I personally think that there is no real way to grief in SMP, if someone takes the time to break people's stuff, then that is just a part of the game, and people should have built better defenses in more reclusive areas. If people start saying that you can grief in SMP then that draws a very fine line between genuine sieges, attacks, etc. and 'griefing'. What are your guys' thoughts on the matter?
I think its possible, but my definition has to do with attacking only ONE person over and over again.
Like, lets say someone joins the server, kills this guy, finds his spawn point and never stops killing him.
Everything else is fine by me.
Its called survival, right?
Doing something with the sole intent of pissing some one off is griefing. Everything els you have mentioned has a point, just being a **** and mindlessly destroying peoples structures does not have any real point.
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They can QQ me a river to go rafting on. It'll be awesome
- RStriker69
I think the main difference between griefing and honest PvP is the intent. If you flood a base to make it easier to plunder the loot inside, that's fine. If you flood a base to **** someone off, there's a big difference.
Of course, individual servers will have different policies. Some might define running around attacking everyone at random to be grief, others may not.
Griefing is possible, especially if spawn locations are static, spawn camping with full diamond armour and a diamond sword, and killing someone again and again at the spawn, or even not at the spawn, base camping, just keep killing them as they re-enter their base, that is griefing
Griefing is possible, especially if spawn locations are static, spawn camping with full diamond armour and a diamond sword, and killing someone again and again at the spawn, or even not at the spawn, base camping, just keep killing them as they re-enter their base, that is griefing
Then you stop playing their server, since clearly they are in charge if an admin isn't paying attention to the ~256 "Gov was killed by Greifomax4000 by a diamond sword" messages. There will be over a thousand servers, guaranteed. Before you build ****, explore the server and pay attention to the players, determining how friendly/fiendish they are. THEN you build your house.
GRIEFING ONLY WORKS WHEN THE TARGET IS TOO STUPID TO STOP PLAYING. Which is why they are greifing. You keep coming back for more. You want to stop the greifers? Then grab up your own armor and weapon and kill them with stealth and intelligent trickery. Get behind them and dump lava on their head. Wait for them to afk, and blow them up with TNT. Tell an admin to kick/ban their ass. It's not hard. Use the squishy gray thing between your ears.
I also question a greifers ability to find full diamond armor.
Um, I don't know if you guys agree, but if someone joins a server, makes a wooden pickaxe, mines your cobblestone wall away, walks into your base and steals everything from your chests that you worked hard to get. Would you not call that griefing? They have invested no time in the server, yet have everything they need to more than survive, but THRIVE.
They could just throw the stuff into lava and then just join another server to do it again, is THAT not griefing?
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Hello, this is a relatively boring signature, how about you look up at my post instead!
I personally think that there is no real way to grief in SMP, if someone takes the time to break people's stuff, then that is just a part of the game, and people should have built better defenses in more reclusive areas. If people start saying that you can grief in SMP then that draws a very fine line between genuine sieges, attacks, etc. and 'griefing'. What are your guys' thoughts on the matter?
I would say griefing is when someone randomly start picking at your house, and just randomly
removes stuff from houses etc.
If people build wood houses, I think the normal griefing would become pyromaniacs instead :tongue.gif:
Since it's simpler.
Quote from Sir Nomington »
My boy, I am disappointed in your lack of thinking this through. You will need to hire someone to guard you premises, hide your chest, make elaborate traps for intruders...
Or, some users on the server works as a "bank" where you can store stuff. Of course we need
trusted people to guard the bank. I'll leave that up to the server admins.
Griefing is possible, especially if spawn locations are static, spawn camping with full diamond armour and a diamond sword, and killing someone again and again at the spawn, or even not at the spawn, base camping, just keep killing them as they re-enter their base, that is griefing
Then you stop playing their server, since clearly they are in charge if an admin isn't paying attention to the ~256 "Gov was killed by Greifomax4000 by a diamond sword" messages. There will be over a thousand servers, guaranteed. Before you build ****, explore the server and pay attention to the players, determining how friendly/fiendish they are. THEN you build your house.
