Here's a Forge mod for the Cave generation parameters. It saves the parameters with the world file so you can have different worlds with different cave parameters at the same time.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Geographicraft (formerly Climate Control) - Control climate, ocean, and land sizes; stop chunk walls; put modded biomes into Default worlds, and more!
RTG plus - All the beautiful terrain of RTG, plus varied and beautiful trees and forests.
Ok, thanks, I will try it. But I might be back later for blonde instructions
Ok, your instructions (and especially the optifine ones, since I dont use optifine) are just confusing to me. Wouldnt it be easier to just edit the minecraft jar and replace the files in it with the files in your mods? I am really totally clueless about this
Yes, that will work, although you should make a copy in case you want to remove it at some point in the future; in that case, you'll want to delete META-INF from the jar and have to add -Dfml.ignorePatchDiscrepancies=true and -Dfml.ignoreInvalidMinecraftCertificates=true to the command line in the profile editor (the JVM arguments line at the bottom, as seen here; I only have the first because I used the method that Optifine uses)
Here's a Forge mod for the Cave generation parameters. It saves the parameters with the world file so you can have different worlds with different cave parameters at the same time.
Does that use the same source that you showed me? If so, there should also be an explanation of what the defaults mean (the ones you used are for 1.6.4 cave generation) and what the equivalents are for 1.7. Also, I noticed that you didn't check for the case of the size/frequency parameters being 0 or less, which will crash the game (random only accepts positive nonzero values); I'd suggest internally adding 1 to sizeControl where it is used in the cave generator, setting the default to 39 (or perhaps 14, resulting in 15, the default for 1.7 generation, since after all this is for 1.7) and adding a check for values less than zero when read from the configuration file, which will enable you to disable caves by setting the size to 0 (random only returns 0 when you use 1 as a parameter). Similarly, frequencyControl should be limited to a minimum of 1, which will result in a 100% chance of generating caves (actually, less because of how the size is determined).
Also, if the configuration file isn't created until after you make a world you'll need to first create a world then quit and delete the region files that were created so they are regenerated with the cave generation parameters you set, instead of having the generation suddenly change outside of the initial spawn area. As noted above, it should also have a line telling you what the parameters mean; I was thinking of something like this:
# Defaults are for 1.7 cave generation; for pre-1.7 cave generation, set sizeControl to 39
# and frequencyControl to 15. sizeControl sets the maximum number of caves in a cave system (0
# disables caves) and frequencyControl is the 1/x chance per chunk, so a value of 1 gives the
# highest chance (100%). Overall number of caves is significantly less than the values indicate.
sizeControl=14
frequencyControl=7
When the *mod* is first loaded, it creates a config files with the defaults for 1.6.x generation. The user can quit and alter it before creating their first world. No world created after the mod is installed should ever have its parameters changed; they're saved with the world. (Although bugs are possible - I'm just starting with parameter saving systems). The problem occurs with worlds created before starting the mod; they have the default parameters. Maybe I should set the defaults to 1.7 generation to avoid that problem.
I did put a little more explanation in the config:
sizeControl = config.get(caveControlCategory, "Size Control", 40,"Maximum cave size; typical is 1/8th as large").getInt();
frequencyControl = config.get(caveControlCategory, "Frequency Control", 15,"One in this many chunks has a cave complex on average").getInt();
If you mean the fog you normally see above ground, then this mod only removes the void fog effect, which makes the fog turn black and close in at lower levels, below about y=20.
Actually, I do, although I didn't do anything with them because I thought it'd be nice to still have some caves underground; as you can see in the examples I gave, ravines are only a fraction of the total underground space.
Also, I thought of another alternative to simply removing caves; how about just limiting the size of cave systems to 1-2 caves per system; basically just random single caves scattered across the map*? Of course, I could also make it so that normal-size cave systems generate, perhaps even as big as or bigger than those in pre-1.6 generation, but with a very low frequency, although it would be better to use a configuration file of some sort than make a separate version for each generation option; I'm not sure how to do this though, even with MCP available.
