The real question is, which costs less? A new computer capable of handling this dated looking game....or a new xbox? I still don't understand how badly coded PC minecraft has to be to require a top end PC to handle a game that looks like it came from the 1990's? Seriously, what they hell?
sure, and uses like 1gb of ram and with my dual core of my laptop uses 80% of cpu, and the 1990 games don't do so, its the fu**ing java that ruins everything
sure, and uses like 1gb of ram and with my dual core of my laptop uses 80% of cpu, and the 1990 games don't do so, its the fu**ing java that ruins everything
Amen brother. And this is why teh 360 edition will always be better to me. More stable, better code. I spent DAYS reconfiguring my laptop to try and run minecraft. Its a new bloody laptop, and the fact remains no one should have to reconfigure their java crap just to play this game. Its popular enough and sold enough now...can we not get a stable version please?
Xbox will always win imo just b/c of the xbox live friends component. PC games are for nerds who do stuff like play the sims with nude characters (seriously).
Why's that? You think Java is slower then any other language? Come back to me when you are less ignorant.
How odd, I don't recall saying anything like that at all. Those words never came out of my mouth. But since you cannot seem to figure out, correctly, what sort of problems programming in java has compared to programming in other languages how about YOU come back when YOU are less ignorant.
How odd, I don't recall saying anything like that at all. Those words never came out of my mouth. But since you cannot seem to figure out, correctly, what sort of problems programming in java has compared to programming in other languages how about YOU come back when YOU are less ignorant.
Please make me less ignorant on why it's such a ***** to program in Java. I'll just sit back and watch.
There are a lot of misinformed people in this thread...
First things first, Java code doesn't execute slowly. Far from it, even. C++ code might run a little faster, but that's not the problem here.
The real problem, is Notch. Yes, Notch. The guy who is worshiped as a god by some people here. I'm talking about him - more specifically, I'm talking about his programming skills. Or should I say lack of programming skills?
Notch is a decent programmer. However, Minecraft is a terribly optimized game. If you know a bit of Java, and if you have ever decompiled Minecraft and looked at the code, you'll know that it is nothing less than a cluster****. Large blocks of useless code, or even worse, unused code are everywhere. The game is programmed in some sort of pyramid structure, and the render code is hardly optimized at all. Why do you think Optifine gives people massive framerate boosts? Optifine is a mod; a bunch of classes and changed code bandaged on top of the Minecraft game, and it's still able to give Minecraft a huge performance boost.
The REAL reason the Xbox version runs much better is because it wasn't ported to C++ by Notch. If Notch ported the game to C++, Minecraft would probably be nicknamed Bugcraft. The XBox version would run slower than the PC version, it would have 10 times as many bugs, and chances are development would suddenly stop at a certain point, just because Notch lost interest in it. C++ still requires you to manage the memory yourself, and if Notch is able to get memory leaks to occur in a game programmed in Java, which has a great Garbage Collector, you seriously don't want to know how badly he'd **** up the C++ version.
At the end of the day, it's possible to optimize the game more when it's written in C++, so it could theoretically run faster than the fully optimized version of the game, programmed in Java, but after all these years, the Java version is still terribly unoptimized. The C++ version wouldn't be different, but it would have additional bugs related to the language itself.
As I said, the Xbox version wasn't ported by Notch. It was done by a team of people who ported it to C++ and greatly optimized it as well.
There are a lot of misinformed people in this thread...
First things first, Java code doesn't execute slowly. Far from it, even. C++ code might run a little faster, but that's not the problem here.
The real problem, is Notch. Yes, Notch. The guy who is worshiped as a god by some people here. I'm talking about him - more specifically, I'm talking about his programming skills. Or should I say lack of programming skills?
Notch is a decent programmer. However, Minecraft is a terribly optimized game. If you know a bit of Java, and if you have ever decompiled Minecraft and looked at the code, you'll know that it is nothing less than a cluster****. Large blocks of useless code, or even worse, unused code are everywhere. The game is programmed in some sort of pyramid structure, and the render code is hardly optimized at all. Why do you think Optifine gives people massive framerate boosts? Optifine is a mod; a bunch of classes and changed code bandaged on top of the Minecraft game, and it's still able to give Minecraft a huge performance boost.
