I'm really not certain how I feel about the new detector and booster rails, but I'm going to stay true to the intent of this mod as an upgrade to *vanilla* minecraft and phase out my own boosters and minecart plates. What I intend however is to have 2 additional variations of the detector rail that will allow users of this mod to retain the plate functionality in detecting occupied carts.
I'm surprised. I thought you wanted to keep your Soul Boosters once renamed because the new boosters only reset momentum to a certain value instead of increasing it. Or did I misunderstand your position on the matter?
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Better Than Wolves Mod WARNING: May cause addiction and/or skull detonation. Handle with care.
I'm really not certain how I feel about the new detector and booster rails, but I'm going to stay true to the intent of this mod as an upgrade to *vanilla* minecraft and phase out my own boosters and minecart plates. What I intend however is to have 2 additional variations of the detector rail that will allow users of this mod to retain the plate functionality in detecting occupied carts.
I'm surprised. I thought you wanted to keep your Soul Boosters once renamed because the new boosters only reset momentum to a certain value instead of increasing it. Or did I misunderstand your position on the matter?
I was under that impression as well...
Maybe you could keep the soul boosters, but modify the recipe so they require more resources than the booster rails? So they would be a better, but more expensive, type of booster.
Well, I know this probably isn't going to get through to you, but mods named like this ("LOLOL MY MOD IS SOOOOO MUCH BETTER THAN THIS GAME FEATURE GAIS") turn out to be horrible most of the time. I wouldn't be surprised if people are dragged away from this mod because of that. I'm not trolling or anything, quite frankly the name doesn't bug me too much, but...eh.
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Quote from kurzacation »
first thing you need to do is chop down trees
Quote from kurzacation »
second thing you need to do is make a wood pik and find some coal
I'm surprised. I thought you wanted to keep your Soul Boosters once renamed because the new boosters only reset momentum to a certain value instead of increasing it. Or did I misunderstand your position on the matter?
Well, I was wavering on this one for awhile, but after converting to the booster rails on a portion of my network yesterday, I am a little less opposed to the way they work.
I would really rather not have duplicate functionality in this mod to what is found in the main game. Boosters are now in the game, and regardless of whether I agree with their specific implementation or not (actually, my only problem with them is the number required to boost freight carts), I do not want to be nerfing in-game features by having blocks in the mod that basically do the same thing, but are simply more powerful.
Also, there's the question of maintaining the mod. The fewer the features, the less work is involved in updating and supporting it. If all I'm doing is duplicating stuff in the main game with a feature, then I feel that process is a wasted effort.
Then there's also the matter of Block ID's. Believe it or not, they're in limited supply, and if I decide to consume them by premanently supporting legacy features, then it increases the chances of incompatibility problems with other mods.
I will however not just rip them out and let players deal with the ramifications. My intent is to phase them out slowly. The next version will disable the crafting recipe for the soul boosters, and if you destroy a booster block, it will return the resources used to create it to you. I'll probably wait several versions before disabling the blocks entirely to give people who were using them a chance to convert to the new booster rails.
My apologies for any inconvenience this may cause to users of the mod, but when I weigh all the above factors, it just doesn't appear to me to be the right move to keep them around.
Quote from Felloffalot »
I'm not trolling or anything, quite frankly the name doesn't bug me too much, but...eh.
Yes...yes you are.
As I said man, give it up. If the name doesn't "bug you too much", then stop posting about it and move on. All you're doing with your repeated posts about it is making it less likely that I'll choose to respond to you should you decide to say something relevant about the mod.
Today, I had time to read a bit about modding, Block IDs, etc. I also read your reply and, all things considered, I completely agree with your decision. Block IDs are a lot more precious than I thought and if Mojang's boosters can do the job, why keep a redundant block? Anyway, I'm sure you already have plenty of new blocks/items you'll like to mod in to take the spot that was left by the Soul Booster. I'm not worried. :3
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Better Than Wolves Mod WARNING: May cause addiction and/or skull detonation. Handle with care.
