along with getting rid of pillaring i support random lava in 4x4x4 or smaller holes so that way people cant camp :biggrin.gif:
also i support no caves since you can hide in em
I know this has probably been stated already, but "pillaring" is extremely useful and makes building certain structures much easier and safer. Also coding to make pillars unstable would probably make most buildings unstable as well since all buildings rely on stacks of blocks.
Removing pillars is a lousy idea even if it could be done in a non-devastating way. Too many use it for things that the OP completely ignored in his cries over cheap mob avoidance.
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Quote from Baraq Hussein Osama »
Do you show children your phallus? Is that what you want them to see?
Removing pillars is a lousy idea even if it could be done in a non-devastating way. Too many use it for things that the OP completely ignored in his cries over cheap mob avoidance.
Answer to my points instead of just saying "yes it is" please.
I agree that there are many things he ignored, and if you hate the idea you should point them out to him.
What points? That it's not fun if you have to control yourself? Big deal. It's still a fix. Self-control is the player's problem.
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Quote from Baraq Hussein Osama »
Do you show children your phallus? Is that what you want them to see?
"Just don't do it" is still not a fix, it is still arguable that is is the games job to put you in danger and its less fun when you try not to win. Along with all my other reasons in the other post.
Since we are talking about a player-created situation that is a side effect of a core game mechanic, but not the main purpose of said game mechanic, I'd say that "just don't do it" is a perfectly fine response - especially when the request is a complete removal/alteration of the game mechanic itself.
But other than that I agree with your post, it would be better to have smarter AIs or flying mobs.
Then I wish to god you would create a thread supporting one of those ideas, or find one that has already been posted and support it. Leave this thread be.
Another less devastating way of removing pillaring would simply be to make the block check that 1.5 tiles of Y axis are free of any entities like I said before.
And then we can no longer use the sneak function to lean over ledges and build out horizontally? Anything that changes a basic block placing function is going to feel pretty devastating in a game mostly about placing blocks...please just focus on additions to the game, not subtracting from it.
You do not have to go into a FPS purposely missing the opponent.
You've never played a FPS that allowed for stealthy/peaceful paths to the goal?
No it isn't. If you don't like pillaring in single-player, you can avoid pillaring in single-player. Why can't you? Exactly - you can. Again, self-control is the player's problem - and that isn't arguable either.
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Quote from Baraq Hussein Osama »
Do you show children your phallus? Is that what you want them to see?
I think it should be the game's job to put the player in danger
You keep saying that. And it keeps having nothing to do with anything. It is the game's job to provide danger: And that has no relevance upon the fact that if one dislikes pillaring in a single-player game, they can simply avoid it. The game's "job" does not invalidate that fact.
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Quote from Baraq Hussein Osama »
Do you show children your phallus? Is that what you want them to see?
By FPS I mean one where the goal is to kill, not capture the flag ones or whatever.
Well of course if you are playing a game where the goal is to kill things, not killing things wouldn't really work. But Minecraft is not a game about killing things, and Survival Mode is about surviving them...not specifically killing them. Killing them is simply one option.
I still fail to see how "Don't do it" is a valid argument though.
So if I complained about flowing lava + flowing water giving me infinite blocks of cobble because it made me always have plenty of cobblestone, would you support changing the way lava works or tell me just to not farm infinite cobble?
If I complained about some random way people used redstone making some other chore too easy for me, would you tell me just not to do it or would you support cutting basic functions from redstone to satisfy me?
And by avoiding pillaring what is one doing?
Purposefully putting themselves in danger in an attempt to have fun, which I think should be the games job.
I think you are confusing "making the game fun" with "forcing players to fight."
I still fail to see how "Don't do it" is a valid argument though.
...Have you paid any attention, at all, to anything, in your life?
A) Single-player game. Nobody else there.
:cool.gif: A belief that pillaring cheapens the gameplay.
C) Don't do it, then the gameplay won't suffer.
Where's the lack of validity?
I am not going to properly reply to this until you properly read my posts answering all those points.
The only point you have is some irrelevant crap about the game's "job" to provide challenge. You have offered nothing whatsoever that invalidates the offered solution to the OP's ridiculous issues. If you can't simply explain yourself, then your point - whatever on Earth it was - has been defeated.
