thanks! Next up is: the recycler system! Excited to finish this one. Should the ship come with the module installed or should it be something the player can build while they are there as an additional module? Honestly I could easily just make them part of the synethesizer system but then recycling would be harder to automate (it also makes less sense from engineering standpoint) so I'll probably make a new machine for it.
So far here are the recyclable items on my list: they should be pretty easy to add. I've decided to not allow items that can already by broken down in normal crafting (aka: logs-->wood-->sticks) , however, if you guys want those for some reason (automation maybe)? let me know. Feel free to suggest more items for the recycler:
all leather armor, saddles, horse armors, chainmail, all iron armor and tools, all gold armor and tools, all diamond armor and tools, gold and iron pressure plates, all rail types, minecarts, hoppers, anvil, iron door/trapdoor, buckets, compass, clock, shears, map, book, enchanted book, shield, records
Also new mechanics idea: speaking of solving annoying minecraft problems with new systems on this map, what if I allow you to extract enchantments off of old gear (with a high chance of failure). And also allow you to spend xp in an item rejuvenation system that resets prior work penalties to 1 (or maybe just for books?). It always annoyed me that combining small enchantment books never works because the work penalties stack up too fast increasing the cost and decreasing the lifetime of your final gear. This system would allow for much easier anvil work as you could sometimes successfully acquire enchanted books off crappy gear (I think the failure rate of this process should be about 50% to keep from being too OP) and you could combine smaller books into high level ones and reset them back to only 1 prior work.
News on 1.11 Update for the map: Also, just realized something interesting. I didn't realize shulkers did not respawn in the End. This means that finding them (and the shulker boxes from them) is rare in a real game. They actually can spawn rarely but renawably on this map during certain times meaning after the 1.11 update shulker boxes might be pretty easy to get on this map compared to normal games! Also, it looks like they are again making a lot of changes that break stuff. For some reason they really want to name each entity variant separately so it has a different name. This is great for future work, but right now it means I'll need to revise a lot of my spawning commands to the newer naming convention. Since they'll probably keep doing stuff like this I'm just waiting for the release for now and designing in 1.10.
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I know this all equals more or less work for you and I don't have a strong leaning on your feature questions so I'm sure whatever you decide will be fine for me. I will say that that having to craft the recycler (recycler isn't a word?) would create a feeling of progression.
I think in 1.11 they have also changed the minecart tag from something like rideableminecart to just minecart again.
I think making the recycler a part of your Landing Pod (or whatever you've in mind to call it) would be reasonable and acceptable within the given storyline. I likewise think that common breakdowns (RE: Logs>wood>sticks) should be included. Not for simplicity sake, but simply as a part of the storyline. If it is a recycler..... let it recycle. Let it do it's function, wherever it will.
As for the extractor, that sounds great. Would love to remove enchantments (ok, low probability) from Mob drops and re-use them. AS for the item use reset, well... I have never actually had a problem with the old system, but in this case I'd say go for it.
Thanks for the feedback guys. I guess I can add everything to the recycler to make it complete Bethel, it just seemed a bit silly to add wood items.
I think the enchantment extractor (henceforth called the "disenchanter") is also a good idea. I had it when realized that it was a shame that the recycler didn't give you anything extra for highly enchanted items. My idea for both the recycler and disenchanter (to make them easily automeable and useful in farms) is that they are a new block, placeable anywhere, that checks above itself. If the recycler detects items it can recycle it crushes them with a sound effect and drops the product in the space below itself. If the disenchanter detects enchanted items above itself it tries to remove the enchantments and place them on a book. There will be a chance of failure as this is so powerful. This works like treasure enchants in that ALL the enchantments from the item (if disenchanting is successful) go onto a single book, effectively allowing you to transfer off a whole set of nice enchants and move it to something new. When this happens the prior work penalty on the new book is reset so you can also use it to reset work penalties on books and items combined together from low levels (but risk losing it). I thought the chance of failure would be balanced around 50%. The disenchanter will destroy the items it tries to remove enchantments from so you have to choose whether getting the materials (recycler) or the enchantments (disenchanter) is more valuable to you. In automation you could also run them in series with water flows I suppose.
Also a small update:
- It was a pain, but I finally got the hive spawning/despawning coded into the map. That's the last of the creature spawning algorithms. It turned out trickier then I thought for a ton of reasons I won't go into. For now I've hard-coded in hive spawning rather then let them keep spawning new ones year after year and risk wrecking terrain and player builds. You can find up to 2 of the hives for each creature and then you'll find no more. One insect is year-round but in only one area. The other 3 are seasonal and the spawner only exists during that season.
- I've calculated up the conversion rates for all the recycler recipes and am now ready to start implementing it. There was a small problem in that certain things I couldn't even give 1 ingot /leather for (normal rails for instance and books). So I created 3 new items: iron nuggets, leather scraps, and industrial diamond that work as smaller units. They can be combined on the synthesizer into real ingots, diamonds, and leather. This allowed me to lock in the return on all items pretty close to 50% since I had a smaller unit.