Today, I had time to read a bit about modding, Block IDs, etc. I also read your reply and, all things considered, I completely agree with your decision. Block IDs are a lot more precious than I thought and if Mojang's boosters can do the job, why keep a redundant block? Anyway, I'm sure you already have plenty of new blocks/items you'll like to mod in to take the spot that was left by the Soul Booster. I'm not worried. :3
Hehe...cool stuff man, and thanks :smile.gif:
Yeah, it doesn't help that the boosters actually occupy two Block IDs either (one each for the on and off state).
If I were to do them from scratch, I probably wouldn't do that now, but being some of my first objects, I did that with both the boosters and the light block as I was working off of some similar code I had found within the minecraft source, and didn't know any better.
Keep in mind this is actually my first minecraft mod, so I'm still learning as I go :smile.gif:
On that note, while waiting for the next release of MCP, I'm actually doing a lot of work right now to minimize the number of base classes I change with the mod, which should increase compatibility with other mods substantially. I've learned a number of tricks along the way that are allowing me to minimize the mod's footprint. I just wiped out the changes that the Block Dispenser required to TileEntityDispenser, and my modifications to Fire for the Hibachi should be the next to go.
As an added bonus, this should make migrating to 1.5 all the easier once I get my hands on the next MCP, as there should be very few changes that are actually required to get it working with 1.5 if I don't touch the base classes.
Anyways, not sure if any of this interests you, but if you're learning about modding, it just may. My advice...don't mess with the base classes if there's any possible way to avoid it. It's not always obvious how to avoid it, but IMO, it's worth the effort. My eventual goal is to have this mod work with zero changes to the base classes, and I think that's entirely attainable.
Hey FlowerChild, I'm back!
Just read the readme's changes to cement, and dang, I'm impressed. Seriously.
On another note (NOT advertising, it's not even started yet), have a look at my current and distantly familiar project in your spare time. I'm very open to your critique (on everything before Flag mod), as you are very logical in reasons for not including things, etc.
Hey FlowerChild, I'm back!
Just read the readme's changes to cement, and dang, I'm impressed. Seriously.
Hehe...thanks man. It was quite the extensive overhall, and it kinda sucks that version came out the night before 1.5, and that I don't think many people saw the results because of it, but I'm optimistic they'll be pleased with the changes regardless, once I get the mod updated :smile.gif:
Quote from utakataJ6 »
On another note (NOT advertising, it's not even started yet), have a look at my current and distantly familiar project in your spare time. I'm very open to your critique (on everything before Flag mod), as you are very logical in reasons for not including things, etc.
I just took a quick look, and while I posted it there, let me repeat here that if you have any modding questions that you think I might be able to help you with, feel free to fire away.
My only advice at this point, will be to repeat what I said above and try to avoid modifying base classes wherever possible (you'll thank yourself for it later), which means that ModLoader will be your best friend.
Also, if you can, try to find yourself a small feature that is not dependant upon the rest of your list to act as your first feature for the mod. I think it will be much more encouraging for you if you can tackle a small task and complete it within a reasonable time (which is what I did with the light blocks), than if you try to tackle everything at once and take a long while to see any real progress as a result.
Best of luck to you man! It's great to see you doing this!
Anyways, not sure if any of this interests you, but if you're learning about modding, it just may.
Anything related to modding is interesting to me. The more I learn about it, the more I think of ideas I would like to implement if I had more knowledge.
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Better Than Wolves Mod WARNING: May cause addiction and/or skull detonation. Handle with care.
I think it will be much more encouraging for you if you can tackle a small task and complete it within a reasonable time
Of course - I've got some portions worked out. I've made it through the absolute beginner modding tutorials quite successfully, as well, and am moving on to Zid's modloader tut's. I appreciate the offer of some help (I'm sure things like a light-source sword and the mall doors, much later on, will certainly require assistance).
In the meantime you may return to your (very awesome) thread.
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Minecraft technology - the logical way - the only way.
