I'll start off by saying I've been playing MC about 2 weeks now; I just purchased it right before beta launch (woot woot!). Definitely my new addiction. (Hopefully it can replace cigarettes?) I pretty much know how everything works in the game - the mining strategies, trapping strategies, redstone devices, cannons, physics, etc. and have become very talented in controlling the flow of Lava and water in-game so, I have some experience with it all. I am almost finished building a massive castle network and town that I'll post when I'm finished to show off my in-game architecture skills.
Anyway, this thread is about your idea so, enough about my background.
I voted the third choice, for two reasons.
1) I don't like the idea of Quicksoil consuming oxygen at certain speeds. The material seems rare enough so that any distance of platform or area built with Quicksoil would not be large enough to walk great distances (i.e; across an entire map), but merely act as something like a horizontal escalator/conveyor belt for quicker navigation through castles or towns. I love the core idea for Quicksoil though.
2) Sticky Sand. I dislike, and am very concerned, about the idea of limiting jump height to half a block. Falling even one block into a 'pool' of sticky sand will, in some cases, cause death to be an only escape option, depending on the geology of it. Of course, this takes away most of its trap-crafting capabilities, but it still acts as a heavy deterrent to would-be invaders and monsters.
EVERYTHING else you have suggested in this thread gains my support. This, overall, is an incredible idea and if it weren't for those two little quirks that I don't exactly agree with, I would have voted the first. Of course I would still play Minecraft in all its glory regardless.
PS: You are also a genius for this, and in my opinion it is one of the most thought out, appropriate, and enhancing ideas I have seen for Minecraft. It compliments the Nether so well, in a quirky opposite way.
Edit:
I also think that there will be issues with monster AI and rubber blocks.
Ya I never got the oxygen consumption thing either, but the main things I disagree with no one else seems to think the same towards them, so I'll have to settle. Anyway, Grey, do you think it'd be a good idea to add example craftables for the blocks and Mob drops?
When I think about it, Chalk/Marble would be more fitting with "parallel, but opposite" Which is a theme I've heard mentioned before. Except that it would add Chalk, which before wouldn't be necessary.
Chalk would be found deep underground, like lava. You could pour lava on it and turn it into Marble, or you could harvest it with an iron pick, then make a portal shape out of it and pour lava on it to turn to Chalk into marble. Marble would be harvested with a Diamond pick. Also, Chalk would be found naturally in the Aether somewhere.
This would make Nether and Aether portal parallel in these ways:
They both require access to lava (To turn Chalk into Marble, or to pour water over and turn to obsidian.)
They both require iron (Make buckets to bring lava up to pour water on to make obsidian and a Nether portal, or to pour Lava on Chalk to make marble.
Diamond Picks would be required to break both Obsidian and Marble.
Chalk is found in the Aether and Lava is found in the Nether, But neither places have to materials necessary to turn the blocks into the blocks required for portals.
And they would be opposite in these ways:
Chalk is solid, while Lava is liquid.
Chalk would require having lava poured over it, while Lava would require lava.
Marble is white, while Obsidian is black.
One problem with this, Marble would be found naturally in the Aether in the form of temples, and a player could just take marble from the temple walls. I suppose the temples could be made out of a mossier form of marble, but then regular marble would be required to make the portal, making two more blocks necessary to add.
I suppose Lightstone would be better in the way that it wouldn't need to have another block added, and is more opposite.
Feel free to ignore this completely, I thought I'd just throw this in there.
Yeah, I'm just not really interested in adding what is effectively a purely aesthetic block when there's something already in game that will work fine. I was also planning on having mossy cobblestone for the temples, to draw the parallel of them being the dungeons of the Aether. In your example, you're essentially suggesting adding not just 1 block, but 3, and you're suggesting using lava to change chalk into marble instead of the standard minecraft method of simply smelting in a furnace.
Quote from Rofflecopters »
1) I don't like the idea of Quicksoil consuming oxygen at certain speeds. The material seems rare enough so that any distance of platform or area built with Quicksoil would not be large enough to walk great distances (i.e; across an entire map), but merely act as something like a horizontal escalator/conveyor belt for quicker navigation through castles or towns. I love the core idea for Quicksoil though.
While you may have a good understanding of how things work that are already in the game, your concepts of how things WOULD work in the game are a little shaky.