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Quote from Baraq Hussein Osama »
Do you show children your phallus? Is that what you want them to see?
Way to go, you can quote the same tower of text 5000 times!
A) Single-player game. Nobody else there.
:cool.gif: A belief that pillaring cheapens the gameplay.
C) Don't do it, then the gameplay won't suffer.
It is EXACTLY that simple. Other people still using it would have NO EFFECT on you. You wouldn't even KNOW they were using it.
Where's the lack of validity? - Simple question. Answer it and you could validate whatever inane point you're trying to make. I notice the OP avoided simple questions about his ideas too.
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Quote from Baraq Hussein Osama »
Do you show children your phallus? Is that what you want them to see?
And by avoiding pillaring what is one doing?
Purposefully putting themselves in danger in an attempt to have fun, which I think should be the games job.
They're avoiding their dislike of pillaring without ****ing up everyone else's game.
They're not putting themselves in danger unless they stand there in the open night like a jackass. There are ways to avoid danger and still avoid pillaring. Did you know that? It's not a hard thing to figure out.
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Quote from Baraq Hussein Osama »
Do you show children your phallus? Is that what you want them to see?
Way to go, you can quote the same tower of text 5000 times!
A) Single-player game. Nobody else there.
:cool.gif: A belief that pillaring cheapens the gameplay.
C) Don't do it, then the gameplay won't suffer.
Where's the lack of validity? - Simple question. Answer it and you could validate whatever inane point you're trying to make. I notice the OP avoided simple questions about his ideas too.
It really seems like you are avoiding my points now, I can not argue with someone if they are not reading my side.
A) No-one else is directly watching you, through bragging, forums, images, friends it still effects other people.
:cool.gif: Correct, and wanting it removed from legit gameplay.
C) The gameplay suffering is a good argument, don't do it is not because of reasons above.
After this post I will go no further and assume I have won if you do not answer to my points.
A) Bragging? Forums? Pictures? Who gives a ****? Avoid them if they honestly have such a deep effect on you. It doesn't effect THE GAME.
:cool.gif: Wanting it removed is selfish and moronic when you can just as easily avoid it otherwise.
C) "Don't do it" is a perfect argument for single-player games. The only point you have made is that some people might be affected by pictures and bragging and that would somehow magically affect their game despite being outside the game - Those people are pathetic.
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Quote from Baraq Hussein Osama »
Do you show children your phallus? Is that what you want them to see?
Although i see no problem with "pillaring" i have in smp had people put up ugly pillars next to my structures for various reasons. i would propose the following, while not stopping pillars from being formed, making them a bit riskier to use as a safety mechanism. Lightning strikes at the highest point normally. as such lightning could be changed to strike the top of pillars more often and simply by doing damage knock the player off the pillar. Basically when a thunderstorm rolls in, the highest points should have the highest chance of getting hit, and if a point is higher then everything else by a good margin, lightning should end whatever dares to reach up to the heavens. This would, in my opinion, discourage people for building pillars for survival while not discouraging their production for other uses.
That said, what you choose to do or not do in single player is up to you, its not the developers job to code in solutions for exploits that only affect ones own game. think of "pillaring" as a cheat code you accidentally stumbled on. while many would prefer to not use the code some want to use its "shininess" to make their life easier. as far as multiplayer is concerned, one should not give themselves an unfair advantage however as SMP is not a competitive game all i ask is this, if you build a pillar for whatever reason, take it down unless its on or near your own structure. my buildings are ugly enough as is.
They are avoiding something that makes their life easier.
A shelter is also something that makes their life easier.
So is hitting the enemy.
Same thing.
Ok...so:
Pillaring = Makes life easier
Shelter = Makes life easier
Fighting = Makes life easier
...then why are you arguing for the removal of one thing that makes life easier, just to force players to do another thing that makes life easier?
No-one will be as impressed at their buildings, a tower that they are proud of and might have taken forever will have took someone else 10 minutes.
It is also not as easy as it sounds to avoid.
How is it selfish if it is an idea for the game you think would make it a lot better for other people as well as you?
From your logic I could suggest something stupid like a super amazing diamond machine that is made with coal and squirts out diamonds while turning back time, and if someone doesn't like it just use your "Don't use it" argument?
Oh and you made me lose the game.
Got to go for a little while, I will be back soon though.
