Curious if anyone can tell me if the new cartographers sell a different map each time you buy one, or if for some silly reason, a given cartographer sells the same one over and over. I.E., I assume you can buy a dozen different ocean monument maps from a single cartographer... yes or no?
Update:
As of this edit (thanks to testing by Sun_Cat and IronMagus) The following appears to be the general mechanics for cartographer map variety:
1. Each cartographer will sell one map of each variety (Woodland Mansion and Ocean Monument) - confirmed by Sun_cat
2. Once a villager's map trade is unlocked, and the map he sells is set, it will not change. - confirmed by Sun_Cat
3. When a given cartographer's treasure map trades are unlocked, the map it sells identifies the nearest "undiscovered/unexplored" structure of that type - confirmed by IronMagus
4. Breeding additional cartographers at the same location will continue to provide the same treasure map until the area [chunk(s)?] containing the structure has been discovered (filled in on the map). Once the area has been explored, newly bred cartographers will sell a map to a new location. - confirmed by IronMagus
That's interesting.... I bet you could put a cartographer in a boat and use him in survival like the /locate command...... or, if you're resourceful, cart him around to find woodland mansion as well.
What I'm getting at is that if what you say is true, having a cartographer at a mall, for instance, would be kind of pointless once the nearest monument/mansion is found. Gives a reason for people to find, protect and breed villagers at random villages, though. I guess there's a bright side.
That leads to another question.... if the world you're playing on has been explored, and the location where a mansion would otherwise generate was explored prior to 1.11, would the cartographer still point to that location; even though a mansion would not be generated there since the area had previously been generated...
So, Sun_Cat and I were discussing this in more detail, via PM. Sun_Cat did some more extensive testing and as of 16w39b at least, it appears that when the map trade is unlocked, the specific map that the cartographer sells is locked in. I.E., Any given cartographer will only provide one map (mansion or monument, or one of each... I haven't used them yet, myself, so I'm a bit unclear on that).
Aside from the 'local' cartographer, it looks like we'll have to search far and wide for villages, and either hope they have a cartographer, or protect and breed until one is born. I'm actually in favor of this, as it does make for more exploration, and it makes logical sense. Part of me wants it to be the other way around, but oh well.
It always finds the closest ocean monument/any structure. So maps from 1 cartographer are the same (they even stack afaik)
Am I the only one thinking they should point (when created, already created ones don't change) to the nearest UNDISCOVERED structure. ("undiscovered" defined as the chunks not having been loaded.)
Yes, and no. No because someone may skirt one when not looking, and never notice it on the edge of the chunks as they're traveling. Yes because there are bound to be pre-1.11 maps where the chunk(s) containing the valid location for a mansion has already been loaded pre 1.11 and thus won't generate the mansion identified.
Am I the only one thinking they should point (when created, already created ones don't change) to the nearest UNDISCOVERED structure. ("undiscovered" defined as the chunks not having been loaded.)
Why would/should a single villager know the location of every special location in the entire world? Making them only know about one special location in their specific region makes sense in a lot of ways and adds value to interacting with other villagers in different parts of the world.
Am I the only one thinking they should point (when created, already created ones don't change) to the nearest UNDISCOVERED structure. ("undiscovered" defined as the chunks not having been loaded.)
Are we sure they don't do (something like) that already? I was playing in survival, where I already have a guardian farm built at a monument I had found earlier (I used an online tool a few snapshots ago to find the nearest one to my base.) So when I got my cartographer the other day and traded for his ocean map, I presumed it would show me the same monument I had already been to. It was in the right direction and everything. But when I actually got in a boat and went exploring, it led me right past my guardian farm, and to a new monument several hundred blocks farther out.
Curious, I hopped into a LAN world so I could use commands real quick. From my base near (200,400) the /locate command shows the nearest monument at (-792,-1448), north and west of my home. That's also what the online tool showed me, and that's the one that I've torn down and made a guardian farm from. The map (which I both unlocked and traded for right outside my home base) shows a different monument, which is /located at (-1208,-2344), farther north and farther west than the first one. I don't know if it's because the other one was already discovered, or because it was from an earlier snapshot, or because I had torn down the structure or dried up the water or what, but for some reason or another, the map doesn't show me the nearest one to where it was created/unlocked/traded for, but the next-nearest.
1. At one location, spawn in 5 villagers with the cartographer profession (everything else default)
2. unlock each of their trades
3. see if they all sell the same map......
