The Meaning of Life, the Universe, and Everything.
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9/26/2012
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I really dislike the current method of gaining a Thaumonomicon-- it kind of strikes me as very meta, having to look up instructions just to get started. Before anyone tries to tell me that a lot of other mods do the same thing, let me mention that I don't play most of those mods, and that's probably one of the reasons why. The ones I do play that offer tips for getting started, aren't quite the same-- most of them are simple enough that you can figure it out just by experimenting a little, even if most people (including me) don't bother. But with Thaumcraft? Who's going to figure out that they need to wave a wand at a bookcase to get the thaumonomicon? It's somewhat immersion-breaking for me. Plus, with how self-contained the rest of the mod is, it just seems inconsistent.
I guess I'm wondering if that part of the whole process has changed along with everything else, and if not, is it possible to add an alternative? While a wizard tower or something to seek out and loot for a Thaumonomicon might be awesome, I would really just like a less meta method. The simplest I can think of is maybe adding a config option that disables the "recipe," so to speak, for the Thaumonomicon in favor of, say, spawning it as dungeon loot or (very rarely) in village library chests. Or maybe just have hooks for that in the API and I can figure it out on my own? Although, now that I think about it, I suppose there might be difficulties in determining the owner of the book... I don't know enough about that, though. Would that sort of thing be possible?
Haven't played any Thaumcraft 2 yet unfortunately. But I plan on checking it out sometime soon (If only for those neat sounding eldritch obelisks and adorable companion chests :3)
Most of the grief I've seen players having with the Taint in TC2 seems to be about the rate at which it spreads. Are any of the Tainted mobs in TC2 particularly dangerous? It seems to me that with the inclusion of taint poison (which I believe was absent from TC2) and tentacles popping out of the ground, the new version of the taint may actually be more deadly than TC2's taint.
Also I believe Azonor mentioned that certain aspects of the taint, such as it's growth rate will be toggle-able.
If that's true I'm definitely ramping the taint in my private server up to 11. Which I'm sure won't make my friends very happy, but I like a challenge XD
Try Tainted -insert (almost) any mob-.
Tainted creepers, pigs, chickens, cows, wisps, villagers, sheep, trees (yes, the trees were aliiive).
Oddly enough enderman, skeletons, zombies, spiders, silverfish were not affected.
I think I'll just mark a taint biome with a waypoint, get the hell out of dodge and return later when I'm good and ready lol
Maybe a shard combined with a book? I don't know about most, but it's a rare day I find a village (in anything other than superflat, at least), or a dungeon.
I really dislike the current method of gaining a Thaumonomicon-- it kind of strikes me as very meta, having to look up instructions just to get started. Before anyone tries to tell me that a lot of other mods do the same thing, let me mention that I don't play most of those mods, and that's probably one of the reasons why. The ones I do play that offer tips for getting started, aren't quite the same-- most of them are simple enough that you can figure it out just by experimenting a little, even if most people (including me) don't bother. But with Thaumcraft? Who's going to figure out that they need to wave a wand at a bookcase to get the thaumonomicon? It's somewhat immersion-breaking for me. Plus, with how self-contained the rest of the mod is, it just seems inconsistent.
I guess I'm wondering if that part of the whole process has changed along with everything else, and if not, is it possible to add an alternative? While a wizard tower or something to seek out and loot for a Thaumonomicon might be awesome, I would really just like a less meta method. The simplest I can think of is maybe adding a config option that disables the "recipe," so to speak, for the Thaumonomicon in favor of, say, spawning it as dungeon loot or (very rarely) in village library chests. Or maybe just have hooks for that in the API and I can figure it out on my own? Although, now that I think about it, I suppose there might be difficulties in determining the owner of the book... I don't know enough about that, though. Would that sort of thing be possible?
The op seems to have the most minimal information of all the mods I've ever seen. Teaches you how to make a wand and thaumonomicon. That's it. Seeing as you had to read a bunch of other things for installing forge as well as the mod itself this shouldn't be a problem at all. Chances are if you hit that download button you also saw the getting started section anyway.
And the thing with having to find a thaumonomicon in a randomly generated structure is, well the random part. If you get really unlucky are you willing to waste a lot of time searching for a randomly generated structure just to even begin learning about the mod? Sounds like bad game (or mod in this case) design to me.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Due to my snarky and sarcastic personality I can easily be seen as a jerk. If I've offended you in any way it was likely unintended.
