-snip-
I paid for a release copy of Minecraft, not beta.
-snip-
Why did you not buy the Beta version? the Beta version is £10/$20 and the alleged price of the released version will be double that apparantly. It is clearly stated when you buy it.
I bought the game in Alpha. But I paid for a pre-order of the released version of Minecraft, as did everyone else.
What you get for purchasing
Please note that Minecraft is currently a work in progress and NOT a finished product! The sandbox mode available right now. However, you may buy a discounted beta account today, which will also include the full game!
As we at Mojang continue to release more complete builds of the game, we will also be reducing the discount gradually until we reach the final version and full price of the product. So the earlier you buy, the better value you get! Although we are very passionate about this project, we cannot guarantee that it will be completed - that's why we offer the discounted price When you purchase the game, you pay for it as it is right now. Future updates are an added bonus.
A lot of u either didn't read this before purchasing or completely forgot about it in all your frustrations. Another player mentioned this in a earlier post but it was sad to see it got completely ignored because everyone would rather reply to flame and just throw it back.
Minecraft is a great game, I'm sure most of you would agree, but i think your asking too much from notch. it was nice to get those weekly updates and the secret Fridays were awesome but because its gotten so big now, its as if hes become super famous or something XD everyone is trying to get a bit of him and i think that is whats pulling him away from progress which in his right he could just stop everything now and never finish if he really wanted too.
What you get for purchasing
Please note that Minecraft is currently a work in progress and NOT a finished product! The sandbox mode available right now. However, you may buy a discounted beta account today, which will also include the full game!
As we at Mojang continue to release more complete builds of the game, we will also be reducing the discount gradually until we reach the final version and full price of the product. So the earlier you buy, the better value you get! Although we are very passionate about this project, we cannot guarantee that it will be completed - that's why we offer the discounted price When you purchase the game, you pay for it as it is right now. Future updates are an added bonus.
A lot of u either didn't read this before purchasing or completely forgot about it in all your frustrations. Another player mentioned this in a earlier post but it was sad to see it got completely ignored because everyone would rather reply to flame and just throw it back.
Minecraft is a great game, I'm sure most of you would agree, but i think your asking too much from notch. it was nice to get those weekly updates and the secret Fridays were awesome but because its gotten so big now, its as if hes become super famous or something XD everyone is trying to get a bit of him and i think that is whats pulling him away from progress which in his right he could just stop everything now and never finish if he really wanted too.
Right now, your posts are no more (if not less) constructive than a flamewar. You have obviously not read this thread, and you haven't taken the time to understand the intricacies of what goes into creating content for the game. Nobody ignored that post, and it isn't "flaming" to tell someone that they are wasting people's time and spreading incorrect information. This thread is addressing people like you, who post without thinking, and they are laying the finger of blame solely on you, for thinking and acting so little toward the myriad of bull being shoved down your throat.
I don't understand why you find that post unconstructive. and the person who posted it obviously has read the thread as it addresses the issues put forth by the OP.
I dont know why you're getting so worked up about this game. I read the "what you get for purchasing" blurb on the website before I committed to buying the Beta product, and fully understood that the game might never be completed and that any update will be a bonus.
I myself can never see this game being completed. Am I bothered? No. Is the current version playable? Very.
I find it unconstructive because it is a reiteration of something that has been said every time a thread like this comes up, it was a completely worthless, thoughtless, and uninspired comment, and if either of you had actually read this thread or understood its purpose you would know why. It's just another pathetic excuse not to improve the game. Why do you want to come up with all these excuses to not improve the game??
I don't understand why you find that post unconstructive. and the person who posted it obviously has read the thread as it addresses the issues put forth by the OP.
I dont know why you're getting so worked up about this game. I read the "what you get for purchasing" blurb on the website before I committed to buying the Beta product, and fully understood that the game might never be completed and that any update will be a bonus.
I myself can never see this game being completed. Am I bothered? No. Is the current version playable? Very.
I find it unconstructive because it is a reiteration of something that has been said every time a thread like this comes up, it was a completely worthless, thoughtless, and uninspired comment, and if either of you had actually read this thread or understood its purpose you would know why. It's just another pathetic excuse not to improve the game. Why do you want to come up with all these excuses to not improve the game??
