In fact, it hasn't been true since 2012; sure, it might be the most popular version played by YouTubers and mod users but Pocket Edition (now Bedrock, but the mobile version in particular) has dominated since 2012, when Java was already as little as 16% of all copies sold:
This is particularly impressive in light of the fact that Pocket Edition was very basic back then, comparable to an early Alpha version of Java (it didn't reach full release status until late 2016, but has since caught up, and had various features from newer Java versions before then, as well as its own unique features).
For another comparison, at last count there were 131 million monthly active players, which is about 3.5 times the lifetime sales for Java (37 million), and certainly more when looking at active players since the 131 million is out of around 480 million registered accounts (about 300 million of which are for the free-to-play Chinese edition; actual sales are around 200 million):
That said, sales of Java as a percentage of all sales have remained relatively steady since 2012; 37 out of 200 million is 18.5%, compared to 16% at the end of 2012, so it can't have fallen too much further (one would expect lifetime sales to be a higher percentage than current sales since Java has been around for longer).
According to that link, 16% was for one day though, so that doesn't mean much. The pocket edition was also much, much cheaper and a much different (more basic) game. The PC platform isn't as large as mobile (similarly, mobile profits by volume and maybe even by revenue far surpass PC for many, many, many years now), plus the PC market had been saturated more since the mobile version was more in its infancy compared to the PC (now Java) version which had been around longer. In my opinion, in 2012 the Java edition was, no argument, the definitive edition, despite which sold more by volume. I'd say the Modern Bedrock edition as of these last few years is more comparable to do a 1:1 comparison (and as of today, I'd say both are somewhat definitive in different ways). Sometime around the middle of the 2010 decade is when the Java version "felt" like it was falling more out of favor and being surpassed, but that's merely my impression. As your last point shows, it seems it's actually held rather steady, which goes against my impression.
I'm not really qualified to *know* whether or not this is possible.
However in my opinion, it would be nice if they could make Java and bedrock cross compatible with saves and the realms service at the very least.
I would suspect there should be some way to make Java Minecraft servers work on bedrock edition client,
however it would mean they would need to add some kind of compatibility mode in the game itself so it can recognize Java code and interact with the save files almost flawlessly, and vice versa with C++. I would like parity with the 2 versions if Java version is to persist because this way no one is missing out.
I'm not really qualified to *know* whether or not this is possible.
However in my opinion, it would be nice if they could make Java and bedrock cross compatible with saves and the realms service at the very least.
I would suspect there should be some way to make Java Minecraft servers work on bedrock edition client,
however it would mean they would need to add some kind of compatibility mode in the game itself so it can recognize Java code and interact with the save files almost flawlessly, and vice versa with C++. I would like parity with the 2 versions if Java version is to persist because this way no one is missing out.
They might be able to honestly, saves can already be converted pretty easily so that probably just needs to be standardized. Multiplayer might be a bit more involved but I'm sure the communication protocol is already the same, surely they're both using TCP and UDP so they could probably make them understand each other.
I haven't posted on here in a good while, but they legally can't put microtransactions into Java Edition because of Notch's clearly stated promise of a one-time purchase with no microtransactions giving you access to all of Minecraft's (now specifically Java Edition's) content and updates on the Minecraft purchase page 10 years ago. So if they are going to add microtransactions, they'll likely face a class action lawsuit.
I haven't posted on here in a good while, but they legally can't put microtransactions into Java Edition because of Notch's clearly stated promise of a one-time purchase with no microtransactions giving you access to all of Minecraft's (now specifically Java Edition's) content and updates on the Minecraft purchase page 10 years ago. So if they are going to add microtransactions, they'll likely face a class action lawsuit.
That's news to me. Said promise still applies because of the original players?
I would suspect there should be some way to make Java Minecraft servers work on bedrock edition client,
however it would mean they would need to add some kind of compatibility mode in the game itself so it can recognize Java code and interact with the save files almost flawlessly, and vice versa with C++. I would like parity with the 2 versions if Java version is to persist because this way no one is missing out.
It is currently possible to play as a Bedrock client on a Java server
by using the server plugin: GeyserMC https://geysermc.org/
From my experience it works quite good, even regarding the obvious fact that some Java- or Bedrock -specific functions are not supported.
