If you are genuinely concerned about misogyny, I urge you to take a look at this. I would also like to point this out as evidence that I am not (trying to be) a troll.
Aside from that, I still support the position that your autonomy as a mod creator should be respected, and I still appreciate the work you've put into the mod. You are likely correct that your community is not a place I belong, and it is fair that I am not welcome there. I do not expect nor wish to be reinstated in the forums (to make it clear that is not my purpose); I only hope that you'll give the issue of the use of this metaphor as inappropriate more thought.
If you are genuinely concerned about misogyny, I urge you to take a look at this. I would also like to point this out as evidence that I am not (trying to be) a troll.
Aside from that, I still support the position that your autonomy as a mod creator should be respected, and I still appreciate the work you've put into the mod. You are likely correct that your community is not a place I belong, and it is fair that I am not welcome there. I do not expect nor wish to be reinstated in the forums (to make it clear that is not my purpose); I only hope that you'll give the issue of the use of this metaphor as inappropriate more thought.
I only hope that you'll give the issue of the use of this metaphor as inappropriate more thought.
I've thought about it throughout my life as I am opposed to bigotry in general.
I'd ask you to give some thought to that you are likely taking the whole "P.C." movement way too far, to the point of watering down and neutering language to Orwellian levels.
Bigotry is based on intent, not words. Am I a tasteless jerk? Absolutely. However, that has nothing to do with whether I am a bigot, and throwing around such accusations when there is ample proof to the contrary is just childish and based on immature concepts of what actual discrimination consists of.
In fact, I'd go so far as to say that by you so readily pointing fingers in such cases, it is *you* who is belittling and reducing the importance of such issues.
If everyone runs around screaming "FIRE!" at the first sign of smoke, then how are we to recognize the danger when a genuine blaze erupts?
I have little else to say on the matter as it is clear we will not agree on this, but I want to make it clear that my intent was not to accuse you of being a bigot. I think there is a meaningful distinction between saying that the content of a statement (or artwork) is misogynistic and calling someone a misogynist. If at any point that distinction was vague, then that is my error. I do not claim to have access to your mental states, so I cannot know your intent.
I do not agree that intent is central to the issue of whether something is misogynistic, and that is likely the crux of why we will not agree. I think that bigotry stems from structural power disparities, that language (whether intentionally or not) can serve to reinforce these structures, and that is what can make something problematic in context.
Re-edit: Better that I don't push this further, I think. This is a thread about BTW, and I'm stepping out so that it can return to that.
Re-edit: Better that I don't push this further, I think. This is a thread about BTW, and I'm stepping out so that it can return to that.
I don't disagree that words are significant and can contribute, but then it largely comes down to context, which again, is largely based on intent.
For example, there have been many instances on the BTW forums of people saying "I am gay", which no one bats an eyelash at. On the other hand, there have been instances (not recently) of people saying "that is gay" which I immediately crack down on as the implication is that of redefining that word to mean something that is negative.
Also, I question your redefining a universal issue for human beings as being gender specific through relating it directly (and I'd say exclusively) to misogyny. If anything, I think that's a clear indication of your own bias here.
But yes, you are right in that this isn't the place to discuss such things and we should leave it there. However, I also think it would benefit you to be far more careful in pointing fingers about such things as you're likely alienating people such as myself that actually agree with you on the core issues through taking things too far.
If you are interested in discussing this further (which I am open to), you can PM me. I may yet have more to add, but it is of course fine if you are either too busy or simply not interested in continuing this further.
Just watched DW20 spotlight of a famous mod' new version, and after covering Windmills, he says something along the lines "These are miraculous, I honestly can't think of any other mod having such a cool vertical windmills".
I am now wondering to whom this "take that" was.
Just watched DW20 spotlight of a famous mod' new version, and after covering Windmills, he says something along the lines "These are miraculous, I honestly can't think of any other mod having such a cool windmills".
I am now wondering to whom this "take that" was.
I think he's blind to anything outside of Forgeland
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"my build. I push the buttons" -DW
He's a mad man with a box
I think he's blind to anything outside of Forgeland
Oh, come on. If you watched it yourself, you'll see how much the part about "I _honestly_ couldn't think about any other mod" is stressed. And it is well known that DW is aware of BTW, in which windmills were, I think, nearly since the days of creation.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Hijacking is probably the least cool thing in the world.
Hey Flowerchild, can you give us something like a idea when your awsome mod would be up-to-date for 1.4.6 ?
@all how long was the waiting time for the other updates? (i started to use the mod with 1.4.5.)
An update should be released soon, somewhere around new years. A typical wait time can be anywhere from a few days to a couple months, but on average, a new release is posted about every 3-4 weeks.
Ok guys at least get the quote right. "I can't think of any other mod that adds a vertical windmill like this." While better than wolves does have vertical windmills they're a recent addition and he may not have been aware of it. Notice he made no such comment when he went over to the horizontal windmill.
Thank the Mayan Gods the world didn't end, otherwise we'd have all missed this totally important and not at all stupid exchange...
As for updating BTW for 1.4.6. Last I heard about it, FC was waiting for ModLoader to be updated (which it has) so I can't imagine it will be a long wait.
Yeah, it was kinda cool, because after ten seconds i realized that it is probably "take that" to spotlighted mod author xirself. Like, y'know, "this is soooooo original, I cannot even believe!"