Of course - I've got some portions worked out. I've made it through the absolute beginner modding tutorials quite successfully, as well, and am moving on to Zid's modloader tut's. I appreciate the offer of some help (I'm sure things like a light-source sword and the mall doors, much later on, will certainly require assistance).
Yeah, I found the modloader tutorials out there particularly lacking. The information available on it is extremely basic, and once you start trying to do anything funky with your code, you're basically on your own to figure things out.
Like, I don't think I saw a single tutorial that told me I need to register my blocks with modloader. I only discovered that a few versions in when the game started crashing for no apparent reason after I had made changes totally unrelated to the blocks in question (if you don't register them, it basically winds up depending on the order in which various classes have their constructor called...and stability becomes a matter of chance) :wink.gif:
Quote from utakataJ6 »
In the meantime you may return to your (very awesome) thread.
Hehe...thanks :smile.gif:
Quote from logorouge »
Anything related to modding is interesting to me. The more I learn about it, the more I think of ideas I would like to implement if I had more knowledge.
Do you have any background in programming? If so, you really might want to consider giving it a go. If not, the learning curve is pretty damn steep at the moment, especially without an official SDK. I wouldn't recommend it as the best way to learn how to code as a result.
I've actually been considering putting out a few tutorials myself, as I find the stuff out there is really lacking, but I'm rather torn between doing that and adding cool new features to this mod :wink.gif:
if your looking to phase out your soul boosters with the new minecraft boosters cant you just add an update to your next version of mod that simply converts every version of your old booster with the new one?
also they sped up water and improved monster spawning ^-^ that and the achievement thing once expanded will be great for new players (without having to watch a bunch of tutorials just to figure out how to last one night) as well
as the older players looking for a couple of challenges to complete
if your looking to phase out your soul boosters with the new minecraft boosters cant you just add an update to your next version of mod that simply converts every version of your old booster with the new one?
Nah, I thought of that, but the problem is that my boosters are a block, and the new ones are a rail. Besides the vertical displacement this would require (which would cause a lot of problems in its own right), I'm sure that would also cause all kinds of problems with the way the tracks link up, etc. Plus, the power differential is so great between them, that I really wouldn't expect people's existing network to function properly if I just swapped them.
I think the current method of slowing phasing them out is the best bet. It gives players the chance to convert over time while recouping the resources they have invested.
Quote from naton9 »
also they sped up water and improved monster spawning ^-^ that and the achievement thing once expanded will be great for new players (without having to watch a bunch of tutorials just to figure out how to last one night) as well
as the older players looking for a couple of challenges to complete
Yeah, I'm certainly not as dissapointed with the update as I was yesterday. I didn't expect to like it, but do find the rain adds a nice bit of variety to the game (even if I wish it had more of an affect on gameplay). I'm not horribly opposed to achievements (I'm actually quite an achievement ***** on the 360), and had a bit of fun earning the ones in there. I'm also happy that they released 1.5_01 so quickly to take care of the crash bugs they introduced.
The main thing I was ticked off at, at first, were the bugs, and how underpowered the boosters are for freight, but with the bugs largely taken care of, I can bring myself to accept the 2nd part :smile.gif:
The main thing I was ticked off at, at first, were the bugs, and how underpowered the boosters are for freight, but with the bugs largely taken care of, I can bring myself to accept the 2nd part :smile.gif:
Yup gotta love beta. but really i dont mind the bugs and i liked how updates come along at a fair rate (with a quick bug fix right after). If notch were to say that "this is it the is the final version no more updates sry guys" id be okay with it. Considering what this game alreadys has and the fact that this game only cost me $20 means that ive gotten my money worth out of the game- and i would be hard pressed to find any game out there for a flat one time $20 to provide as much fun as this game has.
Every update with bugs or not are filed as 'BONUS' for me :smile.gif:
Do you have any background in programming? If so, you really might want to consider giving it a go. If not, the learning curve is pretty damn steep at the moment, especially without an official SDK. I wouldn't recommend it as the best way to learn how to code as a result.