Thanks TheMasterCaver for the interesting and valuable links
From the time of your post (2020 Nov) nothing really has changed in sale of MC Java copies, so it keeps steady
And I think it keeps quite well, same as the Java edition itself and its community still are, so I think all the fears of Java edition disappearing are completely unfounded.
Similar baseless opinions I've already read. Don't trust them.
Java community is different than most of Bedrock's players.
Much of MCJE players are older, mature and more aware of the potential of the game and also more creative, so there were so many custom servers/mods/tools developed, and Mojang/M$ knows that Java players never become the target of paid content provided in Bedrock platform.
Apart from all the above, remember that Java edition is an important experimental field in developing future MC versions, so it simply can't disappear...
And that's it
Now that migration has started, people have realized that Microsoft is requiring phone numbers for all Microsoft accounts. Meaning that it's practically impossible to have multiple Minecraft accounts, because a phone number can only be linked with one Microsoft account.
Now that migration has started, people have realized that Microsoft is requiring phone numbers for all Microsoft accounts. Meaning that it's practically impossible to have multiple Minecraft accounts, because a phone number can only be linked with one Microsoft account.
This truly is the end times. Make sure to download Minecraft while you still can...
Hopefully I'll remember this thread when Java Edition is finally killed off.
What is the practical value of having multiple Minecraft accounts in the first place? The only use case I can think of is if you have children that you don't trust with a phone number (or can't afford a phone for them). If this is the case, you could have them play on the same account using multiple launcher profiles.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Remember those versions that minecraft pranked us with? Specifically:
Minecraft 2.0
Minecraft 1.VR-Pre1
Snapshot 15w14a
Minecraft 3D
Those are still downloadable! Watch this video for 2.0:
To download the other ones you need to make a folder in the versions folder for minecraft and put the client and JSON file for the versions in there. They all need to be named the same aside from file extensions. Once you do that, you will be able to choose that version when making a new profile with the minecraft launcher.
Now that migration has started, people have realized that Microsoft is requiring phone numbers for all Microsoft accounts. Meaning that it's practically impossible to have multiple Minecraft accounts, because a phone number can only be linked with one Microsoft account.
This truly is the end times. Make sure to download Minecraft while you still can...
Hopefully I'll remember this thread when Java Edition is finally killed off.
I'm a bit baffled by this, because I just migrated two accounts last week and neither Microsoft account required that I provide a phone number or had any SMS requirements. It did have what I assume was a two-factor authentication, but that involved sending me a code via email that I then had to enter.
Now that migration has started, people have realized that Microsoft is requiring phone numbers for all Microsoft accounts. Meaning that it's practically impossible to have multiple Minecraft accounts, because a phone number can only be linked with one Microsoft account.
Fake news! Microsoft is not requiring a phone number.
Wrong, if they don't get it when you make your account, they force you into it later on by locking your account for "suspicious activity" with the only option to unlock it being giving them your phone number, it happened to me and it's impossible for anything I made on that account to be suspicious, the email is from a popular provider and wasn't used for anything but that Microsoft account, the password was over 20 characters, and the only thing I did on the account was migrate and login to the launcher, this shouldn't be suspicious.
Wrong, if they don't get it when you make your account, they force you into it later on by locking your account for "suspicious activity" with the only option to unlock it being giving them your phone number, it happened to me and it's impossible for anything I made on that account to be suspicious, the email is from a popular provider and wasn't used for anything but that Microsoft account, the password was over 20 characters, and the only thing I did on the account was migrate and login to the launcher, this shouldn't be suspicious.
It's a ridiculous requirement because if you're signing into the account from the same IP address at the time when the account was created, Microsoft don't have a good excuse to say it was suspicious. They even record a history of logins from where and when you signed into your Microsoft account.
Stuff like phone numbers and two step verification should be optional, they do increase the security of your account though, because it makes it harder for other people to gain access to your account.
The only circumstances to my knowledge where your IP would change is if your IP isn't static, if you masked it with a VPN, or if you had moved home.
But again Microsoft know this, they shouldn't say your sign in was suspicious unless they have good evidence to do so.
No because they are two different code bases. However they can compile the c++ version aka bedrock edition code into java. then modders would be able to mod on pc and the new java edition would become bedrock edition. but java uses opengl graphics api when bedrock uses d3d and depending upon the platform opengles.
