So, about a year ago, a fellow by the name of Regular Hexahedron performed an experiment, which you can find here. In this experiment, he stretched a long line of redstone across the land to find exactly how far you could send a redstone signal before you could no longer detect the source, (in this case, a clock) which would break the line, obviously.
The distance at which the chunk (containing the source) would unload was roughly 289 blocks away. The distance at which the chunk would load again was around 143. a rapid pulser connected to pistons would then cause an update by the clock, turning it back on.
I thought it would be interesting to repeat this experiment on MCXBLA, and boy was it. I copied his method, except of course for the specific designs, he posted no screenshots and the design wouldn't matter for this anyway. But, as it turns out, the rapid pulser would actually become a completely useless component.
I started at Z: -79, at the south end of my rather large flatland area, thinking it would suffice. I sat up the pulser, clock, and pistons, started the clock and began to lay down redstone, with a repeater after every 15 meters of dust. Eventually I reached the end of my flat area, checked my map and saw I had passed the 300-meter mark! Needless to say, I was a tad excited. I hadn't planned on the result exceeding the previous experiment performed in single player, creative mode, on the PC version. So I had to return to my storage, grabbing stacks of redstone, repeaters, and cobblestone to span across the ocean that laid beyond my flatland.
Before long, I had reached Z: 430 the northern edge of the world, and the line was still blinking! At this point, I have stretched the redstone out over 500 meters and I think I know what's going on. But, just out of curiosity, I returned to the flatland, picked up my clock, pulser, pistons, and started extending the line south to Z: -430, the southern edge of my map. I sat everything up once again, placed the repeaters on the way back towards the flatland. I then walked all the way to the north edge again, and guess what... blinking redstone!
My theory is that the chunks you have already discovered are always pre-loaded in the world, or at least partially. E.g. when you see chunks loading on your world that you have visited before, it's actually only loading the textures, the contents themselves are already there.
I'm not an expert on the mechanics of PC Minecraft nor the XBLA version. So, if I just shot an air ball, feel free to let me know. Also, I don't know if anyone has discovered this before me, I performed a search on "pre-loaded chunks" "max distance redstone signal" "no limit on redstone" and about a million other re-wordings, all turning up nothing relative to something like this.
This is just a cool little discovery, which will have it's pros and cons. On the downside, it will be more difficult or not as effective to create a GPS system or the other ideas they discuss on the original thread I posted at the beginning. On the plus side, our redstone creations can't be restricted by size, and we can really stick it to those guys on PC working on 32-bit computers. Say hello to 64-bit (My god, would that thing be slow... but possible!) I'm actually thinking about building one mainly for the wow-factor. Anybody else have the next few years to waste?
Anyway, I'll try to stop rambling now. Leave a post, pretty please, and let me know what you think of this new discovery. What I hope is a new discovery anyway, if not, Steve's legs were subjected to extreme overuse in vain.
P.S. Steve's hammies are JACKED, BRO!! Check out his sick pump...
EDIT: Complications have recently been brought to my attention. I'll need to test more aspects within "half-loaded" chunks before we know exactly how significant this is. Apparently, there are some issues when the distanced mechanism is more complex than a line or clock. I also believe the pulsing, causing consistent updates, has a lot to do with this. There also seems to be severe bugs regarding pistons and minecart tracks. More info on this soon... maybe.
odd, if it can have the chunks loaded, why must we be within a certain distance for a mob grinder to work?
one would think if it can keep the redstone pulsing from that far, it could keep mods spawning and dying in my grinder when im away.
odd, if it can have the chunks loaded, why must we be within a certain distance for a mob grinder to work?
one would think if it can keep the redstone pulsing from that far, it could keep mods spawning and dying in my grinder when im away.
Mobs are supposed to automatically despawn when you get a certain distance away. It is 128 blocks on the PC, though I am not sure if it is the same on the Xbox 360. Mobs despawning has nothing to do with chunks being loaded or not.
odd, if it can have the chunks loaded, why must we be within a certain distance for a mob grinder to work?
one would think if it can keep the redstone pulsing from that far, it could keep mods spawning and dying in my grinder when im away.
You have to be close enough to a mob spawner for it to spawn things
So, about a year ago, a fellow by the name of Regular Hexahedron performed an experiment, which you can find here. In this experiment, he stretched a long line of redstone across the land to find exactly how far you could send a redstone signal before you could no longer detect the source, (in this case, a clock) which would break the line, obviously.
The distance at which the chunk (containing the source) would unload was roughly 289 blocks away. The distance at which the chunk would load again was around 143. a rapid pulser connected to pistons would then cause an update by the clock, turning it back on.