- added 2 new drops to creatures that needed variety
I'm not gonna bother with pictures as its late, but I was thinking to make a gif demoing the new machines and redstone components as I finish them. Pictures aren't really doing it justice.
Quick question: would you guys find it useful for these machines to be redstone activated? As in they turn off if they aren't powered or something like that, making them a redstone component. I don't know why you'd ever need that but I haven't thought super far ahead on how they might be used other then that they allow for some truly sick industrial mob-farming for supplies.
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Quick question: would you guys find it useful for these machines to be redstone activated? As in they turn off if they aren't powered or something like that, making them a redstone component. I don't know why you'd ever need that but I haven't thought super far ahead on how they might be used other then that they allow for some truly sick industrial mob-farming for supplies.
I don't see the need to be able to power them off unless it helps with FPS. Will they be movable via piston?
I don't see the need to be able to power them off unless it helps with FPS. Will they be movable via piston?
the improvement to fps would be negligible at best. I optimize my stuff pretty well and have F3 and fps display up while working.
The piston suggestion is a good one! Didn't think of that. Currently, no, moving them by piston would be the same as mining the block, it should go back into item form I think. To runs checks from the block position I needed to mark it with an invisible entity and the entity would not be pushed by the piston properly while inside a block (I think). Might be a future upgrade if I think of an elegant way to allow for it. thanks. For now I'm actually tempted to use immoveable blocks now that you brought this to my attention haha.
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Only if you want to keep in line with the story you're telling here. In a normal situation.... yeah... everything is powered somehow. I don't see that it is truly necessary.... but if you want to be "authentic".... go for it.
Does that mean I have to turn the lights off when I walk out the door? Drat it... one more chore...
probably won't bother then for the redstone activation on the alpha pre-release. Time to get to work on these new machines this evening!
Sorry if I'm bothering anyone by chatting so often on this thread rather then posting "official" updates. It's just I'm not sure about some of these design choices and like getting opinions. I'm really glad Bethel and Rodabon keep replying haha. I'm gonna assume for everyone else that doesn't that you don't care, speak up if you do!
A couple more comments I've found testing the initial systems:
There is a small issue of stackable items. Back when the recycler only operated on unstackables it wasn't an issue but there is not an easy way short of 64 extra command blocks to check the number in the stack then change the output. This is because minecraft stores the stack number in nbt data which has to match exactly, unlike a scoreboard variable. So...for the sake of lag and simplicity...I'm just gonna not check it. xD This means if a stack of recyclable items passes through the system you'll only get the raw supplies from one of them. I can't imagine this really being a problem except for if the player manually is dropping stuff like chests or rails onto it as the recyclable mob drops don't typically stack. You can get around the issue pretty easily by setting it up with a clocked dropper that you dump the items you want recycled into and it drops them on top one by one. I hope this is fine, I'll put a warning.
Similarly, making the synthesizer recipes shapeless means if you have an extra item stack in there in addition to the ones needed for a particular recipe you'll lose them in the creation. Think of it as an advanced space-age 3D printer as this was my design goal. The supplies you put in are ground into fine powder and the synthesizer assembles the 3D structure. Thanks for the feedback everyone and sorry the new components aren't piston-moveable. I'll think on the issue.
Lastly, funny discovery for disenchanter! It disenchants any enchanted item and a lot of my custom items have hidden enchantments to lend them a different, shiny texture so they can easily be distinguished from normal items in inventory. These can be removed...did not think of this lol. I might go back and hide some interesting ones for you guys to discover.
Also considering making the player have to keep the inventory of the disenchanter stocked with books for it to work for realism. It's not a huge deal but what do you guys think?
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So what you're saying is that modern conveniences can be very wasteful...that sounds pretty realistic.
As for stocking the disenchanter with books, it sounds like a small price to pay for the huge upside. Just make sure it doesn't use a book on failed attempts.
probably won't bother then for the redstone activation on the alpha pre-release. Time to get to work on these new machines this evening!
Sorry if I'm bothering anyone by chatting so often on this thread rather then posting "official" updates. It's just I'm not sure about some of these design choices and like getting opinions. I'm really glad Bethel and Rodabon keep replying haha. I'm gonna assume for everyone else that doesn't that you don't care, speak up if you do!
A couple more comments I've found testing the initial systems:
There is a small issue of stackable items. Back when the recycler only operated on unstackables it wasn't an issue but there is not an easy way short of 64 extra command blocks to check the number in the stack then change the output. This is because minecraft stores the stack number in nbt data which has to match exactly, unlike a scoreboard variable. So...for the sake of lag and simplicity...I'm just gonna not check it. xD This means if a stack of recyclable items passes through the system you'll only get the raw supplies from one of them. I can't imagine this really being a problem except for if the player manually is dropping stuff like chests or rails onto it as the recyclable mob drops don't typically stack. You can get around the issue pretty easily by setting it up with a clocked dropper that you dump the items you want recycled into and it drops them on top one by one. I hope this is fine, I'll put a warning.