I've actually been considering putting out a few tutorials myself, as I find the stuff out there is really lacking, but I'm rather torn between doing that and adding cool new features to this mod :wink.gif:
I'm afraid my lack of experience in programming is my big weakness. Looking at the code of some mod and tweaking a recipe or something like that is pretty easy, but writing my own lines of codes from scratch is well beyond my novice level. Additionally, my last attempt at recompiling a mod I tweaked didn't end exactly well. (Maybe I just didn't have the right tools though.)
So in the end, the interest is there, but I still need to hunt down tutorials all over the place.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Better Than Wolves Mod WARNING: May cause addiction and/or skull detonation. Handle with care.
I'm afraid my lack of experience in programming is my big weakness. Looking at the code of some mod and tweaking a recipe or something like that is pretty easy, but writing my own lines of codes from scratch is well beyond my novice level. Additionally, my last attempt at recompiling a mod I tweaked didn't end exactly well. (Maybe I just didn't have the right tools though.)
So in the end, the interest is there, but I still need to hunt down tutorials all over the place.
Hang in there man. I suspect this will get a LOT easier once the modding SDK is out. Right now it's quite the mish-mash of hacked code and community written tools.
It's been quite the pain for me, and that's with about 15 years of professional programming experince (25 total if you include me doing it as an amateur). I can't even imagine doing this if I was learning to program at the same time. Like, it's one thing for me to look at a piece of code and be able to divine its purpose from similar algorithms I've seen in the past, but quite another when all you have to go on is the name "func_20048_a" and a bunch of variables named i, j, and k :smile.gif:
Like, it's one thing for me to look at a piece of code and be able to divine its purpose from similar algorithms I've seen in the past, but quite another when all you have to go on is the name "func_20048_a" and a bunch of variables named i, j, and k :smile.gif:
That damn obfuscation is the only reason i haven't put out a mod or two =/ Ive got some pretty basic programming experience, and going from tweaking code to writing lines of javascript wouldn't be too hard for me, if not for the obfuscation. Oh, and i, j, and k, werent those x, y, and z? i couldve swore i read that while learning about minecraft's obfuscation. Haha, also, fun fact. Ive checked this thread about 3 times a day checking for a 1.5_01 update xD keep up the great work man, haha
I'm surprised. I thought you wanted to keep your Soul Boosters once renamed because the new boosters only reset momentum to a certain value instead of increasing it. Or did I misunderstand your position on the matter?
Better Than Wolves Mod WARNING: May cause addiction and/or skull detonation. Handle with care.
I was under that impression as well...
Maybe you could keep the soul boosters, but modify the recipe so they require more resources than the booster rails? So they would be a better, but more expensive, type of booster.
Well, I was wavering on this one for awhile, but after converting to the booster rails on a portion of my network yesterday, I am a little less opposed to the way they work.
I would really rather not have duplicate functionality in this mod to what is found in the main game. Boosters are now in the game, and regardless of whether I agree with their specific implementation or not (actually, my only problem with them is the number required to boost freight carts), I do not want to be nerfing in-game features by having blocks in the mod that basically do the same thing, but are simply more powerful.
Also, there's the question of maintaining the mod. The fewer the features, the less work is involved in updating and supporting it. If all I'm doing is duplicating stuff in the main game with a feature, then I feel that process is a wasted effort.
Then there's also the matter of Block ID's. Believe it or not, they're in limited supply, and if I decide to consume them by premanently supporting legacy features, then it increases the chances of incompatibility problems with other mods.
I will however not just rip them out and let players deal with the ramifications. My intent is to phase them out slowly. The next version will disable the crafting recipe for the soul boosters, and if you destroy a booster block, it will return the resources used to create it to you. I'll probably wait several versions before disabling the blocks entirely to give people who were using them a chance to convert to the new booster rails.
My apologies for any inconvenience this may cause to users of the mod, but when I weigh all the above factors, it just doesn't appear to me to be the right move to keep them around.
Yes...yes you are.