I thought it would be interesting to repeat this experiment on MCXBLA, and boy was it. I copied his method, except of course for the specific designs, he posted no screenshots and the design wouldn't matter for this anyway. But, as it turns out, the rapid pulser would actually become a completely useless component.
I started at Z: -79, at the south end of my rather large flatland area, thinking it would suffice. I sat up the pulser, clock, and pistons, started the clock and began to lay down redstone, with a repeater after every 15 meters of dust. Eventually I reached the end of my flat area, checked my map and saw I had passed the 300-meter mark! Needless to say, I was a tad excited. I hadn't planned on the result exceeding the previous experiment performed in single player, creative mode, on the PC version. So I had to return to my storage, grabbing stacks of redstone, repeaters, and cobblestone to span across the ocean that laid beyond my flatland.
Before long, I had reached Z: 430 the northern edge of the world, and the line was still blinking! At this point, I have stretched the redstone out over 500 meters and I think I know what's going on. But, just out of curiosity, I returned to the flatland, picked up my clock, pulser, pistons, and started extending the line south to Z: -430, the southern edge of my map. I sat everything up once again, placed the repeaters on the way back towards the flatland. I then walked all the way to the north edge again, and guess what... blinking redstone!
My theory is that the chunks you have already discovered are always pre-loaded in the world, or at least partially. E.g. when you see chunks loading on your world that you have visited before, it's actually only loading the textures, the contents themselves are already there.
I'm not an expert on the mechanics of PC Minecraft nor the XBLA version. So, if I just shot an air ball, feel free to let me know. Also, I don't know if anyone has discovered this before me, I performed a search on "pre-loaded chunks" "max distance redstone signal" "no limit on redstone" and about a million other re-wordings, all turning up nothing relative to something like this.
This is just a cool little discovery, which will have it's pros and cons. On the downside, it will be more difficult or not as effective to create a GPS system or the other ideas they discuss on the original thread I posted at the beginning. On the plus side, our redstone creations can't be restricted by size, and we can really stick it to those guys on PC working on 32-bit computers. Say hello to 64-bit (My god, would that thing be slow... but possible!) I'm actually thinking about building one mainly for the wow-factor. Anybody else have the next few years to waste?
Anyway, I'll try to stop rambling now. Leave a post, pretty please, and let me know what you think of this new discovery. What I hope is a new discovery anyway, if not, Steve's legs were subjected to extreme overuse in vain.
P.S. Steve's hammies are JACKED, BRO!! Check out his sick pump...
Could a mod out there somewhere please delete the old thread? That typo was driving me insane, and the title wasn't a good representation anyway.
That is an amazing discovery. I will certainly use this.
odd, if it can have the chunks loaded, why must we be within a certain distance for a mob grinder to work?
one would think if it can keep the redstone pulsing from that far, it could keep mods spawning and dying in my grinder when im away.
Mobs are supposed to automatically despawn when you get a certain distance away. It is 128 blocks on the PC, though I am not sure if it is the same on the Xbox 360. Mobs despawning has nothing to do with chunks being loaded or not.
Yup, they didn't design how mobs spawn to help your grinder, or to just scatter them across the entire map, rapin' your churches, burnin' your women. The way mob spawning works is to give a decent chance of the player getting into a conflict. Could you imagine if aggressive mobs just spawned everywhere and didn't de-spawn? It would be the end of the world! The end, I say!
About 1604 using both sides of the line, not counting repeaters. And it wouldn't quite be at once, it would be 30 at a time with a tenth of a second in between explosions... and that would happen 57 times.
That actually sounds pretty epic. Somebody with a capture card should try it.
I get that reference. Let's say a bunch of punk kids go out into the woods and strap a bullet proof vest on a grizzly bear. Then what do you got? Invincible bears. Is that what you want? Invincible bears running around? Rapin' your churches, burnin' your women? Help us! Someone get all these bears out of here! I'm sorry, we threw our special guns away.
Anyway, I think they made the mobs despawn that way all the mobs aren't in 3 or 4 chunks while you run across the map completely mob free... Only so many can spawn at once I've heard.
About 1604 using both sides of the line, not counting repeaters. And it wouldn't quite be at once, it would be 30 at a time with a tenth of a second in between explosions... and that would happen 57 times.
That actually sounds pretty epic. Somebody with a capture card should try it.
You set it up, I'll be more than happy to record it
Edit: If anyone wants to set this up I'll record it and put it on here.
i feel really stupid for asking this, especially because i might be wrong
is this a way to like, erase chunks and then generate them? because i made my world before 1.7.3, and there was no clay. i was hoping if this is the case i could regenerate the chunks and hopefully get some clay.