Why then is everyone in this forum content to kiss the soil Notch trod upon when this game is literally a buggy piece of garbage. Have you ever checked the wiki? Great source of information, particularly when it comes to bugs. Why is it that every feature has section after it naming every stupid bug that affects it.
I'm tired of you and your pals, i think you should just leave this forum and try to develop a game on your own, lets see if it will even get 1/100 of the money Notch got on Minecraft, you call it garbage so lets see if you can make any better, lets ****ing see.
I'm sure everyone there gets a salary, who's job is server upkeep?
Mollstam - I believe his twitter is @mollstam (but I'm not certain, as I don't have him followed). More people should know this; everyone directs their rage at Notch when the servers are down, but he's not even the guy working on them. It's like yelling at Mike Morhaime (CEO of Blizzard) for extended World of Warcraft maintenance.
Also, the "circle jerking" cuts both ways. There are people in this forum who are always talking crap about the game, and threads like this one come out pretty much any time there's anything remotely wrong with anything (or even when there isn't anything wrong, but it's just been too long since an update). I've seen these people agree with barely literate homophobic hate-spewing flamethrowers just because said flamethrowers were on their side. You'll see accusations of there being a mythical "Notch Defense Force" (and frankly, I'm surprised to not see such things in this thread as of yet) that their detractors belong to as a way to discount anything people say that disagrees with their world view.
I've provided literal 100% proof that Jeb, the new favored developer of the forums, plays games just like Notch did to someone who claimed all the latter did was play games, and months later that person is still making the same accusations.
Confirmation bias assures that, even if you somehow have a point, it'll go ignored by people who disagree with you. A thread like yours (albeit usually less well-written) crops up all the time. Every argument you see here is made there, on both sides, and guess what? It doesn't do anything. Even if your stated goal is to unify the community to go storming Notch's doorstep demanding hundreds of contradictory goals (we're an unpleasable fanbase*, after all), it's simply not going to happen, exactly because of the contradictory goals.
Veering offtopic, but:
Quote from bporgn »
Have you written a line of code? I've written hundreds of thousands, and I can tell you right now that there is no reason for these updates to take this long. Also I can almost guarantee you every update to the game was coded in less than a week, the rest of the time spent elsewhere. Programming takes a long time because of procrastination, when you are actually implementing a feature it usually gets done in a matter of days, if not a single day. I've been programming since I was 12 years old, that is now 8 years. I know what I'm talking about and I can assure you that there is, once again, no excuse for what is happening (and more importantly not happening) with this game.
Have you programmed for a full-time job yet? If you're 20, I assume you're in college or some other sort of secondary education. You may not have had the chance to work with other programmers in a professional environment before, so you may not be able to answer the following question: Have you ever had someone dismiss your technical achievements?
Because, trust me, this is something that will happen. You'll pour months of your hard work into something, and it'll be good. I mean, really good. It's some of the most elegant and well thought out code you've ever written. The server that'll use this code will be rock solid. You've done a good thing.
And then, moments later, someone who doesn't see your code (or even someone who does) will dismiss it. "I could have done that in a week", they'll say, without bothering to prove that statement or consider testing or integrating it with the rest of the system or any of the many non-visible changes you had to make. All he'll see is the end result, some program that ties some server to some other server, and he'll think it some simple thing he could easily re-produce.
If that hasn't happened to you, I warn you right now, it will. Why would you do that to someone else?
(* Warning! TvTropes link!)
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
This forum ticked me off so much I went to random.org and set my password to something I'll never be able to remember, then switched my password reset to a throwaway.
I didn't go to college, I've worked with many teams and yeah, everyone has experienced that. But the bugs and unimplemented SMP features aren't rocket science, a lot of the things people are talking about in this thread are literally, as someone said, 10 lines of code, if not less.
There is no notch defense force, but on one side we have rational arguments being presented by people who understand the medium they are working with, and on the other side we have apologetic posters who understand nothing about what goes into developing the game and are very willing to defend the developers to their grave. How so many people can say the same narrow-minded thing, relentlessly, without realizing how obnoxious and counter-productive they are being completely blows my mind. And I don't think it will ever stop blowing my mind. It's kind of like someone you love dying. The pain will never go away. People will always be ignorant.
