we need the ability to fall off and at least 1 hostile mob. otherwise this place would be too safe. falling off would start you about 50 blocks up from sea level, and you basicly die from fall damage if you don't land in water. to make falling off a little less of a terrible fate, the aether could be made a slow travel zone so that you can get your stuff back.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Quote from The_Questioner »
I suggest we adopt a xenophobic attitude towards this clearly deadly threat.
We need to quarantine any infected individuals to prevent this plague from gaining a foot-hold.
that would be cool... you could make a door made from a wall of lava by placing a lot of breezeblocks at the bottom with a lava reservoir and when you power it the wall turns off and you can safely walk across the breezeblocks!
Its a pretty cool idea but i dont like the idea that if you fall off, YOUR DEAD. Unless you fall into the ocean etc. But other than that i like every idea.
Like Kwickgamer said. Plus, you might be able to use a glider, if those make it in. Also...
Quote from Excalipoor »
we need the ability to fall off and at least 1 hostile mob. otherwise this place would be too safe. falling off would start you about 50 blocks up from sea level, and you basicly die from fall damage if you don't land in water. to make falling off a little less of a terrible fate, the aether could be made a slow travel zone so that you can get your stuff back.
The Zephyr and Senties are hostile, about the same as the nether. The zephyr will attempt to blow you off so you fall to your death. And you kindof contradicted yourself. "Let's make a hostile mob to make it more dangerous. Oh, but let's make it COMPLETELY safe with a return-items-on-death." Would you be happy if we made the Nether a Safe-travel zone? No, it would remove most of fun from it.
Instead of struggling hard to keep your health up so you don't die, you have to struggle less-hard to stop from falling to your instant death. The struggle is easier in the Aether, but the stakes are probably instant death instead of a varying amounts of health, or at least having to find your way back to the Aether.
You said naturally occurring. This confuses me as lava appears in the overworld and nether, and breezeblock only in the Aether.
If it can produce this effect though, maybe it wont only occur in the Aether. It can just be set up so that in the Overworld, Breezeblock only forms with Geysers, in Nether it only forms with Volcanoes, but in Aether it naturally generates in other random formations allowing it to simply blow things around.
Eh, ok, you're the boss. But doesn't it kind of remove the traction of adding an Aether if these appear in the overworld?
I've thought of 3 more questions (well, 3 question groups). After that, I don't know what else to discuss about breezeblocks.
1.What about FIRE at input of a breezeblock? It's not solid, but it's not exactly liquid or gas either.
2. If item transport through breezeblock works like water, what about arrows fire into the breezeblock?
3. What if it's like [>] instead of just [>] [] .Does wind power come into play? Does weight of the block come into play?(I.E. would sand get pushed easier than gravel?)
I also figured out that wind could work kind of like a "wind" block from the breezeblocks, since they need empty space anyway (Except for pushing gravel and sand) and should be constantly going, like water. But from a Zephyr, it makes more sense to make it like an arrow.
Eh, ok, you're the boss. But doesn't it kind of remove the traction of adding an Aether if these appear in the overworld?
It depends. But with how perfectly it could work it would be a shame not to use it that way.
I've thought of 3 more questions (well, 3 question groups). After that, I don't know what else to discuss about breezeblocks.
1.What about FIRE at input of a breezeblock? It's not solid, but it's not exactly liquid or gas either.
For the moment, we could probably treat it like air, BUT it might be worth adding it to the materials that the breezeblocks can carry, and then the output will just lay some fire down on the blocks in front of the output. It would allow for some nice fire based traps.
2. If item transport through breezeblock works like water, what about arrows fire into the breezeblock?
i already have mentioned that. arrows dropped into a breezeblock pipe would be dropped out the other side, but fired into might warrant firing out the other side, or just being ignored, it depends on what is practical.
3. What if it's like [>] instead of just [>] [] .Does wind power come into play? Does weight of the block come into play?(I.E. would sand get pushed easier than gravel?)
Yes. I think in this case, the wind/water/lava would basically run a check that goes out as many blocks as the power output, and sees if there is a free space to push those blocks to. That will need some work to fine tune.
I also figured out that wind could work kind of like a "wind" block from the breezeblocks, since they need empty space anyway (Except for pushing gravel and sand) and should be constantly going, like water. But from a Zephyr, it makes more sense to make it like an arrow.
I was thinking more like invisible snowballs from teh Zephyr, but yes, I was also thinking of wind as a non-spilling invisible water block.
Then BE disappointed Grey... Because I am equally so.
You're building the "Redstone Circuits" before getting "Redstone" completed.
Take a look at your first post.
Notice how the "features" of Breezeblock is atleast 1.5x the length of any other block suggestion?
CONDENSE IT.
For god's sakes you mention Redstone ONCE inside the MASSIVE block of text there!
Here's what it should read (take notice of how long the description is):
BreezeBlock:
Has one input, output on the opposite side, and secondary inputs inbetween. When placed, input is facing the player.
The input must have either Air, Water, Lava, or another Breeze block who's output is facing this one's input.
The force of the Air/Water/Lava is calculated by (your balanced equation here).
Secondary inputs must have the same "value" (Air/Water/Lava) as the primary output to increase force.
If the output is blocked, by either an incompatible Breezeblock, or a solid block of another type, the breeze block shuts off.
BreezeBlock can be rotated with a right click.
