Minecraft is more than a game it is a life path. Minecraft is Zen meditation and teaches much about being in the present moment.
Minecraft is more than a game: Minecraft exist no more or less than the "real" world. In the "real" world something as seemingly solid as granite on an atomic level is nothing more than vast empty space and energy. Everything is, on an atomic level, the same vast empty space and energy. So in fact the minecraft is made of the same stuff as your home or heart or hand.
it is a life path.: Minecraft is a philosophical view or vision of the nature or purpose of life or of the way that life should be lived.
Minecraft is Zen meditation:
"Before enlightenment, chopping wood and carrying water. After enlightenment, chopping wood and carrying water." Hsin Hsin Ming
"At any given moment, I open my eyes and exist. And before that, during all eternity, what was there? Nothing." Ugo Betti
"If you cannot find the truth right where you are, where else do you expect to find it?" Dogen
"The whole moon and the entire sky are reflected in one dewdrop on the grass." Dogen
"Zen: Seeing into one's own nature." Hui-neng
"Zen is not some kind of excitement, but merely concentration on our usual everyday routine." Shunryu Suzuki
teaches much about being in the present moment.: “The secret of health for both mind and body is not to mourn for the past, not to worry about the future, or not to anticipate troubles, but to live in the present moment wisely and earnestly.” ~ Buddha
The present moment is the only moment we ever have. There is no past or future there is only now. If I am riding a bike or paying bills making love or mowing grass my mind must be both empty and absorbed in my current task.
teaches much about being in the present moment.: “The secret of health for both mind and body is not to mourn for the past, not to worry about the future, or not to anticipate troubles, but to live in the present moment wisely and earnestly.” ~ Buddha
I must play Minecraft differently than Buddha would. I'm constantly worrying about whether I have enough resources for something. I'm always planning for the future. Where I'm going to build things or whether or not doing something is going to pay off in the future.
I agree with MG. Minecraft is a game; nothing more, nothing less. That is not a bad thing... it's a good thing. There is nothing wrong with being a great game. Games have been entertaining people and helping them relax for centuries.
I agree with MG. Minecraft is a game; nothing more, nothing less. That is not a bad thing... it's a good thing. There is nothing wrong with being a great game. Games have been entertaining people and helping them relax for centuries.
Bear in mind, by the actual definition of game (I lost an argument on this once), a game is merely a recreational activity. A child playing with dolls constitutes a game by the definition. Even though you and I might quibble (I did) that a game has rules, structure, a winner/loser, etc).
So saying MC is a game is almost meaningless to the OP's point. it is a recreational activity. The point of zen comtemplation is to comtemplate on something. MC is something, and thus can be worthy of contemplation.
In which case, the OP has identified commonalities of MC to Zen philosopher's statements.
That doesn't mean MC is Zen. Merely that somebody doing Zen contemplation may find lessons and parallels to Zen teachings while playing MC.
That's not a bad thing.
Technically, MC can teach resource management and environmental conservation. If you kill all the animals, you won't be able to eat. If you burn down all the trees without replanting, you won't have any more wood.
If you mine up all the blocks, you won't have a pretty landscape.
Personally, I think it is cool that the OP has found some very specific parallels from Zen in MC. The Chopping and carrying water for example is almost too apt.
And given the MC360's story after killing the Ender Dragon, it very much carries a deeper examination of the nature of reality and these concepts. it was deliberately written by the game designers that way. Meaning, at least that part of the game was meant to be deeper than "just a game"
None of this means that everybody has to think this way, or come to the same conclusion. Merely that the opportunity to have these thoughts exists.
>Long, nice post.
>Immediately conflited by others.
Well done, forums. -w-
We are allowed to disagree on this forum as well. not everyone shares the same point of view on things. this wouldn't be much of a forum if everyone just agreed with one another.
I disagree that Minecraft is more than a game. In my views, it isn't some way of life. It's a piece of entertainment I use to enjoy myself from time to time. I see no philosophical meaning in Minecraft.