Notch has his own company now, there is literally no reason the server should be down for more than a few minutes for any reason.
I fail to see what owning a company has to do with running a server. He doesn't magically become an expert in running servers just because he owns his own business.
A new release would break existing features, some features got cut out completely, some remained broken and unfixed for months.
It's something called "code bloat" and it happens to any project that becomes sufficiently large. As he adds more and more stuff, the code for the game becomes bigger and bigger and more difficult to change. There are a lot of dependencies between the various functions, so it is also the case that he may also have to deal with the side effects of changing things.
It is also a case of priorities. His "TODO" list is likely very, very long right now. Right now, it appears he's working on an achievement system. So that's likely to be getting most of his attention right now. Jeb is working on wolves - mostly because Notch sorta promised to have dogs in Minecraft at GDC . . .
. . . which reminds me, Notch also went to GDC, so he wasn't coding much during the GDC.
In any case, no his priorities may not be your priorities. He has other things high on his list, and apparently achievements is one of the higher priorities right now, along with wolves. Possibly some other unmentioned stuff is being worked on as well, as these patches have a habit of being a bit more than what they talk about in Twitter.
It's also the case that debugging is hard. As a developer myself, I can understand that he wants to develop new features rather than deal with bugs. While debugging is necessary, it's one of those things developers don't like doing a lot. Perhaps he should spend more time fixing bugs? Sure. He should. But I can understand if he doesn't enjoy it.
The definition of a beta . . .
. . . is very much subjective. I don't think I've seen very much agreement in the industry on what exactly constitutes a "beta."
It's also the case that Minecraft seems to be a game with countless ways to play, and the feature set is a bit arbitrary. It doesn't seem that this game will truly reach a "finished" state soon - indeed, what would really constitute a "finished" sandbox game like this, with its countless number of potential features?
Because, trust me, this is something that will happen. You'll pour months of your hard work into something, and it'll be good. I mean, really good. It's some of the most elegant and well thought out code you've ever written. The server that'll use this code will be rock solid. You've done a good thing.
And then, moments later, someone who doesn't see your code (or even someone who does) will dismiss it. "I could have done that in a week", they'll say, without bothering to prove that statement or consider testing or integrating it with the rest of the system or any of the many non-visible changes you had to make. All he'll see is the end result, some program that ties some server to some other server, and he'll think it some simple thing he could easily re-produce.
You, sir, deserve a :Diamond:.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
When all is said and done, Will you have said more than you have done?
These are the things I'm primely concerned with. These are technical issues in minecraft that are glaring. I don't think anyone sane can read this post and say "These things do not deserve to be fixed."
I was being sarcastic by the way. If the definition of a troll is someone who spreads false information and impedes progress, then you are a troll. You haven't read the thread, you aren't paying attention to the posts, and you won't stop saying things that are meaningless to the discussion. You're wasting people's time and the only thing your posts could possibly achieve would be making minecraft worse, by giving people another irrational reason to ignore its technical flaws.
To all the people that whine and moan. Don't play it. Sell your account. Get rid of it. Thats all you have to do.
Or, if you know notch isn't the best programmer, beat him. Make your own version of minecraft. Do something like fortresscraft is doing. Until then, this is what you are getting, and you posting on the forums sure as heck won't make notch change anything.
+50 points for you :|
also to say "I'll give you a :D" Is people just messing around, jerk. Are people not allowed to do that?
Just cuz everyones not like you doesn't give you the right to be all "Oh you guys are shitty people because you don't promote this very well or act like Ithink you should"
It's a forum. It's for more reasons that to discuss things, but a place to have fun as well.
And I'm sure that when it was in alpha, or whatever, when he was coming out with all the stuff at the same time it's because they were EASIER/FASTER to program. I'm assuming to add things to the game now would be a lot more time efficient. What do you mean no updates? I've only been a member here for like....a month and a half and I've already seen two updates: The bed update and the NEW updates coming in 1.4.