Similarly, making the synthesizer recipes shapeless means if you have an extra item stack in there in addition to the ones needed for a particular recipe you'll lose them in the creation. Think of it as an advanced space-age 3D printer as this was my design goal. The supplies you put in are ground into fine powder and the synthesizer assembles the 3D structure. Thanks for the feedback everyone and sorry the new components aren't piston-moveable. I'll think on the issue.
Lastly, funny discovery for disenchanter! It disenchants any enchanted item and a lot of my custom items have hidden enchantments to lend them a different, shiny texture so they can easily be distinguished from normal items in inventory. These can be removed...did not think of this lol. I might go back and hide some interesting ones for you guys to discover.
Also considering making the player have to keep the inventory of the disenchanter stocked with books for it to work for realism. It's not a huge deal but what do you guys think?
Sorry I am not saying much, I like to sit on top of the mountain, eating my steak and watch all the magic happen
You already answered the only main concern that I had. As far as building all the neat little machines, there will be some sort of in game help, such as the AI, right? If not, maybe some "notes" can be found as loot so we know how to build and use something.
I like the idea of disenchanter needing to be stocked with books for it to work. As a matter of fact, I love the many ideas that all of you have brain stormed. This will be lots of fun. I really love the idea of hidden loot, because it makes me over come my fear of the new mobs and weather to find something new
If you remember back to my very first suggestion I ever offered to you, Dana, back in Cave-In, we were discussing the random blasting rooms and how I (and others) would spend time digging through there assuming that there was some purpose to them.
My recommendation was simple, and you included it in all updates thereafter: Write a manual.
In the case of your newer equipment --- which of us DOES NOT have multiple "instruction manuals" laying around the house that we someday intend to read?
Include a few of them around the ship... as a "just in case" tutorial. Easier to go that route, than the crash and burn lessons learned.
Dana, I have a friend who might be joining me on my end. (at my house specifically) and we might do the play through together, and if possible record it. We're still debugging things on our end... may or may not work, but we'll see... but I wanted to let you know that one other body will be giving some input.
As to my friend, he's fairly new to MineCraft (only been playing less than a year) but not to gaming in general. He's actually here in Taiwan finishing up his MASTER'S DEGREE in Computer Gaming. (now isn't that a degree we'd all covet?) Our play styles are radically different, as I am more survivalist and he's more exploration.... so it will be very interesting to see how it goes.
In any case, I thought that double the input .... and two different perspectives.... would be a bonus for you on this. The game files will not leave my home, if you so wish.
Your thoughts... And his name is James Linh, he's from Vietnam.
that's fine Bethel. It's good to have a few people testing multiplayer anyway! Thank you everyone for your input on the disenchanter.
Sooo...bad news about the disenchanter. I finished it. It seemed to work properly with a system I'd envisioned that used 10 command blocks! I was super proud of the clever way I'd found to do it by transforming the item entity so that the enchantments were preserved naturally. It all seemed to work but I found a problem right at the end:
The game recognized the placement of the custom block, it set itself up anywhere you clicked with the synthesizer item. It dropped the spawning item when you mined the block so it was moveable. It even transformed enchanted items into books and dropped them below. I picked up the books, looking at it, all looked good. The enchantments remained but the lore, names, and prior work were removed and it was just a clean book. Then I went to test the last bit: working on the anvil with the book. THAT didn't work. Did a little research and found some bad news. Apparently enchanted books use an entirely new "StoredEnchantments" tag, I was sure they used the same tag as every other item. In hindsight this is probably to keep sharpness V books from actually being sharp and such. So all the enchants were on the book, and they even showed up in grey text listed (so I thought it was working) but they didn't work in the anvil which meant they were...useless xD
I could not find a simple solution to make my idea work so the disenchanter (almost completed) is now on hold. There is a way I can still do it but it would require checking every possible enchant and level and placing it in the new tag. If I do that I'll have to do them one at a time so no treasure enchant set books like I promised. Composite items would instead spit out several books each with their own enchantment. It will also take about 160 command blocks to do the system now instead of 10 if I want every normal level of every enchant :(. So sad...Next time I'll test my idea thoroughly before I hype it. Anyway, it's still a great idea and I'll probably do it at some point and just make sure most of those blocks aren't running except when a disenchant check happens. But it's too much work to complete for the alpha pre-release so the disenchanter is a lot less useful right now.
You can still make the disenchanter, and it still removes enchantments, but that's all it does. It takes the prior work penalty and enchants OFF of items and now leaves them behind instead of destroying them. I think this is still minorly useful as if you get a bad enchantment or repair something too much you can now refresh it and start over again. Tested and it all works and the item becomes unworked and is cheap in the anvil and can be enchanted on the table all over again. I may bring back the old enchanted extraction idea later but with the amount of work it would require it's now lower on priority list. If you think of something else balanced and useful I can make it do let me know! For instance, I could also allow it to reveal hidden enchants on treasure items that have them hidden. It could help in discovering uses.
On to recycler! The good news is, I know that one will work and I can use all the same systems I developed for disenchanter so that one will be in by release!
- I also added 4 new synthesizer recipes and narrowed the list of useless new drops down to only a handful!
