so, I've been thinking for a long long time, now i know has made a minecraft program has made an exe so you don't have to use a browser. but it still uses java. i think the program could not be java based. for a while, ive been thinking of the advanteges and disadvantages of the conversion.
Advantages:
1. animation can be exstended which could make it more apealing. (aka, giving elbo joints to the mobs)
2. TNT LOVERS!!! if you have 20+ tnt, the program will not shut down when they will go off. the only limitation will be it may lag only from your computer or worst case, an unexspected no responce/program shutdown (if it dose that is.)
3. enviornment building could maby be smoother depending on the computer.
so there are other things that i may have missed. but here is a fact that most of you may know, Minecraft is always running on java. so you may have the top quality computer but java will make limitations makeing the processing power cut by 1/2 or maby 2/3 at most horribly.
now the only disadvantage is depending how good your computer is. if you have a good quality computer (dosn't have to be the best) no problom. i had a low graphics computer and i would have no problom i think. another thing is converting java script into... something else if you use the java virsion vs the program virsion.
so what do ya think?
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This goes into the Java vs. other languages discussion.
So yeah, it could be made in flash for one. It would be faster, but more prone to screen tear, and could use more advance particle effects.
It could also have been made into the most popular game language, LUA.
Can't forget C++. It may be old, but still well used today.
Another argument could as well be that the reason Minecraft has wormed into our hearts is because it is written in Java. It does happen to be a superb language portable to all publicly known operating systems and has its reasons that now it is the primary language new computer science majors are taught.
Edit:
All programs can have multiprocessor support. Most programs only have 2 main threads, making having more then 4 cores unnecessary for the average user.
This goes into the Java vs. other languages discussion.
So yeah, it could be made in flash for one. It would be faster, but more prone to screen tear, and could use more advance particle effects.
Flash supports hardware-accelerated 3D rendering?
Quote from Chrizesu »
It could also have been made into the most popular game language, LUA.
Lua (which is not an acronym, so it only has the first letter capitalised) is sometimes used in games for scripting and modding (eg Garry's Mod, WoW), but not usually for the main part of the game.
Quote from Chrizesu »
Can't forget C++. It may be old, but still well used today.
It would be faster, but C++ is harder to program in, and Notch's code is already somewhat messy. Also, he'd have to learn another language (assuming Notch actually codes anything any more).
Quote from Chrizesu »
All programs can have multiprocessor support. Most programs only have 2 main threads, making having more then 4 cores unnecessary for the average user.
Most programs have one main thread, because it's the default and it takes extra work to make it multithreaded.
Java is real nice.
Imagine Mojang trying to fix bugs in any other language.
Every operating system would have a different build +more for the 64bit and 32bir version.
All those version would have bugs interacting with there specific systems. It would be a lot harder to find the bug and reproduce it when you don't even use that , 1 out of a 100 , operating system.
Look up games like UFO: Alien Invasion or Battle for Wesnoth. Those have many different builds are always having to fix bugs.
Then when they do release a new build , they have to build it for a hundred different operating systems.
This goes into the Java vs. other languages discussion.
So yeah, it could be made in flash for one. It would be faster, but more prone to screen tear, and could use more advance particle effects.
Flash supports hardware-accelerated 3D rendering?
Quote from Chrizesu »
It could also have been made into the most popular game language, LUA.
Probably slower than Java.
Quote from Chrizesu »
Can't forget C++. It may be old, but still well used today.
Faster, but Notch's code is a mess already. Imagine it in C++...
Quote from Chrizesu »
All programs can have multiprocessor support. Most programs only have 2 main threads, making having more then 4 cores unnecessary for the average user.
Most programs have one main thread, because it's the default and it takes extra work to make it multithreaded.
I have seen flash with accelerated 3D, and yeah, C++ can be a mess. Imagine if they don't handle garbage collection right. @_@
Java is not what causes the game to be resource intensive. Keeping track of millions of dynamic blocks makes it resource intensive. Using a different language wouldn't do much to change the large memory footprint and CPU spikes for chunk generation and lighting. (though it would probably mean a decent portion of the non-windows people wouldn't be able to run it)
If you believe I am mistaken, please google something like site:minecraftforum.net language java and be prepared to do a bunch of reading. There are a few people here and there that have made informative and respectful posts on the topic. Unfortunately, they're often outnumbered by incomplete and occasionally wrong information.
I hope you have a decent spring, and I hope this thread doesn't get all flamey.
edit: and multithreading sometimes makes sense, and other times doesn't. As an example - involving more people works great to build a car out of parts made in different factories spread around the world. (study supply chain management - it's really quite amazing.) However, take a long-term social issue and try to solve it with multiple officials who get replaced every few years: often the solution will be very slow or very poor. (see american government) Games are more like government than global trade.
