I'm tired of seeing the thread "Will new structures come up in my current seed?!?!11?"
The answer is no. When you create a new world right now I can guarantee you it'll say "Preparing chunks" on one of the loading bars.
What this means is that it's generating the structures on your seed. This structure code algorithm or whatever does NOT have strongholds, ravines, biomes, rivers, etc. programmed into it. So therefore, any world created right now, even if you make it, spawn, save, and close the world, it'll have the same structures as it would if you explored it now, or when 1.8.2 comes out.
So no, not exploring chunks will not give you new structures because whether or not you explored it, it's already been loaded to create your world.
Great way to really kick off your reputation on this forum. Pretty soon you'll be hated even more than me.
I'm not concerned about what people I don't know think of me on a forum. <3
If you play with me, (when I'm not tired), you know I'm a nice guy, and thats all that matters.
I'm not concerned about what people I don't know think of me on a forum. <3
Then there isn't really a reason for you to be here, no offense. If this thread was worded a bit differently, it wouldn't be a problem. Just try not to be an assh*le about it.
I've been known to get a bit out of line too, arguing with people through posts or pm, and I tend to be a sarcastic **** at times. But starting a whole new thread over it is just asking for trouble. You seem like a smart kid with things to contribute to the community. Just try to avoid threads like this that are only bound to invoke negative reactions.
P.S. ADTR's vocalists deserve a better band. (That's right, I went there. )
I'm not concerned about what people I don't know think of me on a forum. <3
If you play with me, (when I'm not tired), you know I'm a nice guy, and thats all that matters.
hmmmmm an [profanity="asshole"] AND arrogant... lol jk
but seriously though congrats on reducing the overall number of posts you're going to see on this topic (you didn't) by adding to the number of posts you're going to see on this topic.
For future reference, there will always be uninformed people that just dont look hard enough before making a new post on here about some extremely overdone topic and you making another post on said topic will never fix the problem, so much as just add to it.
I'm tired of seeing the thread "Will new structures come up in my current seed?!?!11?"
The answer is no. When you create a new world right now I can guarantee you it'll say "Preparing chunks" on one of the loading bars.
What this means is that it's generating the structures on your seed. This structure code algorithm or whatever does NOT have strongholds, ravines, biomes, rivers, etc. programmed into it. So therefore, any world created right now, even if you make it, spawn, save, and close the world, it'll have the same structures as it would if you explored it now, or when 1.8.2 comes out.
So no, not exploring chunks will not give you new structures because whether or not you explored it, it's already been loaded to create your world.
Deal with it
Interesting, except that since the Xbox 360 Edition is still following the PC, that means you might and can find structures from 1.8.2 on pre 1.8.2 worlds.
On the PC, when you made a world on 1.7.3, it said "preparing chunks" while the world loaded. Then, when 1.8 came out, unexplored areas of your world got 1.8 things like Ravines, Abandoned Mine Shafts, etc, etc. More evidence to this is the Clay Fix patch that came out for the Xbox 360 Edition.
Previously, Clay only spawned in places where the X and Z coordinates were the same. However, if you had unexplored area in your world, you could find clay there after the bug fix. That means the terrain code changing affected the current world. adding something new to it.
Also, I'd like proof of this statement...
So no, not exploring chunks will not give you new structures because whether or not you explored it, it's already been loaded to create your world.
I'm tired of seeing the thread "Will new structures come up in my current seed?!?!11?"
The answer is no. When you create a new world right now I can guarantee you it'll say "Preparing chunks" on one of the loading bars.
What this means is that it's generating the structures on your seed. This structure code algorithm or whatever does NOT have strongholds, ravines, biomes, rivers, etc. programmed into it. So therefore, any world created right now, even if you make it, spawn, save, and close the world, it'll have the same structures as it would if you explored it now, or when 1.8.2 comes out.
So no, not exploring chunks will not give you new structures because whether or not you explored it, it's already been loaded to create your world.
Deal with it
I don't get this algorithim crap. Can someone explain it to me IN SIMPLE WORDS!
I'm tired of seeing the thread "Will new structures come up in my current seed?!?!11?"
The answer is no. When you create a new world right now I can guarantee you it'll say "Preparing chunks" on one of the loading bars.
Deal with it.
