Because of overwhelming feedback, the cost of the mod api access will be 0 dollars.
Our intention wasn’t to make money off selling the access, only to ensure some level of quality. Obviously that wasn’t the most popular idea in the world
So, the mod developers complain that there shouldn't be any fee for access to the Minecraft source code, but they want to make money, via these ad networks, for their development work.
Because of overwhelming feedback, the cost of the mod api access will be 0 dollars.
Our intention wasn’t to make money off selling the access, only to ensure some level of quality. Obviously that wasn’t the most popular idea in the world
So, the mod developers complain that there shouldn't be any fee for access to the Minecraft source code, but they want to make money, via these ad networks, for their development work.
Ever heard of Firefox or Adblock plus? Just wondering, cause they help a lot
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
GENERATION 26: The first time you see this, copy it into your sig on any forum and add 1 to the generation. Social experiment. Quote me if you are expecting a reply so I get notified
Because of overwhelming feedback, the cost of the mod api access will be 0 dollars.
Our intention wasn’t to make money off selling the access, only to ensure some level of quality. Obviously that wasn’t the most popular idea in the world
So, the mod developers complain that there shouldn't be any fee for access to the Minecraft source code, but they want to make money, via these ad networks, for their development work.
Nice.
I don't see how are these two facts connected.
Find a dictionary and look up the word "hypocrite'".
Find a dictionary and look up the word "hypocrite'".
Those facts aren't related what so ever. Modders put in work to make Minecraft better. It's easy to see how they wouldn't want to pay to money to make add-ons for a game they love, especially when they may not have the money to pay for it in the first place. Modding does nothing but help Notch, it gives him ideas and things to work off of. Some community mods have been implemented in the game, and some of those mods wouldn't exist if the source cost money.
I also like how you conveniently look over many things in his previous post.
* Mods must only be playable by people who have bought Minecraft
* You can’t sell your mods or make money off them unless you’ve got a
separate license deal with us
In the long term, we hope this means people will do awesome new things with the Minecraft engine and play around with it. We want to buy and/or license good mods and/or total conversions and sell them ourselves. It’s possible we might have a mod marketplace for selling and buying mods that fans have written, or we might purchase and integrate nice mods that fit the main theme of Minecraft.
To me, it seems obvious that Notch wants people who make good mods to get compensated in some way. In fact, Notch says that he might make a marketplace just so good modders can sell their work. Until he says that those 5 second advertisements are against the rules, I'm behind it entirely.
Those facts aren't related what so ever. Modders put in work to make Minecraft better. It's easy to see how they wouldn't want to pay to money to make add-ons for a game they love, especially when they may not have the money to pay for it in the first place. Modding does nothing but help Notch, it gives him ideas and things to work off of. Some community mods have been implemented in the game, and some of those mods wouldn't exist if the source cost money.
I also like how you conveniently look over many things in his previous post.
* Mods must only be playable by people who have bought Minecraft
* You can’t sell your mods or make money off them unless you’ve got a
separate license deal with us
In the long term, we hope this means people will do awesome new things with the Minecraft engine and play around with it. We want to buy and/or license good mods and/or total conversions and sell them ourselves. It’s possible we might have a mod marketplace for selling and buying mods that fans have written, or we might purchase and integrate nice mods that fit the main theme of Minecraft.
To me, it seems obvious that Notch wants people who make good mods to get compensated in some way. In fact, Notch says that he might make a marketplace just so good modders can sell their work. Until he says that those 5 second advertisements are against the rules, I'm behind it entirely.
I ignored nothing. I read the post you refer to (and quote).
I figured it was obvious, but I guess not.
Notch has already said those advertisements are against the rules. I don't see how you could have missed it, since you put it in bold in your post, but just for clarity:
Quote from Notch »
You can’t sell your mods or make money off them unless you’ve got a separate license deal with us
So again, modders whine that they don't want to buy a license, yet they want to make money, via these ad networks, for their mods. Granted, they're not going to be billionaires, but they're making money none the less.
