(In regard to a mod that gives realistic animal genetics):
Would you really rather have bees that make diamonds and oil with magical genetic blocks?
... did I really ask that?
You're missing the point, Keybounce is not talking about lighting in the nether, he is talking about the unknown roof problem, which could cause areas
that should be unlit to be lit, as although they have a roof, if the game has never generated this roof, it thinks the cave goes all the way to the surface and should be lit. The nether is a good example of this because it has a floor, a roof and I think walls.
On the absence of sunlight in the nether:
This is actually rather interesting, although areas too far away from glowstone, lava or fire have a light level of 0 according to the debug screen, even if you bury yourself there is still some kind of ambient light(Tested on Moody brightness), down at bedrock layer in a 1x2 space you can see far better than at the same place in the Overworld(Tested on Moody brightness).
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Please don't PM me asking for help, I will just redirect you to the appropriate forum, where there are others who are far more skilled than me.
do you know why I don't like patreon? Because I'm a student in high school without an income or allowance... I'd bet that the majority of those who play minecraft are children... I'm just trying to throw that out there. I'm not trying to criticize your methods of keeping this project going.
do you know why I don't like patreon? Because I'm a student in high school without an income or allowance... I'd bet that the majority of those who play minecraft are children...
Yeah, you're totally right. It's hard for the Minecraft community to financially support modders because most Minecraft players don't have any money. I get that. That's what makes trying to be a pro modder so hard.
A monthly payment (even if it's only a few dollars) is a big commitment. I guessing that's why not many Minecraft players donate on Patreon. Do you think there are other ways to donate that players might use instead? Or are players just not interested in donating at all?
How about just doing a PayPal donation where the donator can send you any amount they want.
I have a PayPal account set up for that. Far fewer people use it than Patreon though.
It seems somepeople can make this work though. What are they doing right?
EDIT: maybe my rewards aren't enticing enough? I don't really have much in the way of rewards for PayPal donations. What kinds of rewards would people like to have?
I would love to donate, but like the others I have less than $5 to my name. If I ever get a well paying job I would love to donate.
Also, for me the rewards aren't the driving force, but the project. While a reward like alpha/beta access is a perk that would influence my decision, the smaller things like the aesthetic plates are nice, but supporting the mod itself and the modder (you) is a bigger deal.
EDIT: I think what they are doing is
1) Being in the public eye. EE3 and thaumcraft are massively popular mods. Famous youtubers use them all the time. Also, the first guy is on youtube himself.
2) Being open to the public. I know you talk here, but dude 1 has a public hangout. I know StarCitizen got thousands of pledges at the $1k+ mark because people got monthly meetings with the dev team. People like a human connection I guess? Not sure how that would be different from you being on this thread though.
This isn't criticism, I love how you are doing it now, just trying to answer your question.
I would love to donate, but like the others I have less than $5 to my name. If I ever get a well paying job I would love to donate.
Also, for me the rewards aren't the driving force, but the project. While a reward like alpha/beta access is a perk that would influence my decision, the smaller things like the aesthetic plates are nice, but supporting the mod itself and the modder (you) is a bigger deal.
EDIT: I think what they are doing is
1) Being in the public eye. EE3 and thaumcraft are massively popular mods. Famous youtubers use them all the time. Also, the first guy is on youtube himself.
2) Being open to the public. I know you talk here, but dude 1 has a public hangout. I know StarCitizen got thousands of pledges at the $1k+ mark because people got monthly meetings with the dev team. People like a human connection I guess? Not sure how that would be different from you being on this thread though.
This isn't criticism, I love how you are doing it now, just trying to answer your question.
3) Direwolf20 plays with their mods... just saying
I would love to donate, but like the others I have less than $5 to my name. If I ever get a well paying job I would love to donate.
Also, for me the rewards aren't the driving force, but the project. While a reward like alpha/beta access is a perk that would influence my decision, the smaller things like the aesthetic plates are nice, but supporting the mod itself and the modder (you) is a bigger deal.
EDIT: I think what they are doing is
1) Being in the public eye. EE3 and thaumcraft are massively popular mods. Famous youtubers use them all the time. Also, the first guy is on youtube himself.
