Perhaps, but the "this proves Minecraft is dead since my pet version" stuff is rather tiring. It does look like we are seeing more actual constructive dialog resulting in a better overall product. I like this.
We have lava held up by signs, and signs work as "airlocks" so far. At this moment in the snapshot, I'm "breathing underwater" courtesy of a sign stacked on a sign in the Snapshot, and we are using signs to hold up lava for an Iron Farm. I don't think the intention is to break those mechanics, especially as we need some means to do an "airlock" on our underwater builds. I can't think of anything I'd worry about with lava mechanics than signs to hold it up for an iron farm, but if you have something you'd like tested, that would be happy.
"If you put a stair on flowing water, the flow will be blocked, just
like it is now in today's Minecraft, but you can put it in a source
block and you will have both a stair and a source block."
"The coral block that was shown at Minecon Earth had half slabs, but
we decided to only go with the full blocks, and the half slabs are now
only for crafted stone materials."
About magma blocks and soul sand being used for bubble columns:
"We're still trying to brainstorm different blocks to use for this."
#1. Look like they're still farbling about trying to find a middle ground; this one as quoted applies only to stairs [It also does not perfectly match the behaivior seen in some of the snapshot test videos that are out…], and makes order of operations important. Not horrid, but no where near as good as breaking down and just adding "bubble-free" 'X's as new blocks…
#2. The first part makes it appear that MS/Mj is walking back coral slabs [which suggests also coral stairs], but the second could be read as greenlighting the long awaited stone type slabs [also hopefully obsidian].
#3. Having been quite surprised MS/Mj was letting previously Nether available only blocks seep into the Overworld, this doesn't.
I think, however, they will have quite some little difficulty finding anything as intuitively appropriate as magma blocks for one of the columns (although the rules of convection suggest magma blocks would be better suited to creating the 'UP' columns). With slime blocks and soul sand being the only blocks I can think of that slow a player [cobwebs dropping string if touched by water], it seems more natural for the 'DOWN' columns.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"Why does everything have to be so stoopid?" Harvey Pekar (from American Splendor)
WARNING: I have an extemely "grindy" playstyle; YMMV — if this doesn't seem fun to you, mine what you can from it & bin the rest.
As we see in the 18w08a snapshot, lava lakes at the bottom of ocean ravines have magma blocks in addition to obsidian exposed, which seems a natural fit. Having the bubbles and water pull you into the magma makes exploring those ravines more interesting than simply being blown out. Hitting that magma will still hurt!
Blocking water from coming through blocks takes processing power. If the water is not blocked, it frees that processing power. Thus, this feature will actually decrease intensity when water collides with certain blocks.
Modder here, Actually it's the opposite, allowing water to flow takes more processing power. You still have to check if the water is blocked, and it will take just as much processing power to CHECK if it's blocked or not. If it IS NOT blocked, you have to do more calculations to see if it can still flow, here is some example psudocode: (assume that "this" is a water block):
public void neighborChanged(){ //on block update
if(this.canFlow(Direction){ //can we can flow in this direction? if we can't we don't need to do additional checking, and nothing below will be executed
if(this.distanceFromSource() <= 6){ //are we too far away from the source?
if(this.blockFlowingInto().canMix()){ //are we mixing with other water or lava blocks?
//if the block it is mixing with is water, then modify the water height, flow angle, and possibly even create water source blocks
//else if it is lava, set to cobblestone or obsidian depending if the lava it is mixing with is a source or not
}
else{
//just set to water normally, and calculate flow direction and angle
}
}
//the game may also have to do lighting updates after all of this too, but that's handled elsewhere
}
}
However, even though it technically takes more processing power to make water flow, I expect the performance impact to basically be nonexistant (unless mojang does something stupid), and here's why:
1. They are not re-writing the physics engine. Block updates only occur if adjacent blocks are updated.
2. Minecraft already checks if the water is blocked when water is flowing (grass, snow, and air, allow water to flow; while most other blocks stop water flow, and if the water tries to flow below y=0 it will not flow.
3. If properly implemented, I don't see this taking more than a few more method calls inside the BlockLiquid class, which don't even get called often. There are other things that happen more often and are more complex (like chunk generation, lighting updates, entity pathfinding/updates/spawning, etc).
