I've been running an economy-based world for just under two months now, and I thought people here would be interested in hearing about this little socio-economic experiment.
As a 20 y.o. adult, with political and economic views that are rather liberal and left-leaning, I have a fairly good understanding of economics, and in this particular case the profit motive. One of the surprising things in this world, aside from how well it has been running, is how long is takes for players to fully grasp concepts such as profit-motive and individualism, which is actually fairly long, and how many of them find the profit motive unappealing.
By my guesstimation, about 80% of players, or 4 out of every 5 players, that enter the world beg for material, tools, and food when they first spawn in, instead of obtaining these things for themselves. The next thing that typically happens to these players is very interesting in terms of sociology; these players are then told that they must trade to get these items, find them in the donation shed, or acquire them by themselves.
At this point, the players now realize several very important things about this world: that there is a barrier to entry in this world, that there will be tension caused by competition for resources (and consequently land), and that there is an economic heirarchy (and they are at the very bottom as the newest players). Again, by my guesstimation, about 60% (of the original 80%) lose interest in the world and never return. Of the 12-14 players active in the world, over half of them joined in the early stages of the world, when there was much more resources and less competition. The world easily reaches the max player cap at night since March.
Another very interesting thing I find about this world is the effect, and sometimes lack of, that a bedrock bank vault with consistent security has. The bank vault was constructed in the second week of March. One of the most noticeable effects of the bank vault is the hoarding of resources, which is that economic system of the world is more akin to mercantilism than to capitalism. People only trade when it is necessary or convenient so as to avoid trade deficit, which affects their resources in the bank vault. Another effect, or more accurately the lack of effect, is that burglary and stealing are still common. This is mostly attributed to new players, but there are periods of time when there are no new players and these crimes still happen.
Is this on Xbox version? I might like to join if you have any room!
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Although my MCForum is SoarvivalistGizor, I usually go by SlabGizor117 or Slab. I made this account back when I was a fan more of Paulsoaresjr, rather then Etho.
Is this on Xbox version? I might like to join if you have any room!
Yes, this is on Xbox.
As for applying, we are currently discussing how to handle the issue of 12-14 players that all want to play on the same world, or at least together. Because of this, I am putting applications on hold.
Very interesting.
I don't think I would ask for tools unless I was in a town type place at spawn where I would be afraid to touch anything.
Your members must be efficient gatherers.
Did you take into account the dicks that probably just wanted to grief in the first place?
As for applying, we are currently discussing how to handle the issue of 12-14 players that all want to play on the same world, or at least together. Because of this, I am putting applications on hold.
Sounds like rentable servers would really help you out.
Bigger worlds, more players and more fun.
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I put my shirt on one leg at a time, just like everybody else.
Very interesting.
I don't think I would ask for tools unless I was in a town type place at spawn where I would be afraid to touch anything.
Your members must be efficient gatherers.
Did you take into account the dicks that probably just wanted to grief in the first place?
The spawn point is at a city by water, in the middle of the map. The truth is, there are barely any trees in the immediate area since the world has been running for a fairly long time.
As for griefing, PvP is turned off and TNT and firespread are turned off at request or at my discretion.
The spawn point is at a city by water, in the middle of the map. The truth is, there are barely any trees in the immediate area since the world has been running for a fairly long time.
As for griefing, PvP is turned off and TNT and firespread are turned off at request or at my discretion.
Oh
Why don't you plant saplings?
This seems like a very silly thing not to do.
It basically makes wood an infinite resource.
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I put my shirt on one leg at a time, just like everybody else.
Quite the interesting story, it allows me to have a slight grasp on how the psychological effect of your world as well as society. The current path your world seems to be taking is one of self destruction due to greed.
Quite the interesting story, it allows me to have a slight grasp on how the psychological effect of your world as well as society. The current path your world seems to be taking is one of self destruction due to greed.
This is the path earth is taking.
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I put my shirt on one leg at a time, just like everybody else.
Its funny you say you are left leaning since you are not running a communist or socialist server. In this case I would say you are more a libertarian style capitalism which is also my preference. Community supplies only work early on in a server before it becomes competetive. This was my experience as well. I added property rules as well where you needed to buy property by the 10x10 lots and could expand back from the street 10 blocks at a time for a price. This gave new players something to work towards. You could not move out of town until you purchased the 3rd lot upgrade.
Oh
Why don't you plant saplings?
This seems like a very silly thing not to do.
It basically makes wood an infinite resource.
Because I don't need, since I have a good amount of wood in supply. Also, there were some players that did try to replant the saplings, but other players over-harvested and did not replant the trees. Lumberjacks, who are responsible for both cutting down trees and planting saplings, are in short supply.