2) Being open to the public. I know you talk here, but dude 1 has a public hangout. I know StarCitizen got thousands of pledges at the $1k+ mark because people got monthly meetings with the dev team. People like a human connection I guess? Not sure how that would be different from you being on this thread though.
This isn't criticism, I love how you are doing it now, just trying to answer your question.
Thanks. I appreciate the insights. I'm not afraid of criticism either. =)
So you think people want more (for lack of a better term) "me time" ? I really to try to read and respond to every single message I get on MCF, PMC, IRC, Twitter, Player.me, Skype, etc etc etc. Do you think people would really want me to set aside an hour or so every week/month in a special chat room? How would that be different than what I'm doing now? I'm already pretty responsive to people I think.
I'm really not interested in the alternative option either: start ignoring everyone who isn't a donor/patron to try to change the supply/demand economics of my interactions just to create a market. That seems a little too manipulative for my tastes.
I'm really impressed though that some players really do want to support my projects despite not having any money to spare. I wish there was some way you guys could contribute to the cause. Maybe I could set up some kind of referral program? That way, you could get rewards without donating as long as you find other people who will donate? Would something like that be interesting? Again, what kinds of rewards would be enticing? I always thought it would be cool to give donors hats of some kind. Maybe a nice-looking tricorner hat for sailing? =) Or some other kind of cosmetic apparel/item people can use to show off. What do you think?
This is too much stress, don't take anything I say too seriously!
I know you're responsive, but people seem to like when creators and developers set up organised meetings. It seems like it mostly works for larger groups though. People like CG and TacticalAdvance have thousands (26k in the case of tacticaldavance, 600k+ in the case of CG) of subscribers/customers, but certain groups get monthly meetups with the person themself once a month. TA meets up with people in-game, while CG hosts a live Q&A thing as far as I can tell. (I've not bought into either) Maybe once the mod is released have a private server that you and certain Patrons get on once a month at certain times. You could still get on the normal server, but you would always be on the subscriber one at a set time? It's hard to figure out.
Referrals sound nice, but those are also tricky. Too many referrals and people get annoyed. And while you might have good intentions, some people would just spam it everywhere to get the benefits.
I do love the idea of the tricorner hats though.
Logistics.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
If someone in an S class cuts me off, I don't get upset. He obviously has important things to do. Now, someone in a Toyota? We're fighting.
These forums are dumb and break my links. I'm bubbleawsome on steam too.
Not sure if you know this but in addition to creating a MC mod I also run a vanilla MC server which has been in and out of the top 5, but anyway the thing I find to be most effective in binding my community togeather is a Skype group and a TS3 server, TS3 is good cause I can get back from work fire my PC and log on to the TS3 and if some one wants to say hi they only need log on. Skype I use for the instant messaging, as group calls with it suck.
But yeah if you were to make a effort to be online in TS3 for example, granted most of the time you can leave your mic muted and people won't be online much, but if your there they can poke you and yeah.
Is it distracting, for me generally not as most people are farly happy to do all the talking joke about there day and such, heck sometime if there's 3or 4 of them u can even go as far as ignoring them as they will talk between them selves
Not sure if you know this but in addition to creating a MC mod I also run a vanilla MC server which has been in and out of the top 5, but anyway the thing I find to be most effective in binding my community togeather is a Skype group and a TS3 server, TS3 is good cause I can get back from work fire my PC and log on to the TS3 and if some one wants to say hi they only need log on. Skype I use for the instant messaging, as group calls with it suck.
But yeah if you were to make a effort to be online in TS3 for example, granted most of the time you can leave your mic muted and people won't be online much, but if your there they can poke you and yeah.
Is it distracting, for me generally not as most people are farly happy to do all the talking joke about there day and such, heck sometime if there's 3or 4 of them u can even go as far as ignoring them as they will talk between them selves
I'm not a huge fan of voice chat unless I'm playing games with close friends. I do use skype chat though. Maybe I could make a skype chat some kind of donation reward.
I think the biggest problem regarding the "market value" of your work is its notability within the game. Pahimars and Azanaros mods have content which you can spent days exploring. New blocks, new items, new whatever. Tall worlds "only" adds a higher map ceiling, which is one of those things people will take for granted once they've played for a few hours. From that point onwards, they may think positively about it once in a while but it wont be as striking as lots of other mods are, especially because fairly few projects require a larger map.
