Minecraft Forums

am I the only one who's tired of all the new things?

Please tell me I'm not.

I know I've seen threads like this before, but it's seriously frustrating.

Every update, since alpha, has run slower and slower. Even on my gaming desktop, Minecraft is slow as hell.

Bug fixes need to be done, not just small fixes like 1.5 had, bur serious game engine fixes and updates.

STOP adding new items, address old buggy items, address problems with the Linux version (Including bugs that are still in it, since alpha.) Address horrid FPS.

I know I'm not the only one who's been having issues with Minecraft getting slower and slower every version.

it's awful.

Minecraft used to run over 200FPS on my gaming desktop (numbers from beta 1.8)

Now, as of 1.5, my FPS has been sitting between 30 and 40.
1.4 it sat around 60-70FPS

that's a serious difference. how?

My specs:
AMD Phenom IIx4 955BE
8GB DDR3 Ram, 10666mhz
AMD Radeon HD7870 2gb 1GhZ edition.

it's definitely not a weak computer, it can run Metro maxed @30fps+

So really, what's the deal? People have been begging since the end of beta (and even before that) for Mojang to stop adding things, and fix previously released things (since they can't even release fully working features without having to put out 3 patches for each version.) and focus on FPS and bugs.

One thing Mojang seriously should consider is hiring a competent programmer, not a "game developer" but someone with a professional development background in Java, who can actually get things done properly.

Actually, another thing Mojang should do is learn to listen to their community better, and stick to their promises. (mod API, better lighting for 1.5, things like that.)

Update: after further testing, I've noticed the FPS dip into the mid 20's underground and in jungles. I've also noticed FPS dipping down to around 27 while building.

I cant agree more
1 up and dancing dogs and bugs.
And imaginary diamonds.

Methinks you haven't been reading the changelogs.
At all.
There were a few bad FPS drops, but you have to realize that optomization and bug fixes do not simply consist of making the game run faster.
Second, all I've seen since beta has been performance boosts. In 1.8 I got 30 FPS, in the latest snapshots and updates I've gotten 50.
Furthermore, I get 50 FPS on the highest settings on a computer a lot worse than yours, with the only drop in performance being near redstone (which just got rewritten, so I expect it to be slightly laggy, and even as it is, it's not as bad as it could be).

Finally, you comment about "hiring a competent programmer" is pretentious to say the least, and I'm willing to be that you don't know a single thing about code, and that you probably wouldn't know the difference between Java and Javascript. So I would advise you to shut your trap and let the people who know what they're doing do it.

The only way to actually fix MC is to rewrite it entirely. In C++. That isn't going to happen. Unfortunately.

Quote from Neospector

Methinks you haven't been reading the changelogs.
At all.
There were a few bad FPS drops, but you have to realize that optomization and bug fixes do not simply consist of making the game run faster.
Second, all I've seen since beta has been performance boosts. In 1.8 I got 30 FPS, in the latest snapshots and updates I've gotten 50.
Furthermore, I get 50 FPS on the highest settings on a computer a lot worse than yours, with the only drop in performance being near redstone (which just got rewritten, so I expect it to be slightly laggy, and even as it is, it's not as bad as it could be).

Finally, you comment about "hiring a competent programmer" is pretentious to say the least, and I'm willing to be that you don't know a single thing about code, and that you probably wouldn't know the difference between Java and Javascript. So I would advise you to shut your trap and let the people who know what they're doing do it.

Actually, I did. not one of those where a critical bug, OR addressing performance issues. they where all small bugs, I suppose it's better than no bug fixes, but still.

Actually, I do know something about programming, I took a programming course in high school, and have dabbled about with coding over time. I am not an expert programmer though, and I admit that. HOWEVER, I do know professional coders, one of which (titegtnodI, you can look him up on google.) is one of the best I've seen. I have recently taken up programming again as well.