*Although with the chicken jockeys a lot of isolated caves like this is a recipe for uncontrolled zombie buildup.
Whoops didn't see this before I posted suggesting 1/2 x cave generation. This would work for me. The zombie buildup should be controlled through other means (mods).
Here's a Forge mod for the Cave generation parameters. It saves the parameters with the world file so you can have different worlds with different cave parameters at the same time.
Whoops didn't see this before I posted suggesting 1/2 x cave generation. This would work for me. The zombie buildup should be controlled through other means (mods).
I am going to try this, thanks!
Rather than reducing the size of caves, I'd suggest reducing the frequency instead (using a higher value); for example, here is what you get when you use 40 for both values, which generates cave systems in the same size range as 1.6.x (old cave generation) but at about 1/3 the frequency (1/40 chance per chunk instead of 1/15):
As you can see, caves are much less common, but you still get decent cave systems (I used the same seed as the examples in my OP, except filled in a map zoomed out two times); I actually use MCP for this, directly editing the class, as I don't want to install Forge 1.7.2 just to test the mod.
Looking at this, adding in a frequency control parameter for ravines would also be nice; the default is a 1/50 chance per chunk, which is rather high since a ravine will always generate, unlike caves, and they are about as long as the average spacing. Also, for the cave size, I suggest adding in the following right after the "int i1 = this.rand.nextInt..." line, so that you can specify very high values for size (such as 100, resulting in an average size of around 12) without having extremely large cave systems generate (i.e. so many caves it basically creates a big hole in the middle):
if (i1 > 39) i1 = 39;
This will limit the maximum size to the maximum possible with the 1.6.x cave generation, while not affecting the average much. Another thing I've done in my mods is specify a minimum size; that is, like this, which only allows cave systems with a size of minimumSize or more to generate:
You can even do more stuff; for example, in my current world I modified the cave generator to double the maximum size of caves, but keeping the average size the same:
Original (in generateLargeCaveNode and recursiveGenerate, 1.6.4 names):
Of course, adding too many options can make things confusing,
Also of note, I found another mod that allows you to change cave parameters (and pretty much any other aspect of world generation), with may more options to change (some are named very differently from what I used; for example, they use caveFrequency to describe what I call the size and caveRarity for the frequency).
Yes, that will work, although you should make a copy in case you want to remove it at some point in the future; in that case, you'll want to delete META-INF from the jar and have to add -Dfml.ignorePatchDiscrepancies=true and -Dfml.ignoreInvalidMinecraftCertificates=true to the command line in the profile editor (the JVM arguments line at the bottom, as seen here; I only have the first because I used the method that Optifine uses)
Rather than reducing the size of caves, I'd suggest reducing the frequency instead (using a higher value); for example, here is what you get when you use 40 for both values, which generates cave systems in the same size range as 1.6.x (old cave generation) but at about 1/3 the frequency (1/40 chance per chunk instead of 1/15):
<snip lots o'helpful stuff>
Yup, I meant half the Frequency of caves. Sorry I wasn't clear. Thanks for the explanation and the other mod link. I tried Zeno's mod and method and altered the frequency to half in the config. Although.... darn. I misunderstood the value and halved it, I think I should have *doubled* it to create half the chance. Blarg. So much for that hour of gameplay, time to try again lol.
On another note, doesn't this method only affect the world at generation? So if you had difficulty with conflicts, you could just clear the other mods, create the world, quit out, take out the cavegen mod and put the others back in, and you'd be all set? (except for other mods that affect world gen, that is. I think MoCreatures does).
Thanks again for modding this up and giving such helpful advice!
Yup, I meant half the Frequency of caves. Sorry I wasn't clear. Thanks for the explanation and the other mod link. I tried Zeno's mod and method and altered the frequency to half in the config. Although.... darn. I misunderstood the value and halved it, I think I should have *doubled* it to create half the chance. Blarg. So much for that hour of gameplay, time to try again lol.
