Atheist just means someone who doesn't believe in any specific deities. I'm an atheist, I don't believe all religious people are stupid or anything (Anymore. There was a time I did. My girlfriend snapped my out of that :x)
No that's agnostic. Atheist means you don't believe any diety exists.
MOD EDIT: No double posting, user warned.
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Hello? Eat my tarts? In this cosmic dance of bursting decadence, withheld permissions twist all our arms collectively. But if sweetness can win- and it can- then I'll still be here tomorrow to high five you yesterday my friend. Peace.
In that case, avoid pigs, don't kill them.
This way you won't get bacon, and if you happen to get a slab, you are not allowed to throw or give it away, then also store them in a chest you place anywhere, like a halfway through a forest area, leave it there, and never return.
Technically you stored it.
Also, to make your problem worse, how do you kill a cow without knowing the right direction?
And if you have to pray at certain times, how do you know the time is right, even if you don't really know the time in the game, but only have access to the sun's position and a rather dull clock? Also, direction....
1. Sounds good! Abandonment...
2. Wait... What direction do I have to know to make killing cows easier?
3. Islamic prayer times (as I explained before) is not based on times but on the sun. Didn't you see the pics of the sun room I made? Also if there's a way to change the moving texture for the dial I might make it light up or something on the prayer times!!
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Hello? Eat my tarts? In this cosmic dance of bursting decadence, withheld permissions twist all our arms collectively. But if sweetness can win- and it can- then I'll still be here tomorrow to high five you yesterday my friend. Peace.
First of all, huge props to the OP for calmly shutting down the dickheads trying to rag on Islam.
I find this whole concept very interesting, as I am currently enrolled in a class about Islam. As the OP has proven, the western stereotype of every Muslim being a dangerous fundamentalist is by far an over exageration. I can't wait to see what you do next. Perhaps try and find a big desert and try and make a Bedouin settlement. Also, I would suggest perhaps putting a large black cube of obsidian on your spawn to represent the Kabba. That way, the compass always will point towards the Kabba.
Atheism is when you reject any belief of a deity. You believe there's nothing but dust, no supernatural or divine occurances, and upon death there's nothing but a rotting body in the grave. (or more likely, ash after cremation, why would an atheist need a grave?)
Agnosticism (agnostisism?) is when you believe such a deity may exist somewhere (or someWHEN), but desire proof before proclaiming it as a fact.
One thing i do find interesting is how many atheists dont quite understand what the word atheist means before announcing it as "what they are".
Furthermore, due to the close link between atheism and science (after all, science has been in a ideological battle against religion since ancient times), one can assume that many atheists also follow scientific development closely in the search of "natural truth".
But, and this is what caused myself to swich towards agnosticism, science and the discoveries made lately isnt exactly conforming to the atheist comfort zone.. Which makes the entire atheism <3 science stance a bit of a paradox.
Quantum entanglement (which is proven in labs, without any mathematical or proper fleshed out theoretical explanation of how it is even remotely possible in our "real world"), sub-atomic particles popping in and out of existance, and the quantum theory which states (and to some extent proves) that a particle can be at several places at once before being observed, not to mention the force of gravity which still to this day is nothing but a theory unable to be solved, pretty much suggests that things arent as simple as we would like.
Or just look at a black hole, where time stands still, due to gravity being infinite.
The world isnt an orderly clockwork of perfectly predictable scientific and mathematical equasions.
I have no idea why im writing this in a minecraft thread, i guess im just bored.
the Kaaba is the location of prayer not because the actual building has anything important, but because it is the center of the universe, and is the bride between heaven and Earth.
Wat ....
Other than that - I suppose it's a good idea to bring something new to the game.
If you noticed the note at the bottom, anything in blue is an opinion of Islam. We believe it's the center of the universe. Cuz that's how we roll.
Quote from Dantevortex »
[GIANT SNIP]
I´m just letting that day pass without cutting people´s foreheads.
1. Oh sorry my mistake. (Ipod autocorrect- MY IPOD IS ATHEIST! )
2. No, that simply means you don't believe a deity exists! Agnostic are the ones that think "Hey there may be a God, but I doubt he's that into us praying and stuff, so whatever."
3. There is no atheist law... that's like saying the anarchy law is so-and-so. Atheism = No God = No religious law.
4. I've never heard of any such celebration of Ramadan... Any citations? Links? I might google it later.
5. And as far as that goes if such celebration DOES exist it's by definition not Islamic, as all Islamic laws on living life are to prevent harm to your body, health, and spirit. For example: We don't get tattoos because they damage your body, and we don't drink alcohol because it damages you mind, body, AND spirit. So yeah. There may be some strange sect out there that does twisted stuff in the name of Islam, but it's not apparent in any of the religious writings, laws, or books, so it's not part of the religion.
Quote from m20xr »
[snip] Also, I would suggest perhaps putting a large black cube of obsidian on your spawn to represent the Kabba. That way, the compass always will point towards the Kabba.
1. Thanks.
2. Yes, I have already planned on this. It's actually quite convinient, because I'm not just doing it because of the compasses but instead because the Spawn is the place on the minecraft world that best fits the definition of where we should be praying towards. Although (As I said before) I'll probably make it out of black cloth and not obsidian because it's more fitting, as the real Kaaba is not black stone but is instead covered by a black cloth.
Aha double post avoided!
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Hello? Eat my tarts? In this cosmic dance of bursting decadence, withheld permissions twist all our arms collectively. But if sweetness can win- and it can- then I'll still be here tomorrow to high five you yesterday my friend. Peace.