Funny though, how you don't know a thing about someone but instead insist on using assumptions to reply to them. Really though it just tells me so many things about you in that it probably is not even worth replying to you.

What's also interesting is you're the very first person I've ever heard of who's had steady FPS increases since Beta.

"but you have to realize that optomization and bug fixes do not simply consist of making the game run faster." No, you are correct in the fact they do not just consist of making the game run faster, however they are key factors in making the game run faster and better. (By the way, you misspelled "optimization.")

Also, finishing your post by saying "hurr you know nothing shut up"(even if you said it a bit fancier than that) when you haven't the foggiest clue about what someone knows, puts you in a position of poor intellectual standing. Just a hint, it's far more pretentious to make those sorts of claims "I bet you don't even know the difference between Java and Javascript" when you know nothing about someone, than it is for someone to claim that a company needs to hire an employee with the skill set they actually need.

Quote from superhobo666

Actually, I did. not one of those where a critical bug, OR addressing performance issues. they where all small bugs, I suppose it's better than no bug fixes, but still.
Name a major bug and report it. It will then be fixed because the magic of the internet allows us to actually talk with people from Mojang...
Actually, I do know something about programming, I took a programming course in high school, and have dabbled about with coding over time. I am not an expert programmer though, and I admit that. HOWEVER, I do know professional coders, one of which (titegtnodI, you can look him up on google.) is one of the best I've seen. I have recently taken up programming again as well.
Then that's awesome. But taking a highschool course and talking to a programmer doesn't mean you can burst outright with "MOJANG IS INCOMPETENT HERP DE DERP". I've also dabbled in C programming, and I also talk (regularly) with several programmer, including Simon Robertshaw, cracker64, jacob1, and others from here.
Funny though, how you don't know a thing about someone but instead insist on using assumptions to reply to them. Really though it just tells me so many things about you in that it probably is not even worth replying to you.
I assume based off of what I read in your post. When you say "One thing Mojang seriously should consider is hiring a competent programmer" or "(since they can't even release fully working features without having to put out 3 patches for each version.)" That says to me that you're a very pretentious person who assumes that they're always right and that somehow every issue you have in performance is the developer's fault (See: A lot of the Maplestory community).
What's also interesting is you're the very first person I've ever heard of who's had steady FPS increases since Beta.
Fascinating that I'm the only one you've heard, but, I'm not the only one there is.
"but you have to realize that optomization and bug fixes do not simply consist of making the game run faster." No, you are correct in the fact they do not just consist of making the game run faster, however they are key factors in making the game run faster and better. (By the way, you misspelled "optimization.")
"Better" being key. My point was that you ignored all the bug fixes and went straight for attacking random FPS drops, citing that because there was a small drop in your speed, Mojang has apparently done nothing to optimize the game.
Also, finishing your post by saying "hurr you know nothing shut up"(even if you said it a bit fancier than that) when you haven't the foggiest clue about what someone knows, puts you in a position of poor intellectual standing. Just a hint, it's far more pretentious to make those sorts of claims "I bet you don't even know the difference between Java and Javascript" when you know nothing about someone, than it is for someone to claim that a company needs to hire an employee with the skill set they actually need.
False, pulling information as to how your post sounded is a lot less pretentious than assuming that all of Mojang's current employees aren't capable of programming "properly". The fact is that a majority of people like you making these claims that "it's all Mojang's fault that I dropped a few FPS!" very probably do not know the difference between Java and Javascript. So I consider it to be a frankly rather reliable assumption to make. Absolutely correct? No, not completely. Very likely? Very much so.

It's a problem with, Internal Server, the studdering that come from it is horrid

Why cant we have upgrades, fixes AND new things?

I would love to see an undate based on performance. I haven't had a problem with bugs myself, but I would like to see better frame rates and faster chunk loading overall.

Quote from Neospector

Name a major bug and report it. It will then be fixed because the magic of the internet allows us to actually talk with people from Mojang...