On another note, doesn't this method only affect the world at generation? So if you had difficulty with conflicts, you could just clear the other mods, create the world, quit out, take out the cavegen mod and put the others back in, and you'd be all set? (except for other mods that affect world gen, that is. I think MoCreatures does).
Thanks again for modding this up and giving such helpful advice!
When you say you adjusted the frequency to half, you set it to 30, not 7, right? 7 would actually generate about twice as many caves as 1.6.x cave generation; in other words, equivalent to my "double old caves mod", which used 40 and 7 for size/frequency.
BTW, this gives you an idea of what to expect with a size of 40 and frequency of 30; I also recommend using Unmined to look at a test world before playing to ensure that you set it the way you wanted (Unmined is simple to use; open the level.dat file and set the slider on the right side to around 60):
That actually looks pretty good if you want some good cave systems but not all being interconnected or too hard to find.
When you say you adjusted the frequency to half, you set it to 30, not 7, right? 7 would actually generate about twice as many caves as 1.6.x cave generation; in other words, equivalent to my "double old caves mod", which used 40 and 7 for size/frequency.
Yeah, apparently I can't read lol. The next time I had used 30 and left the size the same, but still ran into a *lot* of caves that connected. So I am trying again with less frequency and size.
I do have a question about using "Large Biomes" - since everything is expanded, the cave systems would be expanded too right? So I'd need to adjust for that, if that's the case.
Edit: I tried a 40 freq / 20 size Large Biomes using seed -1071725924515535711. If the shown area is just where I spawned (looks the right size from the "what I can see" pie slice), then this is what I'm looking for. Mostly simple cave systems with one somewhat complex one. (I don't have online image hosting set up so I can't put a pic up.)
I do have a question about using "Large Biomes" - since everything is expanded, the cave systems would be expanded too right? So I'd need to adjust for that, if that's the case.
World type has no effect on cave generation; in fact, the only thing that affects cave generation is the world seed; assuming the cave generator itself is the same, you'll get the same caves, at the same coordinates, in 1.6 and 1.7 despite the big changes to terrain generation (of course, if one seed/world type has an ocean where another has land then there won't be any caves where water is, but below it they will be the same).
Thank you TMC, that's good to know I'm still playing around with sizes, but the 40/20 seems to make most of the caves I hit end reasonably quickly, with no more than two or three branches. That's just what I'm looking for, as I can go in, explore, clear it and be out in 20 minutes or so. That's all one should expect of a starting character imo.
I do see some bigger cave complexes, but those are best done as expeditions, AFTER I've got my house set up, farm going, food stocked up, iron everything, etc. No point in me finding my way down to y-12 with stone tools, after all
To both you and Zeno, thanks for all of the help and advice!
Back with a quick update - I'm actually at 80/15 now (large biomes) and finding it to be just right. In each couple of minutes of travel there are a few shallow caves with enough coal and iron to get going, a regular amount of ravines with the same, and generally one cave complex that goes down to diamonds level at its lowest point. Perfecto
Good Evening all,
I really hope you can help me. Ok I'm playing minecraft v1.7.2 because the forge I’m using seems to work with that one. So I did all the work of going in & deleting the meta folder & all & I have mods that work in game & all is well & I'm happy (oh btw I’m running forge version 10) on a windows 7 computer. So anyway my mods all work & I dug down into the ground putting in nice stone brick stairs as I went till I hit bottom. So I switched to creative & packed a ton of tnt & blew a big hole (I wanted this to happen to open the area up) but it’s all dark & I tried to put this mod in & it doesn’t show up on my mods list & I’ve downloaded 2 other non-related mods to this tonight & they work & I went to creative mode & put glowstone blocks everywhere in the cavern & it really lit up the room but when I switched back it went dark. Can you help me if you can please & let me know what I’m doing wrong? Thanks all & take care
Good Evening all,
I really hope you can help me. Ok I'm playing minecraft v1.7.2 because the forge I’m using seems to work with that one. So I did all the work of going in & deleting the meta folder & all & I have mods that work in game & all is well & I'm happy (oh btw I’m running forge version 10) on a windows 7 computer. So anyway my mods all work & I dug down into the ground putting in nice stone brick stairs as I went till I hit bottom. So I switched to creative & packed a ton of tnt & blew a big hole (I wanted this to happen to open the area up) but it’s all dark & I tried to put this mod in & it doesn’t show up on my mods list & I’ve downloaded 2 other non-related mods to this tonight & they work & I went to creative mode & put glowstone blocks everywhere in the cavern & it really lit up the room but when I switched back it went dark. Can you help me if you can please & let me know what I’m doing wrong? Thanks all & take care
I assume that you used the "no void fog" mod and put it in the jar according to the instructions shown here; did you put it in the Forge jar or the 1.7.2 jar? Because if the latter then Forge uses its own jar, labeled something like 1.7.2-ForgeXXX; note also that you don't need to create a new profile in this case because Forge already did so (only to prevent the launcher from trying to update the jar).