I just tried it. So I already had one map (Ocean Explorer Map #15), and two monuments. I went back home, spawned in a cartographer (spawning in a villager with "Profession:1" gave me several cartographers in a row, I would have expected some of them to be librarians, but w/e. The command I used was "/summon Villager ~ ~ ~-1 {Profession:1}". So I spawned in some villagers, did some trading, did some exploring, and here's what I found:
So at the start I had map #15. I spawned in a couple of villagers, and traded for maps 17 and 19, which were identical to each other, but different than #15. I quit and started a new game session and traded for map 21, which again was identical (so maps 17, 19, 21 all the same now). Off in the same direction, north and west. So I do some /tp'ing around, a couple thousand blocks at a time. Get a bit off track and decide to /locate the monument...it takes me to another monument that's not the one on the map. Okay, I fly off in the right direction a ways, /locate it again and this time I'm on the map. So I've loaded two new monuments now, and I head back home.
Back at home, I check out the other maps. Identical maps with different numbers do not fill in automatically. However, buying another copy of the same map (same #) gives you one that's already filled in, as much as the original was. Then I spawn in a new villager, and guess what. New map! Yes, this time I get another new one, different than all the rest. Off in an entirely different direction this time. I'm beginning to think that a newly-generated map trade does only show new/unexplored/not-yet-generated territory. So you can't use the same villager over and over, but you can keep getting new maps as long as you keep breeding new villagers, and explore the old maps' areas first.
4. (to confirm) Do ALL cartographers bred sell the same map not yet explored, regardless of location where bred?
They do not. I spawned in a new cartographer (took a couple tries, they don't always get cartographer with {Profession:1}, I was just having a run of good luck. Got a few librarians this time), bought a map. TP'ed 20,000 blocks south and east, tried again. Different map. I did nothing in between except TP to the new location and hop down off the tree it spawned me on. In the screenshot below, in my left hand is the map I bought at home base, and the map I bought far away is in the right hand:
It appears that each new map shows the nearest undiscovered structure to where it was unlocked.
(in response to my 'to be confirmed', since updated)
They do not (sell the same map regardless of where spawned/unlocked). I spawned in a new cartographer (took a couple tries, they don't always get cartographer with {Profession:1}, I was just having a run of good luck. Got a few librarians this time), bought a map. TP'ed 20,000 blocks south and east, tried again. Different map. I did nothing in between except TP to the new location and hop down off the tree it spawned me on. In the screenshot below, in my left hand is the map I bought at home base, and the map I bought far away is in the right hand:
So we're confident that the cartographers point to the nearest undiscovered mansion? In which case, my server is cursed. I just created a new 1.11 world with the same seed and variables (and it looks pretty much the same, too) and found our village fairly close to spawn. Summoned in a cartographer and got his Forest Mansion map, and went to find it. About 19km later I finally found the mansion. (village is at about -100, 200. Forest Mansion is at -4684,-15905. So about 19km away. I'll finish exploring this map, then go back and summon in a new cartographer and check out their map and see where it points me. So far isn't looking good for our server having any chance of seeing one of these things, baring us putting in a teleportation link. (even with nether portal routes, that's still an extremely long ways to go...)
edit:I went back to the original village, and the cartographer still sold me the same forest map #1. When I summoned in a new cartographe and unlocked his trades, that one offered me Forest Map #3, which was out at aprox 13000, 16000. So just under 30km in the opposite direction from the first.These things are definitely not very common on our seed.
We're having a problem on our server. The only map we get leads to outside of our world border.
Is there a way to reset the map we get?
Or is the one out of reach just the closest one?
There's nothing to reset. An exploration map always points to the nearest, undiscovered structure of the given type. The only way to make that one not be the "nearest, undiscovered" one is to either make a different one be "more near" (if another one was closer, this one would not be the "nearest") or make this one be more "discovered" (if you actually go there and look at it, it won't be "undiscovered" any longer). Since the first one is impossible barring Gandalf-level wizardry, and the second one is impossible due to your world border, it seems you are just going to have to do without.
Ninja edit: Are you near the edge of the world border already? The nearest one to where you are now (or wherever the cartographer was when you unlocked his map trade, technically) is outside the world border, but there's a chance there could still be one inside the border, in the other direction. Try unlocking a new map trade near the center of your world. That way, the world border is the same distance in all directions, and if the nearest one is still outside the border, then you're simply out of luck.
Yea, and also remember that when you do single-biome customized worlds, (deep ocean or roofed forest) not only will cartographers trade only the map corresponding with the structure native to the given biome, but it will also attempt to generate the structures more frequently, meaning that you will have to travel less as far to explore the same number of maps.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
The funniest thing about this signature is by the time you realize it doesn't say anything important it's already too late to stop reading it.
Curious if anyone can tell me if the new cartographers sell a different map each time you buy one, or if for some silly reason, a given cartographer sells the same one over and over. I.E., I assume you can buy a dozen different ocean monument maps from a single cartographer... yes or no?