I don't know how much said license was to cost, but based on the pricing history of Minecraft iteslf, and the fact that Notch said:
Quote from Notch »
The access cost won’t be prohibitively expensive
I imagine it would be fairly cheap; something like 10-20 $/€.
I stand by my statement of hypocrisy.
(Just for more clarity, I know that it's not all modders that are doing this, just some of them.)
I think it's a fair trade to wait 5 seconds in order to download a mod that someone invested days and likely weeks developing and publishing it out of charge.
I ignored nothing. I read the post you refer to (and quote).
I figured it was obvious, but I guess not. Notch has already said those advertisements are against the rules. I don't see how you could have missed it, since you put it in bold in your post, but just for clarity:
Quote from Notch »
You can’t sell your mods or make money off them unless you’ve got a separate license deal with us
So again, modders whine that they don't want to buy a license, yet they want to make money, via these ad networks, for their mods. Granted, they're not going to be billionaires, but they're making money none the less.
I don't know how much said license was to cost, but based on the pricing history of Minecraft iteslf, and the fact that Notch said:
Quote from Notch »
The access cost won’t be prohibitively expensive
I imagine it would be fairly cheap; something like 10-20 $/€.
I stand by my statement of hypocrisy.
(Just for more clarity, I know that it's not all modders that are doing this, just some of them.)
No, Notch has not said that ads on downloading mods from external links are against rules. Notch said that ads on mods would be against the rules once he released a centralized marketplace where they could sell mods. Of course, without those ads right now all the revenue generated from people downloading mods would go to external websites.
I find it ridiculous that you say people who bought this game who want to improve it and have the the ability to improve it should pay cash to do so. This is keeping in mind that most mods will probably remain free once the marketplace comes out. These 5 second waits are so minuscule and insignificant I'm surprised anyone is so unappreciative to even call the modders out on them. If you really want to call some people out for trying to make money or exploit minecraft, then you should talk to the people who make hundreds to thousands of dollars off advertisements on videos of themselves playing minecraft.
The modders contribute a lot to the community and I think its ridiculous to complain about small advertisements that aren't making anyone rich. They aren't "selling" anything or "forcing payment" on you, in the same vein that people who make money off youtube videos and ads on network tv aren't "forcing payment". They're ads and you have to deal with them even on this forum. So just wait the 5 seconds to get your favorite mods until the marketplace comes out and then some mods will actually cost you real money. Like I said, I'm behind it until Notch says it's against the rules.
I will let it clear for all of you, you want something in return? Then don't do it. Moding is not a job, it's a hobby. We didn't ask you to do this, you are doing this because you like to do it.
You don't get to make that decision for other people.
If you don't want something, that costs money or costs viewing an ad, you have no intrinsic RIGHT to have that thing at all.
If a thing comes with a cost you are unwilling to pay ... DO WITHOUT THAT THING.
Vote with your wallet, not a five-finger discount.
Vote with our wallets... look, my wallet is already worn and I want it to last for more time. Don't make me use it more just because you want money for who knows what purpose, but I'm sure it's nothing really usefull.
You do realise, that "vote with your wallet" means not using your wallet - and not getting the item in question. You do realise that ... right??
I don't consider you awared money just to make something you like to make.
A friend of mine has a now successful, if very small, business - he makes lighting kits for scale modellers. Little computer-control boards, that can drive LEDs for various patterns of blinking, fading, and so on. They're a big hit with people who make starship, naval, or aircraft models - not the $10 stuff you see on shelves in a hobby store, rather, the special-order, $300 kits that, assembled, are sometimes multiple feet in length or diameter, and generally look like they might be movie or TV props.
He started the business, because he is himself a scale modeller, and made a kit purely for himself ... and got so many compliments, he realised "hey! people will PAY me to make these! Awesome!"