I DO believe in any God whose existence has been scientifically proved. So far, none has been introduced to me. I know that I'm making an assumption when I say things like "There is no God". I can't prove negation, now can I? That's why I take a passive role and prompt the believer to prove his holy message. If he fails to do that, then I choose to wait for further evidence and do not believe in the deity in the meantime. While waiting, I may get arrogantly sceptical and assume that there is no evidence and therefore no reason to believe. I'd be happy to be proven wrong, though.
I'd like someone to prove scientifically that Roman emperors existed.
Which is to say that there are certain questions where science is not so useful at finding answers, and historical eyewitness accounts become valuable. Now if we could prove scientifically that a Roman emperor could not exist, or if we tested all the documents telling of Roman emperors and found them to be fakes, that would be a good reason to doubt the existence of Roman emperors.
There exists a whole range of various accounts of different gods and their attributes and actions, both in history and in the present. Obviously many of these are completely contradictory. So we can say from a logical standpoint that some of them definitely have to be wrong. Many are not credible or consistent, or don't fit with observed reality. So the question then is whether there remain credible accounts of the existence of a deity with attributes fully consistent with everything we can discover about the world scientifically. But the next question is whether you would put more trust in science or in a written message from a deity, given that a deity should know more about the world than we can discover through science. After all, the question of whether science is the only or the best way to discover truth is not a scientific question but a philosophical one. That is, you can't prove scientifically that science is the only or the best way to prove things.
Anyhow, my point here is that waiting for someone to scientifically prove that God exists may not be the best approach to life, and it could be a bit arrogant or even dangerous to put your hope and trust in science as the final arbiter of truth.
Quote from Baleur »
Furthermore, due to the close link between atheism and science (after all, science has been in a ideological battle against religion since ancient times), one can assume that many atheists also follow scientific development closely in the search of "natural truth".
I don't think it's quite correct to state that there's been a science vs. religion debate since ancient times. So many important scientists in the 16th to the 19th century - founders of their fields even - held a belief in a Creator, and this helped rather than hindered their scientific work.
Here's a small sample:
Physics: Newton, Faraday, Maxwell, Kelvin
Chemistry: Boyle, Dalton, Ramsay
Biology: Ray, Linnaeus, Mendel, Pasteur, Virchow, Agassiz
Geology: Steno, Woodward, Brewster, Buckland, Cuvier
Astronomy: Copernicus, Galileo, Kepler, Herschel, Maunder
Mathematics: Pascal, Leibnitz
While we're off on the topic of atheism (or materialism), I like this C.S. Lewis quote:
If the solar system was brought about by an accidental collision, then the appearance of organic life on this planet was also an accident, and the whole evolution of Man was an accident too. If so, then all our thought processes are mere accidents—the accidental by-product of the movement of atoms. And this holds for the materialists and astronomers as well as for anyone else’s. But if their thoughts—i.e. of Materialism and Astronomy—are merely accidental by-products, why should we believe them to be true? I see no reason for believing that one accident should be able to give a correct account of all the other accidents.
Soloman212: sorry for being so far off the real topic of your thread. I hope you don't mind. If so, that's what the report button's for :biggrin.gif:
BTW, is the question of whether the teachings Islam agree with the discoveries of science something that matters to you or to Muslims in general?
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Thread Ninja. Call me ED.
Quote from Tali »
Sssssshepard, the Creepersssss are ~ASssssssssUMING DIRECT CONTROL
[snip]
Soloman212: sorry for being so far off the real topic of your thread. I hope you don't mind. If so, that's what the report button's for :biggrin.gif:
BTW, is the question of whether the teachings Islam agree with the discoveries of science something that matters to you or to Muslims in general?
1. I both agree with you fully and disagree a bit. I do agree that there are a lot of things science can't prove, but I disagree that we shouldn't rely on logic and science to show us truth. There may be things like gravity (MAGNETS. HOW DO THEY WORK?! ) that are unexplainable now, but my beliefs and religion do not in any way contradict science, which I love and study. Science just proves our religion even more!
2. I love that quote.
3. No it's right on topic.
4. It's funny that you ask that because I just brought it up in my first answer. Yes. It is. In fact one of the main things that proves the Quran is not human made to us Muslims is science. Here are some examples off the top of my head:
1. In the Surah (Chapter) about the prophet Sulaiman (my namesake!!!) (It's called Suraht Al Namal, which means the Chapter of the Ant) he is said to be going with his caravan at some point with his followers. And btw, he was able to communicate with animals as I said before. So while he was riding on horses, he heard screaming and yelling, and looked at the floor to see ants scurrying around. And in the chapter it says that one of the ants called out "Go back to the nest before Sulaiman crushes you!" But the interesting thing about this is that the Arabic word used for "crushes" is not just crushes in general but actually only applies to glass. Later on (several years ago) scientists discovered that an ant's exoskeleton is made of glass, or the same components of it. And that of course was not known at all during the time of the revelation of the Quran...
2. The word fig shows up in the Quran once, and the word olive seven times, and once again recently it has been found that eating a fig and seven olives in one sitting is extremely beneficial to your health as it produces a hormone that your body stops producing after your teenage years, giving you energy and strength.
3. The word night shows up 365 times in the Quran, as does day, which turns out to be how long it takes the Earth to revolve around the sun once.
There are many different interesting miracles as such in the Quran. In fact there is a podcast in which a professor goes over each Surah and it's miracles and deeper meanings, and each Surah takes up anywhere from 5 to 20 hours of talking. In fact the shortest Surah in the Quran (FOUR LINES!!!) took up a whopping 5 hours!!!
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Hello? Eat my tarts? In this cosmic dance of bursting decadence, withheld permissions twist all our arms collectively. But if sweetness can win- and it can- then I'll still be here tomorrow to high five you yesterday my friend. Peace.
[snip]
Soloman212: sorry for being so far off the real topic of your thread. I hope you don't mind. If so, that's what the report button's for :biggrin.gif:
BTW, is the question of whether the teachings Islam agree with the discoveries of science something that matters to you or to Muslims in general?