As I said man, give it up. If the name doesn't "bug you too much", then stop posting about it and move on. All you're doing with your repeated posts about it is making it less likely that I'll choose to respond to you should you decide to say something relevant about the mod.
Today, I had time to read a bit about modding, Block IDs, etc. I also read your reply and, all things considered, I completely agree with your decision. Block IDs are a lot more precious than I thought and if Mojang's boosters can do the job, why keep a redundant block? Anyway, I'm sure you already have plenty of new blocks/items you'll like to mod in to take the spot that was left by the Soul Booster. I'm not worried. :3
Better Than Wolves Mod WARNING: May cause addiction and/or skull detonation. Handle with care.
Hehe...cool stuff man, and thanks :smile.gif:
Yeah, it doesn't help that the boosters actually occupy two Block IDs either (one each for the on and off state).
If I were to do them from scratch, I probably wouldn't do that now, but being some of my first objects, I did that with both the boosters and the light block as I was working off of some similar code I had found within the minecraft source, and didn't know any better.
Keep in mind this is actually my first minecraft mod, so I'm still learning as I go :smile.gif:
On that note, while waiting for the next release of MCP, I'm actually doing a lot of work right now to minimize the number of base classes I change with the mod, which should increase compatibility with other mods substantially. I've learned a number of tricks along the way that are allowing me to minimize the mod's footprint. I just wiped out the changes that the Block Dispenser required to TileEntityDispenser, and my modifications to Fire for the Hibachi should be the next to go.
As an added bonus, this should make migrating to 1.5 all the easier once I get my hands on the next MCP, as there should be very few changes that are actually required to get it working with 1.5 if I don't touch the base classes.
Anyways, not sure if any of this interests you, but if you're learning about modding, it just may. My advice...don't mess with the base classes if there's any possible way to avoid it. It's not always obvious how to avoid it, but IMO, it's worth the effort. My eventual goal is to have this mod work with zero changes to the base classes, and I think that's entirely attainable.
Just read the readme's changes to cement, and dang, I'm impressed. Seriously.
On another note (NOT advertising, it's not even started yet), have a look at my current and distantly familiar project in your spare time. I'm very open to your critique (on everything before Flag mod), as you are very logical in reasons for not including things, etc.
Silvercraft
http://www.minecraftforum.net/viewtopic.php?f=1039&t=290810
Minecraft technology - the logical way - the only way.
Hehe...thanks man. It was quite the extensive overhall, and it kinda sucks that version came out the night before 1.5, and that I don't think many people saw the results because of it, but I'm optimistic they'll be pleased with the changes regardless, once I get the mod updated :smile.gif:
I just took a quick look, and while I posted it there, let me repeat here that if you have any modding questions that you think I might be able to help you with, feel free to fire away.
My only advice at this point, will be to repeat what I said above and try to avoid modifying base classes wherever possible (you'll thank yourself for it later), which means that ModLoader will be your best friend.
Also, if you can, try to find yourself a small feature that is not dependant upon the rest of your list to act as your first feature for the mod. I think it will be much more encouraging for you if you can tackle a small task and complete it within a reasonable time (which is what I did with the light blocks), than if you try to tackle everything at once and take a long while to see any real progress as a result.
Best of luck to you man! It's great to see you doing this!
Anything related to modding is interesting to me. The more I learn about it, the more I think of ideas I would like to implement if I had more knowledge.
Better Than Wolves Mod WARNING: May cause addiction and/or skull detonation. Handle with care.
Of course - I've got some portions worked out. I've made it through the absolute beginner modding tutorials quite successfully, as well, and am moving on to Zid's modloader tut's. I appreciate the offer of some help (I'm sure things like a light-source sword and the mall doors, much later on, will certainly require assistance).
In the meantime you may return to your (very awesome) thread.
Minecraft technology - the logical way - the only way.
Yeah, I found the modloader tutorials out there particularly lacking. The information available on it is extremely basic, and once you start trying to do anything funky with your code, you're basically on your own to figure things out.