The REAL reason the Xbox version runs much better is because it wasn't ported to C++ by Notch. If Notch ported the game to C++, Minecraft would probably be nicknamed Bugcraft. The XBox version would run slower than the PC version, it would have 10 times as many bugs, and chances are development would suddenly stop at a certain point, just because Notch lost interest in it. C++ still requires you to manage the memory yourself, and if Notch is able to get memory leaks to occur in a game programmed in Java, which has a great Garbage Collector, you seriously don't want to know how badly he'd **** up the C++ version.
At the end of the day, it's possible to optimize the game more when it's written in C++, so it could theoretically run faster than the fully optimized version of the game, programmed in Java, but after all these years, the Java version is still terribly unoptimized. The C++ version wouldn't be different, but it would have additional bugs related to the language itself.
As I said, the Xbox version wasn't ported by Notch. It was done by a team of people who ported it to C++ and greatly optimized it as well.
There are a lot of misinformed people in this thread...
First things first, Java code doesn't execute slowly. Far from it, even. C++ code might run a little faster, but that's not the problem here.
The real problem, is Notch. Yes, Notch. The guy who is worshiped as a god by some people here. I'm talking about him - more specifically, I'm talking about his programming skills. Or should I say lack of programming skills?
Notch is a decent programmer. However, Minecraft is a terribly optimized game. If you know a bit of Java, and if you have ever decompiled Minecraft and looked at the code, you'll know that it is nothing less than a cluster****. Large blocks of useless code, or even worse, unused code are everywhere. The game is programmed in some sort of pyramid structure, and the render code is hardly optimized at all. Why do you think Optifine gives people massive framerate boosts? Optifine is a mod; a bunch of classes and changed code bandaged on top of the Minecraft game, and it's still able to give Minecraft a huge performance boost.
The REAL reason the Xbox version runs much better is because it wasn't ported to C++ by Notch. If Notch ported the game to C++, Minecraft would probably be nicknamed Bugcraft. The XBox version would run slower than the PC version, it would have 10 times as many bugs, and chances are development would suddenly stop at a certain point, just because Notch lost interest in it. C++ still requires you to manage the memory yourself, and if Notch is able to get memory leaks to occur in a game programmed in Java, which has a great Garbage Collector, you seriously don't want to know how badly he'd **** up the C++ version.
At the end of the day, it's possible to optimize the game more when it's written in C++, so it could theoretically run faster than the fully optimized version of the game, programmed in Java, but after all these years, the Java version is still terribly unoptimized. The C++ version wouldn't be different, but it would have additional bugs related to the language itself.
As I said, the Xbox version wasn't ported by Notch. It was done by a team of people who ported it to C++ and greatly optimized it as well.
Thank you. You just saved us all a long drawn out discussion for the most part. Since you did, I'm gonna finish that thought with the last piece as to why I hate Java. I understand problems with a C language better. That isn't to say I'm some professional programmer, its just that I understand WHY I'm getting an error a little easier than with Java. Half of why I can't play minecraft on the PC absolutely confuses me, though you did a really good job of explaining it simply. You seriously just saved me and MC a few posts.
Maybe, I dunno, I might of let it drop when he decided to assume I was saying Java was so much slower. It irritates me when words are put into my mouth. I probably shouldn't have been so hateful in my reply, regardless of how much it irritates me. Its not his fault, really, to respond like he did when you spend so much of the day talking to people who think you can just reprogram a game across languages in two days cause its just, "copy and pasting". Its easy to assume we're all that blind, wrong or not. I apologize, Mcdude. I probably would have done the same thing, for the same reasons, to you if the tables were turned. No hard feelings man.
I too am on both sides. I enjoy playing it on my PC; mods, easier control scheme, etc. But I also enjoy play on 360; Easier Multiplayer, more people I know play 360 version.
Now the only downside I've heard of for playing 360 is that the worlds are apparently smaller. Now I don't know if that's true or not and in the grand scheme of things the fact that the game is smaller on 360 makes more sense. Only having a limited amount of preset ressources where as on PC you can make upgrades and tweek things.