The op seems to have the most minimal information of all the mods I've ever seen. Teaches you how to make a wand and thaumonomicon. That's it. Seeing as you had to read a bunch of other things for installing forge as well as the mod itself this shouldn't be a problem at all. Chances are if you hit that download button you also saw the getting started section anyway.
And the thing with having to find a thaumonomicon in a randomly generated structure is, well the random part. If you get really unlucky are you willing to waste a lot of time searching for a randomly generated structure just to even begin learning about the mod? Sounds like bad game (or mod in this case) design to me.
That's not my point. The idea is immersion and meta, not being unable to understand how to do it. I regularly compile and maintain modpacks for my private server; I think I'd know how to read an OP by now. My point is that having to go outside of the mod itself for information breaks the immersiveness of the experience. Sure, I'm hardly running a hardcore roleplaying server here-- nevertheless I prefer mods that are self-contained and are both simple and intuitive enough to understand on their own (see: why I never got into IC2 or Buildcraft or anything of their ilk). Thaumcraft is very close as-is to my "vision," I guess you could call it, and, with the overhaul of the research system, the only thing that keeps it from being absolutely perfect in my eyes is the method by which you obtain the Thaumonomicon. That's literally it. It's because it's that close, and that small (I think, anyway) that I dare suggest it-- I wouldn't want to do anything even close to asking Azanor to do more than he's already doing.
As for the second part, I haveabsolutely noproblem with that. The idea of having to actively look for it actually appeals to me; it would feel more like lost knowledge to be found and recovered that way, instead of just popping this life-changing manual of incredible power into existence with nothing more valuable than one gold nugget and a random magic crystal. Hell, the leather needed for the books are more time-consuming to find and gather than either of those; it just doesn't feel as unique and valuable as it should be. As for wasting a lot of time, well... I rarely ever tell my server players precisely what's in my modpacks. Since I happen to be the slightly sadistic whimsical sort of server admin, they've had to endure some nasty surprises over the various iterations of servers I've run. A little treat like that would keep them on their toes. However, I'm very much aware that it wouldn't appeal to others, which is why I suggested it as a config option.
I must agree with one thing here: there could be another way of getting Thaumonomicon that feels more "I've learned how to do that in-game instead of looking it on web!". However, how to do that is another challenge indeed. Very few mods actually have in-game manuals, and ThaumCraft for sure is one of those who does it best. Perhaps only Tinker's Construct does it better, from the mods that I play.
I run a small server for my pack of friends. And while I know a lot of mods, my fellow friends barely even know what the mods offer in terms of gameplay, as they are quite new to the modded minecraft. Like ShallowFire, I don't really tell my folks what's in the pack. Sure, I do mail them list of mods that I add or remove, but that's about all. All they get are the names of the mods. And I doubt anyone even bothers googling. "Hey, let's just ask uncle Iggy!"
It shouldn't be a surprise to anyone that the mods they learn quickest (as in, first), are the mods that offer in-game manuals. ThaumCraft is pretty much self-explanatory when you have Thaumonomicon. But until you get it, you're oblivious of what you can do. Sure, I could tell them "go to that website and read", but that's just no fun. Besides, everyone plays at their own pace, and we're not often in touch. Thus it would be a good idea to blend the creation (or acquiring) of Thaumonomicon into the game and its roleplaying aspect.
It may be fun to actually find Thaumonomicons as loot somewhere in world, and some players would be willing to spend a lot of time to find it - but it's certainly not appealing to everyone. Especially to those, who don't really like exploring, or those, who have little time for it (maybe someone else is doing all the exploring and resource harvesting).
Unlike how it's done in Tinker's Construct, I don't think I'd want to have Thaumonomicon spawned in my inventory, though. While it may be the safest way to go, it might not necessarily be the most entertaining method.
As I support the idea to have different way of getting Thaumonomicon, let me throw some ideas. Thinking them at random, though:
- As mentioned by ShallowFire, they could spawn in dungeons, villages, towers, etc. etc. Or perhaps you could convert one Research Note into your own very first Thaumonomicon?