You'll probably pick up some more patreons once the mod is working and has been adopted by a variety of map generators, assuming those generators' authors give credit where credit is due.
That's the problem with my approach. I've been focusing on making technically difficult mods. The mods other people don't know how to make. I can do some really neat stuff, but it's usually one big thing. Whereas, if you find endless ways to chain crafting recipes together, you can make lots of content really easily.
Hoepfully people won't take my work for granted. =(
While I personally think that many people will take your final works for granted, the seemingly infinite array of MODS, games, stories and other interactive, meaningful productions that will suddenly become possible as a result of your vast works will also immortalize it to some degree.
For instance; despite it's innumerable flaws, disagreements and issues, does the Minecraft Population truly take MCP or Forge for granted?
Is MCP or Forge something that the casual player isn't aware of? To a degree, I would think yes.
Is MCP or Forge (I do know how closely related they are) "forgotten" by the users of the things that they allow? Not at all.
I have followed both this and your M3L threads ever since one of your team members, Barteks2x, privately messaged me for asking why the world of Minecrat was flat and how to fix that situation.
I have personally read almost every single post in both threads and many of the links there in.
Even IF, by some unforeseeable event, this mod never gets released and M3L disapears from the world forever, I don't think I will, so long as I play or follow Minecraft or any of the countless mods therefor, ever forget the enormity and potential of what you are doing.
Ultimately I would like to say this: Thank you for trying, no matter the outcome.
I'm not sure about how popular or how pheesable(botched the spelling) this would be but. A monthly youtube progress video talking about the recent things that have been done in the month. Even if some of the stuff is really complicated I would love to try to understand. Also, could you put up some polls here if you get some ideas for some?
also.. One thing that I had an idea for it sky diving!!! but someone would have to make a mod to tweak the physics of falling to factor in continuous acceleration/tucking in to fall faster, air resistance/wind breaking, and actually increasing the maximum falling speed.
Cuchaz; My bet is that things (Patreon etc) will noticeably pick up after Tall Worlds becomes a solid thing in more people's minds. In other words when it's known by many to be a working mod and videos start abounding showing people's stunts and adventures with it.
And as regards taking it for granted; I don't believe it will be. In fact I think it's simply too early to be asking these questions. Those who do know about the project have seen it in a standing pattern for so long that they sort of "take it for granted" that it will remain so like many other mods and sort of just wait with diminishing hope and only check in every once in a great while.
I fully expect that things will start going into overdrive once the community starts to become aware of a cubic chunks height mod revival finally being successful and something they can play with themselves!
++ Plus; there will be many things/features that people will want to donate for no matter how "Base-Level" it seems this mod is at first glance. For example:
- Tall Worlds API for more Modding compatibility options (Ore and Structure alteration, 3D Biomes, etc)
- Full Plug-in System for 3rd party Terrain Generators and Biomes etc
- Customizable Terrain Generator Interface for easy Custom Worlds
- Updating of Robinton's open source World Save Converter to include compatibility with your Tall Worlds Save Format. Allowing people to bring forward their previous height modded worlds (from all prior existing height mods including the very first one [ymod]).
- Updating open source MCEdit with compatibility for Tall Worlds.
- Updating open source WorldEdit with compatibility for Tall Worlds.
- Heck, you could help update all kinds of core community infrastructure for use with Tall Worlds. Doing this would directly feedback into support for Tall Worlds in general. The more common community tools that are directly compatible with Tall worlds the more people who will not only use it but will do all kinds of unique and wonderful things with it and make videos of such things etc. Essentially a snowball event.
* You could also (before everyone eventually moves on), probably do a reasonably sized Kickstarter or something to fully port Tall Worlds to 1.7.10, with 1.6.4 as an extended goal with higher pledges? I would definitely throw in a pledge for that. Make it reasonably sized and I'd call it easy money. Of course it would have to be after a functional and proven version has been released for your current platform of choice (1.8.x), and people would expect more than just a beta port, they would eventually want a fully functional version. But I don't think that should be too much of a problem since the largest battle would just be getting M3L and Tall Worlds ported to begin with.