I disagree that Minecraft is more than a game. In my views, it isn't some way of life. It's a piece of entertainment I use to enjoy myself from time to time. I see no philosophical meaning in Minecraft.
ah, but is it also a reflection or abstraction of a way of life?
You may not use if for such, but perhaps the OP enjoys using it for other than its prescribed uses?
Given the story after beating the End Dragon, clearly the developers are hinting there is more meaning to be considered in the game.
I don't see that MC specifically has philosophical meaning.
I do see that one can derive philosophical insight from MC.
Bear in mind, by the actual definition of game (I lost an argument on this once), a game is merely a recreational activity. A child playing with dolls constitutes a game by the definition. Even though you and I might quibble (I did) that a game has rules, structure, a winner/loser, etc).
So saying MC is a game is almost meaningless to the OP's point. it is a recreational activity. The point of zen comtemplation is to comtemplate on something. MC is something, and thus can be worthy of contemplation.
In which case, the OP has identified commonalities of MC to Zen philosopher's statements.
That doesn't mean MC is Zen. Merely that somebody doing Zen contemplation may find lessons and parallels to Zen teachings while playing MC.
That's not a bad thing.
Technically, MC can teach resource management and environmental conservation. If you kill all the animals, you won't be able to eat. If you burn down all the trees without replanting, you won't have any more wood.
If you mine up all the blocks, you won't have a pretty landscape.
Personally, I think it is cool that the OP has found some very specific parallels from Zen in MC. The Chopping and carrying water for example is almost too apt.
And given the MC360's story after killing the Ender Dragon, it very much carries a deeper examination of the nature of reality and these concepts. it was deliberately written by the game designers that way. Meaning, at least that part of the game was meant to be deeper than "just a game"
None of this means that everybody has to think this way, or come to the same conclusion. Merely that the opportunity to have these thoughts exists.
I am not a zen philosopher, but I would be very surprised if games (recreational activities) didn't have an esteemed and honored place within formal zen philosophy. In many circles, people arbitrarily take the meaning of a statement "it's just a game" to be derogatory; but it isn't, IMO. Being "just a game" means that people should find enjoyment, satisfaction, entertainment, laughter, comradery, challenge, and relaxation all there. That MG enjoys this game has been perfectly evident on these forums for many months now. I hope it is evident too that I really also have enjoyed this game immensely. What MG said was that it was a game... nothing more and NOTHING LESS; and I think this statement encompasses an astounding philosophy (even though he denies it). Minecraft doesn't need to be touted as anything more than "just a game" to be zen worthy because it IS nothing less than a game... and games (regardless whether they have a bunch of rules or not) are important to our human wellbeing.
Maybe if notch were from A place where stuff like this is popular. Since he is a swede I doubt there is a deeper meaning besides a fun game. I dont understand what you mean by bring us back to the present is this not a game. minecraft can be relaxing though, like meditation, but that is as close to what your saying as its going to get, atleast in my eyes.
"Sometimes when they are deep in dreams, I want to tell them, they are building true worlds in reality. Sometimes I want to tell them of their importance to the universe. Sometimes, when they have not made a true connection in a while, I want to help them to speak the word they fear."
"The player is growing restless. I will tell the player a story. But not the truth. No. A story that contains the truth safely, in a cage of words. Not the naked truth that can burn over any distance." "Take a breath, now. Take another. Feel air in your lungs. Let your limbs return. Yes, move your fingers. Have a body again, under gravity, in air. Respawn in the long dream. There you are. Your body touching the universe again at every point, as though you were separate things. As though we were separate things."
Breathing
Zen breathing cannot be compared with any other. Very ancient it was named in sanskrit "Anapanasati", it can only be materialized through a correct posture. Its goal is above all to establish a slow strong and natural rythm, based on a soft, long and deep breathing out. Air is expelled slowly and silently through the nose, while the push created by the exhaling goes down greatly in the stomach. At the end of the exhalation, inhalation takes place naturally. The masters compare the zen breathing to the mooing of a cow or to the breathing out of a baby who cries as soon as he is born.