- Like in Tinker's Construct, but instead of spawning the Thaumonomicon itself, the user could simply get a simple note in hand, telling the very basic HOW-TOs of ThaumCraft. How to craft the first wand, what materials can be used, and of course how to craft Thaumonomicon. And if someone would lose the notes and get it back, the recipe could be as simple as a piece of paper with a vis shard.
- WAAAAAAAAAAGH!
My suggestions:
Create an item called "Arcane Page", you have to collect 9 of them and create the Thaumonomicon. Want more challenge? number the pages 1-9 and you have to have one of each page to create the Thaumonomicon.
Have the pages spawn randomly in the world, perhaps as "seeds" that drop when you break tall grass. Or fall out of tree leaves like apples. Or, mob drops, maybe just an Enderman drop. Make it tougher? Drop when you break an Eldrich Monolith.
vanilla minecraft itself doesnt give you any explanation on how to craft anything.
imagine, you would be playing this game for the first time. if you didnt already know all the recipes or looked them up before, would you know, how to do anything in the game?
in that regard, only having to remember one recipe in thaumcraft 3.0 is a gigantic leap forward.
adding the book as dungeon loot is not a bad idea. even if you dont know how to craft it, you might find it later on in a chest.
I "discovered" Twilight Forest in a mod pack I was playing by the simple expedient of finding the achivements, with a core achievement being "Create a portal to twilight forest". I can't recall if the achivement text was descriptinve enough or it simply served as the initial incentive - but at any rate, associating the first steps in any mod with achievements quickly serves to bootstrap new players through the things they need to do to unlock the mods potential.
To be honest, if I download a mod I want to at least know how to start playing. I'll read the basics or getting started on the wiki and everything else I would leave to nei and me to figure out. As for thaumcraft after you get a thaumonomicon, which is basic stuff. Everything is easier from there.
As for new stuff suggestions:
I'm sticking with my ancient civilizations.
In your thaumonomicon there would be another tab, for the sake of the idea lets call it eldritch. If you look at the tab it will be inscribed with the thaumic symbols or language. Not only that but the page would be ripped out. Across your many journeys you came across ruins of what seems like an ancient civilization. Around there are many obsidian totems, maybe here you can learn to replicate what they have done, using the ancient arts. All around where there should be pure nodes are chaos node. It seems apparent that they used some sort of node as a sacrifice. The stuff they used was obviously unpredictable and dangerous. Upon searching more you find a page, the page you were missing, on it are more researchable stuff... etc you get the point.
My idea would be to add a village building ( can be disabled in config ofc ) and there could be an NPC selling it. ( laboratory and a alchemist )
not a bad idea. there are thaumcraft villagers anyways. some of them could sell the thaumonomicon, or have it in one of their chests.
also, i really liked the crystal farms from thaumcraft 2. the crystal clusters actually grew over time and you could harvest shards from them with, what is now the golem bell.
would be nice if something like that made a return. a garden full of crystal clusters to harvest vis shards.
not a bad idea. there are thaumcraft villagers anyways. some of them could sell the thaumonomicon, or have it in one of their chests.
also, i really liked the crystal farms from thaumcraft 2. the crystal clusters actually grew over time and you could harvest shards from them with, what is now the golem bell.
would be nice if something like that made a return. a garden full of crystal clusters to harvest vis shards.
I think that'd be interesting, a method of 'renewable' shards at perhaps a cost to the aura or a catalyst to facilitate their growth.
imagine, you would be playing this game for the first time. if you didnt already know all the recipes or looked them up before, would you know, how to do anything in the game?
Ah, memories...
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
What makes you think I was ever being reasonable? I'm sitting here with a pile of guns while wearing a flamethrower, and you thought that, at some point, I was being reasonable?
As far as the thaumonomicon discovery goes I was actually thinking there could be paintings that hint at thaumcraft things , getting new players interested in thaumaturgy.
I must agree with one thing here: there could be another way of getting Thaumonomicon that feels more "I've learned how to do that in-game instead of looking it on web!". However, how to do that is another challenge indeed. Very few mods actually have in-game manuals, and ThaumCraft for sure is one of those who does it best. Perhaps only Tinker's Construct does it better, from the mods that I play.