MS killing java [explicitly or by various forms of sneak] makes a great deal of business sense... UNTIL one factors in the negative reactions.
MS already has an exceedingly poor reputation in some circles, but adding a high percentage of minecraft players to this still seems to be a boneheaded maneuver...
Continually making each version laggier (which can be accomplished simply by deprioritizing code optimaization [making it very hard to prosecute] ) so as to effectively 'brick' older computers [eg. the handmedown often used as a game computer] seems a much more likely strategy.
RE the "suspicious activity" ruse: that strikes me as believable (which says something about MS's reputation)
RE 2-factor: nice for those who want it, but IMO nonsensical for a game account (brokerage/bank/etc. might maybe warrant this). ANY 'lock' man can make, man can break. The best security is vigilance, but that's hard to sell.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"Why does everything have to be so stoopid?" Harvey Pekar (from American Splendor)
WARNING: I have an extemely "grindy" playstyle; YMMV — if this doesn't seem fun to you, mine what you can from it & bin the rest.
they didn't kill java mojang and mojang4j did. Mojang initially released minecraft 1.0.0 in 2012. two years later the world gen is bad, 10 times more bugs after the initial release, startup time takes 3s more to launch, execution is slower codebase is generally more sloppy but somewhat less hardcoded. Microsoft buys it does nothing to the game till about 1.13 where they had somewhat more of a say. You can blame jeb_ for most of the bugs including high performance issues after 1.12x.
Micrsoft makes a re-write of the game, re-write of the game executes really fast low bug count, doesn't care about money eula part makes an in game purchase for money reasons big deal(sarcasticly says), xbox integration great news, join your friends online(mojang never attempted to even consider this), hardware exceleration, shaders, and now rtx with caves and cliffs. O and did I mention bedrock edition has almost always had interesting terrain generation different from java edition? something you didn't see in java till < 1.5.2 and some seeds in 1.5.
conclusion microsoft saved minecraft. in 1.2.5 and 1.6.4 where the most stable versions of the game by the way in java edition. yes things were hard coded but at least they worked. 1.2.5 before the client server merge and 1.6.4 after. Microsoft finished what mojang could not. if anything we should be greateful if they decide to compile a c++ version straight into java bytecode for modding purposes. because java edition is pretty much only used for ideas and debugging at this point they don't care a gaming pc that runs overwatch (high shading capacity) on 60fps won't get 30fps on default settings on minecraft.
Also one last argument. before microsoft the updates were to mostly "fix issues" with adding very few features while addon a crap load of bugs dropped each update possibly on purpose. Then Micrsooft has bedrock edition with very few bugs and pretty much only updates as a patch or yearly updates to maintain user base by adding more content like overwatch also does.
they did re-write it look at the decompiled source of bedrock and look at java editions. further proof is beta youtube videos calling them re-writes and explaining all the features are not in here yet.
I don't believe this is true any more.
In fact, it hasn't been true since 2012; sure, it might be the most popular version played by YouTubers and mod users but Pocket Edition (now Bedrock, but the mobile version in particular) has dominated since 2012, when Java was already as little as 16% of all copies sold:
https://www.gamesbrief.com/2013/01/minecraft-grosses-over-250-million-in-2012-but-which-platform-dominated/
This is particularly impressive in light of the fact that Pocket Edition was very basic back then, comparable to an early Alpha version of Java (it didn't reach full release status until late 2016, but has since caught up, and had various features from newer Java versions before then, as well as its own unique features).
For another comparison, at last count there were 131 million monthly active players, which is about 3.5 times the lifetime sales for Java (37 million), and certainly more when looking at active players since the 131 million is out of around 480 million registered accounts (about 300 million of which are for the free-to-play Chinese edition; actual sales are around 200 million):
https://www.pcmag.com/news/minecraft-has-surpassed-131-million-monthly-active-users
https://www.pcgamesn.com/minecraft/minecraft-player-count
https://www.reddit.com/r/Minecraft/comments/872x1r/unofficial_mojang_sale_statistics/ (link to a Google spreadsheet which is kept up-to-date)
That said, sales of Java as a percentage of all sales have remained relatively steady since 2012; 37 out of 200 million is 18.5%, compared to 16% at the end of 2012, so it can't have fallen too much further (one would expect lifetime sales to be a higher percentage than current sales since Java has been around for longer).