"Shush. Sometimes the player created a small, private world that was soft and warm and simple. Sometimes hard, and cold, and complicated. Sometimes it built a model of the universe in its head; flecks of energy, moving through vast empty spaces. Sometimes it called those flecks "electrons" and "protons".
The above quote refers to the reality that minecraft on a molecular level is no more or less real than the planet earth or waves of sunlight that warm it.
As someone who does practice Zen meditation as a way to stay out of depression, minecraft isn't Zen but at the same time it can be depending on how a person plays it. For example... If you play minecraft in any mode with some ambient music in the background then yes, it could be a form of Zen but not in any real pure form. Minecraft is a great game and it does so many things so well but lets not make it something it's clearly not.
The above quote refers to the reality that minecraft on a molecular level is no more or less real than the planet earth or waves of sunlight that warm it.
If you're really trying to narrow it down that much, then yes. Everything in the universe as far as we know is made up of the same stuff. Things that compose the human body also exist in stars, planets, etc. Everything is made of the same matter.
That doesn't mean Minecraft is real or that it shares some kind of philosophy with real life. Yes you do nothing but try to survive in both real life and Minecraft but that doesn't men their the same. One is a game, one isn't. My views on that will never change.
That doesn't mean Minecraft is real or that it shares some kind of philosophy with real life. Yes you do nothing but try to survive in both real life and Minecraft but that doesn't men their the same. One is a game, one isn't. My views on that will never change.
Don't be so sure of that. Everyone goes through many changes in life, including their beliefs, morals, interests, etc. The term "it's just a phase" can apply to every aspect of your life and how you choose to live it. Some phases may be short-lived, while others could last all the way up to your demise.
As for Minecraft being real, as in physically, it could be; though not in this universe. Here, it is merely emulation. I'm not 100% sold on the idea of a multiverse, but I do find more evidence every now and then that is swaying me in that direction. I do believe in higher dimensions, so I do believe in parallel universes to some extent, I'm just not sure of the magnitude. If the multiverse does exist, as defined, there is a universe out there where real life is identical to Minecraft. It does sound a bit crazy at first, until you realize how odd our own universe actually is in the first place.
There is no discussion to be had on this subject for me. It's a game. nothing more, nothing less.
If others see it as something else, that's good for them. To me, it's a collection of code someone made at a desk for my enjoyment. End of story.
then why are you here, continuing to discuss that which you say there is no discussion to be had?
How do you know that MC was only made for YOUR enjoyment. Is it not also likely that it was made for NOTCH's enjoyment, and then it became something more.
Once a person says a thing is more than just a thing, and uses it successfully for a new purpose, then it is not longer just the thing it was. Arguing otherwise is limiting your thinking.
then why are you here, continuing to discuss that which you say there is no discussion to be had?
How do you know that MC was only made for YOUR enjoyment. Is it not also likely that it was made for NOTCH's enjoyment, and then it became something more.
Once a person says a thing is more than just a thing, and uses it successfully for a new purpose, then it is not longer just the thing it was. Arguing otherwise is limiting your thinking.
I'm just sharing my view. Minecraft is a game. You took what I said literally. When I say Minecraft was created for my enjoyment, I'm speaking of myself as the consumer/fan. I'm not specifically saying Mojang created Minecraft solely for my enjoyment. They made a game for others to enjoy. I am one of those people. As a person who plays video games quite religiously, it was created for my enjoyment.
Video games are created to entertain. Nothing more, nothing less. I've already said that if someone finds more meaning in them than that, more power too them. To me, it's just a collection of code someone created to give me a few hours of distracting entertainment from real life. I'm disagreeing with Baldur that it's some form of philosophical parallel to real life. that's just my opinion.
It's a public forum and I can share my opinion. Please don't try to be little me because I think differently than you. I've said nothing degrading or derogatory about Baldurs views on Minecraft. All I've said is that I disagree and that to me it's just a collection of code created to entertain the masses, which includes me. I pick it up, I play it, I put it down. No deeper thought goes into it than that. It doesn't spark questions about my purpose in life or how the universe works. It doesn't make me question what's real and what isn't. It's just a game to me.