I run a small server for my pack of friends. And while I know a lot of mods, my fellow friends barely even know what the mods offer in terms of gameplay, as they are quite new to the modded minecraft. Like ShallowFire, I don't really tell my folks what's in the pack. Sure, I do mail them list of mods that I add or remove, but that's about all. All they get are the names of the mods. And I doubt anyone even bothers googling. "Hey, let's just ask uncle Iggy!"
It shouldn't be a surprise to anyone that the mods they learn quickest (as in, first), are the mods that offer in-game manuals. ThaumCraft is pretty much self-explanatory when you have Thaumonomicon. But until you get it, you're oblivious of what you can do. Sure, I could tell them "go to that website and read", but that's just no fun. Besides, everyone plays at their own pace, and we're not often in touch. Thus it would be a good idea to blend the creation (or acquiring) of Thaumonomicon into the game and its roleplaying aspect.
It may be fun to actually find Thaumonomicons as loot somewhere in world, and some players would be willing to spend a lot of time to find it - but it's certainly not appealing to everyone. Especially to those, who don't really like exploring, or those, who have little time for it (maybe someone else is doing all the exploring and resource harvesting).
Unlike how it's done in Tinker's Construct, I don't think I'd want to have Thaumonomicon spawned in my inventory, though. While it may be the safest way to go, it might not necessarily be the most entertaining method.
As I support the idea to have different way of getting Thaumonomicon, let me throw some ideas. Thinking them at random, though:
- As mentioned by ShallowFire, they could spawn in dungeons, villages, towers, etc. etc. Or perhaps you could convert one Research Note into your own very first Thaumonomicon?
- Like in Tinker's Construct, but instead of spawning the Thaumonomicon itself, the user could simply get a simple note in hand, telling the very basic HOW-TOs of ThaumCraft. How to craft the first wand, what materials can be used, and of course how to craft Thaumonomicon. And if someone would lose the notes and get it back, the recipe could be as simple as a piece of paper with a vis shard.
- WAAAAAAAAAAGH!
vanilla minecraft itself doesnt give you any explanation on how to craft anything.
imagine, you would be playing this game for the first time. if you didnt already know all the recipes or looked them up before, would you know, how to do anything in the game?
in that regard, only having to remember one recipe in thaumcraft 3.0 is a gigantic leap forward.
adding the book as dungeon loot is not a bad idea. even if you dont know how to craft it, you might find it later on in a chest.
To be honest, if I download a mod I want to at least know how to start playing. I'll read the basics or getting started on the wiki and everything else I would leave to nei and me to figure out. As for thaumcraft after you get a thaumonomicon, which is basic stuff. Everything is easier from there.
I requested it as a config option. Repeat: config option. Emphasis: option. If Azanor can't put it in simply as an alternative (assuming he hasn't already "fixed" it, so to speak) for whatever reason, then I can certainly live without it.
That said, why is it that you're talking about it like the suggestion was for a concrete change? That's like saying no one should be allowed to have a salt shaker because you don't think the dish needs any more salt. It's perfectly fine if the restaurant tells me they don't and aren't going to offer me a salt shaker, but, at the risk of sounding rude-- why should your personal preference inform the potential development of a very small, hopefully simple change that would make me and possibly some others very happy, and that you can decide to opt out of it with no repercussions whatsoever? :/
As for Lord_Yngas's ideas, I don't think I very much like the idea of spawning with the Thaumonomicon. I dislike spawning with anything at the start (it's more organic, as well as more of an accomplishment, to start with nothing and work your way up from there), but, disregarding that, I happen to believe that power like thaumaturgy should be something you have to either find or work for, something that feels rare and valuable (even if technically everyone with this mod installed will get into it eventually, but the point is feeling, not fact). It shouldn't feel like wood or stone-- something you'd never possibly want for, no matter how useful it might be (unless you're doing a megaproject, but the metaphor falls apart at that point). It should feel as valuable as diamonds. That's why I suggested spawning it as loot-- because then it becomes comparable.
Of course, I'm not sure how Thaumonomicons work regarding research and ownership, so spawning it as dungeon loot might not be feasible. Buying it from a villager (I'd prefer as little work for Azanor as possible, so just the librarian, maybe) would probably work, but that wouldn't have the same feel as finding it in a dungeon. Like poking around houses for the odd hidden item versus an end-of-dungeon reward in Zelda, I guess.
not a bad idea. there are thaumcraft villagers anyways. some of them could sell the thaumonomicon, or have it in one of their chests.
also, i really liked the crystal farms from thaumcraft 2. the crystal clusters actually grew over time and you could harvest shards from them with, what is now the golem bell.
would be nice if something like that made a return. a garden full of crystal clusters to harvest vis shards.