Like, I don't think I saw a single tutorial that told me I need to register my blocks with modloader. I only discovered that a few versions in when the game started crashing for no apparent reason after I had made changes totally unrelated to the blocks in question (if you don't register them, it basically winds up depending on the order in which various classes have their constructor called...and stability becomes a matter of chance) :wink.gif:
Hehe...thanks :smile.gif:
Do you have any background in programming? If so, you really might want to consider giving it a go. If not, the learning curve is pretty damn steep at the moment, especially without an official SDK. I wouldn't recommend it as the best way to learn how to code as a result.
I've actually been considering putting out a few tutorials myself, as I find the stuff out there is really lacking, but I'm rather torn between doing that and adding cool new features to this mod :wink.gif:
also they sped up water and improved monster spawning ^-^ that and the achievement thing once expanded will be great for new players (without having to watch a bunch of tutorials just to figure out how to last one night) as well
as the older players looking for a couple of challenges to complete
Nah, I thought of that, but the problem is that my boosters are a block, and the new ones are a rail. Besides the vertical displacement this would require (which would cause a lot of problems in its own right), I'm sure that would also cause all kinds of problems with the way the tracks link up, etc. Plus, the power differential is so great between them, that I really wouldn't expect people's existing network to function properly if I just swapped them.
I think the current method of slowing phasing them out is the best bet. It gives players the chance to convert over time while recouping the resources they have invested.
Yeah, I'm certainly not as dissapointed with the update as I was yesterday. I didn't expect to like it, but do find the rain adds a nice bit of variety to the game (even if I wish it had more of an affect on gameplay). I'm not horribly opposed to achievements (I'm actually quite an achievement ***** on the 360), and had a bit of fun earning the ones in there. I'm also happy that they released 1.5_01 so quickly to take care of the crash bugs they introduced.
The main thing I was ticked off at, at first, were the bugs, and how underpowered the boosters are for freight, but with the bugs largely taken care of, I can bring myself to accept the 2nd part :smile.gif:
Hows your thinking coming out for my blokc ideas?
Yup gotta love beta. but really i dont mind the bugs and i liked how updates come along at a fair rate (with a quick bug fix right after). If notch were to say that "this is it the is the final version no more updates sry guys" id be okay with it. Considering what this game alreadys has and the fact that this game only cost me $20 means that ive gotten my money worth out of the game- and i would be hard pressed to find any game out there for a flat one time $20 to provide as much fun as this game has.
Every update with bugs or not are filed as 'BONUS' for me :smile.gif:
It's coming along quite nicely. Thank you for asking.
I'm afraid my lack of experience in programming is my big weakness. Looking at the code of some mod and tweaking a recipe or something like that is pretty easy, but writing my own lines of codes from scratch is well beyond my novice level. Additionally, my last attempt at recompiling a mod I tweaked didn't end exactly well. (Maybe I just didn't have the right tools though.)
So in the end, the interest is there, but I still need to hunt down tutorials all over the place.
Better Than Wolves Mod WARNING: May cause addiction and/or skull detonation. Handle with care.
Hang in there man. I suspect this will get a LOT easier once the modding SDK is out. Right now it's quite the mish-mash of hacked code and community written tools.
It's been quite the pain for me, and that's with about 15 years of professional programming experince (25 total if you include me doing it as an amateur). I can't even imagine doing this if I was learning to program at the same time. Like, it's one thing for me to look at a piece of code and be able to divine its purpose from similar algorithms I've seen in the past, but quite another when all you have to go on is the name "func_20048_a" and a bunch of variables named i, j, and k :smile.gif:
That damn obfuscation is the only reason i haven't put out a mod or two =/ Ive got some pretty basic programming experience, and going from tweaking code to writing lines of javascript wouldn't be too hard for me, if not for the obfuscation. Oh, and i, j, and k, werent those x, y, and z? i couldve swore i read that while learning about minecraft's obfuscation. Haha, also, fun fact. Ive checked this thread about 3 times a day checking for a 1.5_01 update xD keep up the great work man, haha