1. I both agree with you fully and disagree a bit. I do agree that there are a lot of things science can't prove, but I disagree that we shouldn't rely on logic and science to show us truth. There may be things like gravity (MAGNETS. HOW DO THEY WORK?! ) that are unexplainable now, but my beliefs and religion do not in any way contradict science, which I love and study. Science just proves our religion even more!
I'm not saying that we shouldn't rely on logic and science to show us truth. We can rely on them for much truth, we just need to keep in mind that they can't show us all truth (e.g. science doesn't help us discover moral laws). Also due to human limitations, what we thought was truth from science can turn out to be an error because of human fallibility. (Not that scientific truth changes, but our understanding of it does. Yeah, I'm an old-fashioned believer in objective truth and reality.)
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Thread Ninja. Call me ED.
Quote from Tali »
Sssssshepard, the Creepersssss are ~ASssssssssUMING DIRECT CONTROL
[supersnip]
...
There are many different interesting miracles as such in the Quran. In fact there is a podcast in which a professor goes over each Surah and it's miracles and deeper meanings, and each Surah takes up anywhere from 5 to 20 hours of talking. In fact the shortest Surah in the Quran (FOUR LINES!!!) took up a whopping 5 hours!!!
That is awesome! I love it when things like that happen =D
There are many things like that in the Bible too, which is cool [Of course, parts of the Quran are the same, or at least very similar, as the literature in the Bible, and vice versa.]
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Quote from Vincenzo »
Milk the cow. You get grenades.
Quote from pez »
I like how you were so nonchalant about enterting the blinking Minecart:
"As you can see, I just ****ing teleported. Moving on. . ."
OK I GOT DAH PICS OF MOSQUE!!! Here ya guys go!
Sunrise for maximum epic!
Nighttime shot
If I were to add anything else to it (I probably won't, excluding fixing mah dome if you guys still think it sucks.) it would probably just be another tower. Actually, I just remembered something... It doesn't have an upstairs for women! Oh well. Either way I'm probably gonna begin construction on another one, this time in my SSP, as the founder server this one is on is becoming a bit retarded... rather not go into details...
Nevertheless I shall begin construction of another mosque on my current SSP, and will also make and show you guys a Kaaba and maybe even make the Holy Mosque around it!
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Hello? Eat my tarts? In this cosmic dance of bursting decadence, withheld permissions twist all our arms collectively. But if sweetness can win- and it can- then I'll still be here tomorrow to high five you yesterday my friend. Peace.
Not to be rude to your religion but Minecraft is a game where people enjoy and escape reality. To be following the rules of not eating or touching the Pork I agree but to be praying in-game? Now thats just weird?!?! Leave the praying outside of the game because this is just a fantasy realm. Hope it didn't offend you in any ways.
BTW I'm a buddhist living in Malaysia and I clearly understand how Islam works :smile.gif:
First of all let me congratulate you (and the mods for that matter, too) how this thread appears to be less flamed than others and appears to have a rather good conversation or at least good mannered discussion going on. It is really needed in times such as ours where certain issues unfortunately need to be handled more delicately than they should need to be.
Before starting, I might offer you my point of view in the hope you might apologies any comments or suggestions which may considered unfortunate or even rude. They are not intended to so!
I consider myself agnostic (I would like to believe, but also want to see proof) and have been raised catholic (due to me heritage, likely the same as with everyone else I guess).
Please accept my apologies if the topic has been already discussed or actually solved. I am speaking of number 4 of prayer...the issue of heading towards Kabaa:
If I am not mistaken, someone managed to find out the directions (east-west/north-south) because of the need while building and handling railway tracks. Using railway tracks it is possible to determine the directions.
Now, the real challenge now I guess is where you put you (or your minecraft avatar for that matter) in the "world".
If you consider the virtual world of Minecraft to be where your computer is (which, scientifically would be correct I guess), then the directions in Minecraft and the location for your computer might give you the direction your prayer has to be.
If you do not consider the virtual world of Minecraft to be where your computer is, well...then I have some troubles to think of possible solution. If I am not mistaken, there was the option discussed of building Kabaa in Minecraft (maybe even at the spawn point, easier to get direction with compass) and go from there.
However, I guess this makes it harder to achieve (at least at the spawn point I'd say) if you are on a server which is not yours yourself.
One question toward your religion, if I may. It concerns number 5 of prayer:
So you are not (usually) allowed to pray without carpeting on natural ground? I mean, if you have carpeting, that is not an issue, but what if you have not...how strict is the situation or is this situation covered?
I am just asking again because of Minecraft where there is (not yet) carpeting involved (unless there is a mod or some sort of substitute).
I guess its easier for Christians then (at least the way I was raised), we just pray...
If all this was already discussed, sorry for bothering...I have missed it.
Yes, I must admit that I'm a lazy Atheist. Instead of studying all the hundreds of millions of Hindu deities, I just wait for someone to bring me proof. You see, it's not my task to prove that any religion is false. They're all false until proven otherwise. The same goes with any scientific theory. Until it's proven, it's just something funny and interesting to think about. For novelty purposes only, not something to build your whole life on. I love the truth far too much to believe in falseties, however nice and comforting they are.
I'm gonna be a big buzzkill to Mr. Atheist here for a moment. As a Christian, I don't need to prove me faith to you. If you choose to not believe in my faith then that is your issue. Not mine. So you're choosing to either not go around, acting like some cool atheist, who's better then most other christians and such, or you're going to prove your Atheism to us.
Atheism is a religion mind you. That is your religious view, therefore it is a religion, and if, as you say, I have to prove that My God is real, then as do you, have to prove that my God is not real. Your game ends because niether of us can prove either true or false. Niether of us can provide enough evident information in regards to either side to prove the other false, it's all dependent on your faith. How open minded or close minded you are.