All in all, I've been playing the game on 360 from a friend, as I wasn't sure how I would like it. And I'm going to make the standard xbox guy eplaination for not buying it. The game costs 1600MSP (For those of you who don't know that WOULD be $20 in the United States) But for people like me in Canada we get 1400MSP (Microsoft Points) for $20CDN. It sucks but it means we have to pay ($40 I believe for 2800MSP, I've never bought one so I'm not 100% sure.) After playing the xbox version however, if it wasn't for the MSP issue I would get it ASAP.
Thank you. You just saved us all a long drawn out discussion for the most part. Since you did, I'm gonna finish that thought with the last piece as to why I hate Java. I understand problems with a C language better. That isn't to say I'm some professional programmer, its just that I understand WHY I'm getting an error a little easier than with Java. Half of why I can't play minecraft on the PC absolutely confuses me, though you did a really good job of explaining it simply. You seriously just saved me and MC a few posts.
Maybe, I dunno, I might of let it drop when he decided to assume I was saying Java was so much slower. It irritates me when words are put into my mouth. I probably shouldn't have been so hateful in my reply, regardless of how much it irritates me. Its not his fault, really, to respond like he did when you spend so much of the day talking to people who think you can just reprogram a game across languages in two days cause its just, "copy and pasting". Its easy to assume we're all that blind, wrong or not. I apologize, Mcdude. I probably would have done the same thing, for the same reasons, to you if the tables were turned. No hard feelings man.
Same here. I just hate it when people think Java is such a bad language just because minecraft is coded in it. I mostly let my fingers get ahead of my brain.
Same here. I just hate it when people think Java is such a bad language just because minecraft is coded in it. I mostly let my fingers get ahead of my brain.
Its not a bad language, its just not the most ideal conditions. And the point the other fellow made stands loudly....if notch had programmed minecraft in C still making the mistakes he did, it would be just as, if not more than, littered with issues. The big difference is that more people would have been able to fix that, and we'd probably have a stable game right now. We can't blame just notch anymore, though. Mojang is a fully staffed company now. That means plenty of others are responsible for it remaining in the shape it is now. That speaks a lot to me, in that it must be VERY hard to find programmers who can work with java masterfully. You'd think that among all those hired, some would have begun cleaning up that structure by now. Maybe they have, I can imagine its hard to try and fix those things now that the entire build of the game revolves around those mistakes. I just sat here and tried to remember my own experience with that....doing some simple stuff to make a game and then having a few things interact poorly. Then adding more code to try and make everything to work together.
Then suddenly you have every object altered to work around THAT. Fixing that stuff would mean rewriting everything I'd done, nearly. I've had to do that just to make damage values and animations play correctly. It didn't take me forever, like I said it was a really small project. Only had to go back over some object structure for a few enemy planes and the players plane. But....for something larger, like minecraft...I dunno.
I hated having to scour code for those 4 or so objects for hours. Minecraft has a lot of things interacting, and being stored. I kinda feel bad, nearly, for suggesting his team should have fixed this by now. We'd probably just NOW see it done, and have had no updates since beta. UGH. I'd say things would be awesome if we had a more universal way to program things if I didn't realize how stupid that is both in concept and in reality.
"****"? Was the expletive really required to get your point across?
Let's start with the basic things here:
1) Minecraft sold better than EVERY OTHER XBLA TITLE. If most people thought it was "****" then nobody would be buying it. Duh. You do realise that people buying it aren't all just pre-existing Minecraft players from the PC, right?
2) NOT EVERYONE HAS A GAMING PC OR EVEN WANTS ONE. I said goodbye to PC gaming years ago after getting very sick of the upgrade routine every 6 months just to keep up with the latest and greatest in games. Not to mention the system maintenance. I love the Xbox because I don't have to bash my head against Windows updates, drivers, and hardware upgrades just to play some games. I just turn on the Xbox and play. I like that I don't need to make sure I am using some common third party chat tool to talk to people in game, I can just make a party and I'm done. There's a lot to like about console gaming, and a lot to dislike about PC gaming, and I'm just over the hassle. As such, I never played Minecraft until it came out on XBLA. So, no, it's not "****" and I'm pretty sure you'll find most people in fact really like Minecraft on X360, except for the small amount of ex-PC whiners.
