Minecraft Forums

How's progress been?

Quote from Cuchaz»

Wow, that's completely epic!

It looks like a completely different world engine than Minecraft uses though. Getting something like that working in Minecraft would be too large of a change. You'd be better off just using Spacecraft itself. =)

But importing every Minecraft functionnality to Spacecraft would be an even bigger change... x)

Quote from J0celyn»

But importing every Minecraft functionnality to Spacecraft would be an even bigger change... x)

True, but on the other hand, if the devs of Spacecraft will agree to release the code into public domain (they seem to be very generous about its use), you'll be directly contributing to development of a long-term public domain project with endless possibilies, not constantly trying to deobfuscate a privately owned commercial one without having any say about the course of its development at all.

I'm kind of interested in how their coordinate system works on a spherical planet. It should be theoretically impossible to deform a square mesh into a sphere without affecting connectivity.

Edit: checked the source. Haven't been able to figure it out. All the chunk interaction is 2D or 3D. The LOD stuff looks like it's entirely procedurally generated and doesn't reflect the 1:1 layer and isn't saved, though I could have missed something. Also of note, it looks like LOD blocks are made using the geometry shader to create rectangular prisms. You don't normally see that in blockworld games due to its inability to handle interior face culling. The 1:1 layer is meshed normally.

Also, to those suggesting using stuff from that game, it's written in C++11 and is fundamentally different from how Minecraft works. It wasn't built to accommodate the sheer amount of content and sophistication of Minecraft's procedural generation, and would likely not work particularly well if you tried to apply it to Minecraft. It's a promising start, but at this stage in the game, there's nothing worth taking away from it.

Not that excited about a spherical planet. Maybe more about a cubic planet. THAT would be cool. I mean, hey dude, you can jump off a sort of cliff but it is the edge of your planet, it feels like '*Yahhoooooooo!!! *jumps*'.

I would love that, and if that isn't Mincrafty...
=D

I've always been excited for Cube planets, even hollow cube planets! A long while back, as fr0stbyte124 will recall, I came up with the idea of using Tesseract boundary lines as the orientation/gravity flipping points for a cube planet.Here is a simplified explanation:

Think of the inner cube in the tesseract below as the surface of the cube planet. The lines extending outwards from the edges and corners would be the reorientation boundaries and the outermost surfaces would be the gravity limits, the boundary between the world and space.





Those same lines would continue extending in the same way below the surface to define the reorientation points down below. You could then look at the outer cube in the tesseract as the surface and what is inside as being underground, except that the lines would extend all the way straight to the center, the the central cube of lava, heh heh. You wouldn't want to get gravitationally trapped in that.

Of course, if you wanted to add some more spice to the planet you could give it a hollow central region where gravity completely flips upside down (ala MineUp!/GravityCraft mods), where you would walk on the inner surface oriented opposite of how you would be on the outer surface. Further in towards the center gravity would flip again; containing the central lava, or other solution, "sky" light source (inner-sun) for the inner-world inhabitants. You could map those gravity/orientation change points by deciding where to place further centered smaller cubes within the main one, the diagonal intersection points that travel to the center would continue defining those boundaries as they intersect each cube.

Or.. You could keep gravity oriented the same way all the way down and just have massive open regions underground with lots of glowstone and glowing mushrooms around or something.



* Of course; there would be algorithm implementations to address as well as how to deal with some topological terrain boundary gravity traps that could develop, which could at least temporarily trap a player in uneven boundary terrain.

** But I maintain that those are very minor issues and even add drama and something special to the nature of the playing environment! There should be something special about traveling over "the Edge" of the world, with some potential for avoidable danger involved. ;). It would even promote the idea of building safe tunnels/bridges across the edges that are shaped in such a way as to guarantee no gravity traps. I like it! Besides, a person in a gravity trap would just need to chisel or dig away some blocks to get out of the trap, no big deal.

*** This cube world design method was thought up in relation to use with a Cubic Chunks mod as well as Futurecraft; as such it even provides a seemless way to address gravity/orientation changes for craft (space or air) moving through the atmosphere of a cube world. Refer to the initial explanation with the inner cube as the surface and the outer cube as the outer atmosphere/gravity edge. (Yes, I know that's not how gravity works in the real world. I invoke playability! :P)


EDIT: To clarify; gravity and orientation would have only 6 directions, not angled (With 6 more inverted directions for inverted hollow-world models). Only the boundaries are angled. For instance: If flying a craft, say a hot-air balloon, over the North side of the planet the "Down" at the center of the face of the square would be the same as the "Down" the airship would feel 1 Km up for a ways past the vertical edge of the North square/surface, until it reaches that angled boundary brane whereupon it would reorient to the next sides direction of gravity. * So, when looking "Down" from that height you would see the next square planetary surface sideways for a while! A bomb (or anything) dropped from such a position would, however, change orientation and direction of fall as soon as it intersected the brane (which would be closer in the further down it goes).

I LOVE it! It is the perfect extension of unique Minecraftian physics so far as I'm concerned, and with a completely consistent and intuitive-ish structure and flow for this type of environment.

EDITx2: Also; a cube planet would make it possible to plan for and design lod solutions around more finite horizontal dimensions instead of infinite. Though you would want to remember to consider the dimensions of the outer-cube square face as the horizontal dimension limit rather than just the inner cubes surface square dimensions even though that's the main ground level.

Sounds pretty awesome MindCrak, but really - what's the feasability assessment here, and the timeframe? We don't even have Cubic Chunks yet... don't get me wrong if someone wants to work on that then that's great and I wish them luck, but seriously - ouch @ the code involved. I doubt even JRE on today's top-end PC hardware could cope with such a thing.