In all respects to your opinion, that I do respect. If you'd rather (and I'm assuming you believe in evolution over creation because otherwise you'd believe in creation...makes sense?) believe that we evolved into human beings...from the ideal "monkey", then so be it. Then perhaps you'd be so kind as to explain why monkeys no longer evolve into humans? Thanks. I'll just go with the more reasonable of the 2, and believe that there is a holy and divine entity that did create everything that we know.
Soloman, is it OK if I post cathedral pics here or should I make a separate thread? Also, I had a suggestion about yearly timekeeping buried in my big wall of text post up there, don't know if you saw or liked it.
Go ahead. It's on topic and I'd love to see them. And yes I did see your other post (I might have replied... Can't remember).
As for the rest of you all, my replies are provbably gonna be longer than ten sentences, and I very much do not like typing on my iPhone keyboard for such a long amount, so I'll reply to you all when I get back from school. (this specific reply was relatively short so I did it now.)
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Hello? Eat my tarts? In this cosmic dance of bursting decadence, withheld permissions twist all our arms collectively. But if sweetness can win- and it can- then I'll still be here tomorrow to high five you yesterday my friend. Peace.
I especially lie how he created a library in the wings, likely for the monks and other literate members of whatever order used this particular cathedral.
BEFORE YOU READ: No, I don't actually think I have to follow the rules of Islam in games, I just do it for fun, and as a little extra element to the game. I do in fact enjoy it, and I don't believe it makes a difference in my faith. It's just a little extra roll playing I feel like doing.
Well firstly, I've been playing Minecraft for quite a while now, and I just now noticed I was subconsciously thinking this entire process out. You see, I'm a Muslim, and whenever I've played games, I've always for some reason followed the rules of Islam as best I could. This might be because I'm just wired to do so, or maybe it's because I want to see if it would somehow help me in the game, showing how good Islamic laws really are. As an example, when playing fallout 3, I never picked up pork and beans, nor did I drink alcohol or do drugs. Contrast that with my older brother, who walked around jacked up on mentats and whiskey...
So of course, a game like Minecraft gets really complex. The first thing I did when I got the game was avoid killing pigs at all costs. Here's the rules of Islam concerning them:
1. I can't eat pork (duh).
2. I can't give or sell pork to people (So I can't get rid of it that way...)
3. I can't throw away food in general (Hey! This adds another obstacle... )
So with these rules, what do I do with the stuff?! Well usually I just avoid killing pigs, and instead started wheat farms and fishing areas in all of my Saves. But what if they're stuck in my house, or if someone else does and I pick up the pork? In the latter case, I guess if I gave it back right away it would be like picking it up and handing it to them, and not like taking possession and then giving it to them, so I don't take part in the transaction. In the first example, however, (or if I stumble upon it laying on the floor...) I would be stuck with it! You may be thinking I would just have to make a giant chest room for pork, and you would be right. However, it wouldn't be there forever! There is still this rule:
4. I can eat pork if I need to in order to survive, and there is no other food.
Yay! This means that if I have missing health, and have no other food on hand, I can eat pork! So that (somewhat) solves that problem.
On to the next discussion: Prayer.
You may be thinking, "Ok this is going way to far," but I dunno, I just had to bring it up. Well here is the first tier of rules about prayer:
1. I have to pray 5 times a day. (Duh)
2. Prayer is based on the sun, not on time, so I have to divide the day and find the according times.
3. If I am traveling or ill, I am not obliged to pray. (Traveling = not within view of my home with render distance on far, ill = missing more than half my health, for my purposes)
4. I have to pray towards the Kaaba (I don't know where it is, if there is one in this dimension!!!)
5. I can pray on dirt, grass, sand, or anything natural, along with carpeting.
Well I guess prayer here would be to just make a small Duah, as I can't be bothered to carry out a full prayer (I'm not that crazy...) and I can do it anywhere, as the world of Minecraft is dirt and natural stuffs, although on a server I once played on I actually did make a Mosque with carpeting. However, if I am hurt or not near my house when the time of prayer is, I either do the shortened prayer or none at all, respectively. Now going to the concern of the location of the Kaaba... As I am assuming this is a completely different world I would guess there is no Kaaba. However, the Kaaba is the location of prayer not because the actual building has anything important, but because it is the center of the universe, and is the bride between heaven and Earth. With that logic, the place that best fits that definition would be the spawn. (It's where I appear: Heaven --> Earth, and if you go far in any direction the world begins to fall apart: It's the center of it.) This is actually really handy, due to the fact that the compasses point to it!!! :biggrin.gif: So all I have to do is make a compass, and viola! I know where to pray. But of course there is the question: What if I don't have the ability to make a compass at the time? Then of course I just pray any direction, just like in the real world. (Correct me if I'm wrong here.) Also, as suggested by people, I'll probably make a sort of room with a holed ceiling in order to accurately measure the times of prayer, and will also carry around a bit of colored cloth for a makeshift prayer rug when on the go.
On to the next discussion: Jihad.
I'll just add this quick section: Jihad is basically fighting for ones religion, wether it be in argument, or war, and I guess I am in a way constantly doing that. I am also fulfilling my duty of spreading the word of Islam, such as right now, or when I build mosques and whatnot on online servers. Also, due to the fact that creepers may possibly destroy some of the religious buildings I have, it is also my duty to protect such buildings. (Griefers too. )
On to the next discussion: Punishment of Law.
Everyone always talks about the strict punishments Islam has on laws, such as stoning to death -> . However, I am not entitle to do such things to people, as you actually have to be a judge or judiciary official to be able to carry out and hand out such punishments. However, with this logic, if I were to be made an Admin of a server, I would be entitled to punish griefers accordingly (Of course by the rules of the server, as stoning has no actual affect on minecraft...). Also, if they were destroying my property, and PvP was on, I would also be entitled to attack them. (See above topic).