A) Whether or not it's rare, both the Aether and the overworld are infinite realms and people can gather up as much as they can find. Eventually people will be able to gather up enough to make runways that span entire map chunks.
:cool.gif: People can edit their game with a 3rd party program to give themselves however many blocks they want.
Either way, going "the rarity will keep it from being used this way" doesn't work.
2) Sticky Sand. I dislike, and am very concerned, about the idea of limiting jump height to half a block. Falling even one block into a 'pool' of sticky sand will, in some cases, cause death to be an only escape option, depending on the geology of it. Of course, this takes away most of its trap-crafting capabilities, but it still acts as a heavy deterrent to would-be invaders and monsters.
What are you talking about? "Oh god! I've fallen into STICKY SAND! There's no possible way that my ability to break any block any block except adminium and my ability to place any block I happen to be carrying could possibly save me!" Are you seeing the flaw in your logic? The only situation in which sticky sand = death is this:
=sticky sand =Player
[] []
and that is only auto death if you have absolutely no other blocks in your inventory at all. Even then, it's still no worse than that same situation would be without sticky sand:
EVERYTHING else you have suggested in this thread gains my support. This, overall, is an incredible idea and if it weren't for those two little quirks that I don't exactly agree with, I would have voted the first. Of course I would still play Minecraft in all its glory regardless.
Well, hopefully I'll have addressed those quirks for you. you can always change your vote if that's the case.
PS: You are also a genius for this, and in my opinion it is one of the most thought out, appropriate, and enhancing ideas I have seen for Minecraft. It compliments the Nether so well, in a quirky opposite way.
Well, it's not like any of this is all me. There have been a lot of other people suggesting ideas. My primary focus has been on funneling them into a coherent theme.
Quote from Flubbedpig »
Ya I never got the oxygen consumption thing either, but the main things I disagree with no one else seems to think the same towards them, so I'll have to settle. Anyway, Grey, do you think it'd be a good idea to add example craftables for the blocks and Mob drops?
I already have basic vague general examples for what each block can be used in for crafting. I don't see any point in being more specific than that until after the Aether is actually a reality.
Sorry, yeah you did kind of bust my logic on the sticky sand thing, but I never said that death would be inevitable if falling into it, just that in some cases would be the only option. Or a warp command.
On the quicksoil though, I still don't think that it should consume oxygen. That just seems arbitrary to me.
Yeah, I'm just not really interested in adding what is effectively a purely aesthetic block when there's something already in game that will work fine. I was also planning on having mossy cobblestone for the temples, to draw the parallel of them being the dungeons of the Aether. In your example, you're essentially suggesting adding not just 1 block, but 3, and you're suggesting using lava to change chalk into marble instead of the standard minecraft method of simply smelting in a furnace.
Sorry, yeah you did kind of bust my logic on the sticky sand thing, but I never said that death would be inevitable if falling into it, just that in some cases would be the only option. Or a warp command.
That's not the point I was making. The fact is that death is NOT the only option, and neither is warping. You just need to break the sticky sand that you are standing on, or you need to break the blocks that are forming the border that keep you from just walking out of the sticky sand area. It's no worse than falling into a 2 block deep pit.
That's the point my diagram was making is that unless you are trapped in a pit surrounded by adminium, you aren't going to be trapped in it, and if you are in a pit surrounded by adminium that still has room for you to put a sticky sand block in the bottom of the pit, then that same pit would be just as "deadly/trapping" as if the sticky sand block wasn't there. So not only would you have to specifically go out of your way to trap yourself on a sticky sand block, but the spot you could do it in would work just as well without having the sticky sand at all, which means it's not the sticky sand that is deadly/trapping, but the pit that is deadly/trapping.
On the quicksoil though, I still don't think that it should consume oxygen. That just seems arbitrary to me.
Look, when you run really really fast, what happens? You get winded, also known as running out of oxygen. It's not exactly complicated.
Quote from Chemist98 »
Yeah, you're right. Forget I said anything, then.
It's okay, the marble issue has come up a lot, it warrants repeating the explanation why I don't feel it warrants implementation.
(this is my first post, so please tell me if I did anything wrong.)