- Add-ons: After all else you yourself (who is better qualified) could be funded to make quality add-ons for Tall Worlds. After all; other than things mentioned further above, a height mod by itself should mostly only be a height mod otherwise it will alienate lots of people by adding things that they do not want. However; extra features that can be added by choice or left out by choice by having them in the form of Add-ons (mods) is the perfect way to give EVERYONE what they want.
Add-ons could be anything from really cool well developed additive 3D Biomes (people could add just the ones they like) to custom mob-packs with mobs that primarily occupy certain height ranges or types of 3D Biomes to whatever!
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
- The Cubic Chunks Mod is back! Be a part of it's rebirth and Development.
-- Robinton's Mods: [ Mirror ] for some of his Mods incl Cubic Chunks Mod, due to DropBox broken links.
Also; Multi-player is the largest key to support for most mods so far as I have seen over the years. Once Tall Worlds is stable and solid enough that people start making servers with it you will see FAR more attention and awareness, not the least of which is because most you-tubers do their videos from within multiplayer environments.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
- The Cubic Chunks Mod is back! Be a part of it's rebirth and Development.
-- Robinton's Mods: [ Mirror ] for some of his Mods incl Cubic Chunks Mod, due to DropBox broken links.
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Curse PremiumI just imagine something like a nether generation. Imagine the ability to generate a really tall nether, and you're down at the lava.
At some point, the roof will be higher up than generated vertical minichunks.
For most of the world, there will be compartments and horizontal ledges, so the game won't try to bring sunlight down to where you are.
But every so often, there's a straight open area from the nether roof to the lava sea.
* Promoting this week: Captive Minecraft 4, Winter Realm. Aka: Vertical Vanilla Viewing. Clicky!
* My channel with Mystcraft, and general Minecraft Let's Plays: http://www.youtube.com/user/Keybounce.
* See all my video series: http://www.minecraftforum.net/forums/minecraft-editions/minecraft-editions-show-your/2865421-keybounces-list-of-creation-threads
(In regard to a mod that gives realistic animal genetics):
Would you really rather have bees that make diamonds and oil with magical genetic blocks?
... did I really ask that?
there isn't any sunlight in the nether at all
sorry if my English have mistakes it's not my main language
You're missing the point, Keybounce is not talking about lighting in the nether, he is talking about the unknown roof problem, which could cause areas
that should be unlit to be lit, as although they have a roof, if the game has never generated this roof, it thinks the cave goes all the way to the surface and should be lit. The nether is a good example of this because it has a floor, a roof and I think walls.
On the absence of sunlight in the nether:
This is actually rather interesting, although areas too far away from glowstone, lava or fire have a light level of 0 according to the debug screen, even if you bury yourself there is still some kind of ambient light(Tested on Moody brightness), down at bedrock layer in a 1x2 space you can see far better than at the same place in the Overworld(Tested on Moody brightness).
Please don't PM me asking for help, I will just redirect you to the appropriate forum, where there are others who are far more skilled than me.
This is not the signature you are looking for.
Banners and such things
do you know why I don't like patreon? Because I'm a student in high school without an income or allowance... I'd bet that the majority of those who play minecraft are children... I'm just trying to throw that out there. I'm not trying to criticize your methods of keeping this project going.
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Curse PremiumYeah, you're totally right. It's hard for the Minecraft community to financially support modders because most Minecraft players don't have any money. I get that. That's what makes trying to be a pro modder so hard.
A monthly payment (even if it's only a few dollars) is a big commitment. I guessing that's why not many Minecraft players donate on Patreon. Do you think there are other ways to donate that players might use instead? Or are players just not interested in donating at all?
How about just doing a PayPal donation where the donator can send you any amount they want.
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Curse PremiumI have a PayPal account set up for that. Far fewer people use it than Patreon though.
It seems some people can make this work though. What are they doing right?
EDIT: maybe my rewards aren't enticing enough? I don't really have much in the way of rewards for PayPal donations. What kinds of rewards would people like to have?
I would love to donate, but like the others I have less than $5 to my name. If I ever get a well paying job I would love to donate.
Also, for me the rewards aren't the driving force, but the project. While a reward like alpha/beta access is a perk that would influence my decision, the smaller things like the aesthetic plates are nice, but supporting the mod itself and the modder (you) is a bigger deal.