I have.
Others have.
I always see threads after a new version comes out "why hasn't X bug been fixed?"

One major issue: APU support. Java itself has some problems with this, but there are ways to work around that, and support APU's perfectly fine with Java. Java is one of the very few programming languages that still don't fully support APU's.
Another one: The Lighting engine having been broken since Alpha (how can someone call a company competent when two+ years after a game has launched, they STILL can't figure out lighting? Minecraft is the only game I've seen make it past alpha to full release still with bugs from the alpha period.)
Another issue: problems with AMD CPU's in general. Again, Java is iffy with AMD Hardware for some reason (it's not a problem with the hardware, AMD hardware is supported perfectly fine by many other languages. This also can be worked around to have proper support.
Yet another issue:W key continuing to be detected as pressed, even when Depressed (get stuck walking forward, and have to double tap to stop) This is an issue that has plagued the Linux version since alpha, it's been reported thousands of times, yet has never been fixed.
Another Linux issue: Occasionally while right clicking, the game will click a second time(it isn't the mouse, I've tested with numerous mice, even brand new mice. it's also not a problem with Linux drivers, because it has never happened in other games with the same mice tested and used.) though not a critical bug, like the W sticking bug, it does happen often enough that it is annoying, both of these have killed me numerous times. This bug has also been persistent since alpha, and still has yet to be fixed.

I fail to see how it's pretentious for me to claim that a professional programmer who's focus is Java would be a serious asset for Mojang, instead of hiring less experienced "game developers." Considering there are still bugs from alpha in the game, and they STILL don't have a working lighting system, I think it's a perfectly reasonable comment to make.
One point I might make, is why they would make a game based on random terrain generation that would obviously require a good bit of power, in a language that already has very high overhead, and is inefficient for that sort of purpose. (Why do you think most professional developers use C/C++ or in house languages for their games?)

I still stand firm in believing it's downright silly to presume that someone making a complaint is going to be like a handfull of others making similar complaints, based on the complaint they are making. it's like saying that someone having their first swig of beer is an alcoholic for complaining about the taste, when a couple of real alcoholics at that same bar complain about the taste of the beer as while they're on their 8th beer.

funny enough in the one page you linked, most of the people are coming from my point of view, that they struggle to play, even on decent PC's. Sadly, the guy calling his E-series Processor weak was wrong. GhZ isn't an accurate measurement for CPU's, all it measures is the frequency of the processor, which tells you nothing about the performance. what you want to know are the amount of calculations per second. that's what tells you performance, The E series AMD are equivalent to the current gen Intel Pentium processors. the measurement you want to look at is the FLOPS rating of a CPU, not GhZ.Which leads me to wonder how much most of the people who reply to these forums actually know. (though, I'm willing to bet the average user age on this forum is somewhere between 13 and 15.)

Quote from jpmrocks

Why cant we have upgrades, fixes AND new things?

the best result would in fact be a focus on all 3 things, but it seems Mojang only really focuses on tiny bugs, and adding new things. Not fixing critical problems and engine bugs, and not addressing performance, unless it happens to be a side-effect of fixing one of the new toys if they break.

Quote from mineguy99

Back around Beta 1.3, I was able to run 128x128 with GLSL shaders, Bumbmapping, Ambient Occousion on a multiplayer server at 29-60FPS. At the moment on an even better PC than I had then, I'd be lucky if I could play the game without it freezing on a 64x64 pack.