Just to clarify for Bethel: Most of my drops are inherently useful, there are only some that weren't. Either new ways of making certain goods renewable, or treasure drops that have use in and of themselves. For instance, keep in mind that an unbreakable item with fortune, fire aspect, looting , or sharpness applies the effects regardless of whether or not it is the proper tool. So some those they can drastically increase your farming yields or become nice handheld grinders for mob farms since they can't break.
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Dana --- how about disenchanting from a different angle? How about instead of giving us one or so of the enchantments, how about bottles of EXP? So a high level enchanted item (Level 30) would give you three bottles of EXP and a lower level would give you one or two? Wouldn't that be roughly the same equivalent as trying to grab the usable enchantment? This would make your disenchanter of value to the game, keep within your original idea's framework and still be something.... unique.
Thanks Bethel for your suggestion, it has been incorporated along with 2 of my own!
I added several new functionalities to the disenchanter. I think it is now a very useful new machine! If you place an enchanted item on top of it it first checks to see if it is an item with hidden enchantments. If there are, it reveals them. This can be a good way to reveal the enchants on rare treasure items which I often made hidden. If there are no hidden enchants it instead strips off all enchantments, resets prior work, and removes lore. If this happens it gives you 2 xp bottles of stored experience from the energy it gained from removing the enchantments. 2 xp bottles is about 2 levels starting from level 0. The last thing it does was also a previous suggestion by Bethel. If you stand on top of it and your level is over 9 it will start removing levels and storing them in 3 xp bottles at a time. 3 xp bottles is about a level at level 10 so this is wasteful for levels over 20 but I'll let you guys figure that out. Overall I think this makes it an incredibly useful machine again! The ability to store xp gained in mob farms is pretty powerful too as it means you'll be able to enchant loads of your own books and you can even automate the process of xp collection if you find a mob that regularly drops items with low enchantments.
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completely lag optimized too! Most of those blocks are triggered very rarely and when they do the run light checks before doing any heavy work. I've been running at chunk render 16 and never dipped below the mac upper limit of 30 fps. Mac locks fps for games at 30 so I have no idea what I'm actually running but I figure as long as a mac laptop can run the map at 30 fps with 16 render most people will be fine.
1. Added a couple new passive abilities to some mobs. I may add more over time. By passive I mean things like villagers plant crops and iron golems kill hostiles. A few of my custom creatures have some abilities that can be harnessed if you discover them...
2. Crop seeds now plant themselves if thrown on tilled farmland
3. added a new puzzle ruin
4. improved random single meteors. They now are positionally randomized so can fall far away or close to the player. The single ones a bit more frequent then the showers. I also reduced the likilihood of meteor storms again after observing how many fell in a year.
5. Added a couple new recipes to the synthesizer
6. Completed the disenchanter and added 3 new functions to it (see above): xp storage, enchantment removal + xp, and enchant reveal
7. I FINALLY completed the recycler! Functionality is pretty similar to the disenchanter but it instead finds recyclable items and processes them into raw supplies. I added 66 recyclable items tonight (very tedious) but I made it modular so easy to add more in the future! I think I covered all the basics though. Every metallic, diamond, or leather item now can be recycled and at Bethel's behest I added chests, logs, and planks too but not going to bother with all the dozens of wooden items at the moment. In 1.11 they added the ability to burn most of those for fuel which is about as useful as getting sticks from a recycler and more efficient!
Things are going faster now but still a lot left on my list! It's down to under 25 project items!
Some of this stuff is going to have to get pushed off to updates after the first release so I'm trying to decide what is less important. I think I'm gonna put the elytra, jetpack, and warp crystal upgrades on hold for now and switch entirely to the map intro and orientation for now. The other planned technical items can easily be added as synthesizer recipes later after you guys start. I also will not be able to finish my idea of puzzles in the ruins as that's a lot of intricate command block work. Quite a few custom locations are there but they aren't finished yet as my builder friends have not had time to help me much this past month and that takes a long time by yourself. I think for now I'm gonna fly around and add in the custom spawners I planned at least so you can experience some unique mobs there at the very least. If you find a location and it doesn't seem to have much for now just keep it in mind. It's very likely those will get updated later when my friends can help me do some building. I hope you guys are ok waiting on some of these features, I'll publish them in updates as I finish but there is plenty to play and do on the map already. Really curious how it will all work together, I haven't had time to actually playtest in ages and you guys will get ahead of me as I'm pretty busy saturday through monday.
Also just found out that 1.11 fixes a crippling bug that affects custom maps like this. the graphical entity destacking bug is going to be fixed! Yay! If you don't know about this basically if anything is riding anything and you travel out greater then 70 blocks so they unrender and come back you get a client-side desync and the passenger appears motionless in the air. There actually is nothing wrong it just looks like there is. Relogging fixes it. Some of my creatures, being mob combinations have been affected by it so I'd put in commands to despawn them at r=70 from the player. After 1.11 these guys will spawn more readily as they can use the full r=128 block radius like a normal mob.