It's interesting to say the least, but i imagine most of my grinders are gonna suffer because they use water as key components, i think i'll just make piston-operated crushers as alternatives, was hoping it was similar to Terraria's new water flow system too.
Modders are gonna crack it and make some alternatives, since i imagine it just takes altering the block's properties to not block water set to 0, or any equivalent.
Watch and support people like DocM77 and ilmango, the technical minecrafters who test for these issues. covers how the current 18w08a snapshot breaks important parts of farms, including water changes. The video gives specifics about water as well as other changes that are of concern to them, and relevant to the water discussion here.
Watch and support people like DocM77 and ilmango, the technical minecrafters who test for these issues. covers how the current 18w08a snapshot breaks important parts of farms, including water changes. The video gives specifics about water as well as other changes that are of concern to them, and relevant to the water discussion here.
I actually would add one thing that wasn't mentioned here but that I would very much like to have:
The option to disable the new command auto-fill.
I can see how it's a good idea for beginners, or admins, or long-time-no-play returning players
But for those of us that uses a lot of commands, the new list is just making it annoying. Even the easy simple commands like changing time or weather are a pain, or at least I found them to be.
EDIT: new bug found (or modified thing that really doesn't seems like a good idea)
Before when drinking a night vision + water breathing potions, you'd get perfect underwater sight. Crystal-clear vision.
Now it's like you drank nothing. I think it's because of the new mechanics where your vision underwater start bad and slowly increase but it's making the potions "useless" in that case
Potions are already kinda useless. I really wish we could get stacks of 16 of a kind. Otherwise, you fill your tiny inventory with potions and have no room for anything else. But that's a gripe for another time, and yes, potions no longer grant visibility in water. For *THAT*, people will simply use OptiFine and GammaBright hacks. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
EDIT: the shortcuts for gamemodes (like c, s, etc) have been removed? Ugh... why?
Also, last griping but: when using tab, it should not just highlight the first option but also auto-complete with it. Else you have to double tap tab to get your command.
Exemple: I want to type /gamemode creative
I start typing /gamem then I tab. And instead of filling in with gamemode (like it did before) now it opens the suggestion list and will only complete if I tab again.
Same for creative, same for every command! It's one tap of tab too many in my opinion
I am looking forward to the changes! I think it'll be nice to have water physics rules that are more internally consistent. I was playing around with it in a snapshot and it made underwater a lot more predictable! Plus now that underwater caves sometimes generate with water in them, it makes swimming a lot cooler! I'm looking forward to shipwrecks. Those should be very interesting.
My *current* interpretation (and what I see in Snapshot 18w08b) is that gaps such as with pane glass or gaps between pane glass and glowstone will *NOT* be affected, water will *NOT* leak. From what I've read, fences and stairs would only have water flowing around them if placed within a water source block. Otherwise, they would block the flow of water as expected. I would suspect this will hold for glass panes. HOWEVER...
"Spit in one hand and hope in the other, see what fills faster."
If you can't test a COPY of your world in a snapshot (such as with an SMP server you don't control) then I would agree with @FuelZ's suggestion: board the windows up from the outside before the server upgrade, then test and see. I'd rather have my home look ugly unnecessarily, if covering them are NOT needed, than have my home ruined by not covering the windows. Good luck, but if I see different than what I've mentioned in this post I will most certainly post again about it here.
Oh yeah, check out DocM77's report on 18w08a with Ilmango and others in the Technical Minecraft Community (TMC). For anyone that thinks the new water physics might be a problem for their builds, the TMC watches for these kinds of things and how it may affect their Over Powered farms and such. If there are any changes to water physics that will touch their OP farms, the TMC is likely the first to find out and they will spell out exactly what is going on. Keep an eye on them. Something might slip past the TMC, but I don't think it likely.
And I think this answers our questions. tl;dr Most if not all of the important machines using water will work without changes, and some machines may even be improved. There are still bugs, but they are obviously bugs we expect to see fixed. Perhaps the discussion in this thread was useful, or perhaps the things discussed were already on the minds of Mojang. Either way, we are getting the details on Water Physics, and the future of Minecraft looks pretty cool!