Yes, it says preparing chunks - How many chunks are being prepared? When you spawn in a new world and don''t move a lick, the chunks for a certain distance all around you are calculated using the algorithm (a.k.a. mathematical formulae) in the system at the time (i.e. right now 1.7.3). If you save and then exit right then and look in your XBox storage under Minecraft, you will find that world file and see that it's size is in the order of 4 to 7 MB. Now, re-enter that world and walk a distance away from the spawn without mining or moving any blocks, don't chop down any trees, just walk. Walk back to your spawn point and then save again. Guess what? The "preparing chunks message comes on again and, probably, depending on how far you walked, the save process takes longer than it did the first time. This is because MORE chunks have been generated and MORE chunks need to be prepared before the save can take place. NOW, go back into your XBox storage and see. The world save file will have increased significantly in size... if you walk every chunk in the overworld, the file will grow to be about 17 to 18 MB... and you didn't build a thing. That's because all those chunks were generated as you walked through those areas.
Your own evidence supports my arguments, not yours. Deal with it.
Yes, it says preparing chunks - How many chunks are being prepared? When you spawn in a new world and don''t move a lick, the chunks for a certain distance all around you are calculated using the algorithm (a.k.a. mathematical formulae) in the system at the time (i.e. right now 1.7.3). If you save and then exit right then and look in your XBox storage under Minecraft, you will find that world file and see that it's size is in the order of 4 to 7 MB. Now, re-enter that world and walk a distance away from the spawn without mining or moving any blocks, don't chop down any trees, just walk. Walk back to your spawn point and then save again. Guess what? The "preparing chunks message comes on again and, probably, depending on how far you walked, the save process takes longer than it did the first time. This is because MORE chunks have been generated and MORE chunks need to be prepared before the save can take place. NOW, go back into your XBox storage and see. The world save file will have increased significantly in size... if you walk every chunk in the overworld, the file will grow to be about 17 to 18 MB... and you didn't build a thing. That's because all those chunks were generated as you walked through those areas.
Your own evidence supports my arguments, not yours. Deal with it.
it is your map that is growing in size not the seed. When it generates the chunks its not just the stones ores buildings etc its also the mobs. When the sun rises and the sun sets chunks are generated, its the mob spawn/despawning, plants growing, I assume that changes the size.
I don't get this algorithim crap. Can someone explain it to me IN SIMPLE WORDS!
The algorithms are a series of mathematical calculcations that the program uses to do it's stuff - generate terrain, weather, mobs, etc. The variables in these formulae are provided by your world seed; that is, the system uses a formula to convert the string of your seed into meaningful numbers to put into it's calculations. The seed is set at world creation - either you type it in or it is randomly chosen; but it stays the same for that world save file forever. What causes the confusion over terrain generation is speculation over the point(s) in time when the system actually plugs the seed into the formulae to produce the terrain chunks. The OP is saying it all occurs at the start and I'm saying it occurs the first time you explore a chunk of the world. Once the system plugs the seed into the terrain generation formula for that chunk, it's done. The system doesn't do the calculation for that chunk ever again. However, it still needs to "prepare chunks" for saving over the old chunk info in your file - since you may have built something or moved something in those areas. The "preparing chunks" message comes up with every save in which changes need to be made to the saved file - and that's every time. The message, however, does not say how many of the total of the chunks are being prepared each time... and there's the rub.
it is your map that is growing in size not the seed. When it generates the chunks its not just the stones ores buildings etc its also the mobs. When the sun rises and the sun sets chunks are generated, its the mob spawn/despawning, plants growing, I assume that changes the size.
The seed is just the number string - If your seed is "404" then it stays 3-digits long, period. If your seed is -6351566112809576; that's what it is. It's just the number string the system uses as a variable in all the other formulas it uses to generate everything in the game from terrain to weather to mobs. How much time do you think the system needs to save 3 or 11 digits?
ETA: Sorry, I had to run off quickly. The seed digits are saved in the file along with all generated chunks. The reason the file size is only 4 to 7 MB and not 17 to 18 MB to start with is because the terrain in only some of the chunks is being calculated and generated when the world is first created. The reason walking increased the file size so much is because the additional chunks are being calculated and generated as you explore them the first time. The first time you explore a chunk is the first opportunity anyone has to change parts of that chunk so the system doesn't run the formula until you start to explore. This saves it time and keeps the memory demands on the system smaller initially. After an area has been explored, the system continually saves the change information over top of the initial terrain information for that chunk. It doesn't add a grown tree onto that chunk, it replaces existing air blocks with wood blocks. When you mine a block, you're replacing a solid block with an air block. The total number of blocks within a chunk remains the same. (It's always 16 x 16 x 128 or 32,768 blocks). Proof - I've mined huges areas and built many things in my main world and my file is STILL 17 to 18 MB in size. Mobs spawning don't increase the file size... because (up to 1.7.3) they also despawn. When they spawn, they replace air blocks. When they despawn, air blocks replace them.
UpUp - good explanation, just one error. I believe mobs are treated as entities by the system and not as blocks.