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Amazing work dana and looking at that pic I'm struck by how much command blocks have changed. It all looks very streamlined.
yeah 1.9 really changed things. Mostly upsides. For instance, gone are the days of worrying about order and priority if you are using chains. There are still some odd behavior that takes some getting used to but in the end I it ends up being less blocks and a more streamlined look. Also less lag unless you are careless. The clock blocks always run at 20 cps, however many things don't need to be checked that often. My solution was to loop a Count and stagger when I ran different lines over a second. Only a few things are so important they need to be checked 24/7 20 cps.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Download and play my new Survival Map!
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Sounds good dana.
by c0yote
I tried it with terrible results. I gave my wife my glasses for a second, a creeper showed up and now my wife is pregnant.
Stupid 3D..
thanks! Next up is: the recycler system! Excited to finish this one. Should the ship come with the module installed or should it be something the player can build while they are there as an additional module? Honestly I could easily just make them part of the synethesizer system but then recycling would be harder to automate (it also makes less sense from engineering standpoint) so I'll probably make a new machine for it.
So far here are the recyclable items on my list: they should be pretty easy to add. I've decided to not allow items that can already by broken down in normal crafting (aka: logs-->wood-->sticks) , however, if you guys want those for some reason (automation maybe)? let me know. Feel free to suggest more items for the recycler:
all leather armor, saddles, horse armors, chainmail, all iron armor and tools, all gold armor and tools, all diamond armor and tools, gold and iron pressure plates, all rail types, minecarts, hoppers, anvil, iron door/trapdoor, buckets, compass, clock, shears, map, book, enchanted book, shield, records
Also new mechanics idea: speaking of solving annoying minecraft problems with new systems on this map, what if I allow you to extract enchantments off of old gear (with a high chance of failure). And also allow you to spend xp in an item rejuvenation system that resets prior work penalties to 1 (or maybe just for books?). It always annoyed me that combining small enchantment books never works because the work penalties stack up too fast increasing the cost and decreasing the lifetime of your final gear. This system would allow for much easier anvil work as you could sometimes successfully acquire enchanted books off crappy gear (I think the failure rate of this process should be about 50% to keep from being too OP) and you could combine smaller books into high level ones and reset them back to only 1 prior work.
News on 1.11 Update for the map: Also, just realized something interesting. I didn't realize shulkers did not respawn in the End. This means that finding them (and the shulker boxes from them) is rare in a real game. They actually can spawn rarely but renawably on this map during certain times meaning after the 1.11 update shulker boxes might be pretty easy to get on this map compared to normal games! Also, it looks like they are again making a lot of changes that break stuff. For some reason they really want to name each entity variant separately so it has a different name. This is great for future work, but right now it means I'll need to revise a lot of my spawning commands to the newer naming convention. Since they'll probably keep doing stuff like this I'm just waiting for the release for now and designing in 1.10.
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I know this all equals more or less work for you and I don't have a strong leaning on your feature questions so I'm sure whatever you decide will be fine for me. I will say that that having to craft the recycler (recycler isn't a word?) would create a feeling of progression.
I think in 1.11 they have also changed the minecart tag from something like rideableminecart to just minecart again.
by c0yote
I tried it with terrible results. I gave my wife my glasses for a second, a creeper showed up and now my wife is pregnant.
Stupid 3D..
I think making the recycler a part of your Landing Pod (or whatever you've in mind to call it) would be reasonable and acceptable within the given storyline. I likewise think that common breakdowns (RE: Logs>wood>sticks) should be included. Not for simplicity sake, but simply as a part of the storyline. If it is a recycler..... let it recycle. Let it do it's function, wherever it will.
As for the extractor, that sounds great. Would love to remove enchantments (ok, low probability) from Mob drops and re-use them. AS for the item use reset, well... I have never actually had a problem with the old system, but in this case I'd say go for it.
Thanks for the feedback guys. I guess I can add everything to the recycler to make it complete Bethel, it just seemed a bit silly to add wood items.
I think the enchantment extractor (henceforth called the "disenchanter") is also a good idea. I had it when realized that it was a shame that the recycler didn't give you anything extra for highly enchanted items. My idea for both the recycler and disenchanter (to make them easily automeable and useful in farms) is that they are a new block, placeable anywhere, that checks above itself. If the recycler detects items it can recycle it crushes them with a sound effect and drops the product in the space below itself. If the disenchanter detects enchanted items above itself it tries to remove the enchantments and place them on a book. There will be a chance of failure as this is so powerful. This works like treasure enchants in that ALL the enchantments from the item (if disenchanting is successful) go onto a single book, effectively allowing you to transfer off a whole set of nice enchants and move it to something new. When this happens the prior work penalty on the new book is reset so you can also use it to reset work penalties on books and items combined together from low levels (but risk losing it). I thought the chance of failure would be balanced around 50%. The disenchanter will destroy the items it tries to remove enchantments from so you have to choose whether getting the materials (recycler) or the enchantments (disenchanter) is more valuable to you. In automation you could also run them in series with water flows I suppose.