So far that is all I actually considered. As for Ramadan and fasting: The Sun and Moon don't have phases and don't change position (Anti-respectively) so I have no way of calculating the time of year, and can therefore not fast on Ramadan nor celebrate Eid. (Correct me if I'm wrong here) And for pilgrimage, same thing. Although I guess it wouldn't hurt to go circle around the spawn every once and a while...
Note: Anything in blue is an opinion from me about Islam and not stated as a fact for everything.
Great post, definitely made me chuckle. Very interesting way of playing the game.
It is usually considered proper etiquette to "snip" longer quotes.
I actually don't mind this time because it seems that not a lot of people get around to fully reading the OP before replying...
Quote from ferrit »
[snip]
1. That's all nice and fine but (Like many other instances of evolution) don't you think that at each step of these apes becoming more and more human like and therefore better in every way, they would have killed off the weaker ones? That seems to happen in every other instance! We don't do it now because we are so much more superior than apes that we don't feel the need, but if at first there were all apes and some became more intelligent and such watnot, they would have been similar and still lived together, and knowing male apes (and humans for that matter) they probably would have beaten the other unevolved apes to death with a rock or something. Just saying. With other species that evolve the older versions usually die out... Like with alligators.
2. I am constantly arguing with atheists and Christians at my school and other settings, and I have yet to lose a single argument. As far as Christians go I succeed in both proving the bible wrong and the Quran to be right (as in I put down their disproofs) and with atheists I at least succeed in proving their anti-Islam arguments wrong. I have yet to find any rule in the Islamic law that I couldn't explain logically. It's not just like "Oh god told me so."
3. Pertaining to the above thing: Yes, if someone DID somehow prove any part of the Quran wrong I would seek out a better belief, or mode of interpretation. I don't say my religion is right because it's mine, it's my religion because I see it's right. Unlike with a lot of Christian kids nowadays I know a lot about my religion, and other religions for that matter. I've read most of the books of the bible, and have read translations of the tohra, while most Christians I know haven't even touched one before. So yes, I have researched other religions to make sure mine was best. With that thought in mind:
Quote from Diggeri »
Quote from Soloman212 »
So from this I can assume you've studied and are studying all the religions you here about to make sure they're false? Because if not than you arent exactly doing your job as a person who wants proof for religions.
Yes, I must admit that I'm a lazy Atheist. Instead of studying all the hundreds of millions of Hindu deities, I just wait for someone to bring me proof. You see, it's not my task to prove that any religion is false. They're all false until proven otherwise. The same goes with any scientific theory. Until it's proven, it's just something funny and interesting to think about. For novelty purposes only, not something to build your whole life on. I love the truth far too much to believe in falseties, however nice and comforting they are.
You don't have to study all the deities to know that Hinduism doesn't make sense... And it is your task to seek out the truth. Your logic is "If there is a God he will have someone show me the truth." But instead he gave you the means and the mental ability to seek out the truth, and it is your personal responsibility to make sure you are doing the right thing. And no, they're true until proven otherwise. That's like a judge condemning people to die unless they prove their innocence to him. And if it decides what you'll be doing the rest of your afterlife I think it IS something to live your life by. Besides Islam is in no way hindering my life experience. It's enhancing it. For example some people are like "Aw you can't drink alcohol? Sucks for you." But even if I could, I would hate to drink alcohol, after seeing what it does to people. Most people end up passed out covered in vomit/****, and that's not exactly my idea of a good party. There has never been a time where I regretted having to follow Muslim Laws. Also, if you want the religions to waltz right in front of your face here you go: Find one thing JUST ONE thing that proves Islam is wrong. (I mean the religion, not the people. Not every Muslim is a perfect Muslim.)
Quote from Diggeri »
Quote from Soloman212 »
3. The word night shows up 365 times in the Quran, as does day, which turns out to be how long it takes the Earth to revolve around the sun once.
Actually it takes 365 days and a quarter. Therefore I'd be really impressed if the word night showed up 365¼ times in the Quran. I'd say: "Gee, the writer really did know his Astronomy!" I'm having a project of reading the book and now I'm about halfway through. The project has taken some years already. I'm not reading it in Arabic, so that doesn't really count. Maybe that explains why I haven't been able to find any profound wisdom, only boasts and threats. Well, still lots of Surahs to go. I like to listen to Sufi ritual music, but I think the majority doesn't really accept them as proper Muslims. Nice music, though.
Umm it's the closest integer... please go ahead and write a book that has the word night 365 1/4 times. Even that close an approximation wasn't know to the people of that time. And yes, the book is a lot less amazing in Arabic. Do you know why? Because it was written by an imperfect human, while the original one in Arabic was written by God. So if you want the full effect of it (as I said before) there is this podcast where a professor describes the different miracles of the Quran in detail (in English!) and it gives a better impression of how truly amazing a work of literature and religion the Arabic Quran is.
And once again, back to topic.
Quote from ferrit »
Right back to the topic: Interesting challenge you've set yourself there Soloman, best of luck to you! While it's not quite the same I resist using InvEd and the like, the self-imposed limitations make the game not only more of a challenge but more fun. I suspect that everyone has their own little quirks and rules they follow in MineCraft, but to add more in deliberately is an interesting extension of the concept (plus provides a good reason for building stuff!).
If there was a mod to keep track of infringments would you (or anyone else doing something similar) use it or keep 'score' in your own head? Is it playing against the game or against yourself?