Quite the interesting story, it allows me to have a slight grasp on how the psychological effect of your world as well as society. The current path your world seems to be taking is one of self destruction due to greed.
Lol, I don't think it would be accurate to generalize the real world based on a minecraft world.
As for self-destruction and greed, I forgot to mention a very interesting story.
I was one of the first people to enter the nether. I decided that I wanted a monopoly on potions, and decided to harvest all the netherwart in the netherfortress. However, since this was at an early stage in the world, most people did not care for potions, nevermind netherwart. Some did complain, but did not feel too strongly about it. I eventually decided to replant the netherwart in the nether fort and in random patches of soulsand around the nether. Then, when players started to get into potions, they decided to build a public netherwart farm, which was steadily improved over time.
Surprisingly, there are many things the players do for the general welfare, such as donations in the donation shed, buildings parks, fountains, and even a parkour area. No one in the world has monopolies on any resources or services.
Its funny you say you are left leaning since you are not running a communist or socialist server. In this case I would say you are more a libertarian style capitalism which is also my preference. Community supplies only work early on in a server before it becomes competetive. This was my experience as well. I added property rules as well where you needed to buy property by the 10x10 lots and could expand back from the street 10 blocks at a time for a price. This gave new players something to work towards. You could not move out of town until you purchased the 3rd lot upgrade.
Lol, I am most certainly not a capitalist nor a libertarian. What I do for fun in a game doesn't necessarily reflect on what I think in real life.
You are quite correct about communistic and socialistic practices working on a fairly small scale, i.e. communes and Jewish kibbutz communities.
Lol, I don't think it would be accurate to generalize the real world based on a minecraft world.
As for self-destruction and greed, I forgot to mention a very interesting story.
I was one of the first people to enter the nether. I decided that I wanted a monopoly on potions, and decided to harvest all the netherwart in the netherfortress. However, since this was at an early stage in the world, most people did not care for potions, nevermind netherwart. Some did complain, but did not feel too strongly about it. I eventually decided to replant the netherwart in the nether fort and in random patches of soulsand around the nether. Then, when players started to get into potions, they decided to build a public netherwart farm, which was steadily improved over time.
Surprisingly, there are many things the players do for the general welfare, such as donations in the donation shed, buildings parks, fountains, and even a parkour area. No one in the world has monopolies on any resources or services.
It is nice to know that netherwart, a crucial item in potion making is general and not kept privately, because if only one person has it, they can raise the price to ridiculous amounts.
I had this dilemma. I think that your percents seem pretty accurate. Most people who join my world only stay for about 30 mins after they check out the whole world. They don't like the idea of jobs and economy and currency. My friends are bad at minecraft and blame everything on lag.
when ever i join a survival world my friends set up (even if they've had the world for months before i decided to join), i first learn the location of the "public" base, use a free bed to set spawn, grab some melon slices (if they have a ton, if not i just punch pigs/chickens/cows that are un-domesticated to get some food), then head to the closest forest, chop a few trees, make my own crafting table, a wooden pickaxe, then mine up cobble until my pick breaks, create a furnace, 2 stone picks, and between 4-8 pieces of charcoal. i then grab up my crafting table, and my furnace, find a nice hill, and set up a temp base so i can go out and start gathering iron/coal/diamond. Sure, they always say i can use any iron tools they have laying around but i always feel better gathering them myself.
Though, ironically, when they join a survival world i have set up, i ALWAYS give out a full set of iron armor, an iron sword, pick and shovel, not to mention have a few buildings already set up for them to move in. I never take no for an answer, because they are usually still loading in when i throw the stuff at their feet...
You are quite correct about communistic and socialistic practices working on a fairly small scale, i.e. communes and Jewish kibbutz communities.
Anarcho-Communist Minecraft worlds can actually work out very well if you have the right people. Minecraft is the perfect place for anarchy and Marxism to come together, because it has a chance to succeed. Communism on a large scale will never happen in the real world, particularly not when anarchy is involved. Humanity is not mature enough to handle it, an anarcho-Communist nation would be seen as weak and taken advantage of, probably even invaded at some point.
sorry for my delayed response, azantilon.. i've been paddling on the rio grande. so much bliss.
i have lived in about 4 communal situations.
i have a dear friend who lived in various communes in the 60-70s.
both of our experiences of commune failure was dishes.
i would, perhaps, cite your minecraft world. there are no dishes in minecraft.. but you do have logging with no replanting. people don't mind doing the work, but no one wants to clean up afterward.
good thread, thanks.