I get that reference. Let's say a bunch of punk kids go out into the woods and strap a bullet proof vest on a grizzly bear. Then what do you got? Invincible bears. Is that what you want? Invincible bears running around? Rapin' your churches, burnin' your women? Help us! Someone get all these bears out of here! I'm sorry, we threw our special guns away.
Anyway, I think they made the mobs despawn that way all the mobs aren't in 3 or 4 chunks while you run across the map completely mob free... Only so many can spawn at once I've heard.
You set it up, I'll be more than happy to record it
Ha! WKUK! Why did they have to cancel that show?
Well, I don't have gold at the moment. It kind of snuck up on me and ended a couple days ago. But, if you're interested, I'm starting on my largest build so far, probably within the next day or so, it should be done in a couple months. I could use a cameraman for that. If you would be willing to do a video for that, go ahead and add me: BaronxofxDeath
Also, I get that about the spawning at once. I believe Mob Trap Guy was asking why can't they just not despawn at all, so his mob grinder would work while he was doing something else, far away. That would be fine and dandy the first couple days, but imagine after 40 - 50 MC days. If nothing despawned, think about how many creepers would be running around in the daylight. It would be absolute chaos!
Use a slow clock, just for stability. Mine was a 5-tick clock with one torch and I didn't have a single problem. I would also advise just going over hills and mountains instead of through them. Towards the end of the line, for some reason, when the redstone was in a confined space it sort of flickered quickly, as if there was an invisible monostable circuit between the line in the tunnel and the previous repeater. It appears that this was only an odd visual glitch, but I would just try to avoid it anyway.
i feel really stupid for asking this, especially because i might be wrong
is this a way to like, erase chunks and then generate them? because i made my world before 1.7.3, and there was no clay. i was hoping if this is the case i could regenerate the chunks and hopefully get some clay.
I heard clearing your cache and downloading the update again will fix corrupted blocks. I don't think it will actually generate new types of blocks though, just regenerate the old ones, or reload, I guess you would say? But, if you really want to, you could give it a shot, there's nothing to lose even if it doesn't work.
I heard clearing your cache and downloading the update again will fix corrupted blocks. I don't think it will actually generate new types of blocks though, just regenerate the old ones, or reload, I guess you would say? But, if you really want to, you could give it a shot, there's nothing to lose even if it doesn't work.
The thing I'm most excited about is internet in Minecraft! Only problem is I hardly know crap about routers. =/ The best part though, is when it is done, we won't need 50 people to idle on the serial BUS just for it to work! I'm sure everyone has seen that in some videos of the VoxelBox server or other popular redstone-based channels.
You could even make instant-repeaters going everywhere, imagine that. Press a button and instantly, a whole kilometer away, you just dumped 150 gallons of molten lava on your best friend's face! The possibilities are endless!
I really hope I don't end up finding some issues with this, down the line. As it stands, this one thing alone just put XBLA ahead of PC, in my eyes. Nobody freak out, that's just my personal opinion. (You sooooo know that hardcore PC users will be green with envy over this, though) I also hope 4J doesn't decide to go to the original chunk loading method if/when they increase map size... I doubt it though, I think that's just a PC thing, since the world is so insanely huge and most players have explored thousands of chunks. Not many computers would be able to handle loading, or even partially loading, all of that at once. If the 360 can handle loading our small worlds so easily, I don't think a few more layers of air blocks and an extra handful of chunks is going to affect it too badly.
It means if you have a railway station on one corner of the map, you can press a button or flip a switch... and make a track intersection change direction all the way in the other corner of the map.
This is such incredible news, thanks OP for doing this. I had wanted to try this too, because I'm a big rails/redstone/elevator type of guy... but I ASSUMED that the signal would end at some finite distance and thus why bother with a redstone switching network?
Looks like I've got some experimenting of my own to do tomorrow. I haven't played Minecraft in three or four days, was so burned out and bored with it... but something like this perks me right up.
And about the chunks... it would appear that's exactly the correct explanation if your experiment is true. The chunks are all loaded, but graphics-wise they have a finite radius. Given the implication of four-way split screen, it would make sense that this was their solution - because if the players are scattered, pretty much all chunks were gonna be loaded anyway.
So... the drawback is, very small world size. But the upside is, a redstone line can go corner-to-corner and anywhere else.
And about the chunks... it would appear that's exactly the correct explanation if your experiment is true. The chunks are all loaded, but graphics-wise they have a finite radius. Given the implication of four-way split screen, it would make sense that this was their solution - because if the players are scattered, pretty much all chunks were gonna be loaded anyway.