He built the DS9 station model on the front page - lighting that was partof what inspired him to start the company (there's probably twenty feet of fiber-optic line inside that thing, to run the few LEDs out to all the window points and running lights, most of which aren't really very visible in that photo). He also built the B5 "Star Fury" model; it's maybe 4 or 5 inches across, from thruster pod to thruster pod. And his wife build the Republic Star Destroyer.
And on the Products page, he built - and laboriously hand-crafted the decals to properly "aztec" the hull of - that NX-01 Enterprise, too. I'm not sure of the other models, though.
...
Modelling, and lightning the models, is "something he loves, and enjoys". It's also something that he makes money from. HOW IS THAT WRONG ...??
I always swore to myself that I would never make an account on these forums. However this subject, and the debate that has followed, cuts right to the core of my issues with this community. So, here I am.
I can promise you that I am no troll, but many of you (including some staff from what I have read over the months) do not seem to have a clear understanding of what trolling actually is. Instead, I will simply say that the following is an honest account of my opinions and not just an effort to illicit a negative emotional response from any of you. Some of you may indeed have a negative response to my opinions, but that is an entirely different matter.
First and foremost:
Users see the gradually increasing efforts by modders to monetize their work as changing the dynamics of what game modding has always been about. You are seeing resistance and frustration from those users because of it. If your mod is worth donations, you will receive them. Any effort to magnify that result, other than improvements made to the mod itself, will be met with resistance. It really is as simple as that.
Secondly:
Donations are intended to be... donations. A donation link is all you should need. Otherwise, and I think you modders should seriously consider this, your mod might not be believed to be worth donating for by the users. And is it really still a donation if the user is pressured or nagged? There seem to be quite a few that think this is less like donating and more like being sold a product. People don't like to feel like that. This is human nature, so why make them feel that way to get donations? You'll only push them away and that is what is already starting to happen. There's already a clear divide between what users are accustomed to expect from the modding scene and what certain modders are attempting to accomplish. Which leads me right into my main beef with the entire Minecraft community...
Third:
Too many of you want to be celebrities and seem to think that Minecraft is your big ticket into super-stardom. From the gajillion Let's Play videos on youtube, to the flame wars between forum posters about who "discovered" this minecart booster or that redstone design or this seed, to the modders that want to build a "cult of personality", well... I am going to intentionally leave a bit out here because I think you all know what I am talking about. Some of it is harmless, but some of it isn't.
And finaly:
If hosting your work is too expensive for you to do alone, it may not have been wise to go that path to begin with. There is no reason for modders to take all of that onto their shoulders unless they choose to. Perhaps it is time to look into some other form of distribution. Community sites have always been the default distribution point for mods. So, why not look into that? Also, file hosting sites like megaupload or rapidshare or filedropper would seem to be a viable alternative. Believe me when I say I trust the file downloaded directly from your official mod website the same as I do the ones I download from any of those sites I named. Everything gets scanned.
Now, I realize that my post count, joined date, and lack of an avatar, signature, or emoticons invalidate anything I might have to say. I have seen this said too many times to count by members of these forums. Might I remind you of the silent majority that have bought this game, but do not actively post here? Just a tip: We can still read the forums... just because we choose not to join in the flame-wars, herobrine threads, and general nonsense around here doesn't mean our opinions are automatically NULL.
I think nullunit has the right idea. Adfly barely gives any money, and is that really worth pushing people (who could like the mod and donate) away? Several people on here have already mentioned that they will not download a mod with only an Adfly link, and they were potential publicity/donators for those mods.
If any senator wishes to read this, I suggest a SUSA bill. Stop United States Act. If the internet needs to babysit your lawmaking, Then there's something wrong.
For mods that were spent countless hours on, i dont see why you cant wait 5 seconds to get the link. I think its alright for the adfly links to be put out, they only get 0.005 per each click, per ip. If you dont have 5 seconds to spare, to help someone out who made a great mod, then you should gtfo.
I like working. Does that mean I shouldn't get money from working?
