Yes, it's true that obsidian tools have been suggested many times already. But my suggestion is this:
Change the existing gold tools to obsidian tools. Obsidian makes more sense as a fast-mining tool, but it would also tend to chip and wear out faster than iron or diamond.
Gold tools mining faster makes no sense. We all know this. Gold tools should have been obsidian all along.
Also, if this change is made, it might make sense to allow an iron pickaxe to mine obsidian, but I'd suggest an extremely long time to mine it. Maybe take the old 30 seconds.
Still want gold tools? Well, I'm cool with that, but someone else needs to suggest a more logical use for them. Personally, I'd be okay with gold tools sticking around as is, but being duplicated in all mechanical senses by obsidian.
Edit: Just to be clear: obsidian blocks should stay the same with their hardness and blast resistance. I'm not suggesting a swap of the gold block and obsidian block. Only their use in making tools.
Gold tools make sense. They have low durability because its a soft metal, but do a lot of damage because its very heavy and dense. Also, it works balance wise as a set of rare, but extremely enchantable tools. If gold and obsidian were switched, it would be totally unbalanced because it is easy to farm large amounts of obsidian, and as such players could get very fast tools in large numbers, pretty much making their low durability irrelevant.
In other words, it should stay as it is. Obsidian tools have been suggested and rejected many times, and for good reason.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Minecraft makes me feel like I'm three. Playing with blocks and afraid of the dark.
Gold tools make sense. They have low durability because its a soft metal, but do a lot of damage because its very heavy and dense. Also, it works balance wise as a set of rare, but extremely enchantable tools. If gold and obsidian were switched, it would be totally unbalanced because it is easy to farm large amounts of obsidian, and as such players could get very fast tools in large numbers, pretty much making their low durability irrelevant.
In other words, it should stay as it is. Obsidian tools have been suggested and rejected many times, and for good reason.
Er... If gold was dense wouldn't that make it not a soft metal?
Er... If gold was dense wouldn't that make it not a soft metal?
Ok, he didn't phrase that too well. The point is, gold is a soft metal with a high conductivity (thus, used in clocks and powered rails). To compensate the lack of durability and damage, it mines very quickly and has the highest enchantability.
Obsidian (in the game) is the second hardest substance (first being bedrock), with one of the highest blast resistances.
Why would you flip-flop this, especially when many players use obsidian as base-building material?
Er... If gold was dense wouldn't that make it not a soft metal?
Dense and soft are too different things, they aren't opposites. Soft refers to how easy it is to manipulate, whereas density refers to mass/volume ratio. Basically, its heavy and dense but if you were to smash it into things it would get dented more easily then something like iron. I hope I'm describing that well.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Minecraft makes me feel like I'm three. Playing with blocks and afraid of the dark.
Gold tools make sense. They have low durability because its a soft metal, but do a lot of damage because its very heavy and dense.
Okay, that argument I hadn't heard before. It's a bit more logical than before, but I still don't completely buy the realism of it.
Also, it works balance wise as a set of rare, but extremely enchantable tools. If gold and obsidian were switched, it would be totally unbalanced because it is easy to farm large amounts of obsidian, and as such players could get very fast tools in large numbers, pretty much making their low durability irrelevant.
Hmm, I don't know how other players play, but I find obsidian farming extremely tedious. It's not even really farming, because in order to "farm" it you have to bring in buckets of lava, and even after that, you still have to mine it. The most efficient way to obtain obsidian remains to find lava seas, dump water over it, and mine it the old-fashioned way. An efficiency pick helps, but it's still mind-numbingly slow. And as another poster mentioned, players also use obsidian for building, increasing its opportunity cost.
Personally, according to my play-style, I tend to accumulate a lot more gold than obsidian, although if I really wanted obsidian badly, I could get it. Even so, gold tools are poorly balanced to begin with, because it's just never worth it. The cost of gold is way too high for the small amount of benefit you get from mining faster for about a minute. At least with obsidian it would be worth while to obtain new obsidian and craft new tools when it wears out.