Also, I haven't tested with Forge but I assume (may be wrong) that the 1.7 versions of Forge work the same way as 1.6 versions (I've used Forge on 1.6.2 and added some of my own mods the same way without problems, but haven't used any newer versions), allowing you to modify the jar, just requiring you to add -Dfml.ignoreInvalidMinecraftCertificates=true and -Dfml.ignorePatchDiscrepancies=true to the JVM arguments line (otherwise the game won't start; Forge does this because directly modifying the jar can mess things up, but I doubt any other mods would conflict with mine). That said, this mod won't show up in any case because it isn't a Forge mod.
Also, if you have Optifine installed you can turn off void fog that way as well.
U are the MAN!! lol i downloaed otpifine & it got it to work. Yeah I first started I went into the forge .jar folder & started messing around there deleting the meta folder & it wouldnt play so I figured out I had to go into the actual 1.7.2 folder & modify the stuff there for the mods to work cause the other folder is also called 1.7.2 but it says forge 10.1040 or something like that & it has its own .jar folder in there. But anyway I got it to work & wanted to thankyou so so much for all the great information. Take care & happy minecrafting :-)
Geographicraft (formerly Climate Control) - Control climate, ocean, and land sizes; stop chunk walls; put modded biomes into Default worlds, and more!
RTG plus - All the beautiful terrain of RTG, plus varied and beautiful trees and forests.
Yes, that will work, although you should make a copy in case you want to remove it at some point in the future; in that case, you'll want to delete META-INF from the jar and have to add -Dfml.ignorePatchDiscrepancies=true and -Dfml.ignoreInvalidMinecraftCertificates=true to the command line in the profile editor (the JVM arguments line at the bottom, as seen here; I only have the first because I used the method that Optifine uses)
Does that use the same source that you showed me? If so, there should also be an explanation of what the defaults mean (the ones you used are for 1.6.4 cave generation) and what the equivalents are for 1.7. Also, I noticed that you didn't check for the case of the size/frequency parameters being 0 or less, which will crash the game (random only accepts positive nonzero values); I'd suggest internally adding 1 to sizeControl where it is used in the cave generator, setting the default to 39 (or perhaps 14, resulting in 15, the default for 1.7 generation, since after all this is for 1.7) and adding a check for values less than zero when read from the configuration file, which will enable you to disable caves by setting the size to 0 (random only returns 0 when you use 1 as a parameter). Similarly, frequencyControl should be limited to a minimum of 1, which will result in a 100% chance of generating caves (actually, less because of how the size is determined).
That is to say:
Also, if the configuration file isn't created until after you make a world you'll need to first create a world then quit and delete the region files that were created so they are regenerated with the cave generation parameters you set, instead of having the generation suddenly change outside of the initial spawn area. As noted above, it should also have a line telling you what the parameters mean; I was thinking of something like this:
TheMasterCaver's First World - possibly the most caved-out world in Minecraft history - includes world download.
TheMasterCaver's World - my own version of Minecraft largely based on my views of how the game should have evolved since 1.6.4.
Why do I still play in 1.6.4?
I did put a little more explanation in the config:
Geographicraft (formerly Climate Control) - Control climate, ocean, and land sizes; stop chunk walls; put modded biomes into Default worlds, and more!