GRIEFING ONLY WORKS WHEN THE TARGET IS TOO STUPID TO STOP PLAYING. Which is why they are greifing. You keep coming back for more. You want to stop the greifers? Then grab up your own armor and weapon and kill them with stealth and intelligent trickery. Get behind them and dump lava on their head. Wait for them to afk, and blow them up with TNT. Tell an admin to kick/ban their ass. It's not hard. Use the squishy gray thing between your ears.
I also question a greifers ability to find full diamond armor.
Just fyi, I was not whining about griefers, I was merely stating that griefing exists in MC, whenever there is MP, there will be griefing, no exceptions, just because there was ways to deal with it doesn't mean its not griefing. And no matter what methods Notch tried to implement to prevent griefing, it. will. not. work.
At least not without severely restricting everyone else, which would suck.
Yes, I agree that griefing is always somehow possible within multiplayer interactions BUT: If MP turns out anything like classic creative, there will be many servers, each with their own... atmosphere on what is considered bad. Some will be epic deathmatches, and others will be villages where the only killing is the slaughtering of pigs.
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Hey, try Red Eclipse. It's a free online shooter. It's shweet.
This will be short, I will put my opinions on what I think "griefing" will be like in SMP.
1. What is griefing? I think it is defined GENERALLY by the community as someone that goes on a server NOT to have fun but to take away enjoyment of others, this is better said with examples.
a. YES this if griefing (imo) A player goes to a SMP server, he has no items, since he is new, however, he sees a glass protected farm, and knowing you cannot recover glass after breaking it he begins ruining the poor mans farm. NOW!!! I would not consider this griefing if the offending player kept playing, if he did the victim would perhaps kill the player, strengthen his defenses(cough*not have his farm out in the open*cough) and maybe seek constant revenge. But that is not the case here, the offender simple leaves, and the farmer now has noone to blame but the nearest player, causing more problems.
b. NO this is not griefing. I log unto a server, one of the very first servers and this server has no "rules" whatsoever. I go to said server with the intent of living out my minecraftian life as a bandit, hopefully form a band of merry men and live off the work of others. I personally don't see anything wrong with this as long as I and my bandits don't just log off because our bandit base tree houses were burned down by the local sheriff. If we kept playing and faced the consequences of being bandits, being looked down on, not being offered aid in case of a creeper swarm etc that would be fair play to me.
I know the definition of griefer stated above may not be accurate, and I guess everyone has their own definitions. I however believe griefing in SMP will be very different from griefing in creative for several reasons.
1. In creative everyone essentially is a demigod, the god being the host obviously. You can create and destroy blocks in virtually no time.
2. I think in survival griefing will be much harder, and take more time and work; you have to make tools, or steal them from someone, which I think will be much harder than just clicking a block and seeing it vanish, you have to wait a while especially if doing it with your bare hands.
3. The two very big ways to grief in previous versions were to flood the map with water or lava, obviously those won't work too well in SMP >.>
4. As stated by other people dozens of times, the players playing SMP will have bought the game and are probably looking for a good rep, and since they spent money that usually mean they are looking to have fun not just wreak havoc. Wheras in free versions of multiplayer I can do a "griefing session" in about 15 minutes: wake up, turn on my computer, go to minecraft.net, pick a random server, and grief to my hearts delight, then turn off my computer and go back to sleep.
Now, I think the non-griefing type of PvP action is a MUST, I really don't understand why some people say that SMP should be mostly co-op, unless notch makes the mobs incredibly intelligent and strong I know I MYSELF will be bored as hell. I already play on hard, and I think I'v died about 2 times, one of those times when my little cousin started being mean and covered my screen with his hand T_T while I was battling a skeleton. And if I play with other players, and all the mods don't want PvP action then it will be even easier to pick out all mobs from the safety of a tower, with 5 of my friends.
If you are running your own private server and you just want an SMP world where you can't touch a pixel on any other players head then that's your right.
tl;dr griefing will be harder in SMP, people have payer to play, they don't want a bad rep (most), and I don't think any griefing that does make it unto the servers will be very significant; oh no! you destroyed my glass window. If that happened I would be the stupid one for having a giant glass window low enough and unprotected enough for someone to do that. But if anyone just logs on to servers, damages something, however small, then logs off, then yea, that's a griefer, and I hope they die.