Also a small update:
- It was a pain, but I finally got the hive spawning/despawning coded into the map. That's the last of the creature spawning algorithms. It turned out trickier then I thought for a ton of reasons I won't go into. For now I've hard-coded in hive spawning rather then let them keep spawning new ones year after year and risk wrecking terrain and player builds. You can find up to 2 of the hives for each creature and then you'll find no more. One insect is year-round but in only one area. The other 3 are seasonal and the spawner only exists during that season.
- I've calculated up the conversion rates for all the recycler recipes and am now ready to start implementing it. There was a small problem in that certain things I couldn't even give 1 ingot /leather for (normal rails for instance and books). So I created 3 new items: iron nuggets, leather scraps, and industrial diamond that work as smaller units. They can be combined on the synthesizer into real ingots, diamonds, and leather. This allowed me to lock in the return on all items pretty close to 50% since I had a smaller unit.
- added 2 new drops to creatures that needed variety
I'm not gonna bother with pictures as its late, but I was thinking to make a gif demoing the new machines and redstone components as I finish them. Pictures aren't really doing it justice.
Quick question: would you guys find it useful for these machines to be redstone activated? As in they turn off if they aren't powered or something like that, making them a redstone component. I don't know why you'd ever need that but I haven't thought super far ahead on how they might be used other then that they allow for some truly sick industrial mob-farming for supplies.
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I don't see the need to be able to power them off unless it helps with FPS. Will they be movable via piston?
Everything else sounds great!
by c0yote
I tried it with terrible results. I gave my wife my glasses for a second, a creeper showed up and now my wife is pregnant.
Stupid 3D..
the improvement to fps would be negligible at best. I optimize my stuff pretty well and have F3 and fps display up while working.
The piston suggestion is a good one! Didn't think of that. Currently, no, moving them by piston would be the same as mining the block, it should go back into item form I think. To runs checks from the block position I needed to mark it with an invisible entity and the entity would not be pushed by the piston properly while inside a block (I think). Might be a future upgrade if I think of an elegant way to allow for it. thanks. For now I'm actually tempted to use immoveable blocks now that you brought this to my attention haha.
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Only if you want to keep in line with the story you're telling here. In a normal situation.... yeah... everything is powered somehow. I don't see that it is truly necessary.... but if you want to be "authentic".... go for it.
Does that mean I have to turn the lights off when I walk out the door? Drat it... one more chore...
probably won't bother then for the redstone activation on the alpha pre-release. Time to get to work on these new machines this evening!
Sorry if I'm bothering anyone by chatting so often on this thread rather then posting "official" updates. It's just I'm not sure about some of these design choices and like getting opinions. I'm really glad Bethel and Rodabon keep replying haha. I'm gonna assume for everyone else that doesn't that you don't care, speak up if you do!
A couple more comments I've found testing the initial systems:
There is a small issue of stackable items. Back when the recycler only operated on unstackables it wasn't an issue but there is not an easy way short of 64 extra command blocks to check the number in the stack then change the output. This is because minecraft stores the stack number in nbt data which has to match exactly, unlike a scoreboard variable. So...for the sake of lag and simplicity...I'm just gonna not check it. xD This means if a stack of recyclable items passes through the system you'll only get the raw supplies from one of them. I can't imagine this really being a problem except for if the player manually is dropping stuff like chests or rails onto it as the recyclable mob drops don't typically stack. You can get around the issue pretty easily by setting it up with a clocked dropper that you dump the items you want recycled into and it drops them on top one by one. I hope this is fine, I'll put a warning.
Similarly, making the synthesizer recipes shapeless means if you have an extra item stack in there in addition to the ones needed for a particular recipe you'll lose them in the creation. Think of it as an advanced space-age 3D printer as this was my design goal. The supplies you put in are ground into fine powder and the synthesizer assembles the 3D structure. Thanks for the feedback everyone and sorry the new components aren't piston-moveable. I'll think on the issue.
Lastly, funny discovery for disenchanter! It disenchants any enchanted item and a lot of my custom items have hidden enchantments to lend them a different, shiny texture so they can easily be distinguished from normal items in inventory. These can be removed...did not think of this lol. I might go back and hide some interesting ones for you guys to discover.
Also considering making the player have to keep the inventory of the disenchanter stocked with books for it to work for realism. It's not a huge deal but what do you guys think?
Download and play my new Survival Map!
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So what you're saying is that modern conveniences can be very wasteful...that sounds pretty realistic.
As for stocking the disenchanter with books, it sounds like a small price to pay for the huge upside. Just make sure it doesn't use a book on failed attempts.
by c0yote
I tried it with terrible results. I gave my wife my glasses for a second, a creeper showed up and now my wife is pregnant.
Stupid 3D..
Sorry I am not saying much, I like to sit on top of the mountain, eating my steak and watch all the magic happen
You already answered the only main concern that I had. As far as building all the neat little machines, there will be some sort of in game help, such as the AI, right? If not, maybe some "notes" can be found as loot so we know how to build and use something.