BreezeBlock is on when placed but can be manipulated via Redstone.
TADAAA!
As for that part about "if the block is movable" that needs to be added to the MOVABLE BLOCK'S code, NOT Breeze Stone's.
I'm most disappointed with you for continuing to "chop" my quote again though. I made an effort so that you could go back to your post and know exactly what I was talking about. As you didn't it's like talking to someone who has no short term memory. 1 and 1b were how I titled them in my first post. Hell when you cut them up you CUT THEM BY THOSE TITLES. Yet only one response later you can't remember what they are. I'll say it again "it's like talking to someone who has no short term memory."
And Grey, unless you have a single songstone block be strong enough to push a human 6 spaces, or have songstone blocks power increase exponentially, you can't achieve the same things I was suggesting.
For example, the wind elevator, using the block that pushes in all directions, and increases in power based on how many sides are closed.
A 4*x1 shaft is all you need. (4* because those extra two are used very sparingly)
The only thing I'd have to do to make this work, under the "all direction, etc" block is make sure that with 2 sides open it has power to push a human 6 blocks. (Or I could just expand it's breadth by 1 so I can have it so "only one side exposed pushes 6 blocks")
[Please note, that this would work just as well for moving items as your piping system.]
Now off the bat, using your block it'd require a 6x1 because of those extra directionals needing air behind them.
Secondly, if a single block of yours gives enough force to push 6 blocks how strong is a single addition going to make it? 12?
(This is actually a challenge for you Grey to see if you can replicate an automated elevator with your block as is)
The above diagram was the most compact my design could be. Granted yours using it's multiplicative properties could simply be block atop block until it has enough force, but my design can be repeated to take someone from min build height to max build height with out having to start X blocks above min [meaning your tower of blocks to get the proper velocity] (excusing the one for the start in mine).
Leave piping to a craftable item that acts like minecart tracks.
Lava and water "eruptions" are neat sure, but do they NEED to be created?
Piping for the overworld I might see, the Breeze bock for the Aether I can see. Eruptions in the overworld or Aether? No, maybe the Nether but that would make the current Breeze block (an Aether block) more suited to the Nether than anything else.
You're building the "Redstone Circuits" without really thinking what "Redstone" should do.
And more specifically, you're losing your original goal of "A block that blows" in an attempt to create your own version of Piping.
Sabata, seriously, short term memory? I've got other things I'm working on and thinking about besides JUST THIS THREAD. If you can take the time to notice that Songstone is 1.5x longer than the description for everything else (gee, maybe that's because it still contains most of the description for both songstone AND breezeblock, and hasn't been edited down yet) maybe you could notice that the entire description for Songstone is also ALL PINK. I didn't just do that cause it looked pretty.
And here, as seen from the front;
[v] [v] [v]
[>] [b][o][/b] [<]
[>] [^] [<] []
with all blocks only generating a power of 1 on their own, that center [o] block now has a power of 9, now if that block was behind this block:
[v] [] [v]
[>] [b][v][/b] [<]
[>] [o] [<]
then that bottom [o] block would have a power of 16 (since the [b][v][/b] is getting power from the [b][o][/b] in the first diagram)
[A]
[A]
[A]
[A]=first diagram from the side(always facing in)
[B]
[B]
[B]
[B]=second diagram from the side (always facing in)
[A][B] [] [B][A]
[A][B] [] [B][A]
[A][B] [^] [B][A]
[A][B] [B][A]
that [^] now has a power of 32-33, straight up, no need to create any staggered tunnels at all, so only a 1x1 shaft is needed. The entire base only has a footprint of 3x5 wide and 4 tall. If I wanted to, I could have instead made it taller:
[v] [v] [v]
[>] [v] [<]
[>] [v] [<]
[>] [v] [<]
[>] [v] [<]
[>] [v] [<]
[>] [o] [<]
this setup would also have a power of 16 coming out of the [o] block
[C] [] [C]
[C] [] [C]
[C] [] [C]
[C] [] [C]
[C] [] [C]
[C] [] [C]
[C] [^] [C]
so with the columns of [C] referring to the diagram above, the [^] block would also be supplying a power of 32-33, and only need a 3x3 wide footprint 7 blocks tall to create a single column straight up.
I'd say that makes things quite a bit more compact, though it obviously uses more Breezeblocks.
Since you apparently can't handle being quoted, I'm just going to ignore the rest of what you said. It's honestly not worth the effort to describe what each point is that I'm referring to.
Wind - Can blow player, mobs, items, and lose blocks like Sand, Gravel, and Floatsand. Stacking blocks together generates higher wind. Details for calculating wind direction forthcoming; 1hole open = output(blow), multiple holes open = input(suck), no holes open = transfer
Transport - Can "move" liquids like lava and/or water through its "pipes"
1input and 1 output are on opposite sides from each other, and the remaining 4 sides act as POTENTIAL inputs. The Breezeblock can be turned(through 6 different orientations) by right clicking on it, provided it has a power of 0.
The power of the output face of a Breezeblock starts at 0 if all input and potential input faces are adjacent to solid blocks.
A Breezeblock's power is increased by 1 if its input is facing a non-solid block (Aetherock, water, lava, empty)
A Breezeblock will "carry" whatever non-solid block is adjacent to its input face, which makes its output face recognized as the block it is carrying by other Breezeblocks.