Sounds like an interesting idea, and good for decorations. Wouldn't that kind of go against the new theme of having to go out and explore for things, though? Maybe just make it really slow, like Azanor mentioned for the new aspect system. That way farming it would be a nice extra boost, but wouldn't be lucrative enough to fuel research on its own.
As far as the thaumonomicon discovery goes I was actually thinking there could be paintings that hint at thaumcraft things , getting new players interested in thaumaturgy.
That actually sounds interesting. However, paintings are kind of weird in Minecraft, so I'm not sure that'd work. Plus, how exactly would anyone go about that sort of hinting?
The thaumonomicon acquisition effort is tricky. Make it too hard to get and people might give up on Thaumcraft before they really have started, but I do get making the thaumonomicon feel valuable or an accomplishment to have. Maybe have monsters drop knowledge fragments that combine into the basic pages of the thaumonomicon but require no research ? Once you have all the basic pages you could combine them together with leather and string to make the the true thaumonomicon that all other research is added into. You could make it so the amount of fragments per page part of a config to make it easier or harder.
Another alternative is to have dungeons or a new world gen structure contain a "tattered book" version of the thaumonomicon that you have to combine the knowledge fragments with that results in a random starting page being restored. The amount of fragments to restore a page could be random per book, so each time you start a new world or find another book it makes each book feel more unique rather a back-up copy. It would feel like an accomplishment to fill out the basic pages without making it too inaccessible.
The thaumonomicon acquisition effort is tricky. Make it too hard to get and people might give up on Thaumcraft before they really have started, but I do get making the thaumonomicon feel valuable or an accomplishment to have. Maybe have monsters drop knowledge fragments that combine into the basic pages of the thaumonomicon but require no research ? Once you have all the basic pages you could combine them together with leather and string to make the the true thaumonomicon that all other research is added into. You could make it so the amount of fragments per page part of a config to make it easier or harder.
Another alternative is to have dungeons or a new world gen structure contain a "tattered book" version of the thaumonomicon that you have to combine the knowledge fragments with that results in a random starting page being restored. The amount of fragments to restore a page could be random per book, so each time you start a new world or find another book it makes each book feel more unique rather a back-up copy. It would feel like an accomplishment to fill out the basic pages without making it too inaccessible.
Just some thoughts I had.
I like that concept, perhaps he could combine several of the ideas presented in the thread, Like you have to get the Thaumonomicon from a villager in trade, but perhaps you have to trade him the "parts" of the book, some found randomly as angry zombie drops, some found in the TC added dungeons. Once you've done that he awards you your Thaumonomicon, which is upgradeable like the wands. Perhaps you could combine lost fragments to research additional things to improve your book.
Sounds like an interesting idea, and good for decorations. Wouldn't that kind of go against the new theme of having to go out and explore for things, though? Maybe just make it really slow, like Azanor mentioned for the new aspect system. That way farming it would be a nice extra boost, but wouldn't be lucrative enough to fuel research on its own.
its not a new idea. crystal clusters to farm shards existed in thaumcraft 2 already
the research aspect of the mod is more exploration focused. that doesnt mean, that one of the late game research cant lead to crystal clusters, that you can slowly grow and harvest for shards now and then.
im also interested, if there will still be aspects in liquid form. doesnt look like it in the research.
tbh, i imagined the gathering and combination part of aspects a little different. i though, you where going to go out into the world, collect aspects, and store them in liquid form (jars) and phials, instead of research points.
on the research table, you would combine phials of aspects to phials of new aspects.
this way, we would really feel like alchemists, playing around with the basic elements of the minecraft world. maybe there would be later on an exta alchemy table, to have an automated way, to combine aspects in multiple steps. so you can produce specific aspects in larger amounts.
shards could be used to extract liquid aspects from them, leaving dull shards.