EDIT: I think what they are doing is
1) Being in the public eye. EE3 and thaumcraft are massively popular mods. Famous youtubers use them all the time. Also, the first guy is on youtube himself.
2) Being open to the public. I know you talk here, but dude 1 has a public hangout. I know StarCitizen got thousands of pledges at the $1k+ mark because people got monthly meetings with the dev team. People like a human connection I guess? Not sure how that would be different from you being on this thread though.
This isn't criticism, I love how you are doing it now, just trying to answer your question.
These forums are dumb and break my links. I'm bubbleawsome on steam too.
3) Direwolf20 plays with their mods... just saying
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Curse PremiumThanks. I appreciate the insights. I'm not afraid of criticism either. =)
So you think people want more (for lack of a better term) "me time" ? I really to try to read and respond to every single message I get on MCF, PMC, IRC, Twitter, Player.me, Skype, etc etc etc. Do you think people would really want me to set aside an hour or so every week/month in a special chat room? How would that be different than what I'm doing now? I'm already pretty responsive to people I think.
I'm really not interested in the alternative option either: start ignoring everyone who isn't a donor/patron to try to change the supply/demand economics of my interactions just to create a market. That seems a little too manipulative for my tastes.
I'm really impressed though that some players really do want to support my projects despite not having any money to spare. I wish there was some way you guys could contribute to the cause. Maybe I could set up some kind of referral program? That way, you could get rewards without donating as long as you find other people who will donate? Would something like that be interesting? Again, what kinds of rewards would be enticing? I always thought it would be cool to give donors hats of some kind. Maybe a nice-looking tricorner hat for sailing? =) Or some other kind of cosmetic apparel/item people can use to show off. What do you think?
This is too much stress, don't take anything I say too seriously!
I know you're responsive, but people seem to like when creators and developers set up organised meetings. It seems like it mostly works for larger groups though. People like CG and TacticalAdvance have thousands (26k in the case of tacticaldavance, 600k+ in the case of CG) of subscribers/customers, but certain groups get monthly meetups with the person themself once a month. TA meets up with people in-game, while CG hosts a live Q&A thing as far as I can tell. (I've not bought into either) Maybe once the mod is released have a private server that you and certain Patrons get on once a month at certain times. You could still get on the normal server, but you would always be on the subscriber one at a set time? It's hard to figure out.
Referrals sound nice, but those are also tricky. Too many referrals and people get annoyed. And while you might have good intentions, some people would just spam it everywhere to get the benefits.
I do love the idea of the tricorner hats though.
Logistics.
These forums are dumb and break my links. I'm bubbleawsome on steam too.
Not sure if you know this but in addition to creating a MC mod I also run a vanilla MC server which has been in and out of the top 5, but anyway the thing I find to be most effective in binding my community togeather is a Skype group and a TS3 server, TS3 is good cause I can get back from work fire my PC and log on to the TS3 and if some one wants to say hi they only need log on. Skype I use for the instant messaging, as group calls with it suck.
But yeah if you were to make a effort to be online in TS3 for example, granted most of the time you can leave your mic muted and people won't be online much, but if your there they can poke you and yeah.
Is it distracting, for me generally not as most people are farly happy to do all the talking joke about there day and such, heck sometime if there's 3or 4 of them u can even go as far as ignoring them as they will talk between them selves
Be involved in the Survival of Modding in the Post-Notch Era. Enigma + M3L + LiteLoader/API + BlazeLoader {ALL Open-Source!}
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Curse PremiumI'm not a huge fan of voice chat unless I'm playing games with close friends. I do use skype chat though. Maybe I could make a skype chat some kind of donation reward.
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Curse PremiumThat's the problem with my approach. I've been focusing on making technically difficult mods. The mods other people don't know how to make. I can do some really neat stuff, but it's usually one big thing. Whereas, if you find endless ways to chain crafting recipes together, you can make lots of content really easily.
Hoepfully people won't take my work for granted. =(
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Curse Premium: 3
I'm not sure about how popular or how pheesable(botched the spelling) this would be but. A monthly youtube progress video talking about the recent things that have been done in the month. Even if some of the stuff is really complicated I would love to try to understand. Also, could you put up some polls here if you get some ideas for some?
also.. One thing that I had an idea for it sky diving!!! but someone would have to make a mod to tweak the physics of falling to factor in continuous acceleration/tucking in to fall faster, air resistance/wind breaking, and actually increasing the maximum falling speed.
also I dream of the Grow Home game in minecraft.