The idea of the Aether sounds excellent. I love almost everything about it, but I'd like to point out a few things:
I agree that the Aether should be accessed by a portal. No airship. Since the nether needs a portal to access, then the Aether should require a portal also. The portal should also require Lightstone to create. There's no real need to create a whole new block just to build a portal with. Lightstone is also a good material to use because it is only found in the nether, which would force the player to travel to the nether before the aether. Minecraft needs some more optional long-term goals, and one of those goals could be reaching the aether.
(this is my first post, so please tell me if I did anything wrong.)
The idea of the Aether sounds excellent. I love almost everything about it, but I'd like to point out a few things:
I agree that the Aether should be accessed by a portal. No airship. Since the nether needs a portal to access, then the Aether should require a portal also. The portal should also require Lightstone to create. There's no real need to create a whole new block just to build a portal with. Lightstone is also a good material to use because it is only found in the nether, which would force the player to travel to the nether before the aether. Minecraft needs some more optional long-term goals, and one of those goals could be reaching the aether.
Anyway, this is an excellent idea.
I don't see anything wrong except possibly going into such detail to agree with what is already in the opening post. It's nice to know that you agree with those specific points though.
Out of curiosity, do you just mean that airships shouldn't be able to get you from Overworld to Aether, or do you mean that airships shouldn't exist at all?
Airships could exist, but they shouldn't be able to take you to the aether. Like I said, the only way of getting to the nether is via portal, so the only way of getting to the aether should be by portal.
First of all, why is rubber and sticky gravel getting so many dislikes now? They were put in awhile back :ohmy.gif:
Okay, with sticky gravel you can still use ladders to get up any near blocks or just break the block like grey said.
I was thinking maybe you could make sticky gravel turn into glue when you both set it on fire OR smelt it. This way you can get glue in the nether from just a flint and steel. Also, ghasts can contribute to your glue making needs when they shoot fire balls at it.
Grey, do you think my earlier plant idea (BogFog) is good enough for me to make it it's own topic? I ask because every time I make a topic of what I think is good, it dies within minutes, and I don't want to waste my time again.
Grey, do you think my earlier plant idea (BogFog) is good enough for me to make it it's own topic? I ask because every time I make a topic of what I think is good, it dies within minutes, and I don't want to waste my time again.
I have to agree with Grey on it being a Nether thing, but I know I would support your idea!
But wouldnt that mean you wouldnt need a portal to get back into the Aether.
-snip-
I personally don't feel that airships should be used for getting to the aether at all.
My idea for getting to the aether is to gather balloons for airships by killing Ghasts and getting their "flight bladders", which retains the "progression" that people seem to like.
(I don't like the progression idea.Its a sandbox. If someone wants to go to the aether first, then let them)
My other idea, which ties in with the aether being an actual place above the normal world, would be to have aerwhales and balloon lizards(my idea) occasionally come down to the normal area. You would then kill them and get their balloon-type drop.
First of all, why is rubber and sticky gravel getting so many dislikes now? They were put in awhile back :ohmy.gif:
Okay, with sticky gravel you can still use ladders to get up any near blocks or just break the block like grey said.
I was thinking maybe you could make sticky gravel turn into glue when you both set it on fire OR smelt it. This way you can get glue in the nether from just a flint and steel. Also, ghasts can contribute to your glue making needs when they shoot fire balls at it.
Anyway, merry christmas and a happy new year.
It's just the one guy against the sticky sand, and only because he forgot how minecraft works. The Rubber was just tossed in there, and no one really said much about it except you and me before. Again, instead of glue, I'd go with "tar" for what you get when you smelt it. That way it can be black, and a bucket of tar would be black, and easy to distinguish from a bucket of milk, which would be easy to confuse with a bucket of glue.
Quote from athdaraxen »
Quote from Flubbedpig »
Grey, do you think my earlier plant idea (BogFog) is good enough for me to make it it's own topic? I ask because every time I make a topic of what I think is good, it dies within minutes, and I don't want to waste my time again.
I have to agree with Grey on it being a Nether thing, but I know I would support your idea!
It's an interesting way to handle the concept. Sometimes ideas just don't get much feedback, even when they're good, simply because it's a niche thing that wont change gameplay significantly.