1. Thanks.
2. I also hate InvEd, but not as much as I hate BLASTED CUBOID!!! And yes it does.
4. Umm I don't mesure infringements, just like how I don't in real life. Of course because of that I don't bother doing it in my head, so if such a mod came up it would probably be interesting to try it just to check every once in a while if I'm doing as good as I thought I was. But as far as real life goes it's more about intentions and not results, for example if I gave a homeless beggar money and he used it to purchase a knife and kill a man, and I had no way of knowing he was a murderer or such, and my intentions were pure, then that counts as good as any donation. The same goes for if I eat a turkey sandwich but someone hides a chunk of bacon in it. That would count against them as it was their intentions to deceive me, but my intentions were to partake in a bacon-free sandvich so I am safe. OM NOM. Of course it is for this reason that you can't measure how well you are truly doing, as only God knows intentions, so only his judgement is just and fair. That's why no matter how good a Muslim you think you are, you always end every prayer with a small Duah asking God to accept your prayer even if you may have made mistakes, as you never know if you did something wrong and if you had the right intentions. But yes, of course that would be different in game.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Hello? Eat my tarts? In this cosmic dance of bursting decadence, withheld permissions twist all our arms collectively. But if sweetness can win- and it can- then I'll still be here tomorrow to high five you yesterday my friend. Peace.
No that's agnostic. Atheist means you don't believe any diety exists.
MOD EDIT: No double posting, user warned.
For instance, You worship the God of Death or so, and you get health whenever you kill a hostile mob, BUT you cannot go out in the daytime.
1. Sounds good! Abandonment...
2. Wait... What direction do I have to know to make killing cows easier?
3. Islamic prayer times (as I explained before) is not based on times but on the sun. Didn't you see the pics of the sun room I made? Also if there's a way to change the moving texture for the dial I might make it light up or something on the prayer times!!
I find this whole concept very interesting, as I am currently enrolled in a class about Islam. As the OP has proven, the western stereotype of every Muslim being a dangerous fundamentalist is by far an over exageration. I can't wait to see what you do next. Perhaps try and find a big desert and try and make a Bedouin settlement. Also, I would suggest perhaps putting a large black cube of obsidian on your spawn to represent the Kabba. That way, the compass always will point towards the Kabba.
Agnosticism (agnostisism?) is when you believe such a deity may exist somewhere (or someWHEN), but desire proof before proclaiming it as a fact.
One thing i do find interesting is how many atheists dont quite understand what the word atheist means before announcing it as "what they are".
Furthermore, due to the close link between atheism and science (after all, science has been in a ideological battle against religion since ancient times), one can assume that many atheists also follow scientific development closely in the search of "natural truth".
But, and this is what caused myself to swich towards agnosticism, science and the discoveries made lately isnt exactly conforming to the atheist comfort zone.. Which makes the entire atheism <3 science stance a bit of a paradox.
Quantum entanglement (which is proven in labs, without any mathematical or proper fleshed out theoretical explanation of how it is even remotely possible in our "real world"), sub-atomic particles popping in and out of existance, and the quantum theory which states (and to some extent proves) that a particle can be at several places at once before being observed, not to mention the force of gravity which still to this day is nothing but a theory unable to be solved, pretty much suggests that things arent as simple as we would like.
Or just look at a black hole, where time stands still, due to gravity being infinite.
The world isnt an orderly clockwork of perfectly predictable scientific and mathematical equasions.
I have no idea why im writing this in a minecraft thread, i guess im just bored.
If you noticed the note at the bottom, anything in blue is an opinion of Islam. We believe it's the center of the universe. Cuz that's how we roll.
1. Oh sorry my mistake. (Ipod autocorrect- MY IPOD IS ATHEIST!
2. No, that simply means you don't believe a deity exists! Agnostic are the ones that think "Hey there may be a God, but I doubt he's that into us praying and stuff, so whatever."
3. There is no atheist law... that's like saying the anarchy law is so-and-so. Atheism = No God = No religious law.
4. I've never heard of any such celebration of Ramadan... Any citations? Links? I might google it later.
5. And as far as that goes if such celebration DOES exist it's by definition not Islamic, as all Islamic laws on living life are to prevent harm to your body, health, and spirit. For example: We don't get tattoos because they damage your body, and we don't drink alcohol because it damages you mind, body, AND spirit. So yeah. There may be some strange sect out there that does twisted stuff in the name of Islam, but it's not apparent in any of the religious writings, laws, or books, so it's not part of the religion.
1. Thanks.
2. Yes, I have already planned on this. It's actually quite convinient, because I'm not just doing it because of the compasses but instead because the Spawn is the place on the minecraft world that best fits the definition of where we should be praying towards. Although (As I said before) I'll probably make it out of black cloth and not obsidian because it's more fitting, as the real Kaaba is not black stone but is instead covered by a black cloth.
Aha double post avoided!
Which is to say that there are certain questions where science is not so useful at finding answers, and historical eyewitness accounts become valuable. Now if we could prove scientifically that a Roman emperor could not exist, or if we tested all the documents telling of Roman emperors and found them to be fakes, that would be a good reason to doubt the existence of Roman emperors.
There exists a whole range of various accounts of different gods and their attributes and actions, both in history and in the present. Obviously many of these are completely contradictory. So we can say from a logical standpoint that some of them definitely have to be wrong. Many are not credible or consistent, or don't fit with observed reality. So the question then is whether there remain credible accounts of the existence of a deity with attributes fully consistent with everything we can discover about the world scientifically. But the next question is whether you would put more trust in science or in a written message from a deity, given that a deity should know more about the world than we can discover through science. After all, the question of whether science is the only or the best way to discover truth is not a scientific question but a philosophical one. That is, you can't prove scientifically that science is the only or the best way to prove things.