Sky-Diving. Into an infinite-sized pit blown out with a magic TNT want. Don't hit the edges. Bonus points for dodging exploding TnT.
"Jesus Christ now I realize how messed up I've made my characters....." -booksmusicanime, after writing a "Thought Experiment" post.
"Code Lyoko was such a badass show." - Morgan Elliott from Twitter, after agreeing with me that they should add Odd's hair into TUG!
Cuchaz; My bet is that things (Patreon etc) will noticeably pick up after Tall Worlds becomes a solid thing in more people's minds. In other words when it's known by many to be a working mod and videos start abounding showing people's stunts and adventures with it.
And as regards taking it for granted; I don't believe it will be. In fact I think it's simply too early to be asking these questions. Those who do know about the project have seen it in a standing pattern for so long that they sort of "take it for granted" that it will remain so like many other mods and sort of just wait with diminishing hope and only check in every once in a great while.
I fully expect that things will start going into overdrive once the community starts to become aware of a cubic chunks height mod revival finally being successful and something they can play with themselves!
++ Plus; there will be many things/features that people will want to donate for no matter how "Base-Level" it seems this mod is at first glance. For example:
- Tall Worlds API for more Modding compatibility options (Ore and Structure alteration, 3D Biomes, etc)
- Full Plug-in System for 3rd party Terrain Generators and Biomes etc
- Customizable Terrain Generator Interface for easy Custom Worlds
- Updating of Robinton's open source World Save Converter to include compatibility with your Tall Worlds Save Format. Allowing people to bring forward their previous height modded worlds (from all prior existing height mods including the very first one [ymod]).
- Updating open source MCEdit with compatibility for Tall Worlds.
- Updating open source WorldEdit with compatibility for Tall Worlds.
- Heck, you could help update all kinds of core community infrastructure for use with Tall Worlds. Doing this would directly feedback into support for Tall Worlds in general. The more common community tools that are directly compatible with Tall worlds the more people who will not only use it but will do all kinds of unique and wonderful things with it and make videos of such things etc. Essentially a snowball event.
* You could also (before everyone eventually moves on), probably do a reasonably sized Kickstarter or something to fully port Tall Worlds to 1.7.10, with 1.6.4 as an extended goal with higher pledges? I would definitely throw in a pledge for that. Make it reasonably sized and I'd call it easy money. Of course it would have to be after a functional and proven version has been released for your current platform of choice (1.8.x), and people would expect more than just a beta port, they would eventually want a fully functional version. But I don't think that should be too much of a problem since the largest battle would just be getting M3L and Tall Worlds ported to begin with.
- Add-ons: After all else you yourself (who is better qualified) could be funded to make quality add-ons for Tall Worlds. After all; other than things mentioned further above, a height mod by itself should mostly only be a height mod otherwise it will alienate lots of people by adding things that they do not want. However; extra features that can be added by choice or left out by choice by having them in the form of Add-ons (mods) is the perfect way to give EVERYONE what they want.
Add-ons could be anything from really cool well developed additive 3D Biomes (people could add just the ones they like) to custom mob-packs with mobs that primarily occupy certain height ranges or types of 3D Biomes to whatever!
- The Cubic Chunks Mod is back! Be a part of it's rebirth and Development.
-- Robinton's Mods: [ Mirror ] for some of his Mods incl Cubic Chunks Mod, due to DropBox broken links.
- Dungeon Generator for the Open Cubic Chunks Mod
- QuickSAVE-QuickLOAD for the Open Cubic Chunks Mod
Also; Multi-player is the largest key to support for most mods so far as I have seen over the years. Once Tall Worlds is stable and solid enough that people start making servers with it you will see FAR more attention and awareness, not the least of which is because most you-tubers do their videos from within multiplayer environments.
- The Cubic Chunks Mod is back! Be a part of it's rebirth and Development.
-- Robinton's Mods: [ Mirror ] for some of his Mods incl Cubic Chunks Mod, due to DropBox broken links.
- Dungeon Generator for the Open Cubic Chunks Mod
- QuickSAVE-QuickLOAD for the Open Cubic Chunks Mod