And to people complaining about things that need to be fixed: The game is in beta, you're here to test it then tell what the issues are. Don't complain to have it fixed ASAP. They WILL be fixed in time.
If you don't like it then leave. Nothing you do is going to make notch work any faster.
Just like you can't shame people into losing weight you can't shame people into working faster :|
TROLL TROLL TROLL TROLL TROLL
I'm joking.
I see what you mean, though. All I do is visit Mod threads and 99% of posters are like "OMG This is awesome!!!!" and they don't actually give criticism. I'm not gonna lie, though. I sometimes do it too. But keep in mind that people don't have to ALWAYS get criticism, I mean, people come on the Forums to have fun and talk to other Minecraftians, don't they?
But you may think that Notch has some super awesome massive company now, but, it's still only 5 people (I think, not too sure) so you can't expect them to be able to sort out a server crash quickly when there's about 1 million+ players using minecraft.net. Just sayin'.
Agreed.
But criticism is only good when it's constructive. :tongue.gif:
I was being sarcastic by the way. If the definition of a troll is someone who spreads false information and impedes progress, then you are a troll. You haven't read the thread, you aren't paying attention to the posts, and you won't stop saying things that are meaningless to the discussion. You're wasting people's time and the only thing your posts could possibly achieve would be making minecraft worse, by giving people another irrational reason to ignore its technical flaws.
Man, don't worry about him. Regardless if he gets his kicks from the argument, if people ignore him his disruption will be far more limited. I mean, that's probably rather condescending of me to say because you probably know that, th- Hey, look! Useless pumpkins!
Personally, I think the reasons behind the issues (note, not the issues themselves) with Minecraft could probably be summed up with the following:
[*:35bh3pbi] Notch's inexperience. Let's face it, he's never done anything that's had such an exposure before. I don't think he's ever done something that has had the potential that Minecraft has, even if only in fanbase. In this way, I think he's fallen (falling?) into a similar sort of problem that Duke Nukem Forever fell into. Wired put it well - success kills.
[**] Before the flames start, I'm not saying that Minecraft is going to go vapourware, or that Notch is George Broussard in disguise. Just, please, go read the article before you start all screamin' at me. Not all applies, but there are some similarities.
[**] I think that Mojang needs to have a good, hard think about their staff allocation. Again I'm not hatin', just sayin', and I'm not claiming to have seen them work or anything, but I feel that the best way to do this is to split the staff into (at least) three groups - one group coding for features, one group coding for bugs, and one group dedicated to community feedback. Now, I say that because of the split fanbase - If Mojang went dedicated bug-fixing for a week, people would whine because "wherez mah dwagunz?", if Mojang went dedicated features, we'd have a somewhat more magnified version of what we have now. All that really needs to be said is "You - Bugs. Nothing but bugs. You - Features. Make sure it doesn't break anything." As people are dedicated, they become more efficient, as their tasks or main problem will remain in their head during non-work periods. I'm going out on a limb here a bit, but I don't think that happens.
[*:35bh3pbi] Current community feedback sucks, and that's magnified by the split fanbase. Touched on this before, but look at this very thread - Even in this group that feel there are issues with Minecraft, some want SMP fixes and so on, while others clamour more for delayed features. I guarantee that, if everyone here was asked to choose between bug fixes in an immediate update and custom-coloured bedsheets, we'd have a flame war. It wouldn't be Crusade-scale, but I don't think it would be very nice, either.
[**] We need a dedicated bug-tracker, at least in my opinion. Get Satisfaction sucks for this kind of fanbase and the size of the project, as the bug reports (probably) get drowned out by the feature requests, the "OMG STFU I WANT MY MONEH BACK" posts, and so on. A dedicated bug-tracker would not only remove such chaff, but would also mean that:
[***] People simply can't provide too little information. Think something like Mantis, if you've ever seen the Dwarf Fortress bug tracker - You can't just put in "Minecarts don't werk!", there's specific boxes for things like steps to reproduce problem, OS and OS Version, CPU architecture, and so on and so forth. It sounds like a small thing, but I assure you it's not. Bug reports would be actual reports, instead of conversations involving "We need more details - What OS are you using? Are you playing this in-browser? Classic or Beta?" replied by with "rofl, ho wdo I find that kthx?" And that's good, because it allows people to more easily confirm things, and can actually get stuff done.