Anyhow, my point here is that waiting for someone to scientifically prove that God exists may not be the best approach to life, and it could be a bit arrogant or even dangerous to put your hope and trust in science as the final arbiter of truth.I don't think it's quite correct to state that there's been a science vs. religion debate since ancient times. So many important scientists in the 16th to the 19th century - founders of their fields even - held a belief in a Creator, and this helped rather than hindered their scientific work.
Here's a small sample:
Physics: Newton, Faraday, Maxwell, Kelvin
Chemistry: Boyle, Dalton, Ramsay
Biology: Ray, Linnaeus, Mendel, Pasteur, Virchow, Agassiz
Geology: Steno, Woodward, Brewster, Buckland, Cuvier
Astronomy: Copernicus, Galileo, Kepler, Herschel, Maunder
Mathematics: Pascal, Leibnitz
While we're off on the topic of atheism (or materialism), I like this C.S. Lewis quote:
Soloman212: sorry for being so far off the real topic of your thread. I hope you don't mind. If so, that's what the report button's for :biggrin.gif:
BTW, is the question of whether the teachings Islam agree with the discoveries of science something that matters to you or to Muslims in general?
1. I both agree with you fully and disagree a bit. I do agree that there are a lot of things science can't prove, but I disagree that we shouldn't rely on logic and science to show us truth. There may be things like gravity (MAGNETS. HOW DO THEY WORK?!
2. I love that quote.
3. No it's right on topic.
4. It's funny that you ask that because I just brought it up in my first answer. Yes. It is. In fact one of the main things that proves the Quran is not human made to us Muslims is science. Here are some examples off the top of my head:
1. In the Surah (Chapter) about the prophet Sulaiman (my namesake!!!) (It's called Suraht Al Namal, which means the Chapter of the Ant) he is said to be going with his caravan at some point with his followers. And btw, he was able to communicate with animals as I said before. So while he was riding on horses, he heard screaming and yelling, and looked at the floor to see ants scurrying around. And in the chapter it says that one of the ants called out "Go back to the nest before Sulaiman crushes you!" But the interesting thing about this is that the Arabic word used for "crushes" is not just crushes in general but actually only applies to glass. Later on (several years ago) scientists discovered that an ant's exoskeleton is made of glass, or the same components of it. And that of course was not known at all during the time of the revelation of the Quran...
There are many different interesting miracles as such in the Quran. In fact there is a podcast in which a professor goes over each Surah and it's miracles and deeper meanings, and each Surah takes up anywhere from 5 to 20 hours of talking. In fact the shortest Surah in the Quran (FOUR LINES!!!) took up a whopping 5 hours!!!2. The word fig shows up in the Quran once, and the word olive seven times, and once again recently it has been found that eating a fig and seven olives in one sitting is extremely beneficial to your health as it produces a hormone that your body stops producing after your teenage years, giving you energy and strength.
3. The word night shows up 365 times in the Quran, as does day, which turns out to be how long it takes the Earth to revolve around the sun once.
That is awesome! I love it when things like that happen =D
There are many things like that in the Bible too, which is cool
Sunrise for maximum epic!
Nighttime shot
If I were to add anything else to it (I probably won't, excluding fixing mah dome if you guys still think it sucks.) it would probably just be another tower. Actually, I just remembered something... It doesn't have an upstairs for women! Oh well. Either way I'm probably gonna begin construction on another one, this time in my SSP, as the founder server this one is on is becoming a bit retarded... rather not go into details...
Nevertheless I shall begin construction of another mosque on my current SSP, and will also make and show you guys a Kaaba and maybe even make the Holy Mosque around it!
BTW I'm a buddhist living in Malaysia and I clearly understand how Islam works :smile.gif:
First of all let me congratulate you (and the mods for that matter, too) how this thread appears to be less flamed than others and appears to have a rather good conversation or at least good mannered discussion going on. It is really needed in times such as ours where certain issues unfortunately need to be handled more delicately than they should need to be.
Before starting, I might offer you my point of view in the hope you might apologies any comments or suggestions which may considered unfortunate or even rude. They are not intended to so!
I consider myself agnostic (I would like to believe, but also want to see proof) and have been raised catholic (due to me heritage, likely the same as with everyone else I guess).
Please accept my apologies if the topic has been already discussed or actually solved. I am speaking of number 4 of prayer...the issue of heading towards Kabaa:
If I am not mistaken, someone managed to find out the directions (east-west/north-south) because of the need while building and handling railway tracks. Using railway tracks it is possible to determine the directions.
Now, the real challenge now I guess is where you put you (or your minecraft avatar for that matter) in the "world".
If you consider the virtual world of Minecraft to be where your computer is (which, scientifically would be correct I guess), then the directions in Minecraft and the location for your computer might give you the direction your prayer has to be.
If you do not consider the virtual world of Minecraft to be where your computer is, well...then I have some troubles to think of possible solution. If I am not mistaken, there was the option discussed of building Kabaa in Minecraft (maybe even at the spawn point, easier to get direction with compass) and go from there.
However, I guess this makes it harder to achieve (at least at the spawn point I'd say) if you are on a server which is not yours yourself.
One question toward your religion, if I may. It concerns number 5 of prayer:
So you are not (usually) allowed to pray without carpeting on natural ground? I mean, if you have carpeting, that is not an issue, but what if you have not...how strict is the situation or is this situation covered?
I am just asking again because of Minecraft where there is (not yet) carpeting involved (unless there is a mod or some sort of substitute).
I guess its easier for Christians then (at least the way I was raised), we just pray...
If all this was already discussed, sorry for bothering...I have missed it.
greetings
Rover
As far as everything else goes, it does put an interesting spin on the game...IslamCraft? Hmm. Might start a separate map and do that sometime.
I make Music
http://www.youtube.com/user/AudioLowOfficial
I'm gonna be a big buzzkill to Mr. Atheist here for a moment. As a Christian, I don't need to prove me faith to you. If you choose to not believe in my faith then that is your issue. Not mine. So you're choosing to either not go around, acting like some cool atheist, who's better then most other christians and such, or you're going to prove your Atheism to us.