There would be a boost going from Java to C++, but it would be slight and not worth it. Java is significantly faster now than it was in the days of Java 1.0, and while it can't beat C++ (due to being written in it derp), it can graze it. Not worth the massive bugs.
after reading the posts, i do aggree C++ is slightly more complicated. this is because C++ focuses on normal windows files. however, there are other scripting programs like Lua and other ones mentioned. there is one that i somewhat use for a 3D creation program. this scripting program is called python. this scripting program is more focusing on the aid of 3D creation. someone has made a ragdoll titorial which made the programing just useing python make a realistic ragdoll. (and normaly they have other programs to do the same thing, but takes more memory.)
so there are probobly many scripting programs than we know. Java, Lua, C++ and Python are maby just the tip of the iceberg
before i go, now i think java can render only a limited # of objects, because i heard that is how java shuts down when you blow up 10+ or have a huge floating island as big as a city.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Can anyone sssspare ssssome Gunpowder? it wassss taken from me thissss morning... CURSSSSE YOU SSSSTEVE!!! Sssseeya folkssss
edit: and multithreading sometimes makes sense, and other times doesn't. As an example - involving more people works great to build a car out of parts made in different factories spread around the world. (study supply chain management - it's really quite amazing.) However, take a long-term social issue and try to solve it with multiple officials who get replaced every few years: often the solution will be very slow or very poor. (see american government) Games are more like government than global trade.
why couldn't you split the burden of chunk updates over many cores to truncate the spiking down a bit?
Advantages:
1. animation can be exstended which could make it more apealing. (aka, giving elbo joints to the mobs)
2. TNT LOVERS!!! if you have 20+ tnt, the program will not shut down when they will go off. the only limitation will be it may lag only from your computer or worst case, an unexspected no responce/program shutdown (if it dose that is.)
3. enviornment building could maby be smoother depending on the computer.
so there are other things that i may have missed. but here is a fact that most of you may know, Minecraft is always running on java. so you may have the top quality computer but java will make limitations makeing the processing power cut by 1/2 or maby 2/3 at most horribly.
now the only disadvantage is depending how good your computer is. if you have a good quality computer (dosn't have to be the best) no problom. i had a low graphics computer and i would have no problom i think. another thing is converting java script into... something else if you use the java virsion vs the program virsion.
so what do ya think?
Sssseeya folkssss
So yeah, it could be made in flash for one. It would be faster, but more prone to screen tear, and could use more advance particle effects.
It could also have been made into the most popular game language, LUA.
Can't forget C++. It may be old, but still well used today.
Another argument could as well be that the reason Minecraft has wormed into our hearts is because it is written in Java. It does happen to be a superb language portable to all publicly known operating systems and has its reasons that now it is the primary language new computer science majors are taught.
Edit:
All programs can have multiprocessor support. Most programs only have 2 main threads, making having more then 4 cores unnecessary for the average user.
Flash supports hardware-accelerated 3D rendering?
Lua (which is not an acronym, so it only has the first letter capitalised) is sometimes used in games for scripting and modding (eg Garry's Mod, WoW), but not usually for the main part of the game.
It would be faster, but C++ is harder to program in, and Notch's code is already somewhat messy. Also, he'd have to learn another language (assuming Notch actually codes anything any more).
Most programs have one main thread, because it's the default and it takes extra work to make it multithreaded.
Imagine Mojang trying to fix bugs in any other language.
Every operating system would have a different build +more for the 64bit and 32bir version.
All those version would have bugs interacting with there specific systems. It would be a lot harder to find the bug and reproduce it when you don't even use that , 1 out of a 100 , operating system.
Look up games like UFO: Alien Invasion or Battle for Wesnoth. Those have many different builds are always having to fix bugs.
Then when they do release a new build , they have to build it for a hundred different operating systems.
"Shall we play a game?" - Joshua
I have seen flash with accelerated 3D, and yeah, C++ can be a mess. Imagine if they don't handle garbage collection right. @_@
Java is not what causes the game to be resource intensive. Keeping track of millions of dynamic blocks makes it resource intensive. Using a different language wouldn't do much to change the large memory footprint and CPU spikes for chunk generation and lighting. (though it would probably mean a decent portion of the non-windows people wouldn't be able to run it)
If you believe I am mistaken, please google something like site:minecraftforum.net language java and be prepared to do a bunch of reading. There are a few people here and there that have made informative and respectful posts on the topic. Unfortunately, they're often outnumbered by incomplete and occasionally wrong information.
I hope you have a decent spring, and I hope this thread doesn't get all flamey.
edit: and multithreading sometimes makes sense, and other times doesn't. As an example - involving more people works great to build a car out of parts made in different factories spread around the world. (study supply chain management - it's really quite amazing.) However, take a long-term social issue and try to solve it with multiple officials who get replaced every few years: often the solution will be very slow or very poor. (see american government) Games are more like government than global trade.
See this graph? See how Java is slightly faster than C++ (in this benchmark, anyway)?
This benchmark might not mean anything in the real world, but it's proof that Java isn't always slower than C++.
so there are probobly many scripting programs than we know. Java, Lua, C++ and Python are maby just the tip of the iceberg
before i go, now i think java can render only a limited # of objects, because i heard that is how java shuts down when you blow up 10+ or have a huge floating island as big as a city.
Sssseeya folkssss
why couldn't you split the burden of chunk updates over many cores to truncate the spiking down a bit?
Sssseeya folkssss