Their being impressed or not is irrelevant. This game isn't about being impressive, even if some choose to use the game for that purpose.
It is easy to avoid: Just don't do it. How is that hard? It isn't.
It's selfish because he was crying for the removal of a gameplay element most players find very useful, on the sole basis that he personally believes its POTENTIAL use as mob avoidance was cheap. He went on to ignore all objections, all explanations of its many uses to other players, and how removing it would drastically affect all other players. He wasn't saying a thing for other players - in fact, he was ignoring the objections of other players. He was making a suggestion for himself and nobody else.
You have yet to invalidate the solution. Pictures and bragging of other players will not affect your own game. Whether or not it affects you yourself, well, that's an issue of the PLAYER, not the GAME.
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Quote from Baraq Hussein Osama »
Do you show children your phallus? Is that what you want them to see?
They are avoiding something that makes their life easier.
A shelter is also something that makes their life easier.
So is hitting the enemy.
Same thing.
Ok...so:
Pillaring = Makes life easier
Shelter = Makes life easier
Fighting = Makes life easier
...then why are you arguing for the removal of one thing that makes life easier, just to force players to do another thing that makes life easier?
???
I think he's only arguing against the argument "Just don't do it." He considers it an illegitimate argument because a game should be designed and streamlined so that when there is danger, the player can use everything at his disposal to avoid it and still have a reasonable challenge. So it seems to me.
But not all things are equal, and pillaring doesn't need to be defended against "just don't do it." If tree leaves were diamonds, maybe you could argue that it should be changed, but you're here defending pillaring, and you cannot ignore that context. Reasonable gameplay helps inform what needs changing and what doesn't, and this . . . you can just not do it, just like bug exploits. >sleep
They are avoiding something that makes their life easier.
A shelter is also something that makes their life easier.
So is hitting the enemy.
Same thing.
Ok...so:
Pillaring = Makes life easier
Shelter = Makes life easier
Fighting = Makes life easier
...then why are you arguing for the removal of one thing that makes life easier, just to force players to do another thing that makes life easier?
???
I think he's only arguing against the argument "Just don't do it." He considers it an illegitimate argument because a game should be designed and streamlined so that when there is danger, the player can use everything at his disposal to avoid it and still have a reasonable challenge. So it seems to me.
But not all things are equal, and pillaring doesn't need to be defended against "just don't do it." If tree leaves were diamonds, maybe you could argue that it should be changed, but you're here defending pillaring, and you cannot ignore that context. Reasonable gameplay helps inform what needs changing and what doesn't, and this . . . you can just not do it, just like bug exploits. >sleep
Agreed.
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Quote from Baraq Hussein Osama »
Do you show children your phallus? Is that what you want them to see?
also i support no caves since you can hide in em
For single-player, yes it is.
Removing pillars is a lousy idea even if it could be done in a non-devastating way. Too many use it for things that the OP completely ignored in his cries over cheap mob avoidance.
What points? That it's not fun if you have to control yourself? Big deal. It's still a fix. Self-control is the player's problem.
Since we are talking about a player-created situation that is a side effect of a core game mechanic, but not the main purpose of said game mechanic, I'd say that "just don't do it" is a perfectly fine response - especially when the request is a complete removal/alteration of the game mechanic itself.
Then I wish to god you would create a thread supporting one of those ideas, or find one that has already been posted and support it. Leave this thread be.
And then we can no longer use the sneak function to lean over ledges and build out horizontally? Anything that changes a basic block placing function is going to feel pretty devastating in a game mostly about placing blocks...please just focus on additions to the game, not subtracting from it.
You've never played a FPS that allowed for stealthy/peaceful paths to the goal?
Using a Mob Spawner and a Stick to Master the Animal Kingdom
No it isn't. If you don't like pillaring in single-player, you can avoid pillaring in single-player. Why can't you? Exactly - you can. Again, self-control is the player's problem - and that isn't arguable either.
...Have you paid any attention, at all, to anything, in your life?
A) Single-player game. Nobody else there.
:cool.gif: A belief that pillaring cheapens the gameplay.
C) Don't do it, then the gameplay won't suffer.
Where's the lack of validity?
You keep saying that. And it keeps having nothing to do with anything. It is the game's job to provide danger: And that has no relevance upon the fact that if one dislikes pillaring in a single-player game, they can simply avoid it. The game's "job" does not invalidate that fact.