[***] Similarly, it would allow merging of bugs. Again, sounds really really small, but it's not. Some might cailm it to be essential - Suddenly, the confirming of a bug on two different machines means that it's not, say, a problem limited to Intel chipsets. So whack the bugs together, a discussion really gets under way, and good stuff happens, instead of efforts (both community-based and Mojang-based) aren't fractured.
[***] A bug tracker wouldn't even need to be Mojang-moderated. Just like these forums (I think), the community could handle a lot of the leg-work with a bug tracker - Merging bugs, highlighting major issues (e.g., common crashes), closing reports when it's not a bug, and otherwise proving the continued worth of their touch-typing skills in a world of hunter-seekers. As a result, whoever gets assigned (or just Mojang in general) can spend less time hunting for feedback, and more time acting upon it.
I was going to follow up with something, b- Oh, look! Coloured wool!
No, i do not enjoy being at this arguement (ALTHOUGH i do enjoy you being so buthurt about Minecraft i wont lie.) you are calling Minecraft a buggy piece of garbage and yet you flame me, what sense does that make?
If you consider Minecraft being trash then dont ****ing play it thats all.
instead of going on the forum and whining like little kids who dont get to play with their toys.
One last question:
What did you expect by making this thread, that Notch will fix all the bugs in two simple minutes? I think that if Notch would read this he would lose motivation by people like you who whine all day.]
Great ideas, ChemicalRascal. Personally, I really, really enjoy Minecraft, but I know that the game is not finished. The underlying engine may require a complete overhaul in order to accommodate the rapid scaling that is being demanded. Think about how utterly frightening that would be- simply Herculean.
I don't believe Notch or anyone in his organization is ignoring the issues surrounding his game. In the words of a mentor I had many decades ago, "In the absence of information, people make **** up." Months ago, Notch was very approachable and that quality endeared himself to his community. Now, he has to become a businessman and keep his creation progressing- forcing him away from both his core competency which is coding and his communication with his customer base. I believe that has confused people into thinking that "he doesn't care" or that he is "resting on his laurels".
I've personally encountered many bugs with Minecraft. It is not perfect and can even be incredibly frustrating (SMP). One thing that Notch might consider is opening the code up a bit more to open source development. There is already a huge Mod-development base that would love to contribute their code and energy to the project. That might give him the leverage to complete Minecraft 1.0. Just a thought.
No, i do not enjoy being at this arguement (ALTHOUGH i do enjoy you being so buthurt about Minecraft i wont lie.) you are calling Minecraft a buggy piece of garbage and yet you flame me, what sense does that make?
If you consider Minecraft being trash then dont ****ing play it thats all.
instead of going on the forum and whining like little kids who dont get to play with their toys.
One last question:
What did you expect by making this thread, that Notch will fix all the bugs in two simple minutes? I think that if Notch would read this he would lose motivation by people like you who whine all day.]
inb4itsnotrelatedbs.
I'm not here to flame you. But you should consider not baiting others. This is a discussion thread, so let people discuss the matter without being rude, eh?
No one called Minecraft trash. In fact, they even specified that they like the game, they're merely disappointed that its not living up to its potential. So please don't be rude to others when you don't have your facts straight, ok?
I bought the game in Alpha. But I paid for a pre-order of the released version of Minecraft, as did everyone else.
A lot of u either didn't read this before purchasing or completely forgot about it in all your frustrations. Another player mentioned this in a earlier post but it was sad to see it got completely ignored because everyone would rather reply to flame and just throw it back.
Minecraft is a great game, I'm sure most of you would agree, but i think your asking too much from notch. it was nice to get those weekly updates and the secret Fridays were awesome but because its gotten so big now, its as if hes become super famous or something XD everyone is trying to get a bit of him and i think that is whats pulling him away from progress which in his right he could just stop everything now and never finish if he really wanted too.