The ingredients for a thread that gets a lot of response are generally those that "get the snowball rolling" where you have an overarching idea, with supporting ideas that give people a taste of where things are headed, but where people can keep adding their own ideas. If you have everything already solved and figured out, the most people can do is go "I like that" or "I don't like that"
My personal recommendation would be to find all the threads that have anything to do with improving the Nether, see which one has the most posts, and which of those still have the thread starter who is still active and willing to update their opening post, and add your idea to those. Otherwise try to make your own thread, gather up all the ideas that you can, credit the specific people, and try to come up with more ideas as you go.
Quote from AndrewJohn1995 »
it is a sandbox, but can you get to the nether straight away? no, you need diamond and iron and other materials to get there
besides the aether yields more rewards than the nether
AJ struck the crux of the issue. there already is progression just with how the Nether is set up. you can't go there until after you at least gather 3 iron (minimum) and even then you're putting in a pretty heft amount of work to gather the needed lava in buckets, build the form, pour the water, etc. A similar progression should take place after you've gotten to the nether to allow you to get to the Aether.
I really like this idea, but there are some things I think that would be better if changed:
About sticky sand replacing slowsand, I think it would be better to make sticky sand a new block entirely. The replacement could mess with some traps /bases;
Rubber is interesing, but being around lava ppols is a bit strange. It would be better for it to be placed in a new way, not sure how trought. Maybe small pyramids of rubber, or it being buried 1 tile under netherstone rarely?
Phygs are a bit unecessary. It would be better if they werent something so used(we already got zombie pigs and pigman).What if they could be goats?
And also, it could be interesing if floatsand started moving also by redstone pulses,
First of all, why is rubber and sticky gravel getting so many dislikes now? They were put in awhile back :ohmy.gif:
Okay, with sticky gravel you can still use ladders to get up any near blocks or just break the block like grey said.
I was thinking maybe you could make sticky gravel turn into glue when you both set it on fire OR smelt it. This way you can get glue in the nether from just a flint and steel. Also, ghasts can contribute to your glue making needs when they shoot fire balls at it.
Anyway, merry christmas and a happy new year.
It's just the one guy against the sticky sand, and only because he forgot how minecraft works. The Rubber was just tossed in there, and no one really said much about it except you and me before. Again, instead of glue, I'd go with "tar" for what you get when you smelt it. That way it can be black, and a bucket of tar would be black, and easy to distinguish from a bucket of milk, which would be easy to confuse with a bucket of glue.
Why not introduce actual rubber plants? They could be harvested and melted into rubber? As for tar there is always tar pits.... personally I'd love to see a creeper drown in a pit of tar...
I really like this idea, but there are some things I think that would be better if changed:
About sticky sand replacing slowsand, I think it would be better to make sticky sand a new block entirely. The replacement could mess with some traps /bases;
i'm sure that it hasn't been around long enough for people to have gotten too attached, and besides, sticky sand would have MORE features.
Rubber is interesing, but being around lava ppols is a bit strange. It would be better for it to be placed in a new way, not sure how trought. Maybe small pyramids of rubber, or it being buried 1 tile under netherstone rarely?
Logistically, maybe. But having rubber occur naturally around lava pools means that the player is more likely to fall into a pool when they bounce off of a rubber block. That keeps it as a better natural hazard.
Phygs are a bit unecessary. It would be better if they werent something so used(we already got zombie pigs and pigman).What if they could be goats?
No. It's been discussed why pigs are better, and it's not just for the jokes of when pigs fly.
And also, it could be interesting if floatsand started moving also by redstone pulses,
Also already covered.
Quote from AndrewJohn1995 »
But the fire thing, reasonable idea or not?
lava maybe, fire seems a bit too easy, not sure if it should even be handled through smelting though, since it would be difficult to get it into the bucket without dropping it first.
Anyway, this thread is about your idea so, enough about my background.
I voted the third choice, for two reasons.
1) I don't like the idea of Quicksoil consuming oxygen at certain speeds. The material seems rare enough so that any distance of platform or area built with Quicksoil would not be large enough to walk great distances (i.e; across an entire map), but merely act as something like a horizontal escalator/conveyor belt for quicker navigation through castles or towns. I love the core idea for Quicksoil though.
2) Sticky Sand. I dislike, and am very concerned, about the idea of limiting jump height to half a block. Falling even one block into a 'pool' of sticky sand will, in some cases, cause death to be an only escape option, depending on the geology of it. Of course, this takes away most of its trap-crafting capabilities, but it still acts as a heavy deterrent to would-be invaders and monsters.