If I'm going to be talked down to because I share a different view of a video game, then I will gladly leave this thread and not return to it.
The above quote refers to the reality that minecraft on a molecular level is no more or less real than the planet earth or waves of sunlight that warm it.
The end poem is, in all probability, written in such a way that people of all sorts of differing philosophies can draw something from it if they choose to. I see elements of Cartesian dualism in it; and from what I've been reading about zen over the last day or so, dualism is a line of thought that would be somewhat anti-zen.
The end poem also states quite clearly that the player has been playing a game. The game itself runs the comment "It's a game" on the load screen. It also occasionally shows a random numbers generator ticking on the same screen now, reflecting perhaps a philosophy of "life's a gamble." Minecraft is also an artistic creation of the original writers of it, so that it reflects some elements of whatever the life philosophies are of those creators is inevitable. Minecraft is also a form a media and many pieces of media insert various bits and pieces of different philosophies in them. The power of certain forms of media to influence people is well known.
Like others have stated, I think it's great that some people derive special life messages from the game. I also think there is absolutely nothing wrong with thinking of it as "just a game." There should be no conflict here that I can see.
The end poem is, in all probability, written in such a way that people of all sorts of differing philosophies can draw something from it if they choose to. I see elements of Cartesian dualism in it; and from what I've been reading about zen over the last day or so, dualism is a line of thought that would be somewhat anti-zen.
The end poem also states quite clearly that the player has been playing a game. The game itself runs the comment "It's a game" on the load screen. It also occasionally shows a random numbers generator ticking on the same screen now, reflecting perhaps a philosophy of "life's a gamble." Minecraft is also an artistic creation of the original writers of it, so that it reflects some elements of whatever the life philosophies are of those creators is inevitable. Minecraft is also a form a media and many pieces of media insert various bits and pieces of different philosophies in them. The power of certain forms of media to influence people is well known.
Like others have stated, I think it's great that some people derive special life messages from the game. I also think there is absolutely nothing wrong with thinking of it as "just a game." There should be no conflict here that I can see.
The minecraft refering to itself as a game is no more definitive than jesus saying he will make you fishers of men. There is a truth in the story that can not be directly told.
The End scriptures also state"
"I will tell the player a story. But not the truth. No. A story that contains the truth safely, in a cage of words. Not the naked truth that can burn over any distance."
Minecraft is more than a game: Minecraft exist no more or less than the "real" world. In the "real" world something as seemingly solid as granite on an atomic level is nothing more than vast empty space and energy. Everything is, on an atomic level, the same vast empty space and energy. So in fact the minecraft is made of the same stuff as your home or heart or hand.
it is a life path.: Minecraft is a philosophical view or vision of the nature or purpose of life or of the way that life should be lived.
Minecraft is Zen meditation:
"Before enlightenment, chopping wood and carrying water. After enlightenment, chopping wood and carrying water." Hsin Hsin Ming
"At any given moment, I open my eyes and exist. And before that, during all eternity, what was there? Nothing." Ugo Betti
"If you cannot find the truth right where you are, where else do you expect to find it?" Dogen
"The whole moon and the entire sky are reflected in one dewdrop on the grass." Dogen
"Zen: Seeing into one's own nature." Hui-neng
"Zen is not some kind of excitement, but merely concentration on our usual everyday routine." Shunryu Suzuki
teaches much about being in the present moment.: “The secret of health for both mind and body is not to mourn for the past, not to worry about the future, or not to anticipate troubles, but to live in the present moment wisely and earnestly.” ~ Buddha
The present moment is the only moment we ever have. There is no past or future there is only now. If I am riding a bike or paying bills making love or mowing grass my mind must be both empty and absorbed in my current task.
I must play Minecraft differently than Buddha would. I'm constantly worrying about whether I have enough resources for something. I'm always planning for the future. Where I'm going to build things or whether or not doing something is going to pay off in the future.
Sorry Buddha.
>Immediately conflited by others.