Perhaps, but the "this proves Minecraft is dead since my pet version" stuff is rather tiring. It does look like we are seeing more actual constructive dialog resulting in a better overall product. I like this.
Wonder if lava will follow the new water physics as well or if it will function a bit differently
sugar is bad for you
We have lava held up by signs, and signs work as "airlocks" so far. At this moment in the snapshot, I'm "breathing underwater" courtesy of a sign stacked on a sign in the Snapshot, and we are using signs to hold up lava for an Iron Farm. I don't think the intention is to break those mechanics, especially as we need some means to do an "airlock" on our underwater builds. I can't think of anything I'd worry about with lava mechanics than signs to hold it up for an iron farm, but if you have something you'd like tested, that would be happy.
A bit more info (from Recap of Jeb's talk at the PC Gamer Weekender):
block and you will have both a stair and a source block."
only for crafted stone materials."
#1. Look like they're still farbling about trying to find a middle ground; this one as quoted applies only to stairs [It also does not perfectly match the behaivior seen in some of the snapshot test videos that are out…], and makes order of operations important. Not horrid, but no where near as good as breaking down and just adding "bubble-free" 'X's as new blocks…
#2. The first part makes it appear that MS/Mj is walking back coral slabs [which suggests also coral stairs], but the second could be read as greenlighting the long awaited stone type slabs [also hopefully obsidian].
#3. Having been quite surprised MS/Mj was letting previously Nether available only blocks seep into the Overworld, this doesn't.
I think, however, they will have quite some little difficulty finding anything as intuitively appropriate as magma blocks for one of the columns (although the rules of convection suggest magma blocks would be better suited to creating the 'UP' columns). With slime blocks and soul sand being the only blocks I can think of that slow a player [cobwebs dropping string if touched by water], it seems more natural for the 'DOWN' columns.
As we see in the 18w08a snapshot, lava lakes at the bottom of ocean ravines have magma blocks in addition to obsidian exposed, which seems a natural fit. Having the bubbles and water pull you into the magma makes exploring those ravines more interesting than simply being blown out. Hitting that magma will still hurt!
Modder here, Actually it's the opposite, allowing water to flow takes more processing power. You still have to check if the water is blocked, and it will take just as much processing power to CHECK if it's blocked or not. If it IS NOT blocked, you have to do more calculations to see if it can still flow, here is some example psudocode: (assume that "this" is a water block):
However, even though it technically takes more processing power to make water flow, I expect the performance impact to basically be nonexistant (unless mojang does something stupid), and here's why:
1. They are not re-writing the physics engine. Block updates only occur if adjacent blocks are updated.
2. Minecraft already checks if the water is blocked when water is flowing (grass, snow, and air, allow water to flow; while most other blocks stop water flow, and if the water tries to flow below y=0 it will not flow.
3. If properly implemented, I don't see this taking more than a few more method calls inside the BlockLiquid class, which don't even get called often. There are other things that happen more often and are more complex (like chunk generation, lighting updates, entity pathfinding/updates/spawning, etc).
My Github ด้้้้้็็็็็้้้้้็็็็็้้้้้็็็็็้้้้้็็็็็้้้้้็็็็็้้้้้็็็็็้้้้้็็็็็้้้้้дด็็็็็้้้้้็็็็้้้้้็็็็็้้้้้็็็็็้้้้้็็็็็้้้้้
It's interesting to say the least, but i imagine most of my grinders are gonna suffer because they use water as key components, i think i'll just make piston-operated crushers as alternatives, was hoping it was similar to Terraria's new water flow system too.
Modders are gonna crack it and make some alternatives, since i imagine it just takes altering the block's properties to not block water set to 0, or any equivalent.
", courier, monospace">STATS
", courier, monospace">NAME: MINERZ123
", courier, monospace">CLASS :PROCRASTINATOR
LEVEL: 100
", courier, monospace">"eh, i'll finish this later. maybe."
Watch and support people like DocM77 and ilmango, the technical minecrafters who test for these issues. covers how the current 18w08a snapshot breaks important parts of farms, including water changes. The video gives specifics about water as well as other changes that are of concern to them, and relevant to the water discussion here.
I actually would add one thing that wasn't mentioned here but that I would very much like to have:
The option to disable the new command auto-fill.