EVERYTHING else you have suggested in this thread gains my support. This, overall, is an incredible idea and if it weren't for those two little quirks that I don't exactly agree with, I would have voted the first. Of course I would still play Minecraft in all its glory regardless.
PS: You are also a genius for this, and in my opinion it is one of the most thought out, appropriate, and enhancing ideas I have seen for Minecraft. It compliments the Nether so well, in a quirky opposite way.
Edit:
I also think that there will be issues with monster AI and rubber blocks.
Chalk would be found deep underground, like lava. You could pour lava on it and turn it into Marble, or you could harvest it with an iron pick, then make a portal shape out of it and pour lava on it to turn to Chalk into marble. Marble would be harvested with a Diamond pick. Also, Chalk would be found naturally in the Aether somewhere.
This would make Nether and Aether portal parallel in these ways:
They both require access to lava (To turn Chalk into Marble, or to pour water over and turn to obsidian.)
They both require iron (Make buckets to bring lava up to pour water on to make obsidian and a Nether portal, or to pour Lava on Chalk to make marble.
Diamond Picks would be required to break both Obsidian and Marble.
Chalk is found in the Aether and Lava is found in the Nether, But neither places have to materials necessary to turn the blocks into the blocks required for portals.
And they would be opposite in these ways:
Chalk is solid, while Lava is liquid.
Chalk would require having lava poured over it, while Lava would require lava.
Marble is white, while Obsidian is black.
One problem with this, Marble would be found naturally in the Aether in the form of temples, and a player could just take marble from the temple walls. I suppose the temples could be made out of a mossier form of marble, but then regular marble would be required to make the portal, making two more blocks necessary to add.
I suppose Lightstone would be better in the way that it wouldn't need to have another block added, and is more opposite.
Feel free to ignore this completely, I thought I'd just throw this in there.
While you may have a good understanding of how things work that are already in the game, your concepts of how things WOULD work in the game are a little shaky.
A) Whether or not it's rare, both the Aether and the overworld are infinite realms and people can gather up as much as they can find. Eventually people will be able to gather up enough to make runways that span entire map chunks.
:cool.gif: People can edit their game with a 3rd party program to give themselves however many blocks they want.
Either way, going "the rarity will keep it from being used this way" doesn't work.
What are you talking about? "Oh god! I've fallen into STICKY SAND! There's no possible way that my ability to break any block any block except adminium and my ability to place any block I happen to be carrying could possibly save me!" Are you seeing the flaw in your logic? The only situation in which sticky sand = death is this:
[]
and that is only auto death if you have absolutely no other blocks in your inventory at all. Even then, it's still no worse than that same situation would be without sticky sand:
Well, hopefully I'll have addressed those quirks for you. you can always change your vote if that's the case.
Well, it's not like any of this is all me. There have been a lot of other people suggesting ideas. My primary focus has been on funneling them into a coherent theme.
I already have basic vague general examples for what each block can be used in for crafting. I don't see any point in being more specific than that until after the Aether is actually a reality.
PLEASE ALSO SUPPORT:
Sabata & Grey Acumen's "New Nether"
Grey Acumen's Minecraft 2.0 Suggestion Series
On the quicksoil though, I still don't think that it should consume oxygen. That just seems arbitrary to me.
Yeah, you're right. Forget I said anything, then.
That's the point my diagram was making is that unless you are trapped in a pit surrounded by adminium, you aren't going to be trapped in it, and if you are in a pit surrounded by adminium that still has room for you to put a sticky sand block in the bottom of the pit, then that same pit would be just as "deadly/trapping" as if the sticky sand block wasn't there. So not only would you have to specifically go out of your way to trap yourself on a sticky sand block, but the spot you could do it in would work just as well without having the sticky sand at all, which means it's not the sticky sand that is deadly/trapping, but the pit that is deadly/trapping.
Look, when you run really really fast, what happens? You get winded, also known as running out of oxygen. It's not exactly complicated.
It's okay, the marble issue has come up a lot, it warrants repeating the explanation why I don't feel it warrants implementation.