Atheism is a religion mind you. That is your religious view, therefore it is a religion, and if, as you say, I have to prove that My God is real, then as do you, have to prove that my God is not real. Your game ends because niether of us can prove either true or false. Niether of us can provide enough evident information in regards to either side to prove the other false, it's all dependent on your faith. How open minded or close minded you are.
In all respects to your opinion, that I do respect. If you'd rather (and I'm assuming you believe in evolution over creation because otherwise you'd believe in creation...makes sense?) believe that we evolved into human beings...from the ideal "monkey", then so be it. Then perhaps you'd be so kind as to explain why monkeys no longer evolve into humans? Thanks. I'll just go with the more reasonable of the 2, and believe that there is a holy and divine entity that did create everything that we know.
I make Music
http://www.youtube.com/user/AudioLowOfficial
Go ahead. It's on topic and I'd love to see them. And yes I did see your other post (I might have replied... Can't remember).
As for the rest of you all, my replies are provbably gonna be longer than ten sentences, and I very much do not like typing on my iPhone keyboard for such a long amount, so I'll reply to you all when I get back from school. (this specific reply was relatively short so I did it now.)
And here is the forum thread.
http://www.minecraftforum.net/viewtopic.php?f=23&t=4307
I especially lie how he created a library in the wings, likely for the monks and other literate members of whatever order used this particular cathedral.
They asked me how well I understood theoretical physics. I told them I had a theoretical degree in physics. They said welcome aboard.
Great post, definitely made me chuckle. Very interesting way of playing the game.
It is usually considered proper etiquette to "snip" longer quotes.
They asked me how well I understood theoretical physics. I told them I had a theoretical degree in physics. They said welcome aboard.
I actually don't mind this time because it seems that not a lot of people get around to fully reading the OP before replying...
1. That's all nice and fine but (Like many other instances of evolution) don't you think that at each step of these apes becoming more and more human like and therefore better in every way, they would have killed off the weaker ones? That seems to happen in every other instance! We don't do it now because we are so much more superior than apes that we don't feel the need, but if at first there were all apes and some became more intelligent and such watnot, they would have been similar and still lived together, and knowing male apes (and humans for that matter) they probably would have beaten the other unevolved apes to death with a rock or something.
2. I am constantly arguing with atheists and Christians at my school and other settings, and I have yet to lose a single argument. As far as Christians go I succeed in both proving the bible wrong and the Quran to be right (as in I put down their disproofs) and with atheists I at least succeed in proving their anti-Islam arguments wrong. I have yet to find any rule in the Islamic law that I couldn't explain logically. It's not just like "Oh god told me so."
3. Pertaining to the above thing: Yes, if someone DID somehow prove any part of the Quran wrong I would seek out a better belief, or mode of interpretation. I don't say my religion is right because it's mine, it's my religion because I see it's right. Unlike with a lot of Christian kids nowadays I know a lot about my religion, and other religions for that matter. I've read most of the books of the bible, and have read translations of the tohra, while most Christians I know haven't even touched one before. So yes, I have researched other religions to make sure mine was best. With that thought in mind:
You don't have to study all the deities to know that Hinduism doesn't make sense... And it is your task to seek out the truth. Your logic is "If there is a God he will have someone show me the truth." But instead he gave you the means and the mental ability to seek out the truth, and it is your personal responsibility to make sure you are doing the right thing. And no, they're true until proven otherwise. That's like a judge condemning people to die unless they prove their innocence to him. And if it decides what you'll be doing the rest of your afterlife I think it IS something to live your life by. Besides Islam is in no way hindering my life experience. It's enhancing it. For example some people are like "Aw you can't drink alcohol? Sucks for you." But even if I could, I would hate to drink alcohol, after seeing what it does to people. Most people end up passed out covered in vomit/****, and that's not exactly my idea of a good party. There has never been a time where I regretted having to follow Muslim Laws. Also, if you want the religions to waltz right in front of your face here you go: Find one thing JUST ONE thing that proves Islam is wrong. (I mean the religion, not the people. Not every Muslim is a perfect Muslim.)
Umm it's the closest integer... please go ahead and write a book that has the word night 365 1/4 times. Even that close an approximation wasn't know to the people of that time. And yes, the book is a lot less amazing in Arabic. Do you know why? Because it was written by an imperfect human, while the original one in Arabic was written by God. So if you want the full effect of it (as I said before) there is this podcast where a professor describes the different miracles of the Quran in detail (in English!) and it gives a better impression of how truly amazing a work of literature and religion the Arabic Quran is.
And once again, back to topic.
1. Thanks.
2. I also hate InvEd, but not as much as I hate BLASTED CUBOID!!!
4. Umm I don't mesure infringements, just like how I don't in real life. Of course because of that I don't bother doing it in my head, so if such a mod came up it would probably be interesting to try it just to check every once in a while if I'm doing as good as I thought I was. But as far as real life goes it's more about intentions and not results, for example if I gave a homeless beggar money and he used it to purchase a knife and kill a man, and I had no way of knowing he was a murderer or such, and my intentions were pure, then that counts as good as any donation. The same goes for if I eat a turkey sandwich but someone hides a chunk of bacon in it. That would count against them as it was their intentions to deceive me, but my intentions were to partake in a bacon-free sandvich so I am safe. OM NOM. Of course it is for this reason that you can't measure how well you are truly doing, as only God knows intentions, so only his judgement is just and fair. That's why no matter how good a Muslim you think you are, you always end every prayer with a small Duah asking God to accept your prayer even if you may have made mistakes, as you never know if you did something wrong and if you had the right intentions. But yes, of course that would be different in game.