Well done, forums. -w-
Stay fluffy~
I don't see the conflict, really. Games, just by being games, have a long-esteemed place within the meaning of life.
Bear in mind, by the actual definition of game (I lost an argument on this once), a game is merely a recreational activity. A child playing with dolls constitutes a game by the definition. Even though you and I might quibble (I did) that a game has rules, structure, a winner/loser, etc).
So saying MC is a game is almost meaningless to the OP's point. it is a recreational activity. The point of zen comtemplation is to comtemplate on something. MC is something, and thus can be worthy of contemplation.
In which case, the OP has identified commonalities of MC to Zen philosopher's statements.
That doesn't mean MC is Zen. Merely that somebody doing Zen contemplation may find lessons and parallels to Zen teachings while playing MC.
That's not a bad thing.
Technically, MC can teach resource management and environmental conservation. If you kill all the animals, you won't be able to eat. If you burn down all the trees without replanting, you won't have any more wood.
If you mine up all the blocks, you won't have a pretty landscape.
Personally, I think it is cool that the OP has found some very specific parallels from Zen in MC. The Chopping and carrying water for example is almost too apt.
And given the MC360's story after killing the Ender Dragon, it very much carries a deeper examination of the nature of reality and these concepts. it was deliberately written by the game designers that way. Meaning, at least that part of the game was meant to be deeper than "just a game"
None of this means that everybody has to think this way, or come to the same conclusion. Merely that the opportunity to have these thoughts exists.
it's not like Halo inspires this much philosophical thought.
http://roosterteeth.com/archive/?id=88
I disagree that Minecraft is more than a game. In my views, it isn't some way of life. It's a piece of entertainment I use to enjoy myself from time to time. I see no philosophical meaning in Minecraft.
ah, but is it also a reflection or abstraction of a way of life?
You may not use if for such, but perhaps the OP enjoys using it for other than its prescribed uses?
Given the story after beating the End Dragon, clearly the developers are hinting there is more meaning to be considered in the game.
I don't see that MC specifically has philosophical meaning.
I do see that one can derive philosophical insight from MC.
There's a difference in those 2 statements.
I am not a zen philosopher, but I would be very surprised if games (recreational activities) didn't have an esteemed and honored place within formal zen philosophy. In many circles, people arbitrarily take the meaning of a statement "it's just a game" to be derogatory; but it isn't, IMO. Being "just a game" means that people should find enjoyment, satisfaction, entertainment, laughter, comradery, challenge, and relaxation all there. That MG enjoys this game has been perfectly evident on these forums for many months now. I hope it is evident too that I really also have enjoyed this game immensely. What MG said was that it was a game... nothing more and NOTHING LESS; and I think this statement encompasses an astounding philosophy (even though he denies it). Minecraft doesn't need to be touted as anything more than "just a game" to be zen worthy because it IS nothing less than a game... and games (regardless whether they have a bunch of rules or not) are important to our human wellbeing.
If others see it as something else, that's good for them. To me, it's a collection of code someone made at a desk for my enjoyment. End of story.
http://www.minecraftwiki.net/wiki/End_Poem
"Sometimes when they are deep in dreams, I want to tell them, they are building true worlds in reality. Sometimes I want to tell them of their importance to the universe. Sometimes, when they have not made a true connection in a while, I want to help them to speak the word they fear."
"The player is growing restless.
I will tell the player a story.
But not the truth.
No. A story that contains the truth safely, in a cage of words. Not the naked truth that can burn over any distance."
"Take a breath, now. Take another. Feel air in your lungs. Let your limbs return. Yes, move your fingers. Have a body again, under gravity, in air. Respawn in the long dream. There you are. Your body touching the universe again at every point, as though you were separate things. As though we were separate things."