It's funny to think that the Xbox version of Minecraft is actually only about 12 months behind the current PC version. That's right kids, in July 2011, Minecraft functioned almost exactly the same on the PC as it does on the Xbox. People have such short memories.
Hey it's still better than pocket edition. Xbox version could has bigger worlds if it wasn't for split screen. Forcing everyone to have smaller worlds for split screen is bs. I cant even use it on my tv so I'm double screwed :/ .
Xbox will always win imo just b/c of the xbox live friends component. PC games are for nerds who do stuff like play the sims with nude characters (seriously).
were you possibly dropped on the head while you were a baby? Pc servers can hold up to over 100 of your friends.
were you possibly dropped on the head while you were a baby? Pc servers can hold up to over 100 of your friends.
Thanks for that Captain Obvious. This isn't facebook. Who knows 100 friends on at the same time to have that need? Are you seriously trying to tell me it's easier/faster to start a world and play with a friend in under 20 seconds from scratch on the pc? I can click on my friend list right now and do just that, with a friend on split screen even. What do you have to do?
sure, and uses like 1gb of ram and with my dual core of my laptop uses 80% of cpu, and the 1990 games don't do so, its the fu**ing java that ruins everything
Amen brother. And this is why teh 360 edition will always be better to me. More stable, better code. I spent DAYS reconfiguring my laptop to try and run minecraft. Its a new bloody laptop, and the fact remains no one should have to reconfigure their java crap just to play this game. Its popular enough and sold enough now...can we not get a stable version please?
Why's that? You think Java is slower then any other language? Come back to me when you are less ignorant.
Please make me less ignorant on why it's such a ***** to program in Java. I'll just sit back and watch.
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Retired StaffFirst things first, Java code doesn't execute slowly. Far from it, even. C++ code might run a little faster, but that's not the problem here.
The real problem, is Notch. Yes, Notch. The guy who is worshiped as a god by some people here. I'm talking about him - more specifically, I'm talking about his programming skills. Or should I say lack of programming skills?
Notch is a decent programmer. However, Minecraft is a terribly optimized game. If you know a bit of Java, and if you have ever decompiled Minecraft and looked at the code, you'll know that it is nothing less than a cluster****. Large blocks of useless code, or even worse, unused code are everywhere. The game is programmed in some sort of pyramid structure, and the render code is hardly optimized at all. Why do you think Optifine gives people massive framerate boosts? Optifine is a mod; a bunch of classes and changed code bandaged on top of the Minecraft game, and it's still able to give Minecraft a huge performance boost.
The REAL reason the Xbox version runs much better is because it wasn't ported to C++ by Notch. If Notch ported the game to C++, Minecraft would probably be nicknamed Bugcraft. The XBox version would run slower than the PC version, it would have 10 times as many bugs, and chances are development would suddenly stop at a certain point, just because Notch lost interest in it. C++ still requires you to manage the memory yourself, and if Notch is able to get memory leaks to occur in a game programmed in Java, which has a great Garbage Collector, you seriously don't want to know how badly he'd **** up the C++ version.
At the end of the day, it's possible to optimize the game more when it's written in C++, so it could theoretically run faster than the fully optimized version of the game, programmed in Java, but after all these years, the Java version is still terribly unoptimized. The C++ version wouldn't be different, but it would have additional bugs related to the language itself.
As I said, the Xbox version wasn't ported by Notch. It was done by a team of people who ported it to C++ and greatly optimized it as well.
Thank you! 1'up.
Thank you. You just saved us all a long drawn out discussion for the most part. Since you did, I'm gonna finish that thought with the last piece as to why I hate Java. I understand problems with a C language better. That isn't to say I'm some professional programmer, its just that I understand WHY I'm getting an error a little easier than with Java. Half of why I can't play minecraft on the PC absolutely confuses me, though you did a really good job of explaining it simply. You seriously just saved me and MC a few posts.
Maybe, I dunno, I might of let it drop when he decided to assume I was saying Java was so much slower. It irritates me when words are put into my mouth. I probably shouldn't have been so hateful in my reply, regardless of how much it irritates me. Its not his fault, really, to respond like he did when you spend so much of the day talking to people who think you can just reprogram a game across languages in two days cause its just, "copy and pasting". Its easy to assume we're all that blind, wrong or not. I apologize, Mcdude. I probably would have done the same thing, for the same reasons, to you if the tables were turned. No hard feelings man.