I guess I'm wondering if that part of the whole process has changed along with everything else, and if not, is it possible to add an alternative? While a wizard tower or something to seek out and loot for a Thaumonomicon might be awesome, I would really just like a less meta method. The simplest I can think of is maybe adding a config option that disables the "recipe," so to speak, for the Thaumonomicon in favor of, say, spawning it as dungeon loot or (very rarely) in village library chests. Or maybe just have hooks for that in the API and I can figure it out on my own? Although, now that I think about it, I suppose there might be difficulties in determining the owner of the book... I don't know enough about that, though. Would that sort of thing be possible?
Try Tainted -insert (almost) any mob-.
Tainted creepers, pigs, chickens, cows, wisps, villagers, sheep, trees (yes, the trees were aliiive).
Oddly enough enderman, skeletons, zombies, spiders, silverfish were not affected.
I think I'll just mark a taint biome with a waypoint, get the hell out of dodge and return later when I'm good and ready lol
The op seems to have the most minimal information of all the mods I've ever seen. Teaches you how to make a wand and thaumonomicon. That's it. Seeing as you had to read a bunch of other things for installing forge as well as the mod itself this shouldn't be a problem at all. Chances are if you hit that download button you also saw the getting started section anyway.
And the thing with having to find a thaumonomicon in a randomly generated structure is, well the random part. If you get really unlucky are you willing to waste a lot of time searching for a randomly generated structure just to even begin learning about the mod? Sounds like bad game (or mod in this case) design to me.
That's not my point. The idea is immersion and meta, not being unable to understand how to do it. I regularly compile and maintain modpacks for my private server; I think I'd know how to read an OP by now. My point is that having to go outside of the mod itself for information breaks the immersiveness of the experience. Sure, I'm hardly running a hardcore roleplaying server here-- nevertheless I prefer mods that are self-contained and are both simple and intuitive enough to understand on their own (see: why I never got into IC2 or Buildcraft or anything of their ilk). Thaumcraft is very close as-is to my "vision," I guess you could call it, and, with the overhaul of the research system, the only thing that keeps it from being absolutely perfect in my eyes is the method by which you obtain the Thaumonomicon. That's literally it. It's because it's that close, and that small (I think, anyway) that I dare suggest it-- I wouldn't want to do anything even close to asking Azanor to do more than he's already doing.
As for the second part, I have absolutely no problem with that. The idea of having to actively look for it actually appeals to me; it would feel more like lost knowledge to be found and recovered that way, instead of just popping this life-changing manual of incredible power into existence with nothing more valuable than one gold nugget and a random magic crystal. Hell, the leather needed for the books are more time-consuming to find and gather than either of those; it just doesn't feel as unique and valuable as it should be. As for wasting a lot of time, well... I rarely ever tell my server players precisely what's in my modpacks. Since I happen to be the slightly
sadisticwhimsical sort of server admin, they've had to endure some nasty surprises over the various iterations of servers I've run. A little treat like that would keep them on their toes.My suggestions:
Create an item called "Arcane Page", you have to collect 9 of them and create the Thaumonomicon. Want more challenge? number the pages 1-9 and you have to have one of each page to create the Thaumonomicon.
Have the pages spawn randomly in the world, perhaps as "seeds" that drop when you break tall grass. Or fall out of tree leaves like apples. Or, mob drops, maybe just an Enderman drop. Make it tougher? Drop when you break an Eldrich Monolith.
Just my $0.02
-pete
imagine, you would be playing this game for the first time. if you didnt already know all the recipes or looked them up before, would you know, how to do anything in the game?
in that regard, only having to remember one recipe in thaumcraft 3.0 is a gigantic leap forward.
adding the book as dungeon loot is not a bad idea. even if you dont know how to craft it, you might find it later on in a chest.
(Jorge Luis Borges, Evangelio Apocrifo)
As for new stuff suggestions:
I'm sticking with my ancient civilizations.
In your thaumonomicon there would be another tab, for the sake of the idea lets call it eldritch. If you look at the tab it will be inscribed with the thaumic symbols or language. Not only that but the page would be ripped out. Across your many journeys you came across ruins of what seems like an ancient civilization. Around there are many obsidian totems, maybe here you can learn to replicate what they have done, using the ancient arts. All around where there should be pure nodes are chaos node. It seems apparent that they used some sort of node as a sacrifice. The stuff they used was obviously unpredictable and dangerous. Upon searching more you find a page, the page you were missing, on it are more researchable stuff... etc you get the point.
not a bad idea. there are thaumcraft villagers anyways. some of them could sell the thaumonomicon, or have it in one of their chests.
also, i really liked the crystal farms from thaumcraft 2. the crystal clusters actually grew over time and you could harvest shards from them with, what is now the golem bell.
would be nice if something like that made a return. a garden full of crystal clusters to harvest vis shards.