If a Breezeblock's output face is directly touching an input face of another Breezeblock, then the output Breezeblock's power is added to the Input Breezeblock's power
If a Breezeblock's output face is directly touching a potential input face of another Breezeblock, AND the output Breezeblock is carrying the same block as the input Breezeblock, then the output Breezeblock's power is added to the input Breezeblock's power.
If a Breezeblock is carrying lava or water and its output face is facing a mobile block, then the mobile block will be pushed away from the breezeblock and a full (non-spring) lava or water block will be placed in front of the breezeblock's output face. Lava/Water combinations will result in obsidian/cobblestone which will likely result in a blockage of the breezeblock's output.
If the output face of a Breezeblock is covered by an immobile block, or if there is a redstone current being applied to the Breezeblock, its power will be overridden to 0.
There's are more rules to it, which should allow items to be sucked through a breezeblock system(but will get burned if they get sucked into a lava system) as well as a crafting idea to allow for a vacuum chest that can suck up any item that is placed in front/on top of it, provided the chest has room in its inventory, but I need to sleep and come back to this.
Mine:
Quote from sabata2 »
BreezeBlock:
Has one input, output on the opposite side, and secondary inputs inbetween. When placed, input is facing the player.
The input must have either Air, Water, Lava, or another Breeze block who's output is facing this one's input.
The force of the Air/Water/Lava is calculated by (your balanced equation here).
Secondary inputs must have the same "value" (Air/Water/Lava) as the primary output to increase force.
If the output is blocked, by either an incompatible Breezeblock, or a solid block of another type, the breeze block shuts off.
BreezeBlock can be rotated with a right click.
BreezeBlock is on when placed but can be manipulated via Redstone.
CONDENSE IT.
Also, notice just how much Breeze Block you had to use to get the same effect?
For 32~ power (essentially a 32 bock elevator) you required A (7) x2 + B (8) x2 + 1? Took you 25 Breezeblock for 32 straight up ONLY.
Mine, uses 4 for every 8 block tall repetition, plus an initial starting one (which I technically don't need). So for me to get a 32 high elevator... 16 blocks. 17 if you really want me to use that unneeded one.
Plus, yours can't be modified mid route to allow single step offshoots, or even move horizontally without using just as much Breeze block. Mine can even go diagonally if I so choose.
Now, how often do you figure you're going to have Breezeblock spawn in the Aetherworld? Enough to accommodate your 1.28x efficient design (using the 32 block high model), or enough to accommodate my 2x efficient design?
Also, look at what else has the relative complexities of the "towers" we built.
Yours, Redstone.
Mine, DIRT. (Seriously it''s about as complicated as staggered steps!)
Yours is fashioned more towards the guy who made the 16 bit ALU in redstone than the average explorer who wants a faster method of climbing.
For shits and giggles, if I wanted to manipulate my version to go down a horizontal offshoot, all I'd have to do is put ONE breezeblock on the opposite side I want to do, and continue the pattern (use it from a birds eye view).
And if I wanted it to be an optional offshoot, I just don't have to place that extra breezeblock and instead have a 2 deep hole in the wall until I can continue my pattern.
YOURS, would require MORE manipulation of this input/output functionality, and would also HAVE to start your power further than 2 blocks away.
Anything yours can do, mine can do at lower cost, AND its easier to code, PLUS it's easier to understand by laymen!
As for the whole "piping" functionality that sets our designs apart, the only thing yours does in that respect that mine doesn't introduces something that isn't needed (plus rather complicated [the eruptions]) or is done better by a bucket [simple piping].
There are so many incorrect assumptions that you make about this that I can't even begin to address them all.
Also being able to create a "wind elevator" with fewer blocks does NOT somehow qualify your idea as being better. Seriously, if you want to win a knitting competition against an NBA player, that's fine with me. I understand how my version works, and it works well for a variety of different tasks.
My recommendation to you is to simply be patient while I refine the description for Breezeblock at my own pace. When you no longer see the entire description for that covered in pink, then maybe I'll start listening to issues you feel are a problem. Until then you're effectively critiquing a the painting of a guy who has only just finished selecting his colors.
Hehe, I was going to make a thread for this! Good thing I found this one :tongue.gif: before people started calling me a copier :tongue.gif:. Horray for the above world!
Dang.this looks like it took a really long time to plan around, and it looks awesome. Especially that aetherwhale thingy. it reminds me of the windfish from legend of zelda links awakening (my faveorite zelda ever!) +10!
Can I be disappointed too? Both of you are acting like my baby sister and brother.
"Superman is waaaay better than Carebears!"
"No he's not!"
There's constructive, heating construction, which melds and sands a good idea together. Then there is hacking at eachother's ideas with the hatchets of "I'm right, and you're stupid"
Sabata, how do you get items from to with bucketeering on the following figure, without any manual input except for dumping the item off at
[] [] [] [] []
[] [] [] [] []
= My safe bunker near my spawn point = My mountain base where my treasurey is.
What would a pipe system be powered by? Steam?
You're essentially proposing, "Change your pipeblock to something overly simple so that somebody else can invent a pipeblock."
Here, I'll condense it further.
"IT'S A PIPE. YOU PUT JUNK IN, JUNK COMES OUT THE OTHER END. THE MORE JUNK THAT GOES IN, THE MORE JUNK COMES OUT."