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Quote from cardgame »
Falling through a hole in the fabric of space/time isn't magic, just luck.
I personally think that there is no real way to grief in SMP, if someone takes the time to break people's stuff, then that is just a part of the game, and people should have built better defenses in more reclusive areas. If people start saying that you can grief in SMP then that draws a very fine line between genuine sieges, attacks, etc. and 'griefing'. What are your guys' thoughts on the matter?
What is griefing? Is it something you are not supposed to do? Then griefing will be defined on a server by server basis, and PVP, seiges, ect. may all be considered griefing on some servers.
Is griefing merely interfering with anothers work without their consent or working to reduce another's fun? Then a shload of activities is griefing.
Before we can answer the question of 'Is X griefing', we must figure out what is the essential essence of griefing.
Quote from CedricD »
Quote from Sir Nomington »
Oh dear lord...
-Stealing is not griefing
-Player versus Player is not griefing
-Killing players in general is not griefing
-Running around with buckets of lava and stacks of obsidian, using the lava to flood structures and obsidian to lock players in their fiery demise whilst shouting "I AM THE LIZARD QUEEN" is most definitely griefing.
This good sir wins this thread.
Griefing is only griefing if it's only purpose is to **** with people, killing players for your own gain isn't griefing, that's killing and stealing.
My happiness increases and I relieve stress by ****ing with people. Thus, actions that are merely for the purpose of ****ing with people are for my own gain, and thus not griefing according to your definition.
Quote from Invertin »
Quote from Asaeis Wi Vio »
Survival multiplayer isn't quite the same thing as creative; there can be no such thing as 'griefing' on survival. If there is, then you can combat between players on any other game 'griefing'.
There is a significant difference between PVP and griefing. PVP is killing other players for fun or supplies. Griefing is killing other players or destroying their buildings just to be a ****.
And for those who have fun being a ****?
If you can kill another person for any reason except retribution/justice, then it seems likely that any form of killing a person for any reason is not griefing.
Modedit: Merged posts. Double-posting and in this case triple-posting is a no.
Like, lets say someone joins the server, kills this guy, finds his spawn point and never stops killing him.
Everything else is fine by me.
Its called survival, right?
- RStriker69
Of course, individual servers will have different policies. Some might define running around attacking everyone at random to be grief, others may not.
such as burn trees/houses,cover plants with anything(so plants will not get the sunlight),etc......
it hurts both of human and natural
Then you stop playing their server, since clearly they are in charge if an admin isn't paying attention to the ~256 "Gov was killed by Greifomax4000 by a diamond sword" messages. There will be over a thousand servers, guaranteed. Before you build ****, explore the server and pay attention to the players, determining how friendly/fiendish they are. THEN you build your house.
GRIEFING ONLY WORKS WHEN THE TARGET IS TOO STUPID TO STOP PLAYING. Which is why they are greifing. You keep coming back for more. You want to stop the greifers? Then grab up your own armor and weapon and kill them with stealth and intelligent trickery. Get behind them and dump lava on their head. Wait for them to afk, and blow them up with TNT. Tell an admin to kick/ban their ass. It's not hard. Use the squishy gray thing between your ears.
I also question a greifers ability to find full diamond armor.
They could just throw the stuff into lava and then just join another server to do it again, is THAT not griefing?
I would say griefing is when someone randomly start picking at your house, and just randomly
removes stuff from houses etc.
If people build wood houses, I think the normal griefing would become pyromaniacs instead :tongue.gif:
Since it's simpler.
Or, some users on the server works as a "bank" where you can store stuff. Of course we need
trusted people to guard the bank. I'll leave that up to the server admins.
A upstanding citizen.
Just fyi, I was not whining about griefers, I was merely stating that griefing exists in MC, whenever there is MP, there will be griefing, no exceptions, just because there was ways to deal with it doesn't mean its not griefing. And no matter what methods Notch tried to implement to prevent griefing, it. will. not. work.