Well of course if you are playing a game where the goal is to kill things, not killing things wouldn't really work. But Minecraft is not a game about killing things, and Survival Mode is about surviving them...not specifically killing them. Killing them is simply one option.
So if I complained about flowing lava + flowing water giving me infinite blocks of cobble because it made me always have plenty of cobblestone, would you support changing the way lava works or tell me just to not farm infinite cobble?
If I complained about some random way people used redstone making some other chore too easy for me, would you tell me just not to do it or would you support cutting basic functions from redstone to satisfy me?
I think you are confusing "making the game fun" with "forcing players to fight."
Using a Mob Spawner and a Stick to Master the Animal Kingdom
The only point you have is some irrelevant crap about the game's "job" to provide challenge. You have offered nothing whatsoever that invalidates the offered solution to the OP's ridiculous issues. If you can't simply explain yourself, then your point - whatever on Earth it was - has been defeated.
A) Single-player game. Nobody else there.
:cool.gif: A belief that pillaring cheapens the gameplay.
C) Don't do it, then the gameplay won't suffer.
It is EXACTLY that simple. Other people still using it would have NO EFFECT on you. You wouldn't even KNOW they were using it.
Where's the lack of validity? - Simple question. Answer it and you could validate whatever inane point you're trying to make. I notice the OP avoided simple questions about his ideas too.
They're avoiding their dislike of pillaring without ****ing up everyone else's game.
They're not putting themselves in danger unless they stand there in the open night like a jackass. There are ways to avoid danger and still avoid pillaring. Did you know that? It's not a hard thing to figure out.
A) Bragging? Forums? Pictures? Who gives a ****? Avoid them if they honestly have such a deep effect on you. It doesn't effect THE GAME.
:cool.gif: Wanting it removed is selfish and moronic when you can just as easily avoid it otherwise.
C) "Don't do it" is a perfect argument for single-player games. The only point you have made is that some people might be affected by pictures and bragging and that would somehow magically affect their game despite being outside the game - Those people are pathetic.
That said, what you choose to do or not do in single player is up to you, its not the developers job to code in solutions for exploits that only affect ones own game. think of "pillaring" as a cheat code you accidentally stumbled on. while many would prefer to not use the code some want to use its "shininess" to make their life easier. as far as multiplayer is concerned, one should not give themselves an unfair advantage however as SMP is not a competitive game all i ask is this, if you build a pillar for whatever reason, take it down unless its on or near your own structure. my buildings are ugly enough as is.
Wallace
And? If they dislike it, they should and can avoid it without any problem.
Vegetarianism would make my life easier by cutting down on all the fatty meats I ingest. I avoid it because I don't like it.
Ok...so:
Pillaring = Makes life easier
Shelter = Makes life easier
Fighting = Makes life easier
...then why are you arguing for the removal of one thing that makes life easier, just to force players to do another thing that makes life easier?
???
Using a Mob Spawner and a Stick to Master the Animal Kingdom
Their being impressed or not is irrelevant. This game isn't about being impressive, even if some choose to use the game for that purpose.
It is easy to avoid: Just don't do it. How is that hard? It isn't.
It's selfish because he was crying for the removal of a gameplay element most players find very useful, on the sole basis that he personally believes its POTENTIAL use as mob avoidance was cheap. He went on to ignore all objections, all explanations of its many uses to other players, and how removing it would drastically affect all other players. He wasn't saying a thing for other players - in fact, he was ignoring the objections of other players. He was making a suggestion for himself and nobody else.
You have yet to invalidate the solution. Pictures and bragging of other players will not affect your own game. Whether or not it affects you yourself, well, that's an issue of the PLAYER, not the GAME.
I think he's only arguing against the argument "Just don't do it." He considers it an illegitimate argument because a game should be designed and streamlined so that when there is danger, the player can use everything at his disposal to avoid it and still have a reasonable challenge. So it seems to me.
But not all things are equal, and pillaring doesn't need to be defended against "just don't do it." If tree leaves were diamonds, maybe you could argue that it should be changed, but you're here defending pillaring, and you cannot ignore that context. Reasonable gameplay helps inform what needs changing and what doesn't, and this . . . you can just not do it, just like bug exploits.
>sleep
Agreed.
Just deal with it.