RTG plus - All the beautiful terrain of RTG, plus varied and beautiful trees and forests.
Whoops didn't see this before I posted suggesting 1/2 x cave generation. This would work for me. The zombie buildup should be controlled through other means (mods).
I am going to try this, thanks!
Rather than reducing the size of caves, I'd suggest reducing the frequency instead (using a higher value); for example, here is what you get when you use 40 for both values, which generates cave systems in the same size range as 1.6.x (old cave generation) but at about 1/3 the frequency (1/40 chance per chunk instead of 1/15):
As you can see, caves are much less common, but you still get decent cave systems (I used the same seed as the examples in my OP, except filled in a map zoomed out two times); I actually use MCP for this, directly editing the class, as I don't want to install Forge 1.7.2 just to test the mod.
Looking at this, adding in a frequency control parameter for ravines would also be nice; the default is a 1/50 chance per chunk, which is rather high since a ravine will always generate, unlike caves, and they are about as long as the average spacing. Also, for the cave size, I suggest adding in the following right after the "int i1 = this.rand.nextInt..." line, so that you can specify very high values for size (such as 100, resulting in an average size of around 12) without having extremely large cave systems generate (i.e. so many caves it basically creates a big hole in the middle):
This will limit the maximum size to the maximum possible with the 1.6.x cave generation, while not affecting the average much. Another thing I've done in my mods is specify a minimum size; that is, like this, which only allows cave systems with a size of minimumSize or more to generate:
You can even do more stuff; for example, in my current world I modified the cave generator to double the maximum size of caves, but keeping the average size the same:
Original (in generateLargeCaveNode and recursiveGenerate, 1.6.4 names):
Modified:
Of course, adding too many options can make things confusing,
Also of note, I found another mod that allows you to change cave parameters (and pretty much any other aspect of world generation), with may more options to change (some are named very differently from what I used; for example, they use caveFrequency to describe what I call the size and caveRarity for the frequency).
TheMasterCaver's First World - possibly the most caved-out world in Minecraft history - includes world download.
TheMasterCaver's World - my own version of Minecraft largely based on my views of how the game should have evolved since 1.6.4.
Why do I still play in 1.6.4?
Ok, I will try it out. Thanks!
Yup, I meant half the Frequency of caves. Sorry I wasn't clear. Thanks for the explanation and the other mod link. I tried Zeno's mod and method and altered the frequency to half in the config. Although.... darn. I misunderstood the value and halved it, I think I should have *doubled* it to create half the chance. Blarg. So much for that hour of gameplay, time to try again lol.
On another note, doesn't this method only affect the world at generation? So if you had difficulty with conflicts, you could just clear the other mods, create the world, quit out, take out the cavegen mod and put the others back in, and you'd be all set? (except for other mods that affect world gen, that is. I think MoCreatures does).
Thanks again for modding this up and giving such helpful advice!
When you say you adjusted the frequency to half, you set it to 30, not 7, right? 7 would actually generate about twice as many caves as 1.6.x cave generation; in other words, equivalent to my "double old caves mod", which used 40 and 7 for size/frequency.
TheMasterCaver's First World - possibly the most caved-out world in Minecraft history - includes world download.
TheMasterCaver's World - my own version of Minecraft largely based on my views of how the game should have evolved since 1.6.4.
Why do I still play in 1.6.4?
That actually looks pretty good if you want some good cave systems but not all being interconnected or too hard to find.
TheMasterCaver's First World - possibly the most caved-out world in Minecraft history - includes world download.
TheMasterCaver's World - my own version of Minecraft largely based on my views of how the game should have evolved since 1.6.4.
Why do I still play in 1.6.4?
Yeah, apparently I can't read lol. The next time I had used 30 and left the size the same, but still ran into a *lot* of caves that connected. So I am trying again with less frequency and size.
I do have a question about using "Large Biomes" - since everything is expanded, the cave systems would be expanded too right? So I'd need to adjust for that, if that's the case.