I like the idea of disenchanter needing to be stocked with books for it to work. As a matter of fact, I love the many ideas that all of you have brain stormed. This will be lots of fun. I really love the idea of hidden loot, because it makes me over come my fear of the new mobs and weather to find something new
If you remember back to my very first suggestion I ever offered to you, Dana, back in Cave-In, we were discussing the random blasting rooms and how I (and others) would spend time digging through there assuming that there was some purpose to them.
My recommendation was simple, and you included it in all updates thereafter: Write a manual.
In the case of your newer equipment --- which of us DOES NOT have multiple "instruction manuals" laying around the house that we someday intend to read?
Include a few of them around the ship... as a "just in case" tutorial. Easier to go that route, than the crash and burn lessons learned.
Dana, I have a friend who might be joining me on my end. (at my house specifically) and we might do the play through together, and if possible record it. We're still debugging things on our end... may or may not work, but we'll see... but I wanted to let you know that one other body will be giving some input.
As to my friend, he's fairly new to MineCraft (only been playing less than a year) but not to gaming in general. He's actually here in Taiwan finishing up his MASTER'S DEGREE in Computer Gaming. (now isn't that a degree we'd all covet?) Our play styles are radically different, as I am more survivalist and he's more exploration.... so it will be very interesting to see how it goes.
In any case, I thought that double the input .... and two different perspectives.... would be a bonus for you on this. The game files will not leave my home, if you so wish.
Your thoughts... And his name is James Linh, he's from Vietnam.
that's fine Bethel. It's good to have a few people testing multiplayer anyway! Thank you everyone for your input on the disenchanter.
Sooo...bad news about the disenchanter. I finished it. It seemed to work properly with a system I'd envisioned that used 10 command blocks! I was super proud of the clever way I'd found to do it by transforming the item entity so that the enchantments were preserved naturally. It all seemed to work but I found a problem right at the end:
I could not find a simple solution to make my idea work so the disenchanter (almost completed) is now on hold. There is a way I can still do it but it would require checking every possible enchant and level and placing it in the new tag. If I do that I'll have to do them one at a time so no treasure enchant set books like I promised. Composite items would instead spit out several books each with their own enchantment. It will also take about 160 command blocks to do the system now instead of 10 if I want every normal level of every enchant :(. So sad...Next time I'll test my idea thoroughly before I hype it. Anyway, it's still a great idea and I'll probably do it at some point and just make sure most of those blocks aren't running except when a disenchant check happens. But it's too much work to complete for the alpha pre-release so the disenchanter is a lot less useful right now.
You can still make the disenchanter, and it still removes enchantments, but that's all it does. It takes the prior work penalty and enchants OFF of items and now leaves them behind instead of destroying them. I think this is still minorly useful as if you get a bad enchantment or repair something too much you can now refresh it and start over again. Tested and it all works and the item becomes unworked and is cheap in the anvil and can be enchanted on the table all over again. I may bring back the old enchanted extraction idea later but with the amount of work it would require it's now lower on priority list. If you think of something else balanced and useful I can make it do let me know! For instance, I could also allow it to reveal hidden enchants on treasure items that have them hidden. It could help in discovering uses.
On to recycler! The good news is, I know that one will work and I can use all the same systems I developed for disenchanter so that one will be in by release!
- I also added 4 new synthesizer recipes and narrowed the list of useless new drops down to only a handful!
Just to clarify for Bethel: Most of my drops are inherently useful, there are only some that weren't. Either new ways of making certain goods renewable, or treasure drops that have use in and of themselves. For instance, keep in mind that an unbreakable item with fortune, fire aspect, looting , or sharpness applies the effects regardless of whether or not it is the proper tool. So some those they can drastically increase your farming yields or become nice handheld grinders for mob farms since they can't break.
Download and play my new Survival Map!
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Dana --- how about disenchanting from a different angle? How about instead of giving us one or so of the enchantments, how about bottles of EXP? So a high level enchanted item (Level 30) would give you three bottles of EXP and a lower level would give you one or two? Wouldn't that be roughly the same equivalent as trying to grab the usable enchantment? This would make your disenchanter of value to the game, keep within your original idea's framework and still be something.... unique.
Thanks Bethel for your suggestion, it has been incorporated along with 2 of my own!
I added several new functionalities to the disenchanter. I think it is now a very useful new machine! If you place an enchanted item on top of it it first checks to see if it is an item with hidden enchantments. If there are, it reveals them. This can be a good way to reveal the enchants on rare treasure items which I often made hidden. If there are no hidden enchants it instead strips off all enchantments, resets prior work, and removes lore. If this happens it gives you 2 xp bottles of stored experience from the energy it gained from removing the enchantments. 2 xp bottles is about 2 levels starting from level 0. The last thing it does was also a previous suggestion by Bethel. If you stand on top of it and your level is over 9 it will start removing levels and storing them in 3 xp bottles at a time. 3 xp bottles is about a level at level 10 so this is wasteful for levels over 20 but I'll let you guys figure that out. Overall I think this makes it an incredibly useful machine again! The ability to store xp gained in mob farms is pretty powerful too as it means you'll be able to enchant loads of your own books and you can even automate the process of xp collection if you find a mob that regularly drops items with low enchantments.