Quote from CosmicDan»

Sounds pretty awesome MindCrak, but really - what's the feasability assessment here, and the timeframe? We don't even have Cubic Chunks yet... don't get me wrong if someone wants to work on that then that's great and I wish them luck, but seriously - ouch @ the code involved. I doubt even JRE on today's top-end PC hardware could cope with such a thing.

Yeah, this wasn't meant as a suggestion for immediate implementation or anything, heh heh. It's just that there had been more talk about Spherical and Cube game planets up above so I wanted to throw this idea out there while people were thinking about it, as perhaps inspiration for future projects or additions. It's never to early to start thinking about how current methods might be developed or bridged into future ones.

Quote from MineCrak»

Yeah, this wasn't meant as a suggestion for immediate implementation or anything, heh heh. It's just that there had been more talk about Spherical and Cube game planets up above so I wanted to throw this idea out there while people were thinking about it, as perhaps inspiration for future projects or additions. It's never to early to start thinking about how current methods might be developed or bridged into future ones.

Yeah for sure. I've not played Futurecraft but I know about it, it's be amazing to play something like that. Also with Galacticraft. Insane project though; not just an infinite world but an infinite UNIVERSE lol!

How would the gravity work for the 6 faces of the cube planet though? I.e. "falling off the edge" would not be... ideal, you'd miss out on a lot of area. Wrap-around gravity? And what if someone were to mine right on the edge of one planet face...? The gravity calculations would be intense!

I support that idea! I love that.

But how would water work? Imagine there is a water fall just on the edge of the planet, it would render a strange thing. =)

I explained the gravity at the edges as well as I could in the post above. However; you could get some feel for such things by messing around with the original MineUp! mod for mc beta 1.8.1 or the further evolution of it in GravityCraft for mc 1.2.5. Or by watching the videos about them in their OPs.

In both, when making a world, you can set it up to have an upside down layer at the bottom. When you dig down to the half way point gravity flips you over, and yes, there can be some interesting effects. The bottom side of the planet, flipside, looks normal when you are at it but it co-exists with the other side at the same time. All structures etc face the correct way and work as expected. A LOT of work and detail went into making all that happen. Also, as the sun sets on one side it rises on the other. Go ahead, blow a hole all the way through the world and look from one side to the other, heh heh.

Also; at least in GravityCraft, there are items you can use to change your characters gravity as well as that of mobs and other things I think. So there is all kinds of fun and experimentation that can be done. They aren't completely bug free though and you probably need a fast computer, so don't be surprised.

* Considering that I know both MineT3485 and Ivorius, in fact I brought them together, it's not entirely out of the question that at least Ivorius might be willing to work on such a project, but only once all the other dependencies were available and stable, and once Minecraft itself stabilizes a bit. He knows now how much work goes into making such a thing work for even just one version of minecraft, updating for a whole new infrastructure is a major pain...

EDIT: Of course; if he could rely on a stable target like M3L to keep from having to rewrite absolutely everything for each version.. hmm..

Yeah, that would be so awesome.
You would draw my attention so much that I would not quit Minecraft for at least 60 years.
=D
(interior mind: ) "I want that mod, I want that mod, I want it. Come on, do it... Please...."

Quote from Cuchaz»

Cubic "planets" would be pretty stellar in Minecraft. First things first though. Let's reinvent the wheel develop new deobfuscation technology so we can build a new mod loader that allows us to make bigger changes safely so we can get cubic chunks working. =)

Yeah let's get right on that, and show the collective minds of MCP and Forge that they're doing it all wrong [/sarcasm]

Or; just make a coremod, or contribute to Forge directly... dunno if you're serious but it kind-of annoys me that this mod, and others, are "making their own mod loader" instead of forking/contributing to Forge and FML. API fragmentation in a in Minecraft is the LAST thing we need, we're already suffering performance and compatibility issues

In my family, you would say that "Vous vous êtes fait prendre pour un dondon". =)

Any way, you wanted to make it completely forge compatible, so there wouldn't be any problem. Would be cool if the mods on Forge could run with the M3L API (without Forge).

Hmm, that's interesting. I've not personally had any problem but then again I've only made one thread over there (and it was just a somewhat-advanced request for help, which went well).

Fair enough about the coremods stuff, but doesn't the same go for class access transformation and reflection? That's gotta be potentially destructive to a near extent too I'd think.

Are you saying (or hinting) that your mod loader and API is also doing it's own deobfuscation? If so, then I am indeed interested in your work. FYI, I work professionally in Android development and it often involves reverse engineering Java bytecode and dealing with this rebuilt bytecode that's obfuscated; so I've experience in it I must say that I'm not very impressed with the amount of variables and methods that are still ineligible in 1.7.10 - at least compared to 1.6.4, so I dunno what MCP is up to.

I see you already have a thread for this Magic Mojo Loader, so I will continue there

Quote from CosmicDan»

Are you saying (or hinting) that your mod loader and API is also doing it's own deobfuscation? If so, then I am indeed interested in your work. FYI, I work professionally in Android development and it often involves reverse engineering Java bytecode and dealing with this rebuilt bytecode that's obfuscated; so I've experience in it I must say that I'm not very impressed with the amount of variables and methods that are still ineligible in 1.7.10 - at least compared to 1.6.4, so I dunno what MCP is up to.

I see you already have a thread for this Magic Mojo Loader, so I will continue there

You might also be interested in { THIS } thread. It is the deobfuscation part of what Cuchaz was talking about (Enigma), and it's open source so you can help out to your hearts content!