Right now, your posts are no more (if not less) constructive than a flamewar. You have obviously not read this thread, and you haven't taken the time to understand the intricacies of what goes into creating content for the game. Nobody ignored that post, and it isn't "flaming" to tell someone that they are wasting people's time and spreading incorrect information. This thread is addressing people like you, who post without thinking, and they are laying the finger of blame solely on you, for thinking and acting so little toward the myriad of bull being shoved down your throat.
I find it unconstructive because it is a reiteration of something that has been said every time a thread like this comes up, it was a completely worthless, thoughtless, and uninspired comment, and if either of you had actually read this thread or understood its purpose you would know why. It's just another pathetic excuse not to improve the game. Why do you want to come up with all these excuses to not improve the game??
Being an ass wont improve the game.
Had to be said.
Supporting:
☺
Excuse my impoliteness.
Its faar beyond that level,
I'm tired of you and your pals, i think you should just leave this forum and try to develop a game on your own, lets see if it will even get 1/100 of the money Notch got on Minecraft, you call it garbage so lets see if you can make any better, lets ****ing see.
Supporting:
☺
Mollstam - I believe his twitter is @mollstam (but I'm not certain, as I don't have him followed). More people should know this; everyone directs their rage at Notch when the servers are down, but he's not even the guy working on them. It's like yelling at Mike Morhaime (CEO of Blizzard) for extended World of Warcraft maintenance.
Also, the "circle jerking" cuts both ways. There are people in this forum who are always talking crap about the game, and threads like this one come out pretty much any time there's anything remotely wrong with anything (or even when there isn't anything wrong, but it's just been too long since an update). I've seen these people agree with barely literate homophobic hate-spewing flamethrowers just because said flamethrowers were on their side. You'll see accusations of there being a mythical "Notch Defense Force" (and frankly, I'm surprised to not see such things in this thread as of yet) that their detractors belong to as a way to discount anything people say that disagrees with their world view.
I've provided literal 100% proof that Jeb, the new favored developer of the forums, plays games just like Notch did to someone who claimed all the latter did was play games, and months later that person is still making the same accusations.
Confirmation bias assures that, even if you somehow have a point, it'll go ignored by people who disagree with you. A thread like yours (albeit usually less well-written) crops up all the time. Every argument you see here is made there, on both sides, and guess what? It doesn't do anything. Even if your stated goal is to unify the community to go storming Notch's doorstep demanding hundreds of contradictory goals (we're an unpleasable fanbase*, after all), it's simply not going to happen, exactly because of the contradictory goals.
Veering offtopic, but:
Have you programmed for a full-time job yet? If you're 20, I assume you're in college or some other sort of secondary education. You may not have had the chance to work with other programmers in a professional environment before, so you may not be able to answer the following question: Have you ever had someone dismiss your technical achievements?
Because, trust me, this is something that will happen. You'll pour months of your hard work into something, and it'll be good. I mean, really good. It's some of the most elegant and well thought out code you've ever written. The server that'll use this code will be rock solid. You've done a good thing.
And then, moments later, someone who doesn't see your code (or even someone who does) will dismiss it. "I could have done that in a week", they'll say, without bothering to prove that statement or consider testing or integrating it with the rest of the system or any of the many non-visible changes you had to make. All he'll see is the end result, some program that ties some server to some other server, and he'll think it some simple thing he could easily re-produce.
If that hasn't happened to you, I warn you right now, it will. Why would you do that to someone else?
(* Warning! TvTropes link!)
There is no notch defense force, but on one side we have rational arguments being presented by people who understand the medium they are working with, and on the other side we have apologetic posters who understand nothing about what goes into developing the game and are very willing to defend the developers to their grave. How so many people can say the same narrow-minded thing, relentlessly, without realizing how obnoxious and counter-productive they are being completely blows my mind. And I don't think it will ever stop blowing my mind. It's kind of like someone you love dying. The pain will never go away. People will always be ignorant.
I fail to see what owning a company has to do with running a server. He doesn't magically become an expert in running servers just because he owns his own business.
It's something called "code bloat" and it happens to any project that becomes sufficiently large. As he adds more and more stuff, the code for the game becomes bigger and bigger and more difficult to change. There are a lot of dependencies between the various functions, so it is also the case that he may also have to deal with the side effects of changing things.