Thanks for pointing that out. I am still tussling with understanding how the system might be saving entities and items (e.g. within chests) and the redstone circuitry differently than the blocks themselves. For example, while basic mining and building doesn't increase the file size appreciably; using a lot of redstone seems to. So there is something different there - just not sure what.
Thanks for pointing that out. I am still tussling with understanding how the system might be saving entities and items (e.g. within chests) and the redstone circuitry differently than the blocks themselves. For example, while basic mining and building doesn't increase the file size appreciably; using a lot of redstone seems to. So there is something different there - just not sure what.
I think that's a discussion worth having, but probably not for this thread. My own suspicions lie in the direction of the conversion from block to entities and back to blocks (think about redstone; 1 block can become between 1 and 4 entities, each of which can then be converted back into 1 block). I also have suspicions regarding how this interacts with the use of the duping glitch and/or generators, both of which have the ability to add a block that did not previously exist in the world through the conversion-to-entity process.
The world is not fully generated at the start. Unless 4J Studios does something different from the PC version, or even from what they have already done in the past(like clay spawning in older worlds), we will be able to get new terrain features in ungenerated areas.
The world is not fully generated at the start. Unless 4J Studios does something different from the PC version, or even from what they have already done in the past(like clay spawning in older worlds), we will be able to get new terrain features in ungenerated areas.
Interesting.
When the clay fiasco started before the last update I had some unexplored area on my map. After the update, I went to the unexplored areas and finally found clay.
Did the clay show up after the update OR was the clay already there, but I just didn't know it? I don't know.
But I do know that we don't really know. What we can do is create a new world now, and then close it and just hang on to it. After the update, go explore it.
* Then we'll know for sure if the new features show up in unexplored areas of old worlds OR if you have to start a new one for them to show up.
* Then we'll know for sure if the whole map is generated at once OR if it's generated as we explore it.
I don't know who's right, and I'm not sure of anybody's claims.
I just know it's real simple to test it out for myself and then I'll know once and for all.
The answer is no. When you create a new world right now I can guarantee you it'll say "Preparing chunks" on one of the loading bars.
What this means is that it's generating the structures on your seed. This structure code algorithm or whatever does NOT have strongholds, ravines, biomes, rivers, etc. programmed into it. So therefore, any world created right now, even if you make it, spawn, save, and close the world, it'll have the same structures as it would if you explored it now, or when 1.8.2 comes out.
So no, not exploring chunks will not give you new structures because whether or not you explored it, it's already been loaded to create your world.
Deal with it
But this has been said before. There should be an official thread for this. Oh wait...
When I'm tired, I go to sleep.
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Retired StaffGreat way to really kick off your reputation on this forum. Pretty soon you'll be hated even more than me.
I'm not concerned about what people I don't know think of me on a forum. <3
If you play with me, (when I'm not tired), you know I'm a nice guy, and thats all that matters.
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Retired StaffThen there isn't really a reason for you to be here, no offense. If this thread was worded a bit differently, it wouldn't be a problem. Just try not to be an assh*le about it.
I've been known to get a bit out of line too, arguing with people through posts or pm, and I tend to be a sarcastic **** at times. But starting a whole new thread over it is just asking for trouble. You seem like a smart kid with things to contribute to the community. Just try to avoid threads like this that are only bound to invoke negative reactions.
P.S. ADTR's vocalists deserve a better band. (That's right, I went there.
hmmmmm an [profanity="asshole"] AND arrogant... lol jk
but seriously though congrats on reducing the overall number of posts you're going to see on this topic (you didn't) by adding to the number of posts you're going to see on this topic.
For future reference, there will always be uninformed people that just dont look hard enough before making a new post on here about some extremely overdone topic and you making another post on said topic will never fix the problem, so much as just add to it.
Gonna have to disagree, i wouldn't change a thing about that band, they're great how they are
On the PC, when you made a world on 1.7.3, it said "preparing chunks" while the world loaded. Then, when 1.8 came out, unexplored areas of your world got 1.8 things like Ravines, Abandoned Mine Shafts, etc, etc. More evidence to this is the Clay Fix patch that came out for the Xbox 360 Edition.
Previously, Clay only spawned in places where the X and Z coordinates were the same. However, if you had unexplored area in your world, you could find clay there after the bug fix. That means the terrain code changing affected the current world. adding something new to it.
Also, I'd like proof of this statement...
Needs more dragons?