The argument here seems to be simplicity vs. potential. Considering the addition of redstone, which to anybody without education in computers is not exactly kindergarten math, I think Notch is aiming at potential. He wants users to be able to craft wonders, their own little multifunctional world.
Classic is for simplicity.
For grey,
I meant, if it behaves like water, wouldn't fired arrows just hit a wall inside the wall? How could you fix it so that arrows would come out the other end of extensive piping?
How about instead of invisible snowballs, how about little pixelated swirls around the ball to indicate where the windball is? Also, I think the Zephyrs should be a lot less common than ghasts in the nether (With Ghasts, every step is followed by ghasts firing on you) or they have shorter range. Because, there is a lot of other things to focus on in the Aether.
There should be marble. Random marble formations should appear.
There should be white trees with golden leaves.
There should be little friendly mobs called haloites which are little heads with wings and a halo.They spawn in groups of five.You can wear them as a hat and jump twice as high. when killed they drop 1-2 feathers.
I hope you take my ideas into consideration
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
WTB! What the bacon! Bacon makes the world go round!
Good grief, you really do have a handle on the ideas of the Aether. I was considering bringing that up, but wanted to indulge Sabata in the idea of a wind elevator specifically.
There's constructive, heating construction, which melds and sands a good idea together. Then there is hacking at eachother's ideas with the hatchets of "I'm right, and you're stupid"
The creative process isn't always pretty. I'm actually not angry at the attacks on the ideas at all, that's just simple trial by fire. I WANT him to do his best to find things wrong with the process, because being able to address any issues easily is how you know if an idea has potential for reality.
What has actually been getting me more heated has been how many of those issues had already been addressed already and the constant insistence to materialize the new Breezeblock description all at once. It just doesn't work that way. It's still in pink, it's still listed as a topic of discussion, I'm still working on refining the wording for that. If anything, I'm upset because the "attacks" on the idea aren't up to snuff.
You're essentially proposing, "Change your pipeblock to something overly simple so that somebody else can invent a pipeblock."
This.
Here, I'll condense it further.
"IT'S A PIPE. YOU PUT JUNK IN, JUNK COMES OUT THE OTHER END. THE MORE JUNK THAT GOES IN, THE MORE JUNK COMES OUT."
The argument here seems to be simplicity vs. potential. Considering the addition of redstone, which to anybody without education in computers is not exactly kindergarten math, I think Notch is aiming at potential. He wants users to be able to craft wonders, their own little multifunctional world.
Classic is for simplicity.
and this too.
For grey,
I meant, if it behaves like water, wouldn't fired arrows just hit a wall inside the wall? How could you fix it so that arrows would come out the other end of extensive piping?
the easiest way would likely be to have fired arrows treated as another material and then sent through the system that way.(except they would be removed as they are sucked in from the block they were fired at) whereas dropped arrows would be sucked through the system as if moving through water.
How about instead of invisible snowballs, how about little pixelated swirls around the ball to indicate where the windball is? Also, I think the Zephyrs should be a lot less common than ghasts in the nether (With Ghasts, every step is followed by ghasts firing on you) or they have shorter range. Because, there is a lot of other things to focus on in the Aether.
actually, that's exactly the type of graphical effect I was thinking of for that. When I said invisible snowballs, I was only talking about how the physical mechanic, the interaction of the Zephyr's wind with blocks and mobs, would be handled. I hadn't yet gotten to talking about how wind would "look"
Quote from RedEmbers22 »
There should be marble. Random marble formations should appear.
There should be white trees with golden leaves.
There should be little friendly mobs called haloites which are little heads with wings and a halo.They spawn in groups of five.You can wear them as a hat and jump twice as high. when killed they drop 1-2 feathers.
I hope you take my ideas into consideration
I'd like to, but most of your desires have already been brought up earlier and dismissed. There is the possibility of crystal trees, but not golden, and unless marble shows up in overworld first, Aether wont be adding it. Until then, the temples will be made of Mossy cobblestone, but if Notch adds Marble to the overworld, I wouldn't be opposed to temples being made out of marble.
As for the "haloites" that is definitely the best take I've seen on an "angelic" mob, but they're still going to be viewed as "angels" of the aether, and I'm not too big on people being able to just shoot them down, and other people wont be too big on the idea of Aether getting any bigger into the "heaven" role. Also, Phygs already drop feathers, and can be ridden for a pretty similar effect.
Here is my take on breezeblock: (shortened to BB for ease of use)
Base Rules:
*unidirectional, with input facing the player and output facing away
*naturally made, the output will face north
*if either in or out is covered by a block that is not air, a water-source-block, a lava-source-block, or BB, there is no force
*if it is receiving redstone power, there is no force
Input/Output:
*input is 1 block, where any items in the input cube are moved from the input side to the output side (and henceforth effected by the output force)
*output gives 4 blocks of force, where all items or mobs (including the player) are pushed (ending up at the space 5 blocks away)
*if a solid block is in the way of the output length, the output length will extend to the block and stop (pushing everything against the solid block)
Speed:
*the output speed is X2 the speed of water (making any movement towards the block impossible, but quick movement away)
*output speed facing upwards is equal to water (making it possible to "swim" down a wind elevator and movement upwards will be faster than moving up a ladder)
In a Row:
*if the output of BR is placed against the input of another BB ( like this: [>] [>] ) the "blocks of force" of the last BB is added to the next one (so 2 in a row gives 8 force, 3 in a row gives 12, etc)
*the input remains 1 block regardless of length
*the output speed remains the same regardless of length
*redstone power reduces the BB's force to 0, so as long as the last stone in the row is powered, there is no wind (also, if a stone in the middle of a line is powered, it cancels the power of that one and all behind it, but leaves all in front alone)
*to prevent giefing (and limit computer load) the "blocks of force" is limited to 16 (so any BB row larger than 4 makes no difference)
Lava/Water:
*If a source-block of lava or water is on the input side of a BB, it will fill the output length with that liquid, filling the space entirely but not spilling out (so 2 BRs with a lava input will make a 8 block long deadly line of lava!)