Obsidian (in the game) is the second hardest substance (first being bedrock), with one of the highest blast resistances.
Why would you flip-flop this, especially when many players use obsidian as base-building material?
I'm fine with Obsidian as a block remaining extremely hard. Why can't it be hard in block form, but not so durable in tool form? That's essentially true of plenty of real-world materials.
But I guess my OP wasn't clear on that. Let me correct it.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
I think you are going to love my Survival Let's Play series on YouTube! It's called Spaceboot1's Garden. I make pretty things.
Okay, that argument I hadn't heard before. It's a bit more logical than before, but I still don't completely buy the realism of it.
Hmm, I don't know how other players play, but I find obsidian farming extremely tedious. It's not even really farming, because in order to "farm" it you have to bring in buckets of lava, and even after that, you still have to mine it. The most efficient way to obtain obsidian remains to find lava seas, dump water over it, and mine it the old-fashioned way. An efficiency pick helps, but it's still mind-numbingly slow. And as another poster mentioned, players also use obsidian for building, increasing its opportunity cost.
Personally, according to my play-style, I tend to accumulate a lot more gold than obsidian, although if I really wanted obsidian badly, I could get it. Even so, gold tools are poorly balanced to begin with, because it's just never worth it. The cost of gold is way too high for the small amount of benefit you get from mining faster for about a minute. At least with obsidian it would be worth while to obtain new obsidian and craft new tools when it wears out.
You see, my main though is that because its possible to create an obsidian generator, the tools it makes shouldn't be faster thatn diamond... it could be overpowered. True, its tedious, but you could set it up so all you need to do is tape your left mouse button down and get as much as you want. Also, if you don't buy the realism of it, look it up. Gold has a density, but is soft and malleable. It seems like kind of a contradiction, but its true.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Minecraft makes me feel like I'm three. Playing with blocks and afraid of the dark.
You see, my main though is that because its possible to create an obsidian generator, the tools it makes shouldn't be faster thatn diamond... it could be overpowered.
Um, if you know how to make an obsidian generator, can you post a link to some instructions? Because I honestly didn't know it was possible. I would find that quite useful.
Also, if you don't buy the realism of it, look it up. Gold has a density, but is soft and malleable. It seems like kind of a contradiction, but its true.
I believe you about the part where gold is denser than iron. What I'm not sold on is the idea that therefore gold tools are faster than iron tools. Like I said before, I am willing to suspend disbelief in the name of fun gameplay, so all of this is essentially wankery. But if gold is denser, and we're talking about let's say, swinging a gold pickaxe, then a gold pickaxe would be heavier than an iron pickaxe, and thus it would require more energy to swing, and each swing would be slower. You would be able to put more energy into each swing, but they would take longer.
If you lightened/shrunk the gold pickaxe to compensate, making it light enough to swing quickly, then you've basically taken away your density advantage.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
I think you are going to love my Survival Let's Play series on YouTube! It's called Spaceboot1's Garden. I make pretty things.
Um, if you know how to make an obsidian generator, can you post a link to some instructions? Because I honestly didn't know it was possible. I would find that quite useful.
I believe you about the part where gold is denser than iron. What I'm not sold on is the idea that therefore gold tools are faster than iron tools. Like I said before, I am willing to suspend disbelief in the name of fun gameplay, so all of this is essentially wankery. But if gold is denser, and we're talking about let's say, swinging a gold pickaxe, then a gold pickaxe would be heavier than an iron pickaxe, and thus it would require more energy to swing, and each swing would be slower. You would be able to put more energy into each swing, but they would take longer.
If you lightened/shrunk the gold pickaxe to compensate, making it light enough to swing quickly, then you've basically taken away your density advantage.
I didn't mean faster as in faster swing speed, I meant faster as in it smashes things faster. Overall its a little stretch, but you get the idea. It makes sense were gold is placed and changing it is unnecessary.
Also, apparently I was wrong. I thought they had added an infinite lava source to the game... oh well. Doesn't change the fact that you don't really need to search for it. Its like if gold was found in huge pockets but took a while to break. The tools would still be overpowered because of how easily you can acquire large amounts of them.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Minecraft makes me feel like I'm three. Playing with blocks and afraid of the dark.