Depends of what you're working on, and what society considers about your "job". If I don't consider moding as a job, I don't give you any money.
... and if you take and use his mod(s) anyway, you become a thief.
The mods are distributed freely (with adfly), not being sold. Unless you claim to have made it and then redistribute it, there's really nothing that can be "stolen".
If any senator wishes to read this, I suggest a SUSA bill. Stop United States Act. If the internet needs to babysit your lawmaking, Then there's something wrong.
Depends of what you're working on, and what society considers about your "job". If I don't consider moding as a job, I don't give you any money.
... and if you take and use his mod(s) anyway, you become a thief.
The mods are distributed freely (with adfly), not being sold. Unless you claim to have made it and then redistribute it, there's really nothing that can be "stolen".
If viewing the ads is a requirement to download, then, "viewing the ads" is the payment being asked for.
Taking something without rendering the asked-for payment, is theft.
So, the mod developers complain that there shouldn't be any fee for access to the Minecraft source code, but they want to make money, via these ad networks, for their development work.
Nice.
I don't see how are these two facts connected.
Find a dictionary and look up the word "hypocrite'".
You don't have to give them a cent if you don't want to, and I don't want to :smile.gif:
Those facts aren't related what so ever. Modders put in work to make Minecraft better. It's easy to see how they wouldn't want to pay to money to make add-ons for a game they love, especially when they may not have the money to pay for it in the first place. Modding does nothing but help Notch, it gives him ideas and things to work off of. Some community mods have been implemented in the game, and some of those mods wouldn't exist if the source cost money.
I also like how you conveniently look over many things in his previous post.
To me, it seems obvious that Notch wants people who make good mods to get compensated in some way. In fact, Notch says that he might make a marketplace just so good modders can sell their work. Until he says that those 5 second advertisements are against the rules, I'm behind it entirely.
I ignored nothing. I read the post you refer to (and quote).
I figured it was obvious, but I guess not.
Notch has already said those advertisements are against the rules. I don't see how you could have missed it, since you put it in bold in your post, but just for clarity:
So again, modders whine that they don't want to buy a license, yet they want to make money, via these ad networks, for their mods. Granted, they're not going to be billionaires, but they're making money none the less.
I don't know how much said license was to cost, but based on the pricing history of Minecraft iteslf, and the fact that Notch said:
I imagine it would be fairly cheap; something like 10-20 $/€.
I stand by my statement of hypocrisy.
(Just for more clarity, I know that it's not all modders that are doing this, just some of them.)
Ain't it?
No, Notch has not said that ads on downloading mods from external links are against rules. Notch said that ads on mods would be against the rules once he released a centralized marketplace where they could sell mods. Of course, without those ads right now all the revenue generated from people downloading mods would go to external websites.
I find it ridiculous that you say people who bought this game who want to improve it and have the the ability to improve it should pay cash to do so. This is keeping in mind that most mods will probably remain free once the marketplace comes out. These 5 second waits are so minuscule and insignificant I'm surprised anyone is so unappreciative to even call the modders out on them. If you really want to call some people out for trying to make money or exploit minecraft, then you should talk to the people who make hundreds to thousands of dollars off advertisements on videos of themselves playing minecraft.
The modders contribute a lot to the community and I think its ridiculous to complain about small advertisements that aren't making anyone rich. They aren't "selling" anything or "forcing payment" on you, in the same vein that people who make money off youtube videos and ads on network tv aren't "forcing payment". They're ads and you have to deal with them even on this forum. So just wait the 5 seconds to get your favorite mods until the marketplace comes out and then some mods will actually cost you real money. Like I said, I'm behind it until Notch says it's against the rules.
You do realise, that "vote with your wallet" means not using your wallet - and not getting the item in question. You do realise that ... right??
A friend of mine has a now successful, if very small, business - he makes lighting kits for scale modellers. Little computer-control boards, that can drive LEDs for various patterns of blinking, fading, and so on. They're a big hit with people who make starship, naval, or aircraft models - not the $10 stuff you see on shelves in a hobby store, rather, the special-order, $300 kits that, assembled, are sometimes multiple feet in length or diameter, and generally look like they might be movie or TV props.