I can see how it's a good idea for beginners, or admins, or long-time-no-play returning players
But for those of us that uses a lot of commands, the new list is just making it annoying. Even the easy simple commands like changing time or weather are a pain, or at least I found them to be.
EDIT: new bug found (or modified thing that really doesn't seems like a good idea)
Before when drinking a night vision + water breathing potions, you'd get perfect underwater sight. Crystal-clear vision.
Now it's like you drank nothing. I think it's because of the new mechanics where your vision underwater start bad and slowly increase but it's making the potions "useless" in that case
Options ➡️ Chat Settings ➡️ Command Suggestions: OFF
Potions are already kinda useless. I really wish we could get stacks of 16 of a kind. Otherwise, you fill your tiny inventory with potions and have no room for anything else. But that's a gripe for another time, and yes, potions no longer grant visibility in water. For *THAT*, people will simply use OptiFine and GammaBright hacks. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Woah that's such a cool base
And idk myself, I'm curious how the physics of water will look and act in worlds...
Oh, okay, hadn't seen that, my fault then
EDIT: the shortcuts for gamemodes (like c, s, etc) have been removed? Ugh... why?
Also, last griping but: when using tab, it should not just highlight the first option but also auto-complete with it. Else you have to double tap tab to get your command.
Exemple: I want to type /gamemode creative
I start typing /gamem then I tab. And instead of filling in with gamemode (like it did before) now it opens the suggestion list and will only complete if I tab again.
Same for creative, same for every command! It's one tap of tab too many in my opinion
quote=Felina_Lain
EDIT: the shortcuts for gamemodes (like c, s, etc) have been removed? Ugh... why?
Apparently also the numeric shortcuts…
Agree on the Ugh! [if inclined to stronger language]
…best guess being that whoever coded it wasn't able to figure out haow to make the abbreviations work with the new auto complete gizmo…
Thanks.
Take a look what my base looks like inside before they decided it has a gaps between glass panels and glowstones.
With 1.13, my base would be flooded.
My videos: https://www.youtube.com/user/robingravel
My cartoons: http://www.dailymotion.com/robin-gravel
Flash Animation (if your computer supports flash):
http://robingravel.byethost15.com/eflash.htm
Few flash movies have easter egg/extras
oof
lol you should like board up the windows before the update comes out just incase
I am looking forward to the changes! I think it'll be nice to have water physics rules that are more internally consistent. I was playing around with it in a snapshot and it made underwater a lot more predictable! Plus now that underwater caves sometimes generate with water in them, it makes swimming a lot cooler! I'm looking forward to shipwrecks. Those should be very interesting.
peace
Plant Life, Trees, Flowers, Food and Farming! Pam's mods.
My *current* interpretation (and what I see in Snapshot 18w08b) is that gaps such as with pane glass or gaps between pane glass and glowstone will *NOT* be affected, water will *NOT* leak. From what I've read, fences and stairs would only have water flowing around them if placed within a water source block. Otherwise, they would block the flow of water as expected. I would suspect this will hold for glass panes. HOWEVER...
"Spit in one hand and hope in the other, see what fills faster."
If you can't test a COPY of your world in a snapshot (such as with an SMP server you don't control) then I would agree with @FuelZ's suggestion: board the windows up from the outside before the server upgrade, then test and see. I'd rather have my home look ugly unnecessarily, if covering them are NOT needed, than have my home ruined by not covering the windows. Good luck, but if I see different than what I've mentioned in this post I will most certainly post again about it here.
Oh yeah, check out DocM77's report on 18w08a with Ilmango and others in the Technical Minecraft Community (TMC). For anyone that thinks the new water physics might be a problem for their builds, the TMC watches for these kinds of things and how it may affect their Over Powered farms and such. If there are any changes to water physics that will touch their OP farms, the TMC is likely the first to find out and they will spell out exactly what is going on. Keep an eye on them. Something might slip past the TMC, but I don't think it likely.
And I think this answers our questions. tl;dr Most if not all of the important machines using water will work without changes, and some machines may even be improved. There are still bugs, but they are obviously bugs we expect to see fixed. Perhaps the discussion in this thread was useful, or perhaps the things discussed were already on the minds of Mojang. Either way, we are getting the details on Water Physics, and the future of Minecraft looks pretty cool!