Now the only downside I've heard of for playing 360 is that the worlds are apparently smaller. Now I don't know if that's true or not and in the grand scheme of things the fact that the game is smaller on 360 makes more sense. Only having a limited amount of preset ressources where as on PC you can make upgrades and tweek things.
All in all, I've been playing the game on 360 from a friend, as I wasn't sure how I would like it. And I'm going to make the standard xbox guy eplaination for not buying it. The game costs 1600MSP (For those of you who don't know that WOULD be $20 in the United States) But for people like me in Canada we get 1400MSP (Microsoft Points) for $20CDN. It sucks but it means we have to pay ($40 I believe for 2800MSP, I've never bought one so I'm not 100% sure.) After playing the xbox version however, if it wasn't for the MSP issue I would get it ASAP.
Pc master race ftw
Same here. I just hate it when people think Java is such a bad language just because minecraft is coded in it. I mostly let my fingers get ahead of my brain.
Its not a bad language, its just not the most ideal conditions. And the point the other fellow made stands loudly....if notch had programmed minecraft in C still making the mistakes he did, it would be just as, if not more than, littered with issues. The big difference is that more people would have been able to fix that, and we'd probably have a stable game right now. We can't blame just notch anymore, though. Mojang is a fully staffed company now. That means plenty of others are responsible for it remaining in the shape it is now. That speaks a lot to me, in that it must be VERY hard to find programmers who can work with java masterfully. You'd think that among all those hired, some would have begun cleaning up that structure by now. Maybe they have, I can imagine its hard to try and fix those things now that the entire build of the game revolves around those mistakes. I just sat here and tried to remember my own experience with that....doing some simple stuff to make a game and then having a few things interact poorly. Then adding more code to try and make everything to work together.
Then suddenly you have every object altered to work around THAT. Fixing that stuff would mean rewriting everything I'd done, nearly. I've had to do that just to make damage values and animations play correctly. It didn't take me forever, like I said it was a really small project. Only had to go back over some object structure for a few enemy planes and the players plane. But....for something larger, like minecraft...I dunno.
I hated having to scour code for those 4 or so objects for hours. Minecraft has a lot of things interacting, and being stored. I kinda feel bad, nearly, for suggesting his team should have fixed this by now. We'd probably just NOW see it done, and have had no updates since beta. UGH. I'd say things would be awesome if we had a more universal way to program things if I didn't realize how stupid that is both in concept and in reality.
"Most people"? Who's that then guv?
"****"? Was the expletive really required to get your point across?
Let's start with the basic things here:
1) Minecraft sold better than EVERY OTHER XBLA TITLE. If most people thought it was "****" then nobody would be buying it. Duh. You do realise that people buying it aren't all just pre-existing Minecraft players from the PC, right?
2) NOT EVERYONE HAS A GAMING PC OR EVEN WANTS ONE. I said goodbye to PC gaming years ago after getting very sick of the upgrade routine every 6 months just to keep up with the latest and greatest in games. Not to mention the system maintenance. I love the Xbox because I don't have to bash my head against Windows updates, drivers, and hardware upgrades just to play some games. I just turn on the Xbox and play. I like that I don't need to make sure I am using some common third party chat tool to talk to people in game, I can just make a party and I'm done. There's a lot to like about console gaming, and a lot to dislike about PC gaming, and I'm just over the hassle. As such, I never played Minecraft until it came out on XBLA. So, no, it's not "****" and I'm pretty sure you'll find most people in fact really like Minecraft on X360, except for the small amount of ex-PC whiners.
It's funny to think that the Xbox version of Minecraft is actually only about 12 months behind the current PC version. That's right kids, in July 2011, Minecraft functioned almost exactly the same on the PC as it does on the Xbox. People have such short memories.
Fallout, and Minecraft.
Thanks for that Captain Obvious. This isn't facebook. Who knows 100 friends on at the same time to have that need? Are you seriously trying to tell me it's easier/faster to start a world and play with a friend in under 20 seconds from scratch on the pc? I can click on my friend list right now and do just that, with a friend on split screen even. What do you have to do?