I didn't mean faster as in faster swing speed, I meant faster as in it smashes things faster. Overall its a little stretch, but you get the idea. It makes sense were gold is placed and changing it is unnecessary.
I do get the idea. I of course realize that you kind of have to stretch things a little no matter which way you go. I just thought it might be a little more interesting way to stretch to fit obsidian tools in that way.
Doesn't change the fact that you don't really need to search for it. Its like if gold was found in huge pockets but took a while to break. The tools would still be overpowered because of how easily you can acquire large amounts of them.
I think you have a point in that it would be easier to get. But obsidian is still a pain to mine. Think of it as trading your time: you spend extra time mining the obsidian, and get back that time when you use the tool. If the designers really wanted to balance it, they could adjust the speed a bit at either end, but I don't think even that would be necessary. It's very similar to trading resources for more resources, the way a lot of things in Minecraft work. To think of one example, you craft an iron pickaxe, and use it to dig more iron. Spend a resource to get more of the resource. I really think it might as well be the same with obsidian tools.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
I think you are going to love my Survival Let's Play series on YouTube! It's called Spaceboot1's Garden. I make pretty things.
I don't think it's safe to call this idea imbalanced just due to the nature of gold tools. Sure, they might be enchantable quite well. But their durability is so low, so why would you put levels into them? When was the last time you made/used a gold tool? And I mean a legit gold tool, by the way, not a hacked one.
In some ways, gold tools are just vanity tools. You make them because you have gold ingots lying around. What else are you going to do with your gold ingots? But of course you wouldn't actually use up your gold tools, because then they'll be gone, and you won't have them anymore.
One thing I like about the idea of obsidian tools is that they're another vanity tool. I'm sure virtually every Minecraft player has asked themselves "What if there were obsidian tools?" How great would it be to have a purplish-black sword?
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
I think you are going to love my Survival Let's Play series on YouTube! It's called Spaceboot1's Garden. I make pretty things.
Change the existing gold tools to obsidian tools. Obsidian makes more sense as a fast-mining tool, but it would also tend to chip and wear out faster than iron or diamond.
Gold tools mining faster makes no sense. We all know this. Gold tools should have been obsidian all along.
Also, if this change is made, it might make sense to allow an iron pickaxe to mine obsidian, but I'd suggest an extremely long time to mine it. Maybe take the old 30 seconds.
Still want gold tools? Well, I'm cool with that, but someone else needs to suggest a more logical use for them. Personally, I'd be okay with gold tools sticking around as is, but being duplicated in all mechanical senses by obsidian.
Edit: Just to be clear: obsidian blocks should stay the same with their hardness and blast resistance. I'm not suggesting a swap of the gold block and obsidian block. Only their use in making tools.
Want to play Minecraft SSP like Spaceboot1? Try my modpack, all mods made by me, Spaceboot1!
In other words, it should stay as it is. Obsidian tools have been suggested and rejected many times, and for good reason.
Er... If gold was dense wouldn't that make it not a soft metal?
Ok, he didn't phrase that too well. The point is, gold is a soft metal with a high conductivity (thus, used in clocks and powered rails). To compensate the lack of durability and damage, it mines very quickly and has the highest enchantability.
Obsidian (in the game) is the second hardest substance (first being bedrock), with one of the highest blast resistances.
Why would you flip-flop this, especially when many players use obsidian as base-building material?
[quote=Badgerz]You have to keep in mind that people are stupid.
[quote=Catelite]Just because you don't understand how something works, doesn't make it broken or pointless. >_<
Dense and soft are too different things, they aren't opposites. Soft refers to how easy it is to manipulate, whereas density refers to mass/volume ratio. Basically, its heavy and dense but if you were to smash it into things it would get dented more easily then something like iron. I hope I'm describing that well.
Okay, that argument I hadn't heard before. It's a bit more logical than before, but I still don't completely buy the realism of it.