It is also a case of priorities. His "TODO" list is likely very, very long right now. Right now, it appears he's working on an achievement system. So that's likely to be getting most of his attention right now. Jeb is working on wolves - mostly because Notch sorta promised to have dogs in Minecraft at GDC . . .
. . . which reminds me, Notch also went to GDC, so he wasn't coding much during the GDC.
In any case, no his priorities may not be your priorities. He has other things high on his list, and apparently achievements is one of the higher priorities right now, along with wolves. Possibly some other unmentioned stuff is being worked on as well, as these patches have a habit of being a bit more than what they talk about in Twitter.
It's also the case that debugging is hard. As a developer myself, I can understand that he wants to develop new features rather than deal with bugs. While debugging is necessary, it's one of those things developers don't like doing a lot. Perhaps he should spend more time fixing bugs? Sure. He should. But I can understand if he doesn't enjoy it.
. . . is very much subjective. I don't think I've seen very much agreement in the industry on what exactly constitutes a "beta."
It's also the case that Minecraft seems to be a game with countless ways to play, and the feature set is a bit arbitrary. It doesn't seem that this game will truly reach a "finished" state soon - indeed, what would really constitute a "finished" sandbox game like this, with its countless number of potential features?
You, sir, deserve a :Diamond:.
These are the things I'm primely concerned with. These are technical issues in minecraft that are glaring. I don't think anyone sane can read this post and say "These things do not deserve to be fixed."
I was being sarcastic by the way. If the definition of a troll is someone who spreads false information and impedes progress, then you are a troll. You haven't read the thread, you aren't paying attention to the posts, and you won't stop saying things that are meaningless to the discussion. You're wasting people's time and the only thing your posts could possibly achieve would be making minecraft worse, by giving people another irrational reason to ignore its technical flaws.
+50 points for you :|
also to say "I'll give you a :D" Is people just messing around, jerk. Are people not allowed to do that?
Just cuz everyones not like you doesn't give you the right to be all "Oh you guys are shitty people because you don't promote this very well or act like Ithink you should"
It's a forum. It's for more reasons that to discuss things, but a place to have fun as well.
And I'm sure that when it was in alpha, or whatever, when he was coming out with all the stuff at the same time it's because they were EASIER/FASTER to program. I'm assuming to add things to the game now would be a lot more time efficient. What do you mean no updates? I've only been a member here for like....a month and a half and I've already seen two updates: The bed update and the NEW updates coming in 1.4.
And to people complaining about things that need to be fixed: The game is in beta, you're here to test it then tell what the issues are. Don't complain to have it fixed ASAP. They WILL be fixed in time.
If you don't like it then leave. Nothing you do is going to make notch work any faster.
Just like you can't shame people into losing weight you can't shame people into working faster :|
So go troll another site.
Agreed.
But criticism is only good when it's constructive. :tongue.gif:
Man, don't worry about him. Regardless if he gets his kicks from the argument, if people ignore him his disruption will be far more limited. I mean, that's probably rather condescending of me to say because you probably know that, th- Hey, look! Useless pumpkins!
Personally, I think the reasons behind the issues (note, not the issues themselves) with Minecraft could probably be summed up with the following:
[*:35bh3pbi] Notch's inexperience. Let's face it, he's never done anything that's had such an exposure before. I don't think he's ever done something that has had the potential that Minecraft has, even if only in fanbase. In this way, I think he's fallen (falling?) into a similar sort of problem that Duke Nukem Forever fell into. Wired put it well - success kills.
[**] Before the flames start, I'm not saying that Minecraft is going to go vapourware, or that Notch is George Broussard in disguise. Just, please, go read the article before you start all screamin' at me. Not all applies, but there are some similarities.
[**] I think that Mojang needs to have a good, hard think about their staff allocation. Again I'm not hatin', just sayin', and I'm not claiming to have seen them work or anything, but I feel that the best way to do this is to split the staff into (at least) three groups - one group coding for features, one group coding for bugs, and one group dedicated to community feedback. Now, I say that because of the split fanbase - If Mojang went dedicated bug-fixing for a week, people would whine because "wherez mah dwagunz?", if Mojang went dedicated features, we'd have a somewhat more magnified version of what we have now. All that really needs to be said is "You - Bugs. Nothing but bugs. You - Features. Make sure it doesn't break anything." As people are dedicated, they become more efficient, as their tasks or main problem will remain in their head during non-work periods. I'm going out on a limb here a bit, but I don't think that happens.