Funny enough, back in alpha (I bought minecraft in alpha 1.4. I still fondly remember when they first came out with the winter worlds. back before biomes. /sigh), I was able to play on multiplayer, on a laptop with 4GB of DDR2 RAM (lowest clock speed) an integrated graphics chip (Intel 4000 series.) and an Intel core 2 duo processor, with a 64x64 texture pack between 60 to 100FPS.. that old laptop stopped being able to play Minecraft, about beta 4. that old laptop back in alpha could also host a server and play on it at the same time at a steady 40FPS.

my new laptop has an Intel core i5, Nvidia Geforce 540m, (1gb GDDR3) and 6GB DDR3 (lowest clock) and it often has trouble running Minecraft. Even on an Intel machine, I've noticed a steady drop in performance since the adventure update (I bought that laptop shortly before the adventure update)
Hell, that laptop runs Skyrim and Metro at 1366x768 on medium (high for Skyrim) and keeps around 30FPS (40 to 50 for Skyrim)

My gaming desktop
AMD Phenom II x4 955BE
AMD Radeon HD 7870 2GB GDDR5 GhZ edition (completely pointless number, it's FLOPS that count!)
8GB DDR3 SDRAM 10666

it ran minecraft before the adventure update at around 200+fps.
adventure update hits? 150FPS. (big update, it's fair there was a performance hit, but that was pretty steep)
it's steadily gone down well into the full release. during the fall, I ordered a new videocard (the 7870, I was running a 6850 beforehand.) and at that time, my FPS went from 60-70 without Optifine to 90-100 again, without optifine. and the last few updates have pushed down to the average 30-40 FPS (down to as far as 23 when loading a lot of chunks, or while ungergound.)

I shudder to think of how bad it would run on my old 6850 now.

most AMD machines (particularly APU's) struggle to get above 30FPS, even on higher end processors.
it's not the quality, it's because Java/Mojang don't actively support APU's, when many other games (yes, even other java games) work perfectly fine on APU's.

Quote from superhobo666

the best result would in fact be a focus on all 3 things, but it seems Mojang only really focuses on tiny bugs, and adding new things. Not fixing critical problems and engine bugs, and not addressing performance, unless it happens to be a side-effect of fixing one of the new toys if they break.

You dont keep track of the update logs, do you?

I play on pretty much minimal settings and even have to turn off my sound now in 1.5 it just laggs too much for me, even singleplayer.

Quote from jpmrocks

You dont keep track of the update logs, do you?

I have already answered this question above.

Yes, I do keep track of the update logs. that's the first thing I look for when an update comes out.

Quote from superhobo666

What's also interesting is you're the very first person I've ever heard of who's had steady FPS increases since Beta.

I'll be the second person you've heard who has had a steady FPS increase since Beta.

Though I swear, I have to ask. I see it around all the time. Why the hell do people insist on having FPS over 60? It's ENTIRELY unnecessary. At 60, the game is running at full speed, and is fully functional.

Quote from jpmrocks

Why cant we have upgrades, fixes AND new things?

We do



Now, back to SuperHobo666, Minecraft doesn't win awards for "fastest game" and "game with least bugs" instead it gets its awards from things like "best sandbox game" and stuff like that. Minecraft is about how creative people can be while building whatever they're building, not how fast they can build it. If there were no new items, redstoners would be bored out of their brains, architects would be stuck building stuff out of things like stone, and joining other peoples worlds wouldn't have any surprises. I do agree that they should fix bugs, but that is what they are doing. 1.5 and 1.5.1 bugs fixes aren't "minor". I totally disagree with you.

Minecraft gets better by it's content, not by how fast those who play use it.

Just wondering , isnt 24 FPS the same in performance as 240 , 60 , 100 or 9999999 FPS?

I say it because I have in mind that the human eye cant catch more than 24 images per second.

Ahem.

1.2.5. I had 18 fps at minimal settings

1.5 I have 40 fps at max settings.

Don't tell me that they didn't do anything to increase performance.

Maybe it is because it is Linux ?

Could it be that???

From reading this thread, assuming that Mojang doesn't have a professional java developer ('cause I don't know these things), they should hire one. All that could happen is their profits going up, as more people would be able to play it, afterwards giving it a good review.

You guys do realize that the human brain can only recognize 30 FPS as a continuous video instead of a bunch of connected pictures, right? I'm all for performance increases, but until then I'll be happy with what I got.