*the line of lava or water is not source blocks, so it cannot be removed (or farmed) with buckets
*this also means that spires of water or lava crated by BB will not spill over, even if facing directly down (the source-block at the input still flows normally)
*the output speed remains the same regardless of material
Feel free to chop this up, but I want solid feedback on this.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
I once saw a chicken push a creeper off of a cliff. I never looked at chickens the same way ever again. That is of course until I needed feathers.
I managed to ask notch about this, and he might add it once the Nether is more interesting!
More info:
Notch was on Coe's livestream, and I managed to ask about this through the constant stream of people talking. He said that he wasn't going to add more realms while there's a mostly boring one already there. He might add more realms when it is more interesting.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
I protect: Slimes, pigs, pigmen, squids
I destroy: Ghasts, chickens, creepers What did those poor [Pig]s do to deserve death?
GENERATION 20: The first time you see this, copy it into your sig on any forum and add 1 to the generation.
Sabata, how do you get items from to with bucketeering on the following figure, without any manual input except for dumping the item off at
[] [] [] [] []
[] [] [] [] []
= My safe bunker near my spawn point = My mountain base where my treasurey is.
What would a pipe system be powered by? Steam?
You're essentially proposing, "Change your pipeblock to something overly simple so that somebody else can invent a pipeblock."
Here, I'll condense it further.
"IT'S A PIPE. YOU PUT JUNK IN, JUNK COMES OUT THE OTHER END. THE MORE JUNK THAT GOES IN, THE MORE JUNK COMES OUT."
The argument here seems to be simplicity vs. potential. Considering the addition of redstone, which to anybody without education in computers is not exactly kindergarten math, I think Notch is aiming at potential. He wants users to be able to craft wonders, their own little multifunctional world.
Assuming that isn't the actual distance you want it to travel, and either of our options are available, You make a direct air pipe using Grey's, or you use my pattern either over ground, under ground, or some angle inbetween.
"Piping items" NEVER had to deal with water or lava. Air does that trick just fine.
If you're talking about "piping lava/water" then you're going to have to go from one place to another, and if one of those places actually has the lava/water, then just cart it with a bucket. You'll be at both places either way.
If you're talking about trying to siphon things from chests or some other random idea I haven't seen yet that attempts to use some new functionality... hell if I know.
And yes that's basically what I'm proposing.
Because I believe sight has been lost on the initial goal. And I ask you "How in Notch's Green Overworld does a Pipe fit into the Aether?"
You could even use a Breeze Block in it's construction if you desperately wanted to. But a Breeze Block should NOT be a Pipe.
@The redstone bit
I think Notch just wanted to create a method so people could open doors/set off TNT from a distance. It ended up being Bit Logic. Notch DEFINITELY didn't have that 16 Bit ALU in mind when he was thinking up Redstone.
I think this is the inherent difference between us.
You must have believed that really large simple computers was his ultimate goal with Redstone.
Exactly! =D
Oh, I forgot about walking across.
[]
[] []
[] []
There, that works.
Like Kwickgamer said. Plus, you might be able to use a glider, if those make it in. Also...
The Zephyr and Senties are hostile, about the same as the nether. The zephyr will attempt to blow you off so you fall to your death. And you kindof contradicted yourself. "Let's make a hostile mob to make it more dangerous. Oh, but let's make it COMPLETELY safe with a return-items-on-death." Would you be happy if we made the Nether a Safe-travel zone? No, it would remove most of fun from it.
Instead of struggling hard to keep your health up so you don't die, you have to struggle less-hard to stop from falling to your instant death. The struggle is easier in the Aether, but the stakes are probably instant death instead of a varying amounts of health, or at least having to find your way back to the Aether.
If it can produce this effect though, maybe it wont only occur in the Aether. It can just be set up so that in the Overworld, Breezeblock only forms with Geysers, in Nether it only forms with Volcanoes, but in Aether it naturally generates in other random formations allowing it to simply blow things around.
PLEASE ALSO SUPPORT:
Sabata & Grey Acumen's "New Nether"
Grey Acumen's Minecraft 2.0 Suggestion Series
I've thought of 3 more questions (well, 3 question groups). After that, I don't know what else to discuss about breezeblocks.
1.What about FIRE at input of a breezeblock? It's not solid, but it's not exactly liquid or gas either.
2. If item transport through breezeblock works like water, what about arrows fire into the breezeblock?
3. What if it's like [>]
I also figured out that wind could work kind of like a "wind" block from the breezeblocks, since they need empty space anyway (Except for pushing gravel and sand) and should be constantly going, like water. But from a Zephyr, it makes more sense to make it like an arrow.