At least not without severely restricting everyone else, which would suck.
1. What is griefing? I think it is defined GENERALLY by the community as someone that goes on a server NOT to have fun but to take away enjoyment of others, this is better said with examples.
a. YES this if griefing (imo) A player goes to a SMP server, he has no items, since he is new, however, he sees a glass protected farm, and knowing you cannot recover glass after breaking it he begins ruining the poor mans farm. NOW!!! I would not consider this griefing if the offending player kept playing, if he did the victim would perhaps kill the player, strengthen his defenses(cough*not have his farm out in the open*cough) and maybe seek constant revenge. But that is not the case here, the offender simple leaves, and the farmer now has noone to blame but the nearest player, causing more problems.
b. NO this is not griefing. I log unto a server, one of the very first servers and this server has no "rules" whatsoever. I go to said server with the intent of living out my minecraftian life as a bandit, hopefully form a band of merry men and live off the work of others. I personally don't see anything wrong with this as long as I and my bandits don't just log off because our bandit base tree houses were burned down by the local sheriff. If we kept playing and faced the consequences of being bandits, being looked down on, not being offered aid in case of a creeper swarm etc that would be fair play to me.
I know the definition of griefer stated above may not be accurate, and I guess everyone has their own definitions. I however believe griefing in SMP will be very different from griefing in creative for several reasons.
1. In creative everyone essentially is a demigod, the god being the host obviously. You can create and destroy blocks in virtually no time.
2. I think in survival griefing will be much harder, and take more time and work; you have to make tools, or steal them from someone, which I think will be much harder than just clicking a block and seeing it vanish, you have to wait a while especially if doing it with your bare hands.
3. The two very big ways to grief in previous versions were to flood the map with water or lava, obviously those won't work too well in SMP >.>
4. As stated by other people dozens of times, the players playing SMP will have bought the game and are probably looking for a good rep, and since they spent money that usually mean they are looking to have fun not just wreak havoc. Wheras in free versions of multiplayer I can do a "griefing session" in about 15 minutes: wake up, turn on my computer, go to minecraft.net, pick a random server, and grief to my hearts delight, then turn off my computer and go back to sleep.
Now, I think the non-griefing type of PvP action is a MUST, I really don't understand why some people say that SMP should be mostly co-op, unless notch makes the mobs incredibly intelligent and strong I know I MYSELF will be bored as hell. I already play on hard, and I think I'v died about 2 times, one of those times when my little cousin started being mean and covered my screen with his hand T_T while I was battling a skeleton. And if I play with other players, and all the mods don't want PvP action then it will be even easier to pick out all mobs from the safety of a tower, with 5 of my friends.
If you are running your own private server and you just want an SMP world where you can't touch a pixel on any other players head then that's your right.
tl;dr griefing will be harder in SMP, people have payer to play, they don't want a bad rep (most), and I don't think any griefing that does make it unto the servers will be very significant; oh no! you destroyed my glass window. If that happened I would be the stupid one for having a giant glass window low enough and unprotected enough for someone to do that. But if anyone just logs on to servers, damages something, however small, then logs off, then yea, that's a griefer, and I hope they die.
What is griefing? Is it something you are not supposed to do? Then griefing will be defined on a server by server basis, and PVP, seiges, ect. may all be considered griefing on some servers.
Is griefing merely interfering with anothers work without their consent or working to reduce another's fun? Then a shload of activities is griefing.
Before we can answer the question of 'Is X griefing', we must figure out what is the essential essence of griefing.
My happiness increases and I relieve stress by ****ing with people. Thus, actions that are merely for the purpose of ****ing with people are for my own gain, and thus not griefing according to your definition.
And for those who have fun being a ****?
If you can kill another person for any reason except retribution/justice, then it seems likely that any form of killing a person for any reason is not griefing.
Modedit: Merged posts. Double-posting and in this case triple-posting is a no.
If they randomly come by and put random holes in your work, that is griefing.
If you are sitting there insulting them and stealing from them, that is not.