TheMasterCaver's First World - possibly the most caved-out world in Minecraft history - includes world download.
TheMasterCaver's World - my own version of Minecraft largely based on my views of how the game should have evolved since 1.6.4.
Why do I still play in 1.6.4?
According to that link, 16% was for one day though, so that doesn't mean much. The pocket edition was also much, much cheaper and a much different (more basic) game. The PC platform isn't as large as mobile (similarly, mobile profits by volume and maybe even by revenue far surpass PC for many, many, many years now), plus the PC market had been saturated more since the mobile version was more in its infancy compared to the PC (now Java) version which had been around longer. In my opinion, in 2012 the Java edition was, no argument, the definitive edition, despite which sold more by volume. I'd say the Modern Bedrock edition as of these last few years is more comparable to do a 1:1 comparison (and as of today, I'd say both are somewhat definitive in different ways). Sometime around the middle of the 2010 decade is when the Java version "felt" like it was falling more out of favor and being surpassed, but that's merely my impression. As your last point shows, it seems it's actually held rather steady, which goes against my impression.
I'm not really qualified to *know* whether or not this is possible.
However in my opinion, it would be nice if they could make Java and bedrock cross compatible with saves and the realms service at the very least.
I would suspect there should be some way to make Java Minecraft servers work on bedrock edition client,
however it would mean they would need to add some kind of compatibility mode in the game itself so it can recognize Java code and interact with the save files almost flawlessly, and vice versa with C++. I would like parity with the 2 versions if Java version is to persist because this way no one is missing out.
They might be able to honestly, saves can already be converted pretty easily so that probably just needs to be standardized. Multiplayer might be a bit more involved but I'm sure the communication protocol is already the same, surely they're both using TCP and UDP so they could probably make them understand each other.
I haven't posted on here in a good while, but they legally can't put microtransactions into Java Edition because of Notch's clearly stated promise of a one-time purchase with no microtransactions giving you access to all of Minecraft's (now specifically Java Edition's) content and updates on the Minecraft purchase page 10 years ago. So if they are going to add microtransactions, they'll likely face a class action lawsuit.
That's news to me. Said promise still applies because of the original players?
It is currently possible to play as a Bedrock client on a Java server
by using the server plugin: GeyserMC https://geysermc.org/
From my experience it works quite good, even regarding the obvious fact that some Java- or Bedrock -specific functions are not supported.
Thanks TheMasterCaver for the interesting and valuable links
From the time of your post (2020 Nov) nothing really has changed in sale of MC Java copies, so it keeps steady
And I think it keeps quite well, same as the Java edition itself and its community still are, so I think all the fears of Java edition disappearing are completely unfounded.
Similar baseless opinions I've already read. Don't trust them.
Java community is different than most of Bedrock's players.
Much of MCJE players are older, mature and more aware of the potential of the game and also more creative, so there were so many custom servers/mods/tools developed, and Mojang/M$ knows that Java players never become the target of paid content provided in Bedrock platform.
Apart from all the above, remember that Java edition is an important experimental field in developing future MC versions, so it simply can't disappear...
And that's it
Now that migration has started, people have realized that Microsoft is requiring phone numbers for all Microsoft accounts. Meaning that it's practically impossible to have multiple Minecraft accounts, because a phone number can only be linked with one Microsoft account.
https://old.reddit.com/r/Minecraft/comments/nvjcit/possible_big_change_coming_with_account_migration/
This truly is the end times. Make sure to download Minecraft while you still can...
Hopefully I'll remember this thread when Java Edition is finally killed off.
What is the practical value of having multiple Minecraft accounts in the first place? The only use case I can think of is if you have children that you don't trust with a phone number (or can't afford a phone for them). If this is the case, you could have them play on the same account using multiple launcher profiles.
Remember those versions that minecraft pranked us with? Specifically:
Those are still downloadable! Watch this video for 2.0:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PQdu9LKAdIU
To download the other ones you need to make a folder in the versions folder for minecraft and put the client and JSON file for the versions in there. They all need to be named the same aside from file extensions. Once you do that, you will be able to choose that version when making a new profile with the minecraft launcher.