For the moment, we could probably treat it like air, BUT it might be worth adding it to the materials that the breezeblocks can carry, and then the output will just lay some fire down on the blocks in front of the output. It would allow for some nice fire based traps.
i already have mentioned that. arrows dropped into a breezeblock pipe would be dropped out the other side, but fired into might warrant firing out the other side, or just being ignored, it depends on what is practical.
Yes. I think in this case, the wind/water/lava would basically run a check that goes out as many blocks as the power output, and sees if there is a free space to push those blocks to. That will need some work to fine tune.
I was thinking more like invisible snowballs from teh Zephyr, but yes, I was also thinking of wind as a non-spilling invisible water block.
PLEASE ALSO SUPPORT:
Sabata & Grey Acumen's "New Nether"
Grey Acumen's Minecraft 2.0 Suggestion Series
You're building the "Redstone Circuits" before getting "Redstone" completed.
Take a look at your first post.
Notice how the "features" of Breezeblock is atleast 1.5x the length of any other block suggestion?
CONDENSE IT.
For god's sakes you mention Redstone ONCE inside the MASSIVE block of text there!
Here's what it should read (take notice of how long the description is):
BreezeBlock:
Has one input, output on the opposite side, and secondary inputs inbetween. When placed, input is facing the player.
The input must have either Air, Water, Lava, or another Breeze block who's output is facing this one's input.
The force of the Air/Water/Lava is calculated by (your balanced equation here).
Secondary inputs must have the same "value" (Air/Water/Lava) as the primary output to increase force.
If the output is blocked, by either an incompatible Breezeblock, or a solid block of another type, the breeze block shuts off.
BreezeBlock can be rotated with a right click.
BreezeBlock is on when placed but can be manipulated via Redstone.
TADAAA!
As for that part about "if the block is movable" that needs to be added to the MOVABLE BLOCK'S code, NOT Breeze Stone's.
I'm most disappointed with you for continuing to "chop" my quote again though. I made an effort so that you could go back to your post and know exactly what I was talking about. As you didn't it's like talking to someone who has no short term memory. 1 and 1b were how I titled them in my first post. Hell when you cut them up you CUT THEM BY THOSE TITLES. Yet only one response later you can't remember what they are. I'll say it again "it's like talking to someone who has no short term memory."
And Grey, unless you have a single songstone block be strong enough to push a human 6 spaces, or have songstone blocks power increase exponentially, you can't achieve the same things I was suggesting.
For example, the wind elevator, using the block that pushes in all directions, and increases in power based on how many sides are closed.
A 4*x1 shaft is all you need. (4* because those extra two are used very sparingly)
The only thing I'd have to do to make this work, under the "all direction, etc" block is make sure that with 2 sides open it has power to push a human 6 blocks. (Or I could just expand it's breadth by 1 so I can have it so "only one side exposed pushes 6 blocks")
[Please note, that this would work just as well for moving items as your piping system.]
Now off the bat, using your block it'd require a 6x1 because of those extra directionals needing air behind them.
Secondly, if a single block of yours gives enough force to push 6 blocks how strong is a single addition going to make it? 12?
(This is actually a challenge for you Grey to see if you can replicate an automated elevator with your block as is)
The above diagram was the most compact my design could be. Granted yours using it's multiplicative properties could simply be block atop block until it has enough force, but my design can be repeated to take someone from min build height to max build height with out having to start X blocks above min [meaning your tower of blocks to get the proper velocity] (excusing the one for the start in mine).
Leave piping to a craftable item that acts like minecart tracks.
Lava and water "eruptions" are neat sure, but do they NEED to be created?
Piping for the overworld I might see, the Breeze bock for the Aether I can see. Eruptions in the overworld or Aether? No, maybe the Nether but that would make the current Breeze block (an Aether block) more suited to the Nether than anything else.
You're building the "Redstone Circuits" without really thinking what "Redstone" should do.
And more specifically, you're losing your original goal of "A block that blows" in an attempt to create your own version of Piping.
And here, as seen from the front;
[v] [v] [v]
[>] [b][o][/b] [<]
[>] [^] [<]
with all blocks only generating a power of 1 on their own, that center [o] block now has a power of 9, now if that block was behind this block:
[v] [] [v]
[>] [b][v][/b] [<]
[>] [o] [<]
then that bottom [o] block would have a power of 16 (since the [b][v][/b] is getting power from the [b][o][/b] in the first diagram)
[A]
[A]
[A]
[A]=first diagram from the side(always facing in)
[B]
[B]
[B]
[B]=second diagram from the side (always facing in)
[A][B] [] [B][A]
[A][B] [] [B][A]
[A][B] [^] [B][A]
[A][B]
that [^] now has a power of 32-33, straight up, no need to create any staggered tunnels at all, so only a 1x1 shaft is needed. The entire base only has a footprint of 3x5 wide and 4 tall. If I wanted to, I could have instead made it taller:
[v] [v] [v]
[>] [v] [<]
[>] [v] [<]
[>] [v] [<]
[>] [v] [<]
[>] [v] [<]
[>] [o] [<]
this setup would also have a power of 16 coming out of the [o] block
[C] [] [C]
[C] [] [C]
[C] [] [C]
[C] [] [C]
[C] [] [C]
[C] [] [C]
[C] [^] [C]
so with the columns of [C] referring to the diagram above, the [^] block would also be supplying a power of 32-33, and only need a 3x3 wide footprint 7 blocks tall to create a single column straight up.