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As a 20 y.o. adult, with political and economic views that are rather liberal and left-leaning, I have a fairly good understanding of economics, and in this particular case the profit motive. One of the surprising things in this world, aside from how well it has been running, is how long is takes for players to fully grasp concepts such as profit-motive and individualism, which is actually fairly long, and how many of them find the profit motive unappealing.
By my guesstimation, about 80% of players, or 4 out of every 5 players, that enter the world beg for material, tools, and food when they first spawn in, instead of obtaining these things for themselves. The next thing that typically happens to these players is very interesting in terms of sociology; these players are then told that they must trade to get these items, find them in the donation shed, or acquire them by themselves.
At this point, the players now realize several very important things about this world: that there is a barrier to entry in this world, that there will be tension caused by competition for resources (and consequently land), and that there is an economic heirarchy (and they are at the very bottom as the newest players). Again, by my guesstimation, about 60% (of the original 80%) lose interest in the world and never return. Of the 12-14 players active in the world, over half of them joined in the early stages of the world, when there was much more resources and less competition. The world easily reaches the max player cap at night since March.
Although my MCForum is SoarvivalistGizor, I usually go by SlabGizor117 or Slab. I made this account back when I was a fan more of Paulsoaresjr, rather then Etho.
Yes, this is on Xbox.
As for applying, we are currently discussing how to handle the issue of 12-14 players that all want to play on the same world, or at least together. Because of this, I am putting applications on hold.
I don't think I would ask for tools unless I was in a town type place at spawn where I would be afraid to touch anything.
Your members must be efficient gatherers.
Did you take into account the dicks that probably just wanted to grief in the first place?
Sounds like rentable servers would really help you out.
Bigger worlds, more players and more fun.
The spawn point is at a city by water, in the middle of the map. The truth is, there are barely any trees in the immediate area since the world has been running for a fairly long time.
As for griefing, PvP is turned off and TNT and firespread are turned off at request or at my discretion.
Oh
Why don't you plant saplings?
This seems like a very silly thing not to do.
It basically makes wood an infinite resource.
This is the path earth is taking.
In the event of Earth being destroyed due to greed a section of humans will go to the stars in an attempt to gather more resources.
Because I don't need, since I have a good amount of wood in supply. Also, there were some players that did try to replant the saplings, but other players over-harvested and did not replant the trees. Lumberjacks, who are responsible for both cutting down trees and planting saplings, are in short supply.
Lol, I don't think it would be accurate to generalize the real world based on a minecraft world.
As for self-destruction and greed, I forgot to mention a very interesting story.
I was one of the first people to enter the nether. I decided that I wanted a monopoly on potions, and decided to harvest all the netherwart in the netherfortress. However, since this was at an early stage in the world, most people did not care for potions, nevermind netherwart. Some did complain, but did not feel too strongly about it. I eventually decided to replant the netherwart in the nether fort and in random patches of soulsand around the nether. Then, when players started to get into potions, they decided to build a public netherwart farm, which was steadily improved over time.
Surprisingly, there are many things the players do for the general welfare, such as donations in the donation shed, buildings parks, fountains, and even a parkour area. No one in the world has monopolies on any resources or services.
Lol, I am most certainly not a capitalist nor a libertarian. What I do for fun in a game doesn't necessarily reflect on what I think in real life.
You are quite correct about communistic and socialistic practices working on a fairly small scale, i.e. communes and Jewish kibbutz communities.
It is nice to know that netherwart, a crucial item in potion making is general and not kept privately, because if only one person has it, they can raise the price to ridiculous amounts.
largest cause of commune failure: dishes.
people don't mind going out and doing things, but no one really wants to clean up.
Though, ironically, when they join a survival world i have set up, i ALWAYS give out a full set of iron armor, an iron sword, pick and shovel, not to mention have a few buildings already set up for them to move in. I never take no for an answer, because they are usually still loading in when i throw the stuff at their feet...
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Retired StaffAnarcho-Communist Minecraft worlds can actually work out very well if you have the right people. Minecraft is the perfect place for anarchy and Marxism to come together, because it has a chance to succeed. Communism on a large scale will never happen in the real world, particularly not when anarchy is involved. Humanity is not mature enough to handle it, an anarcho-Communist nation would be seen as weak and taken advantage of, probably even invaded at some point.
i have lived in about 4 communal situations.
i have a dear friend who lived in various communes in the 60-70s.
both of our experiences of commune failure was dishes.
i would, perhaps, cite your minecraft world. there are no dishes in minecraft.. but you do have logging with no replanting. people don't mind doing the work, but no one wants to clean up afterward.
good thread, thanks.