15w14a is on this link:
http://minecraft.gamepedia.com/15w14a
1.RV-Pre1 is here:
http://minecraft.gamepedia.com/1.RV-Pre1
Minecraft 3D is here:
https://minecraft.gamepedia.com/Java_Edition_3D_Shareware_v1.34
I'm a bit baffled by this, because I just migrated two accounts last week and neither Microsoft account required that I provide a phone number or had any SMS requirements. It did have what I assume was a two-factor authentication, but that involved sending me a code via email that I then had to enter.
- sunperp
I also don't see much use to two accounts, having had two at once in the past and finding it not useful
Fake news! Microsoft is not requiring a phone number.
Creator of Metroid Cubed 3, a Metroid-themed mod! Become a donator today!
Wrong, if they don't get it when you make your account, they force you into it later on by locking your account for "suspicious activity" with the only option to unlock it being giving them your phone number, it happened to me and it's impossible for anything I made on that account to be suspicious, the email is from a popular provider and wasn't used for anything but that Microsoft account, the password was over 20 characters, and the only thing I did on the account was migrate and login to the launcher, this shouldn't be suspicious.
It's a ridiculous requirement because if you're signing into the account from the same IP address at the time when the account was created, Microsoft don't have a good excuse to say it was suspicious. They even record a history of logins from where and when you signed into your Microsoft account.
Stuff like phone numbers and two step verification should be optional, they do increase the security of your account though, because it makes it harder for other people to gain access to your account.
The only circumstances to my knowledge where your IP would change is if your IP isn't static, if you masked it with a VPN, or if you had moved home.
But again Microsoft know this, they shouldn't say your sign in was suspicious unless they have good evidence to do so.
No because they are two different code bases. However they can compile the c++ version aka bedrock edition code into java. then modders would be able to mod on pc and the new java edition would become bedrock edition. but java uses opengl graphics api when bedrock uses d3d and depending upon the platform opengles.
MS killing java [explicitly or by various forms of sneak] makes a great deal of business sense... UNTIL one factors in the negative reactions.
MS already has an exceedingly poor reputation in some circles, but adding a high percentage of minecraft players to this still seems to be a boneheaded maneuver...
Continually making each version laggier (which can be accomplished simply by deprioritizing code optimaization [making it very hard to prosecute] ) so as to effectively 'brick' older computers [eg. the handmedown often used as a game computer] seems a much more likely strategy.
RE the "suspicious activity" ruse: that strikes me as believable (which says something about MS's reputation)
RE 2-factor: nice for those who want it, but IMO nonsensical for a game account (brokerage/bank/etc. might maybe warrant this). ANY 'lock' man can make, man can break. The best security is vigilance, but that's hard to sell.
they didn't kill java mojang and mojang4j did. Mojang initially released minecraft 1.0.0 in 2012. two years later the world gen is bad, 10 times more bugs after the initial release, startup time takes 3s more to launch, execution is slower codebase is generally more sloppy but somewhat less hardcoded. Microsoft buys it does nothing to the game till about 1.13 where they had somewhat more of a say. You can blame jeb_ for most of the bugs including high performance issues after 1.12x.
Micrsoft makes a re-write of the game, re-write of the game executes really fast low bug count, doesn't care about money eula part makes an in game purchase for money reasons big deal(sarcasticly says), xbox integration great news, join your friends online(mojang never attempted to even consider this), hardware exceleration, shaders, and now rtx with caves and cliffs. O and did I mention bedrock edition has almost always had interesting terrain generation different from java edition? something you didn't see in java till < 1.5.2 and some seeds in 1.5.
conclusion microsoft saved minecraft. in 1.2.5 and 1.6.4 where the most stable versions of the game by the way in java edition. yes things were hard coded but at least they worked. 1.2.5 before the client server merge and 1.6.4 after. Microsoft finished what mojang could not. if anything we should be greateful if they decide to compile a c++ version straight into java bytecode for modding purposes. because java edition is pretty much only used for ideas and debugging at this point they don't care a gaming pc that runs overwatch (high shading capacity) on 60fps won't get 30fps on default settings on minecraft.
Also one last argument. before microsoft the updates were to mostly "fix issues" with adding very few features while addon a crap load of bugs dropped each update possibly on purpose. Then Micrsooft has bedrock edition with very few bugs and pretty much only updates as a patch or yearly updates to maintain user base by adding more content like overwatch also does.
they did re-write it look at the decompiled source of bedrock and look at java editions. further proof is beta youtube videos calling them re-writes and explaining all the features are not in here yet.