I'd say that makes things quite a bit more compact, though it obviously uses more Breezeblocks.
Since you apparently can't handle being quoted, I'm just going to ignore the rest of what you said. It's honestly not worth the effort to describe what each point is that I'm referring to.
PLEASE ALSO SUPPORT:
Sabata & Grey Acumen's "New Nether"
Grey Acumen's Minecraft 2.0 Suggestion Series
Yours:
Mine:
CONDENSE IT.
Also, notice just how much Breeze Block you had to use to get the same effect?
For 32~ power (essentially a 32 bock elevator) you required A (7) x2 + B (8) x2 + 1? Took you 25 Breezeblock for 32 straight up ONLY.
Mine, uses 4 for every 8 block tall repetition, plus an initial starting one (which I technically don't need). So for me to get a 32 high elevator... 16 blocks. 17 if you really want me to use that unneeded one.
Plus, yours can't be modified mid route to allow single step offshoots, or even move horizontally without using just as much Breeze block. Mine can even go diagonally if I so choose.
Now, how often do you figure you're going to have Breezeblock spawn in the Aetherworld? Enough to accommodate your 1.28x efficient design (using the 32 block high model), or enough to accommodate my 2x efficient design?
Also, look at what else has the relative complexities of the "towers" we built.
Yours, Redstone.
Mine, DIRT. (Seriously it''s about as complicated as staggered steps!)
Yours is fashioned more towards the guy who made the 16 bit ALU in redstone than the average explorer who wants a faster method of climbing.
For shits and giggles, if I wanted to manipulate my version to go down a horizontal offshoot, all I'd have to do is put ONE breezeblock on the opposite side I want to do, and continue the pattern (use it from a birds eye view).
And if I wanted it to be an optional offshoot, I just don't have to place that extra breezeblock and instead have a 2 deep hole in the wall until I can continue my pattern.
YOURS, would require MORE manipulation of this input/output functionality, and would also HAVE to start your power further than 2 blocks away.
Anything yours can do, mine can do at lower cost, AND its easier to code, PLUS it's easier to understand by laymen!
As for the whole "piping" functionality that sets our designs apart, the only thing yours does in that respect that mine doesn't introduces something that isn't needed (plus rather complicated [the eruptions]) or is done better by a bucket [simple piping].
Also being able to create a "wind elevator" with fewer blocks does NOT somehow qualify your idea as being better. Seriously, if you want to win a knitting competition against an NBA player, that's fine with me. I understand how my version works, and it works well for a variety of different tasks.
My recommendation to you is to simply be patient while I refine the description for Breezeblock at my own pace. When you no longer see the entire description for that covered in pink, then maybe I'll start listening to issues you feel are a problem. Until then you're effectively critiquing a the painting of a guy who has only just finished selecting his colors.
PLEASE ALSO SUPPORT:
Sabata & Grey Acumen's "New Nether"
Grey Acumen's Minecraft 2.0 Suggestion Series
Drop the piping system as an inherency of Breeze Block.
Leave that to a craftable pipe.
There, gimme a call when you've got it all down and set.
I want to see stuff added to Minecraft now!!
Honestly, over complication.
Can I be disappointed too? Both of you are acting like my baby sister and brother.
"Superman is waaaay better than Carebears!"
"No he's not!"
There's constructive, heating construction, which melds and sands a good idea together. Then there is hacking at eachother's ideas with the hatchets of "I'm right, and you're stupid"
Sabata, how do you get items from
[] [] [] [] []
[] [] [] []
What would a pipe system be powered by? Steam?
You're essentially proposing, "Change your pipeblock to something overly simple so that somebody else can invent a pipeblock."
Here, I'll condense it further.
"IT'S A PIPE. YOU PUT JUNK IN, JUNK COMES OUT THE OTHER END. THE MORE JUNK THAT GOES IN, THE MORE JUNK COMES OUT."
The argument here seems to be simplicity vs. potential. Considering the addition of redstone, which to anybody without education in computers is not exactly kindergarten math, I think Notch is aiming at potential. He wants users to be able to craft wonders, their own little multifunctional world.
Classic is for simplicity.
For grey,
I meant, if it behaves like water, wouldn't fired arrows just hit a wall inside the wall? How could you fix it so that arrows would come out the other end of extensive piping?
How about instead of invisible snowballs, how about little pixelated swirls around the ball to indicate where the windball is? Also, I think the Zephyrs should be a lot less common than ghasts in the nether (With Ghasts, every step is followed by ghasts firing on you) or they have shorter range. Because, there is a lot of other things to focus on in the Aether.
There should be white trees with golden leaves.
There should be little friendly mobs called haloites which are little heads with wings and a halo.They spawn in groups of five.You can wear them as a hat and jump twice as high. when killed they drop 1-2 feathers.
I hope you take my ideas into consideration
WTB! What the bacon! Bacon makes the world go round!
I think that the portal part should look like the nether portal except golden
WTB! What the bacon! Bacon makes the world go round!
Good grief, you really do have a handle on the ideas of the Aether. I was considering bringing that up, but wanted to indulge Sabata in the idea of a wind elevator specifically.