Update:
As of this edit (thanks to testing by Sun_Cat and IronMagus) The following appears to be the general mechanics for cartographer map variety:
1. Each cartographer will sell one map of each variety (Woodland Mansion and Ocean Monument) - confirmed by Sun_cat
2. Once a villager's map trade is unlocked, and the map he sells is set, it will not change. - confirmed by Sun_Cat
3. When a given cartographer's treasure map trades are unlocked, the map it sells identifies the nearest "undiscovered/unexplored" structure of that type - confirmed by IronMagus
4. Breeding additional cartographers at the same location will continue to provide the same treasure map until the area [chunk(s)?] containing the structure has been discovered (filled in on the map). Once the area has been explored, newly bred cartographers will sell a map to a new location. - confirmed by IronMagus
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It always finds the closest ocean monument/any structure. So maps from 1 cartographer are the same (they even stack afaik)
That's interesting.... I bet you could put a cartographer in a boat and use him in survival like the /locate command...... or, if you're resourceful, cart him around to find woodland mansion as well.
What I'm getting at is that if what you say is true, having a cartographer at a mall, for instance, would be kind of pointless once the nearest monument/mansion is found. Gives a reason for people to find, protect and breed villagers at random villages, though. I guess there's a bright side.
That leads to another question.... if the world you're playing on has been explored, and the location where a mansion would otherwise generate was explored prior to 1.11, would the cartographer still point to that location; even though a mansion would not be generated there since the area had previously been generated...
<-- Click Banner to Apply !!
So, Sun_Cat and I were discussing this in more detail, via PM. Sun_Cat did some more extensive testing and as of 16w39b at least, it appears that when the map trade is unlocked, the specific map that the cartographer sells is locked in. I.E., Any given cartographer will only provide one map (mansion or monument, or one of each... I haven't used them yet, myself, so I'm a bit unclear on that).
Aside from the 'local' cartographer, it looks like we'll have to search far and wide for villages, and either hope they have a cartographer, or protect and breed until one is born. I'm actually in favor of this, as it does make for more exploration, and it makes logical sense. Part of me wants it to be the other way around, but oh well.
<-- Click Banner to Apply !!
One of each, and they are unlocked together
Am I the only one thinking they should point (when created, already created ones don't change) to the nearest UNDISCOVERED structure. ("undiscovered" defined as the chunks not having been loaded.)
Yes, and no. No because someone may skirt one when not looking, and never notice it on the edge of the chunks as they're traveling. Yes because there are bound to be pre-1.11 maps where the chunk(s) containing the valid location for a mansion has already been loaded pre 1.11 and thus won't generate the mansion identified.
<-- Click Banner to Apply !!
Why would/should a single villager know the location of every special location in the entire world? Making them only know about one special location in their specific region makes sense in a lot of ways and adds value to interacting with other villagers in different parts of the world.
by c0yote
I tried it with terrible results. I gave my wife my glasses for a second, a creeper showed up and now my wife is pregnant.
Stupid 3D..
Are we sure they don't do (something like) that already? I was playing in survival, where I already have a guardian farm built at a monument I had found earlier (I used an online tool a few snapshots ago to find the nearest one to my base.) So when I got my cartographer the other day and traded for his ocean map, I presumed it would show me the same monument I had already been to. It was in the right direction and everything. But when I actually got in a boat and went exploring, it led me right past my guardian farm, and to a new monument several hundred blocks farther out.
Curious, I hopped into a LAN world so I could use commands real quick. From my base near (200,400) the /locate command shows the nearest monument at (-792,-1448), north and west of my home. That's also what the online tool showed me, and that's the one that I've torn down and made a guardian farm from. The map (which I both unlocked and traded for right outside my home base) shows a different monument, which is /located at (-1208,-2344), farther north and farther west than the first one. I don't know if it's because the other one was already discovered, or because it was from an earlier snapshot, or because I had torn down the structure or dried up the water or what, but for some reason or another, the map doesn't show me the nearest one to where it was created/unlocked/traded for, but the next-nearest.
Village Mechanics: A not-so-brief guide - Update 2017! Now with 1.8 breeding mechanics! Long-overdue trading info, coming soon!
You think magic isn't real? Consider this: for every person, there is a sentence -- a series of words -- which has the power to destroy them.
Sounds like it's time for another experiment...
1. At one location, spawn in 5 villagers with the cartographer profession (everything else default)
2. unlock each of their trades
3. see if they all sell the same map......
<-- Click Banner to Apply !!