I think that'd be interesting, a method of 'renewable' shards at perhaps a cost to the aura or a catalyst to facilitate their growth.
Ah, memories...
I requested it as a config option. Repeat: config option. Emphasis: option. If Azanor can't put it in simply as an alternative (assuming he hasn't already "fixed" it, so to speak) for whatever reason, then I can certainly live without it.
That said, why is it that you're talking about it like the suggestion was for a concrete change? That's like saying no one should be allowed to have a salt shaker because you don't think the dish needs any more salt. It's perfectly fine if the restaurant tells me they don't and aren't going to offer me a salt shaker, but, at the risk of sounding rude-- why should your personal preference inform the potential development of a very small, hopefully simple change that would make me and possibly some others very happy, and that you can decide to opt out of it with no repercussions whatsoever? :/
As for Lord_Yngas's ideas, I don't think I very much like the idea of spawning with the Thaumonomicon. I dislike spawning with anything at the start (it's more organic, as well as more of an accomplishment, to start with nothing and work your way up from there), but, disregarding that, I happen to believe that power like thaumaturgy should be something you have to either find or work for, something that feels rare and valuable (even if technically everyone with this mod installed will get into it eventually, but the point is feeling, not fact). It shouldn't feel like wood or stone-- something you'd never possibly want for, no matter how useful it might be (unless you're doing a megaproject, but the metaphor falls apart at that point). It should feel as valuable as diamonds. That's why I suggested spawning it as loot-- because then it becomes comparable.
Of course, I'm not sure how Thaumonomicons work regarding research and ownership, so spawning it as dungeon loot might not be feasible. Buying it from a villager (I'd prefer as little work for Azanor as possible, so just the librarian, maybe) would probably work, but that wouldn't have the same feel as finding it in a dungeon. Like poking around houses for the odd hidden item versus an end-of-dungeon reward in Zelda, I guess.
Sounds like an interesting idea, and good for decorations. Wouldn't that kind of go against the new theme of having to go out and explore for things, though? Maybe just make it really slow, like Azanor mentioned for the new aspect system. That way farming it would be a nice extra boost, but wouldn't be lucrative enough to fuel research on its own.
That actually sounds interesting. However, paintings are kind of weird in Minecraft, so I'm not sure that'd work. Plus, how exactly would anyone go about that sort of hinting?
Another alternative is to have dungeons or a new world gen structure contain a "tattered book" version of the thaumonomicon that you have to combine the knowledge fragments with that results in a random starting page being restored. The amount of fragments to restore a page could be random per book, so each time you start a new world or find another book it makes each book feel more unique rather a back-up copy. It would feel like an accomplishment to fill out the basic pages without making it too inaccessible.
Just some thoughts I had.
I like that concept, perhaps he could combine several of the ideas presented in the thread, Like you have to get the Thaumonomicon from a villager in trade, but perhaps you have to trade him the "parts" of the book, some found randomly as angry zombie drops, some found in the TC added dungeons. Once you've done that he awards you your Thaumonomicon, which is upgradeable like the wands. Perhaps you could combine lost fragments to research additional things to improve your book.
its not a new idea. crystal clusters to farm shards existed in thaumcraft 2 already
the research aspect of the mod is more exploration focused. that doesnt mean, that one of the late game research cant lead to crystal clusters, that you can slowly grow and harvest for shards now and then.
im also interested, if there will still be aspects in liquid form. doesnt look like it in the research.
tbh, i imagined the gathering and combination part of aspects a little different. i though, you where going to go out into the world, collect aspects, and store them in liquid form (jars) and phials, instead of research points.
on the research table, you would combine phials of aspects to phials of new aspects.
this way, we would really feel like alchemists, playing around with the basic elements of the minecraft world. maybe there would be later on an exta alchemy table, to have an automated way, to combine aspects in multiple steps. so you can produce specific aspects in larger amounts.
shards could be used to extract liquid aspects from them, leaving dull shards.