PLEASE ALSO SUPPORT:
Sabata & Grey Acumen's "New Nether"
Grey Acumen's Minecraft 2.0 Suggestion Series
The idea of the Aether sounds excellent. I love almost everything about it, but I'd like to point out a few things:
I agree that the Aether should be accessed by a portal. No airship. Since the nether needs a portal to access, then the Aether should require a portal also. The portal should also require Lightstone to create. There's no real need to create a whole new block just to build a portal with. Lightstone is also a good material to use because it is only found in the nether, which would force the player to travel to the nether before the aether. Minecraft needs some more optional long-term goals, and one of those goals could be reaching the aether.
Anyway, this is an excellent idea.
I don't see anything wrong except possibly going into such detail to agree with what is already in the opening post. It's nice to know that you agree with those specific points though.
Out of curiosity, do you just mean that airships shouldn't be able to get you from Overworld to Aether, or do you mean that airships shouldn't exist at all?
PLEASE ALSO SUPPORT:
Sabata & Grey Acumen's "New Nether"
Grey Acumen's Minecraft 2.0 Suggestion Series
Okay, with sticky gravel you can still use ladders to get up any near blocks or just break the block like grey said.
I was thinking maybe you could make sticky gravel turn into glue when you both set it on fire OR smelt it. This way you can get glue in the nether from just a flint and steel. Also, ghasts can contribute to your glue making needs when they shoot fire balls at it.
Anyway, merry christmas and a happy new year.
I have to agree with Grey on it being a Nether thing, but I know I would support your idea!
I personally don't feel that airships should be used for getting to the aether at all.
My idea for getting to the aether is to gather balloons for airships by killing Ghasts and getting their "flight bladders", which retains the "progression" that people seem to like.
(I don't like the progression idea.Its a sandbox. If someone wants to go to the aether first, then let them)
My other idea, which ties in with the aether being an actual place above the normal world, would be to have aerwhales and balloon lizards(my idea) occasionally come down to the normal area. You would then kill them and get their balloon-type drop.
besides the aether yields more rewards than the nether
It's an interesting way to handle the concept. Sometimes ideas just don't get much feedback, even when they're good, simply because it's a niche thing that wont change gameplay significantly.
The ingredients for a thread that gets a lot of response are generally those that "get the snowball rolling" where you have an overarching idea, with supporting ideas that give people a taste of where things are headed, but where people can keep adding their own ideas. If you have everything already solved and figured out, the most people can do is go "I like that" or "I don't like that"
My personal recommendation would be to find all the threads that have anything to do with improving the Nether, see which one has the most posts, and which of those still have the thread starter who is still active and willing to update their opening post, and add your idea to those. Otherwise try to make your own thread, gather up all the ideas that you can, credit the specific people, and try to come up with more ideas as you go.
AJ struck the crux of the issue. there already is progression just with how the Nether is set up. you can't go there until after you at least gather 3 iron (minimum) and even then you're putting in a pretty heft amount of work to gather the needed lava in buckets, build the form, pour the water, etc. A similar progression should take place after you've gotten to the nether to allow you to get to the Aether.
PLEASE ALSO SUPPORT:
Sabata & Grey Acumen's "New Nether"
Grey Acumen's Minecraft 2.0 Suggestion Series
About sticky sand replacing slowsand, I think it would be better to make sticky sand a new block entirely. The replacement could mess with some traps /bases;
Rubber is interesing, but being around lava ppols is a bit strange. It would be better for it to be placed in a new way, not sure how trought. Maybe small pyramids of rubber, or it being buried 1 tile under netherstone rarely?
Phygs are a bit unecessary. It would be better if they werent something so used(we already got zombie pigs and pigman).What if they could be goats?
And also, it could be interesing if floatsand started moving also by redstone pulses,
Well tar or glue, either one works fine for me
But the fire thing, reasonable idea or not?
Logistically, maybe. But having rubber occur naturally around lava pools means that the player is more likely to fall into a pool when they bounce off of a rubber block. That keeps it as a better natural hazard.
No. It's been discussed why pigs are better, and it's not just for the jokes of when pigs fly.
Also already covered.
lava maybe, fire seems a bit too easy, not sure if it should even be handled through smelting though, since it would be difficult to get it into the bucket without dropping it first.
PLEASE ALSO SUPPORT:
Sabata & Grey Acumen's "New Nether"
Grey Acumen's Minecraft 2.0 Suggestion Series