Download and play my new Survival Map!
Space Expedition to EPIC 204: Go on a Space-Age Adventure to visit and explore EPIC 204, a wacky world of dense asteroids and full of alien life! Experience Custom Seasons, Weather, Over 50 new creatures, Beautiful Biomes, Alien Ruins, Dungeons, and new space age tech crafting recipes!
The Mechanics Update!
completely lag optimized too! Most of those blocks are triggered very rarely and when they do the run light checks before doing any heavy work. I've been running at chunk render 16 and never dipped below the mac upper limit of 30 fps. Mac locks fps for games at 30 so I have no idea what I'm actually running but I figure as long as a mac laptop can run the map at 30 fps with 16 render most people will be fine.
1. Added a couple new passive abilities to some mobs. I may add more over time. By passive I mean things like villagers plant crops and iron golems kill hostiles. A few of my custom creatures have some abilities that can be harnessed if you discover them...
2. Crop seeds now plant themselves if thrown on tilled farmland
3. added a new puzzle ruin
4. improved random single meteors. They now are positionally randomized so can fall far away or close to the player. The single ones a bit more frequent then the showers. I also reduced the likilihood of meteor storms again after observing how many fell in a year.
5. Added a couple new recipes to the synthesizer
6. Completed the disenchanter and added 3 new functions to it (see above): xp storage, enchantment removal + xp, and enchant reveal
7. I FINALLY completed the recycler! Functionality is pretty similar to the disenchanter but it instead finds recyclable items and processes them into raw supplies. I added 66 recyclable items tonight (very tedious) but I made it modular so easy to add more in the future! I think I covered all the basics though. Every metallic, diamond, or leather item now can be recycled and at Bethel's behest I added chests, logs, and planks too but not going to bother with all the dozens of wooden items at the moment. In 1.11 they added the ability to burn most of those for fuel which is about as useful as getting sticks from a recycler and more efficient!
Things are going faster now but still a lot left on my list! It's down to under 25 project items!
Some of this stuff is going to have to get pushed off to updates after the first release so I'm trying to decide what is less important. I think I'm gonna put the elytra, jetpack, and warp crystal upgrades on hold for now and switch entirely to the map intro and orientation for now. The other planned technical items can easily be added as synthesizer recipes later after you guys start. I also will not be able to finish my idea of puzzles in the ruins as that's a lot of intricate command block work. Quite a few custom locations are there but they aren't finished yet as my builder friends have not had time to help me much this past month and that takes a long time by yourself. I think for now I'm gonna fly around and add in the custom spawners I planned at least so you can experience some unique mobs there at the very least. If you find a location and it doesn't seem to have much for now just keep it in mind. It's very likely those will get updated later when my friends can help me do some building. I hope you guys are ok waiting on some of these features, I'll publish them in updates as I finish but there is plenty to play and do on the map already. Really curious how it will all work together, I haven't had time to actually playtest in ages and you guys will get ahead of me as I'm pretty busy saturday through monday.
Also just found out that 1.11 fixes a crippling bug that affects custom maps like this. the graphical entity destacking bug is going to be fixed! Yay! If you don't know about this basically if anything is riding anything and you travel out greater then 70 blocks so they unrender and come back you get a client-side desync and the passenger appears motionless in the air. There actually is nothing wrong it just looks like there is. Relogging fixes it. Some of my creatures, being mob combinations have been affected by it so I'd put in commands to despawn them at r=70 from the player. After 1.11 these guys will spawn more readily as they can use the full r=128 block radius like a normal mob.
Download and play my new Survival Map!
Space Expedition to EPIC 204: Go on a Space-Age Adventure to visit and explore EPIC 204, a wacky world of dense asteroids and full of alien life! Experience Custom Seasons, Weather, Over 50 new creatures, Beautiful Biomes, Alien Ruins, Dungeons, and new space age tech crafting recipes!
Amazing work dana and looking at that pic I'm struck by how much command blocks have changed. It all looks very streamlined.
by c0yote
I tried it with terrible results. I gave my wife my glasses for a second, a creeper showed up and now my wife is pregnant.
Stupid 3D..
yeah 1.9 really changed things. Mostly upsides. For instance, gone are the days of worrying about order and priority if you are using chains. There are still some odd behavior that takes some getting used to but in the end I it ends up being less blocks and a more streamlined look. Also less lag unless you are careless. The clock blocks always run at 20 cps, however many things don't need to be checked that often. My solution was to loop a Count and stagger when I ran different lines over a second. Only a few things are so important they need to be checked 24/7 20 cps.
Download and play my new Survival Map!
Space Expedition to EPIC 204: Go on a Space-Age Adventure to visit and explore EPIC 204, a wacky world of dense asteroids and full of alien life! Experience Custom Seasons, Weather, Over 50 new creatures, Beautiful Biomes, Alien Ruins, Dungeons, and new space age tech crafting recipes!
Hey dana we testing this weekend or next?
by c0yote
I tried it with terrible results. I gave my wife my glasses for a second, a creeper showed up and now my wife is pregnant.
Stupid 3D..