[*:35bh3pbi] Current community feedback sucks, and that's magnified by the split fanbase. Touched on this before, but look at this very thread - Even in this group that feel there are issues with Minecraft, some want SMP fixes and so on, while others clamour more for delayed features. I guarantee that, if everyone here was asked to choose between bug fixes in an immediate update and custom-coloured bedsheets, we'd have a flame war. It wouldn't be Crusade-scale, but I don't think it would be very nice, either.
[**] We need a dedicated bug-tracker, at least in my opinion. Get Satisfaction sucks for this kind of fanbase and the size of the project, as the bug reports (probably) get drowned out by the feature requests, the "OMG STFU I WANT MY MONEH BACK" posts, and so on. A dedicated bug-tracker would not only remove such chaff, but would also mean that:
[***] People simply can't provide too little information. Think something like Mantis, if you've ever seen the Dwarf Fortress bug tracker - You can't just put in "Minecarts don't werk!", there's specific boxes for things like steps to reproduce problem, OS and OS Version, CPU architecture, and so on and so forth. It sounds like a small thing, but I assure you it's not. Bug reports would be actual reports, instead of conversations involving "We need more details - What OS are you using? Are you playing this in-browser? Classic or Beta?" replied by with "rofl, ho wdo I find that kthx?" And that's good, because it allows people to more easily confirm things, and can actually get stuff done.
[***] Similarly, it would allow merging of bugs. Again, sounds really really small, but it's not. Some might cailm it to be essential - Suddenly, the confirming of a bug on two different machines means that it's not, say, a problem limited to Intel chipsets. So whack the bugs together, a discussion really gets under way, and good stuff happens, instead of efforts (both community-based and Mojang-based) aren't fractured.
[***] A bug tracker wouldn't even need to be Mojang-moderated. Just like these forums (I think), the community could handle a lot of the leg-work with a bug tracker - Merging bugs, highlighting major issues (e.g., common crashes), closing reports when it's not a bug, and otherwise proving the continued worth of their touch-typing skills in a world of hunter-seekers. As a result, whoever gets assigned (or just Mojang in general) can spend less time hunting for feedback, and more time acting upon it.
I was going to follow up with something, b- Oh, look! Coloured wool!
"WAHHH, WHY ISNT THIS GAME PERFECT ENOUGH YET?"
MOD EDIT: Sorry, but offensively paraphrasing other users in that way is insulting. User warned
http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/M ... bleFanbase
If you consider Minecraft being trash then dont ****ing play it thats all.
instead of going on the forum and whining like little kids who dont get to play with their toys.
One last question:
What did you expect by making this thread, that Notch will fix all the bugs in two simple minutes? I think that if Notch would read this he would lose motivation by people like you who whine all day.]
inb4itsnotrelatedbs.
Supporting:
☺
I don't believe Notch or anyone in his organization is ignoring the issues surrounding his game. In the words of a mentor I had many decades ago, "In the absence of information, people make **** up." Months ago, Notch was very approachable and that quality endeared himself to his community. Now, he has to become a businessman and keep his creation progressing- forcing him away from both his core competency which is coding and his communication with his customer base. I believe that has confused people into thinking that "he doesn't care" or that he is "resting on his laurels".
I've personally encountered many bugs with Minecraft. It is not perfect and can even be incredibly frustrating (SMP). One thing that Notch might consider is opening the code up a bit more to open source development. There is already a huge Mod-development base that would love to contribute their code and energy to the project. That might give him the leverage to complete Minecraft 1.0. Just a thought.
I'm not here to flame you. But you should consider not baiting others. This is a discussion thread, so let people discuss the matter without being rude, eh?
No one called Minecraft trash. In fact, they even specified that they like the game, they're merely disappointed that its not living up to its potential. So please don't be rude to others when you don't have your facts straight, ok?