Breathing
Zen breathing cannot be compared with any other. Very ancient it was named in sanskrit "Anapanasati", it can only be materialized through a correct posture. Its goal is above all to establish a slow strong and natural rythm, based on a soft, long and deep breathing out. Air is expelled slowly and silently through the nose, while the push created by the exhaling goes down greatly in the stomach. At the end of the exhalation, inhalation takes place naturally. The masters compare the zen breathing to the mooing of a cow or to the breathing out of a baby who cries as soon as he is born.
note: breathing quoted from this page http://www.zen-deshimaru.com/en/zen/how-to-practice-zazen
"Shush. Sometimes the player created a small, private world that was soft and warm and simple. Sometimes hard, and cold, and complicated. Sometimes it built a model of the universe in its head; flecks of energy, moving through vast empty spaces. Sometimes it called those flecks "electrons" and "protons".
The above quote refers to the reality that minecraft on a molecular level is no more or less real than the planet earth or waves of sunlight that warm it.
That doesn't mean Minecraft is real or that it shares some kind of philosophy with real life. Yes you do nothing but try to survive in both real life and Minecraft but that doesn't men their the same. One is a game, one isn't. My views on that will never change.
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Retired StaffDon't be so sure of that. Everyone goes through many changes in life, including their beliefs, morals, interests, etc. The term "it's just a phase" can apply to every aspect of your life and how you choose to live it. Some phases may be short-lived, while others could last all the way up to your demise.
As for Minecraft being real, as in physically, it could be; though not in this universe. Here, it is merely emulation. I'm not 100% sold on the idea of a multiverse, but I do find more evidence every now and then that is swaying me in that direction. I do believe in higher dimensions, so I do believe in parallel universes to some extent, I'm just not sure of the magnitude. If the multiverse does exist, as defined, there is a universe out there where real life is identical to Minecraft. It does sound a bit crazy at first, until you realize how odd our own universe actually is in the first place.
then why are you here, continuing to discuss that which you say there is no discussion to be had?
How do you know that MC was only made for YOUR enjoyment. Is it not also likely that it was made for NOTCH's enjoyment, and then it became something more.
Once a person says a thing is more than just a thing, and uses it successfully for a new purpose, then it is not longer just the thing it was. Arguing otherwise is limiting your thinking.
Video games are created to entertain. Nothing more, nothing less. I've already said that if someone finds more meaning in them than that, more power too them. To me, it's just a collection of code someone created to give me a few hours of distracting entertainment from real life. I'm disagreeing with Baldur that it's some form of philosophical parallel to real life. that's just my opinion.
It's a public forum and I can share my opinion. Please don't try to be little me because I think differently than you. I've said nothing degrading or derogatory about Baldurs views on Minecraft. All I've said is that I disagree and that to me it's just a collection of code created to entertain the masses, which includes me. I pick it up, I play it, I put it down. No deeper thought goes into it than that. It doesn't spark questions about my purpose in life or how the universe works. It doesn't make me question what's real and what isn't. It's just a game to me.
If I'm going to be talked down to because I share a different view of a video game, then I will gladly leave this thread and not return to it.
The end poem is, in all probability, written in such a way that people of all sorts of differing philosophies can draw something from it if they choose to. I see elements of Cartesian dualism in it; and from what I've been reading about zen over the last day or so, dualism is a line of thought that would be somewhat anti-zen.
The end poem also states quite clearly that the player has been playing a game. The game itself runs the comment "It's a game" on the load screen. It also occasionally shows a random numbers generator ticking on the same screen now, reflecting perhaps a philosophy of "life's a gamble." Minecraft is also an artistic creation of the original writers of it, so that it reflects some elements of whatever the life philosophies are of those creators is inevitable. Minecraft is also a form a media and many pieces of media insert various bits and pieces of different philosophies in them. The power of certain forms of media to influence people is well known.
Like others have stated, I think it's great that some people derive special life messages from the game. I also think there is absolutely nothing wrong with thinking of it as "just a game." There should be no conflict here that I can see.
The minecraft refering to itself as a game is no more definitive than jesus saying he will make you fishers of men. There is a truth in the story that can not be directly told.
The End scriptures also state"
"I will tell the player a story.
But not the truth.
No. A story that contains the truth safely, in a cage of words. Not the naked truth that can burn over any distance."