Edit: I tried a 40 freq / 20 size Large Biomes using seed -1071725924515535711. If the shown area is just where I spawned (looks the right size from the "what I can see" pie slice), then this is what I'm looking for. Mostly simple cave systems with one somewhat complex one. (I don't have online image hosting set up so I can't put a pic up.)
World type has no effect on cave generation; in fact, the only thing that affects cave generation is the world seed; assuming the cave generator itself is the same, you'll get the same caves, at the same coordinates, in 1.6 and 1.7 despite the big changes to terrain generation (of course, if one seed/world type has an ocean where another has land then there won't be any caves where water is, but below it they will be the same).
TheMasterCaver's First World - possibly the most caved-out world in Minecraft history - includes world download.
TheMasterCaver's World - my own version of Minecraft largely based on my views of how the game should have evolved since 1.6.4.
Why do I still play in 1.6.4?
I do see some bigger cave complexes, but those are best done as expeditions, AFTER I've got my house set up, farm going, food stocked up, iron everything, etc. No point in me finding my way down to y-12 with stone tools, after all
To both you and Zeno, thanks for all of the help and advice!
HZ
Anyway, nice mods!
forgive my bad english.
The method used to generate caves is actually known as "Perlin worms":
Look familiar?
TheMasterCaver's First World - possibly the most caved-out world in Minecraft history - includes world download.
TheMasterCaver's World - my own version of Minecraft largely based on my views of how the game should have evolved since 1.6.4.
Why do I still play in 1.6.4?
I really hope you can help me. Ok I'm playing minecraft v1.7.2 because the forge I’m using seems to work with that one. So I did all the work of going in & deleting the meta folder & all & I have mods that work in game & all is well & I'm happy (oh btw I’m running forge version 10) on a windows 7 computer. So anyway my mods all work & I dug down into the ground putting in nice stone brick stairs as I went till I hit bottom. So I switched to creative & packed a ton of tnt & blew a big hole (I wanted this to happen to open the area up) but it’s all dark & I tried to put this mod in & it doesn’t show up on my mods list & I’ve downloaded 2 other non-related mods to this tonight & they work & I went to creative mode & put glowstone blocks everywhere in the cavern & it really lit up the room but when I switched back it went dark. Can you help me if you can please & let me know what I’m doing wrong? Thanks all & take care
I assume that you used the "no void fog" mod and put it in the jar according to the instructions shown here; did you put it in the Forge jar or the 1.7.2 jar? Because if the latter then Forge uses its own jar, labeled something like 1.7.2-ForgeXXX; note also that you don't need to create a new profile in this case because Forge already did so (only to prevent the launcher from trying to update the jar).
Also, I haven't tested with Forge but I assume (may be wrong) that the 1.7 versions of Forge work the same way as 1.6 versions (I've used Forge on 1.6.2 and added some of my own mods the same way without problems, but haven't used any newer versions), allowing you to modify the jar, just requiring you to add -Dfml.ignoreInvalidMinecraftCertificates=true and -Dfml.ignorePatchDiscrepancies=true to the JVM arguments line (otherwise the game won't start; Forge does this because directly modifying the jar can mess things up, but I doubt any other mods would conflict with mine). That said, this mod won't show up in any case because it isn't a Forge mod.
Also, if you have Optifine installed you can turn off void fog that way as well.
TheMasterCaver's First World - possibly the most caved-out world in Minecraft history - includes world download.
TheMasterCaver's World - my own version of Minecraft largely based on my views of how the game should have evolved since 1.6.4.
Why do I still play in 1.6.4?
U are the MAN!! lol i downloaed otpifine & it got it to work. Yeah I first started I went into the forge .jar folder & started messing around there deleting the meta folder & it wouldnt play so I figured out I had to go into the actual 1.7.2 folder & modify the stuff there for the mods to work cause the other folder is also called 1.7.2 but it says forge 10.1040 or something like that & it has its own .jar folder in there. But anyway I got it to work & wanted to thankyou so so much for all the great information. Take care & happy minecrafting :-)