So... the drawback is, very small world size. But the upside is, a redstone line can go corner-to-corner and anywhere else.
Thanks again OP! Great experiment.
Go ahead and give it a try, just make sure the clock is slow enough to be reliable, as I mentioned before. I was just as surprised as you are! I expected the same result as PC, or close to it. I was absolutely floored when I made it to 400 meters, let alone sending a signal all the way across the 860 meter length of the map!
And I would gladly sacrifice a nearly infinite world for something like this. I mean, this has the potential to completely revolutionize redstone as we know it. I know, that may not seem like a big deal to the average person. But just think of all the new redstone creations that have never been done before. I have a feeling we're going to be seeing redstone ingenuity, the likes of which we have never seen before.
This is such an awesome thing. I really hope the big redstone builders dive into this and show us what can be done. I am so eager to start thinking up my own redstone contraption now!
I'm not a redstone techie so I don't really understand what happened but from looking about people's comments, it seems pretty big.
Can anyone simplify of what happened?
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I'm secretly stupid. But don't tell anyone.
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Retired StaffThe distance at which the chunk (containing the source) would unload was roughly 289 blocks away. The distance at which the chunk would load again was around 143. a rapid pulser connected to pistons would then cause an update by the clock, turning it back on.
I thought it would be interesting to repeat this experiment on MCXBLA, and boy was it. I copied his method, except of course for the specific designs, he posted no screenshots and the design wouldn't matter for this anyway. But, as it turns out, the rapid pulser would actually become a completely useless component.
I started at Z: -79, at the south end of my rather large flatland area, thinking it would suffice. I sat up the pulser, clock, and pistons, started the clock and began to lay down redstone, with a repeater after every 15 meters of dust. Eventually I reached the end of my flat area, checked my map and saw I had passed the 300-meter mark! Needless to say, I was a tad excited. I hadn't planned on the result exceeding the previous experiment performed in single player, creative mode, on the PC version. So I had to return to my storage, grabbing stacks of redstone, repeaters, and cobblestone to span across the ocean that laid beyond my flatland.
Before long, I had reached Z: 430 the northern edge of the world, and the line was still blinking! At this point, I have stretched the redstone out over 500 meters and I think I know what's going on. But, just out of curiosity, I returned to the flatland, picked up my clock, pulser, pistons, and started extending the line south to Z: -430, the southern edge of my map. I sat everything up once again, placed the repeaters on the way back towards the flatland. I then walked all the way to the north edge again, and guess what... blinking redstone!
My theory is that the chunks you have already discovered are always pre-loaded in the world, or at least partially. E.g. when you see chunks loading on your world that you have visited before, it's actually only loading the textures, the contents themselves are already there.
I'm not an expert on the mechanics of PC Minecraft nor the XBLA version. So, if I just shot an air ball, feel free to let me know. Also, I don't know if anyone has discovered this before me, I performed a search on "pre-loaded chunks" "max distance redstone signal" "no limit on redstone" and about a million other re-wordings, all turning up nothing relative to something like this.
This is just a cool little discovery, which will have it's pros and cons. On the downside, it will be more difficult or not as effective to create a GPS system or the other ideas they discuss on the original thread I posted at the beginning. On the plus side, our redstone creations can't be restricted by size, and we can really stick it to those guys on PC working on 32-bit computers. Say hello to 64-bit
Anyway, I'll try to stop rambling now. Leave a post, pretty please, and let me know what you think of this new discovery. What I hope is a new discovery anyway, if not, Steve's legs were subjected to extreme overuse in vain.
P.S. Steve's hammies are JACKED, BRO!! Check out his sick pump...
EDIT: Complications have recently been brought to my attention. I'll need to test more aspects within "half-loaded" chunks before we know exactly how significant this is. Apparently, there are some issues when the distanced mechanism is more complex than a line or clock. I also believe the pulsing, causing consistent updates, has a lot to do with this. There also seems to be severe bugs regarding pistons and minecart tracks. More info on this soon... maybe.
one would think if it can keep the redstone pulsing from that far, it could keep mods spawning and dying in my grinder when im away.
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Retired StaffYou have to be close enough to a mob spawner for it to spawn things
That is an amazing discovery. I will certainly use this.
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Retired StaffYup, they didn't design how mobs spawn to help your grinder, or to just scatter them across the entire map, rapin' your churches, burnin' your women. The way mob spawning works is to give a decent chance of the player getting into a conflict. Could you imagine if aggressive mobs just spawned everywhere and didn't de-spawn? It would be the end of the world! The end, I say!