He started the business, because he is himself a scale modeller, and made a kit purely for himself ... and got so many compliments, he realised "hey! people will PAY me to make these! Awesome!"
From that, Madman Lighting was born.
He built the DS9 station model on the front page - lighting that was partof what inspired him to start the company (there's probably twenty feet of fiber-optic line inside that thing, to run the few LEDs out to all the window points and running lights, most of which aren't really very visible in that photo). He also built the B5 "Star Fury" model; it's maybe 4 or 5 inches across, from thruster pod to thruster pod. And his wife build the Republic Star Destroyer.
And on the Products page, he built - and laboriously hand-crafted the decals to properly "aztec" the hull of - that NX-01 Enterprise, too. I'm not sure of the other models, though.
...
Modelling, and lightning the models, is "something he loves, and enjoys". It's also something that he makes money from. HOW IS THAT WRONG ...??
I can promise you that I am no troll, but many of you (including some staff from what I have read over the months) do not seem to have a clear understanding of what trolling actually is. Instead, I will simply say that the following is an honest account of my opinions and not just an effort to illicit a negative emotional response from any of you. Some of you may indeed have a negative response to my opinions, but that is an entirely different matter.
First and foremost:
Users see the gradually increasing efforts by modders to monetize their work as changing the dynamics of what game modding has always been about. You are seeing resistance and frustration from those users because of it. If your mod is worth donations, you will receive them. Any effort to magnify that result, other than improvements made to the mod itself, will be met with resistance. It really is as simple as that.
Secondly:
Donations are intended to be... donations. A donation link is all you should need. Otherwise, and I think you modders should seriously consider this, your mod might not be believed to be worth donating for by the users. And is it really still a donation if the user is pressured or nagged? There seem to be quite a few that think this is less like donating and more like being sold a product. People don't like to feel like that. This is human nature, so why make them feel that way to get donations? You'll only push them away and that is what is already starting to happen. There's already a clear divide between what users are accustomed to expect from the modding scene and what certain modders are attempting to accomplish. Which leads me right into my main beef with the entire Minecraft community...
Third:
Too many of you want to be celebrities and seem to think that Minecraft is your big ticket into super-stardom. From the gajillion Let's Play videos on youtube, to the flame wars between forum posters about who "discovered" this minecart booster or that redstone design or this seed, to the modders that want to build a "cult of personality", well... I am going to intentionally leave a bit out here because I think you all know what I am talking about. Some of it is harmless, but some of it isn't.
And finaly:
If hosting your work is too expensive for you to do alone, it may not have been wise to go that path to begin with. There is no reason for modders to take all of that onto their shoulders unless they choose to. Perhaps it is time to look into some other form of distribution. Community sites have always been the default distribution point for mods. So, why not look into that? Also, file hosting sites like megaupload or rapidshare or filedropper would seem to be a viable alternative. Believe me when I say I trust the file downloaded directly from your official mod website the same as I do the ones I download from any of those sites I named. Everything gets scanned.
Now, I realize that my post count, joined date, and lack of an avatar, signature, or emoticons invalidate anything I might have to say. I have seen this said too many times to count by members of these forums. Might I remind you of the silent majority that have bought this game, but do not actively post here? Just a tip: We can still read the forums... just because we choose not to join in the flame-wars, herobrine threads, and general nonsense around here doesn't mean our opinions are automatically NULL.
... and if you take and use his mod(s) anyway, you become a thief.
The mods are distributed freely (with adfly), not being sold. Unless you claim to have made it and then redistribute it, there's really nothing that can be "stolen".
If viewing the ads is a requirement to download, then, "viewing the ads" is the payment being asked for.
Taking something without rendering the asked-for payment, is theft.
So basically, you have just stolen a bit of our time. I demand a comphensation.