestion creates no problem and can be avoided with no effort, that doesn't act as a saving grace. For example: I suggest a floating ghostly clown face that descends from the sky every now and then. Sometimes the face can appear in your house. It doesn't do anything and it barely blocks your view.
Chances are, the clown face would still be a rejected thing as it's not very fitting. Not that I'm saying your idea is that ridiculous though. But you know what I'm driving at.
Looks like you fixed a lot of those exploit issues already, but there are still some other issues and possible exploits.
The fighting and trading parts is not what sticks out, it's everything else that does.
You forgot Ocelots, which aren't the most useful things in the world, but hey. Your mob is only fractionally unique, as again, it has the abilities of players and villagers mashed together. The traveler as an ally is also a complete upgrade from a wolf.
You didn't need to. 0_Zippy attacked some of your points, and instead of correcting him or defending yourself, you jumped straight "AUGH THIS COMMUNITY AUGH!!" and said nothing else. Regardless of whether he was right or wrong, 0_Zippy doesn't represent an entire forum.
I would actually love to see that. We're talking exactly how the OP described the mob? Not even Mojang gave us anything that detailed. Dude, if you pull that off, I will remove all my rebuttal posts and give you constant upvotes for like a week.
I never said I hate the community because Of someone arguing. I simply said I should have expected as much knowing the community. On your point about making the mob, I assure you it will happen (although the constant upvotes aren't necessary), although not for a month or so as I try to figure some thinks out first with my computer.
I think I will make one of those to depict the mob for an easier way to understand. Good idea.
EDIT: Okay, maybe I won't... Unless somebody could show me a program/site where it's really easy to make a tree diagram, this will take me forever!
You have some good points.
Hmm, I see. I should change that. What were you thinking about the time limit?
I understand what you're driving at here. You're going for something that gives different outcomes so it has that "replay value". For lack of a better term. But what you described is still kind of an opinion thing. Yes, some people could see this as a fun on-the-edge thing.
However, others could see it as an unpredictable, unfun nuisance. Especially the parts where your travelers could start attacking you for very minuscule reasons, which would add to the nuisance part.
What if a traveler is passing by and I don't care about him, then a troll skeleton shoots and knocks me within "aware" range of the traveler, and I get that 10% chance that the traveler attacks me? Not the best example, but again, you know where I'm going.
See, again. You aren't thinking of the near infinite possibilities here. The traveler could be trapped with just one zombie. Maybe two zombies. Maybe one enderman. Maybe one slime and two zombies. The list goes on forever...
The only option I see there is to remove the quest. Unless the traveler had more complex backbreaking amounts of code that "detected" if he was barricaded, but that'd make no sense because the traveler would want to be barricaded. He wouldn't go "no, that's cheating! i choose to not be protected to make this quest more fair!!"
Oh wow, so this thing is actually more overpowered than an iron golem on a lead. I'm sorry, there is not a snowball's chance in hell this is balanced at all. Not if you can give it diamond armor and a diamond sword and such. On top of that, this thing is still a walking chest.
Overall, there is too much grey area for this mob. What I mean is, you have Problem A, so you give it Solution A. But Solution A now creates Problem B and C. So you come up with Solution B and C and now created Problem D, E and F. This mob is complex enough that there doesn't seem to be a happy medium unless some things get removed outright.
- Iron Golems - Do lots of damage, have lots of health. But they don't care to follow you and you can't exactly choose who they attack as they do it by proximity. Yes, leads do help big time, but they can still get quirky and not do exactly what you want.
- Wolves - Do mediocre damage and have mediocre health, but they always attack attacked you and you have much more control over what they do.
- Ocelots - Not exactly little feline tanks, but they do ward off the most destructive mob in the Overworld.
- Snow Golems - Underpowered, but are still worth making distractions. Maybe.
Now onto your traveler.The Unofficial Suggestion Guide - Everything you need to know to not make goofy mistakes in a suggestion! Honestly though, you should really go there.
You have my Support!
The points made by users such as Theriasis, Proiclan, and 0_Zippy are very valid. The mob would suffer from various issues such as, but not limited to:
- Exploitation
- Being incongruous (very complex mob, while many other mobs are extremely basic)
- Balance issues
Before somebody says this, no, I'm not "cracking under pressure" because I got some negative posts. I was admittedly a little soaked up in my mob idea, but now I'm accepting many of the arguments. They are true.I thank everybody that has commented so far. To the supporters, thanks, and I hope you'll continue to support. To the criticizers, thank you, too. I actually like this mob more now. It is much easier to grasp, and I don't know, it just makes more sense.
Also, to the supporters: we need to think about how this could be applied to vanilla Minecraft. AI problems in general, it being way more complex than other mobs and not fitting in, fulfilling a similar purpose to Iron Golems and such, etc., all make this vanilla idea farfetched. As a mod, sure. Mods don't have to be fitting to vanilla. When you start thinking about it, the flaws in this mob will become much more apparent.
I'm not finished tweaking this mob. I'm, of course, still open to criticism, and I will be changing things as time goes on. I'm also in a little bit of a rush, so I haven't done a lot of changes to the changed post yet. It probably still needs some refinement. For example, I'm thinking about only having one or two types of Travellers (the Survivalist is... meh).
Senseless post.
He's doing the smart thing. He's listening and making improvements instead of going "omg my idea is gooood you guys jus dun't understand shut uuuppppp!!!!!"
I was making a joke. You don't need to become all defensive and getting involved with things that don't involve you.
Some people.