Yes, it says preparing chunks - How many chunks are being prepared? When you spawn in a new world and don''t move a lick, the chunks for a certain distance all around you are calculated using the algorithm (a.k.a. mathematical formulae) in the system at the time (i.e. right now 1.7.3). If you save and then exit right then and look in your XBox storage under Minecraft, you will find that world file and see that it's size is in the order of 4 to 7 MB. Now, re-enter that world and walk a distance away from the spawn without mining or moving any blocks, don't chop down any trees, just walk. Walk back to your spawn point and then save again. Guess what? The "preparing chunks message comes on again and, probably, depending on how far you walked, the save process takes longer than it did the first time. This is because MORE chunks have been generated and MORE chunks need to be prepared before the save can take place. NOW, go back into your XBox storage and see. The world save file will have increased significantly in size... if you walk every chunk in the overworld, the file will grow to be about 17 to 18 MB... and you didn't build a thing. That's because all those chunks were generated as you walked through those areas.
Your own evidence supports my arguments, not yours. Deal with it.
it is your map that is growing in size not the seed. When it generates the chunks its not just the stones ores buildings etc its also the mobs. When the sun rises and the sun sets chunks are generated, its the mob spawn/despawning, plants growing, I assume that changes the size.
The algorithms are a series of mathematical calculcations that the program uses to do it's stuff - generate terrain, weather, mobs, etc. The variables in these formulae are provided by your world seed; that is, the system uses a formula to convert the string of your seed into meaningful numbers to put into it's calculations. The seed is set at world creation - either you type it in or it is randomly chosen; but it stays the same for that world save file forever. What causes the confusion over terrain generation is speculation over the point(s) in time when the system actually plugs the seed into the formulae to produce the terrain chunks. The OP is saying it all occurs at the start and I'm saying it occurs the first time you explore a chunk of the world. Once the system plugs the seed into the terrain generation formula for that chunk, it's done. The system doesn't do the calculation for that chunk ever again. However, it still needs to "prepare chunks" for saving over the old chunk info in your file - since you may have built something or moved something in those areas. The "preparing chunks" message comes up with every save in which changes need to be made to the saved file - and that's every time. The message, however, does not say how many of the total of the chunks are being prepared each time... and there's the rub.
The seed is just the number string - If your seed is "404" then it stays 3-digits long, period. If your seed is -6351566112809576; that's what it is. It's just the number string the system uses as a variable in all the other formulas it uses to generate everything in the game from terrain to weather to mobs. How much time do you think the system needs to save 3 or 11 digits?
ETA: Sorry, I had to run off quickly. The seed digits are saved in the file along with all generated chunks. The reason the file size is only 4 to 7 MB and not 17 to 18 MB to start with is because the terrain in only some of the chunks is being calculated and generated when the world is first created. The reason walking increased the file size so much is because the additional chunks are being calculated and generated as you explore them the first time. The first time you explore a chunk is the first opportunity anyone has to change parts of that chunk so the system doesn't run the formula until you start to explore. This saves it time and keeps the memory demands on the system smaller initially. After an area has been explored, the system continually saves the change information over top of the initial terrain information for that chunk. It doesn't add a grown tree onto that chunk, it replaces existing air blocks with wood blocks. When you mine a block, you're replacing a solid block with an air block. The total number of blocks within a chunk remains the same. (It's always 16 x 16 x 128 or 32,768 blocks). Proof - I've mined huges areas and built many things in my main world and my file is STILL 17 to 18 MB in size. Mobs spawning don't increase the file size... because (up to 1.7.3) they also despawn. When they spawn, they replace air blocks. When they despawn, air blocks replace them.
Thanks for pointing that out. I am still tussling with understanding how the system might be saving entities and items (e.g. within chests) and the redstone circuitry differently than the blocks themselves. For example, while basic mining and building doesn't increase the file size appreciably; using a lot of redstone seems to. So there is something different there - just not sure what.
I think that's a discussion worth having, but probably not for this thread. My own suspicions lie in the direction of the conversion from block to entities and back to blocks (think about redstone; 1 block can become between 1 and 4 entities, each of which can then be converted back into 1 block). I also have suspicions regarding how this interacts with the use of the duping glitch and/or generators, both of which have the ability to add a block that did not previously exist in the world through the conversion-to-entity process.
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Retired StaffOlder ADTR is much better then their last album.
Interesting.
When the clay fiasco started before the last update I had some unexplored area on my map. After the update, I went to the unexplored areas and finally found clay.
Did the clay show up after the update OR was the clay already there, but I just didn't know it? I don't know.
But I do know that we don't really know. What we can do is create a new world now, and then close it and just hang on to it. After the update, go explore it.
* Then we'll know for sure if the new features show up in unexplored areas of old worlds OR if you have to start a new one for them to show up.
* Then we'll know for sure if the whole map is generated at once OR if it's generated as we explore it.
I don't know who's right, and I'm not sure of anybody's claims.
I just know it's real simple to test it out for myself and then I'll know once and for all.