Although I personally consider this video rather lame. DW20 is a great spotlighter, but even he can't make such a buggy and pointless update look good. The only worthy thing is probably Sortron - for progammers by programmer; this setting for Sorting Machine is incredibly lame, it's like "hey, you could already acoomplish this with timer and/or filter, but now they are integrated!". These managers are an attempt to make something Logistics Pipey for tubenet, and they work really bad and clog up the network because it wasn't really designed for that. Lamps are nice, but seriously? Inverted Lamps? Come on. And we all know the only point of windmills, because array of solar panels does pretty much the same thing in terms of blutricity.
Ok guys at least get the quote right. "I can't think of any other mod that adds a vertical windmill like this." While better than wolves does have vertical windmills they're a recent addition and he may not have been aware of it. Notice he made no such comment when he went over to the horizontal windmill.
Oh, actually, he is. Must've missed word "vertical" because he mumbled it.
Yes Sar, that's what he says. HOWEVER, it's still pretty tendentious. Remember he hangs out with a lot of modders, Eloraam included which whom he seems to be very "close" (well, as close as what close can mean on the internet). I can't possibly believe he wasn't aware of the last skirmish that happened between FC and Elo.
But I guess we are particularly on edge and alike to be maybe over-sensitive about that kind of things given the current ambiance around here...
Oh, nobody is blaming nobody, right? I just giggled a bit when saw this, and wanted to share this experience.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Hijacking is probably the least cool thing in the world.
I read all messages posted here. After 30,000 posts or so to this thread however, I think it reasonable that I choose not to respond to all of them.
Aside from that, I still support the position that your autonomy as a mod creator should be respected, and I still appreciate the work you've put into the mod. You are likely correct that your community is not a place I belong, and it is fair that I am not welcome there. I do not expect nor wish to be reinstated in the forums (to make it clear that is not my purpose); I only hope that you'll give the issue of the use of this metaphor as inappropriate more thought.
I've thought about it throughout my life as I am opposed to bigotry in general.
I'd ask you to give some thought to that you are likely taking the whole "P.C." movement way too far, to the point of watering down and neutering language to Orwellian levels.
Bigotry is based on intent, not words. Am I a tasteless jerk? Absolutely. However, that has nothing to do with whether I am a bigot, and throwing around such accusations when there is ample proof to the contrary is just childish and based on immature concepts of what actual discrimination consists of.
In fact, I'd go so far as to say that by you so readily pointing fingers in such cases, it is *you* who is belittling and reducing the importance of such issues.
If everyone runs around screaming "FIRE!" at the first sign of smoke, then how are we to recognize the danger when a genuine blaze erupts?
I do not agree that intent is central to the issue of whether something is misogynistic, and that is likely the crux of why we will not agree. I think that bigotry stems from structural power disparities, that language (whether intentionally or not) can serve to reinforce these structures, and that is what can make something problematic in context.
Re-edit: Better that I don't push this further, I think. This is a thread about BTW, and I'm stepping out so that it can return to that.
I don't disagree that words are significant and can contribute, but then it largely comes down to context, which again, is largely based on intent.
For example, there have been many instances on the BTW forums of people saying "I am gay", which no one bats an eyelash at. On the other hand, there have been instances (not recently) of people saying "that is gay" which I immediately crack down on as the implication is that of redefining that word to mean something that is negative.
Also, I question your redefining a universal issue for human beings as being gender specific through relating it directly (and I'd say exclusively) to misogyny. If anything, I think that's a clear indication of your own bias here.
But yes, you are right in that this isn't the place to discuss such things and we should leave it there. However, I also think it would benefit you to be far more careful in pointing fingers about such things as you're likely alienating people such as myself that actually agree with you on the core issues through taking things too far.
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Retired StaffI would assume not, he's trying to wrap the mod up right now.
I am now wondering to whom this "take that" was.
I think he's blind to anything outside of Forgeland
He's a mad man with a box
Oh, come on. If you watched it yourself, you'll see how much the part about "I _honestly_ couldn't think about any other mod" is stressed. And it is well known that DW is aware of BTW, in which windmills were, I think, nearly since the days of creation.
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Retired StaffAn update should be released soon, somewhere around new years. A typical wait time can be anywhere from a few days to a couple months, but on average, a new release is posted about every 3-4 weeks.
As for updating BTW for 1.4.6. Last I heard about it, FC was waiting for ModLoader to be updated (which it has) so I can't imagine it will be a long wait.
Although I personally consider this video rather lame. DW20 is a great spotlighter, but even he can't make such a buggy and pointless update look good. The only worthy thing is probably Sortron - for progammers by programmer; this setting for Sorting Machine is incredibly lame, it's like "hey, you could already acoomplish this with timer and/or filter, but now they are integrated!". These managers are an attempt to make something Logistics Pipey for tubenet, and they work really bad and clog up the network because it wasn't really designed for that. Lamps are nice, but seriously? Inverted Lamps? Come on. And we all know the only point of windmills, because array of solar panels does pretty much the same thing in terms of blutricity.
Oh, actually, he is. Must've missed word "vertical" because he mumbled it.
1st video, 16:43.
Oh, nobody is blaming nobody, right? I just giggled a bit when saw this, and wanted to share this experience.
@Gormador: Sorry man I was talking to electronicRU. Nothing wrong with what you said.
Probably just best to forget it and move on.
Yeah, I already agreed with you, am not I? Though I gotta fix original post to match his quote closer. Thanks for the clarification.