The creative process isn't always pretty. I'm actually not angry at the attacks on the ideas at all, that's just simple trial by fire. I WANT him to do his best to find things wrong with the process, because being able to address any issues easily is how you know if an idea has potential for reality.
What has actually been getting me more heated has been how many of those issues had already been addressed already and the constant insistence to materialize the new Breezeblock description all at once. It just doesn't work that way. It's still in pink, it's still listed as a topic of discussion, I'm still working on refining the wording for that. If anything, I'm upset because the "attacks" on the idea aren't up to snuff.
This.
and this too.
the easiest way would likely be to have fired arrows treated as another material and then sent through the system that way.(except they would be removed as they are sucked in from the block they were fired at) whereas dropped arrows would be sucked through the system as if moving through water.
actually, that's exactly the type of graphical effect I was thinking of for that. When I said invisible snowballs, I was only talking about how the physical mechanic, the interaction of the Zephyr's wind with blocks and mobs, would be handled. I hadn't yet gotten to talking about how wind would "look"
I'd like to, but most of your desires have already been brought up earlier and dismissed. There is the possibility of crystal trees, but not golden, and unless marble shows up in overworld first, Aether wont be adding it. Until then, the temples will be made of Mossy cobblestone, but if Notch adds Marble to the overworld, I wouldn't be opposed to temples being made out of marble.
As for the "haloites" that is definitely the best take I've seen on an "angelic" mob, but they're still going to be viewed as "angels" of the aether, and I'm not too big on people being able to just shoot them down, and other people wont be too big on the idea of Aether getting any bigger into the "heaven" role. Also, Phygs already drop feathers, and can be ridden for a pretty similar effect.
PLEASE ALSO SUPPORT:
Sabata & Grey Acumen's "New Nether"
Grey Acumen's Minecraft 2.0 Suggestion Series
Base Rules:
*unidirectional, with input facing the player and output facing away
*naturally made, the output will face north
*if either in or out is covered by a block that is not air, a water-source-block, a lava-source-block, or BB, there is no force
*if it is receiving redstone power, there is no force
Input/Output:
*input is 1 block, where any items in the input cube are moved from the input side to the output side (and henceforth effected by the output force)
*output gives 4 blocks of force, where all items or mobs (including the player) are pushed (ending up at the space 5 blocks away)
*if a solid block is in the way of the output length, the output length will extend to the block and stop (pushing everything against the solid block)
Speed:
*the output speed is X2 the speed of water (making any movement towards the block impossible, but quick movement away)
*output speed facing upwards is equal to water (making it possible to "swim" down a wind elevator and movement upwards will be faster than moving up a ladder)
In a Row:
*if the output of BR is placed against the input of another BB ( like this: [>] [>] ) the "blocks of force" of the last BB is added to the next one (so 2 in a row gives 8 force, 3 in a row gives 12, etc)
*the input remains 1 block regardless of length
*the output speed remains the same regardless of length
*redstone power reduces the BB's force to 0, so as long as the last stone in the row is powered, there is no wind (also, if a stone in the middle of a line is powered, it cancels the power of that one and all behind it, but leaves all in front alone)
*to prevent giefing (and limit computer load) the "blocks of force" is limited to 16 (so any BB row larger than 4 makes no difference)
Lava/Water:
*If a source-block of lava or water is on the input side of a BB, it will fill the output length with that liquid, filling the space entirely but not spilling out (so 2 BRs with a lava input will make a 8 block long deadly line of lava!)
*the line of lava or water is not source blocks, so it cannot be removed (or farmed) with buckets
*this also means that spires of water or lava crated by BB will not spill over, even if facing directly down (the source-block at the input still flows normally)
*the output speed remains the same regardless of material
Feel free to chop this up, but I want solid feedback on this.
More info:
Notch was on Coe's livestream, and I managed to ask about this through the constant stream of people talking. He said that he wasn't going to add more realms while there's a mostly boring one already there. He might add more realms when it is more interesting.
I destroy: Ghasts, chickens, creepers
What did those poor [Pig]s do to deserve death?
GENERATION 20: The first time you see this, copy it into your sig on any forum and add 1 to the generation.
YAY!!!
you get (
{cake}
for contacting Notch with this.
Assuming that isn't the actual distance you want it to travel, and either of our options are available, You make a direct air pipe using Grey's, or you use my pattern either over ground, under ground, or some angle inbetween.
"Piping items" NEVER had to deal with water or lava. Air does that trick just fine.
If you're talking about "piping lava/water" then you're going to have to go from one place to another, and if one of those places actually has the lava/water, then just cart it with a bucket. You'll be at both places either way.
If you're talking about trying to siphon things from chests or some other random idea I haven't seen yet that attempts to use some new functionality... hell if I know.
And yes that's basically what I'm proposing.
Because I believe sight has been lost on the initial goal. And I ask you "How in Notch's Green Overworld does a Pipe fit into the Aether?"
You could even use a Breeze Block in it's construction if you desperately wanted to. But a Breeze Block should NOT be a Pipe.
@The redstone bit
I think Notch just wanted to create a method so people could open doors/set off TNT from a distance. It ended up being Bit Logic. Notch DEFINITELY didn't have that 16 Bit ALU in mind when he was thinking up Redstone.
I think this is the inherent difference between us.
You must have believed that really large simple computers was his ultimate goal with Redstone.