I just tried it. So I already had one map (Ocean Explorer Map #15), and two monuments. I went back home, spawned in a cartographer (spawning in a villager with "Profession:1" gave me several cartographers in a row, I would have expected some of them to be librarians, but w/e. The command I used was "/summon Villager ~ ~ ~-1 {Profession:1}". So I spawned in some villagers, did some trading, did some exploring, and here's what I found:
So at the start I had map #15. I spawned in a couple of villagers, and traded for maps 17 and 19, which were identical to each other, but different than #15. I quit and started a new game session and traded for map 21, which again was identical (so maps 17, 19, 21 all the same now). Off in the same direction, north and west. So I do some /tp'ing around, a couple thousand blocks at a time. Get a bit off track and decide to /locate the monument...it takes me to another monument that's not the one on the map. Okay, I fly off in the right direction a ways, /locate it again and this time I'm on the map. So I've loaded two new monuments now, and I head back home.
Back at home, I check out the other maps. Identical maps with different numbers do not fill in automatically. However, buying another copy of the same map (same #) gives you one that's already filled in, as much as the original was. Then I spawn in a new villager, and guess what. New map! Yes, this time I get another new one, different than all the rest. Off in an entirely different direction this time. I'm beginning to think that a newly-generated map trade does only show new/unexplored/not-yet-generated territory. So you can't use the same villager over and over, but you can keep getting new maps as long as you keep breeding new villagers, and explore the old maps' areas first.
Village Mechanics: A not-so-brief guide - Update 2017! Now with 1.8 breeding mechanics! Long-overdue trading info, coming soon!
You think magic isn't real? Consider this: for every person, there is a sentence -- a series of words -- which has the power to destroy them.
Excellent work! Sounds like we're getting close to the root mechanics.
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They do not. I spawned in a new cartographer (took a couple tries, they don't always get cartographer with {Profession:1}, I was just having a run of good luck. Got a few librarians this time), bought a map. TP'ed 20,000 blocks south and east, tried again. Different map. I did nothing in between except TP to the new location and hop down off the tree it spawned me on. In the screenshot below, in my left hand is the map I bought at home base, and the map I bought far away is in the right hand:
It appears that each new map shows the nearest undiscovered structure to where it was unlocked.
Village Mechanics: A not-so-brief guide - Update 2017! Now with 1.8 breeding mechanics! Long-overdue trading info, coming soon!
You think magic isn't real? Consider this: for every person, there is a sentence -- a series of words -- which has the power to destroy them.
Updated OP
<-- Click Banner to Apply !!
Thank's all for this test!!
So we're confident that the cartographers point to the nearest undiscovered mansion? In which case, my server is cursed. I just created a new 1.11 world with the same seed and variables (and it looks pretty much the same, too) and found our village fairly close to spawn. Summoned in a cartographer and got his Forest Mansion map, and went to find it. About 19km later I finally found the mansion. (village is at about -100, 200. Forest Mansion is at -4684,-15905. So about 19km away. I'll finish exploring this map, then go back and summon in a new cartographer and check out their map and see where it points me. So far isn't looking good for our server having any chance of seeing one of these things, baring us putting in a teleportation link. (even with nether portal routes, that's still an extremely long ways to go...)
edit:I went back to the original village, and the cartographer still sold me the same forest map #1. When I summoned in a new cartographe and unlocked his trades, that one offered me Forest Map #3, which was out at aprox 13000, 16000. So just under 30km in the opposite direction from the first.These things are definitely not very common on our seed.
We're having a problem on our server. The only map we get leads to outside of our world border.
Is there a way to reset the map we get?
Or is the one out of reach just the closest one?
There's nothing to reset. An exploration map always points to the nearest, undiscovered structure of the given type. The only way to make that one not be the "nearest, undiscovered" one is to either make a different one be "more near" (if another one was closer, this one would not be the "nearest") or make this one be more "discovered" (if you actually go there and look at it, it won't be "undiscovered" any longer). Since the first one is impossible barring Gandalf-level wizardry, and the second one is impossible due to your world border, it seems you are just going to have to do without.
Ninja edit: Are you near the edge of the world border already? The nearest one to where you are now (or wherever the cartographer was when you unlocked his map trade, technically) is outside the world border, but there's a chance there could still be one inside the border, in the other direction. Try unlocking a new map trade near the center of your world. That way, the world border is the same distance in all directions, and if the nearest one is still outside the border, then you're simply out of luck.
Village Mechanics: A not-so-brief guide - Update 2017! Now with 1.8 breeding mechanics! Long-overdue trading info, coming soon!
You think magic isn't real? Consider this: for every person, there is a sentence -- a series of words -- which has the power to destroy them.
Yea, and also remember that when you do single-biome customized worlds, (deep ocean or roofed forest) not only will cartographers trade only the map corresponding with the structure native to the given biome, but it will also attempt to generate the structures more frequently, meaning that you will have to travel less as far to explore the same number of maps.
The funniest thing about this signature is by the time you realize it doesn't say anything important it's already too late to stop reading it.
Thanks for the Help mate!