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Retired StaffAbout 1604 using both sides of the line, not counting repeaters. And it wouldn't quite be at once, it would be 30 at a time with a tenth of a second in between explosions... and that would happen 57 times.
That actually sounds pretty epic. Somebody with a capture card should try it.
I get that reference. Let's say a bunch of punk kids go out into the woods and strap a bullet proof vest on a grizzly bear. Then what do you got? Invincible bears. Is that what you want? Invincible bears running around? Rapin' your churches, burnin' your women? Help us! Someone get all these bears out of here! I'm sorry, we threw our special guns away.
Anyway, I think they made the mobs despawn that way all the mobs aren't in 3 or 4 chunks while you run across the map completely mob free... Only so many can spawn at once I've heard.
You set it up, I'll be more than happy to record it
Edit: If anyone wants to set this up I'll record it and put it on here.
I'll be re-testing in my own world
is this a way to like, erase chunks and then generate them? because i made my world before 1.7.3, and there was no clay. i was hoping if this is the case i could regenerate the chunks and hopefully get some clay.
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Retired StaffHa! WKUK! Why did they have to cancel that show?
Well, I don't have gold at the moment. It kind of snuck up on me and ended a couple days ago. But, if you're interested, I'm starting on my largest build so far, probably within the next day or so, it should be done in a couple months. I could use a cameraman for that. If you would be willing to do a video for that, go ahead and add me: BaronxofxDeath
Also, I get that about the spawning at once. I believe Mob Trap Guy was asking why can't they just not despawn at all, so his mob grinder would work while he was doing something else, far away. That would be fine and dandy the first couple days, but imagine after 40 - 50 MC days. If nothing despawned, think about how many creepers would be running around in the daylight. It would be absolute chaos!
Use a slow clock, just for stability. Mine was a 5-tick clock with one torch and I didn't have a single problem. I would also advise just going over hills and mountains instead of through them. Towards the end of the line, for some reason, when the redstone was in a confined space it sort of flickered quickly, as if there was an invisible monostable circuit between the line in the tunnel and the previous repeater. It appears that this was only an odd visual glitch, but I would just try to avoid it anyway.
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Retired StaffI heard clearing your cache and downloading the update again will fix corrupted blocks. I don't think it will actually generate new types of blocks though, just regenerate the old ones, or reload, I guess you would say? But, if you really want to, you could give it a shot, there's nothing to lose even if it doesn't work.
i'll try that. thanks man
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Retired StaffYou could even make instant-repeaters going everywhere, imagine that. Press a button and instantly, a whole kilometer away, you just dumped 150 gallons of molten lava on your best friend's face! The possibilities are endless!
I really hope I don't end up finding some issues with this, down the line. As it stands, this one thing alone just put XBLA ahead of PC, in my eyes. Nobody freak out, that's just my personal opinion. (You sooooo know that hardcore PC users will be green with envy over this, though) I also hope 4J doesn't decide to go to the original chunk loading method if/when they increase map size... I doubt it though, I think that's just a PC thing, since the world is so insanely huge and most players have explored thousands of chunks. Not many computers would be able to handle loading, or even partially loading, all of that at once. If the 360 can handle loading our small worlds so easily, I don't think a few more layers of air blocks and an extra handful of chunks is going to affect it too badly.
It means if you have a railway station on one corner of the map, you can press a button or flip a switch... and make a track intersection change direction all the way in the other corner of the map.
This is such incredible news, thanks OP for doing this. I had wanted to try this too, because I'm a big rails/redstone/elevator type of guy... but I ASSUMED that the signal would end at some finite distance and thus why bother with a redstone switching network?
Looks like I've got some experimenting of my own to do tomorrow.
And about the chunks... it would appear that's exactly the correct explanation if your experiment is true. The chunks are all loaded, but graphics-wise they have a finite radius. Given the implication of four-way split screen, it would make sense that this was their solution - because if the players are scattered, pretty much all chunks were gonna be loaded anyway.
So... the drawback is, very small world size. But the upside is, a redstone line can go corner-to-corner and anywhere else.
Thanks again OP! Great experiment.
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Retired StaffGo ahead and give it a try, just make sure the clock is slow enough to be reliable, as I mentioned before. I was just as surprised as you are! I expected the same result as PC, or close to it. I was absolutely floored when I made it to 400 meters, let alone sending a signal all the way across the 860 meter length of the map!
And I would gladly sacrifice a nearly infinite world for something like this. I mean, this has the potential to completely revolutionize redstone as we know it. I know, that may not seem like a big deal to the average person. But just think of all the new redstone creations that have never been done before. I have a feeling we're going to be seeing redstone ingenuity, the likes of which we have never seen before.
Can anyone simplify of what happened?