Hmm, I don't know how other players play, but I find obsidian farming extremely tedious. It's not even really farming, because in order to "farm" it you have to bring in buckets of lava, and even after that, you still have to mine it. The most efficient way to obtain obsidian remains to find lava seas, dump water over it, and mine it the old-fashioned way. An efficiency pick helps, but it's still mind-numbingly slow. And as another poster mentioned, players also use obsidian for building, increasing its opportunity cost.
Personally, according to my play-style, I tend to accumulate a lot more gold than obsidian, although if I really wanted obsidian badly, I could get it. Even so, gold tools are poorly balanced to begin with, because it's just never worth it. The cost of gold is way too high for the small amount of benefit you get from mining faster for about a minute. At least with obsidian it would be worth while to obtain new obsidian and craft new tools when it wears out.
I'm fine with Obsidian as a block remaining extremely hard. Why can't it be hard in block form, but not so durable in tool form? That's essentially true of plenty of real-world materials.
But I guess my OP wasn't clear on that. Let me correct it.
Want to play Minecraft SSP like Spaceboot1? Try my modpack, all mods made by me, Spaceboot1!
You see, my main though is that because its possible to create an obsidian generator, the tools it makes shouldn't be faster thatn diamond... it could be overpowered. True, its tedious, but you could set it up so all you need to do is tape your left mouse button down and get as much as you want. Also, if you don't buy the realism of it, look it up. Gold has a density, but is soft and malleable. It seems like kind of a contradiction, but its true.
Um, if you know how to make an obsidian generator, can you post a link to some instructions? Because I honestly didn't know it was possible. I would find that quite useful.
I believe you about the part where gold is denser than iron. What I'm not sold on is the idea that therefore gold tools are faster than iron tools. Like I said before, I am willing to suspend disbelief in the name of fun gameplay, so all of this is essentially wankery. But if gold is denser, and we're talking about let's say, swinging a gold pickaxe, then a gold pickaxe would be heavier than an iron pickaxe, and thus it would require more energy to swing, and each swing would be slower. You would be able to put more energy into each swing, but they would take longer.
If you lightened/shrunk the gold pickaxe to compensate, making it light enough to swing quickly, then you've basically taken away your density advantage.
Want to play Minecraft SSP like Spaceboot1? Try my modpack, all mods made by me, Spaceboot1!
I didn't mean faster as in faster swing speed, I meant faster as in it smashes things faster. Overall its a little stretch, but you get the idea. It makes sense were gold is placed and changing it is unnecessary.
Also, apparently I was wrong. I thought they had added an infinite lava source to the game... oh well. Doesn't change the fact that you don't really need to search for it. Its like if gold was found in huge pockets but took a while to break. The tools would still be overpowered because of how easily you can acquire large amounts of them.
I do get the idea. I of course realize that you kind of have to stretch things a little no matter which way you go. I just thought it might be a little more interesting way to stretch to fit obsidian tools in that way.
I think you have a point in that it would be easier to get. But obsidian is still a pain to mine. Think of it as trading your time: you spend extra time mining the obsidian, and get back that time when you use the tool. If the designers really wanted to balance it, they could adjust the speed a bit at either end, but I don't think even that would be necessary. It's very similar to trading resources for more resources, the way a lot of things in Minecraft work. To think of one example, you craft an iron pickaxe, and use it to dig more iron. Spend a resource to get more of the resource. I really think it might as well be the same with obsidian tools.
Want to play Minecraft SSP like Spaceboot1? Try my modpack, all mods made by me, Spaceboot1!
You can make stone tools, and many people use cobblestone/stone/stone brick as a building material.
---
All things considered, I'm not going to throw support behind this because I don't think I'd end up using obsidian tools either.
One thing I like about the idea of obsidian tools is that they're another vanity tool. I'm sure virtually every Minecraft player has asked themselves "What if there were obsidian tools?" How great would it be to have a purplish-black sword?
Want to play Minecraft SSP like Spaceboot1? Try my modpack, all mods made by me, Spaceboot1!