As for the mobs I meant for the map as a whole, having an area that is spider themed doesn't necessarily have to have any custom mobs (Spider's Den from Depths of Irkalla as an example). However I believe that in this day and age of CTM maps fighting endless Creepers, Spiders, Zombies, Skeletons, and the occasional Blaze or Ghast can get very dull, so at some point the map needs custom mobs to spice things up and amp up difficulty.
As for the aesthetics, which I know has been a long debate here, I personally don't have a problem with playing a boxy map as long as it is fun and enjoyable. The problem is you aren't going to be able to rope people in without something to catch their attention. Vechs can pull this off because he was the first person to make a CTM and will always have the most popular maps.
Strongly agree with the first half. Custom mobs are necessary now. Gear tiers are often not well handled by map makers either, through loot, which means by the time a player hits the last few intersections, their gear barely scales up. This also means that mobs need to scale up which requires custom mobs. Without that, it's just a swarm of mobs which isn't fun and doesn't let the player progress meaningfully.
As for the other though I disagree, though for similar reasons to above - we have the capability to do things that look nice and please the eye, so take that time to do it. I see a boxy map and instead of thinking about loot or anything, I immediately feel like they were either lazy, or didn't care about their user experience enough to create something one could find visually pleasing. The worse it is, the lower my opinion of the map drops, honestly. It doesn't need to be god-tier decorated, but actually showing some effort goes a long, long way.
I definitely agree with all of this, but I probably just should have been more specific. Those were more of my opinion because I quite like block variation as long as it isn't too distracting (I have fun coming up with finding blocks that work together).
As for the mobs I meant for the map as a whole, having an area that is spider themed doesn't necessarily have to have any custom mobs (Spider's Den from Depths of Irkalla as an example). However I believe that in this day and age of CTM maps fighting endless Creepers, Spiders, Zombies, Skeletons, and the occasional Blaze or Ghast can get very dull, so at some point the map needs custom mobs to spice things up and amp up difficulty.
As for the aesthetics, which I know has been a long debate here, I personally don't have a problem with playing a boxy map as long as it is fun and enjoyable. The problem is you aren't going to be able to rope people in without something to catch their attention. Vechs can pull this off because he was the first person to make a CTM and will always have the most popular maps.
EDIT: Page get!
I guess I agree with this. Block variation is a good idea to avoid making everything look bland and "same-y"; however, if you're going to make an area out of randomized blocks, then for the love of god, use blocks with low contrast. For example, I use a combination of stone and andesite for the majority of my (still not finished >.>) minimap, Pinnacle; my area in Titan's Revolt uses obsidian, black stained clay, and coal blocks. (Yes, this makes gathering coal trivial for the rest of the map. I see this as a good thing; forcing the player to grind excessively for basic materials is not something that I think should happen.) The point is, from a distance, the player probably shouldn't even notice that you're using multiple different blocks. Block variation is something you use to provide texture; variations with a lot of colors of blocks are almost literally painful to look at.
Custom mobs, as of now, are the best way to increase the difficulty of a map without resorting to mob-spam. Vanilla mobs simply aren't dangerous enough for late-game dungeons. It is possible to ramp up the difficulty by using environmental features, but it's hard to pull off in a way that's actually entertaining. I've seen a lot of situations where a dungeon has some sort of environmental gimmick that has just made the area annoying. Vanilla mobs are good enough for early areas, but when there are so many tools for creating custom mobs that it's an easy task, there's very little excuse for not doing so.
I definitely agree with the point about aesthetics; I care very little about how a map looks, and much more about how a map plays. This is why I like (a good number of) Vechs' maps; they may not look great, but they (mostly) play well. Not all people are like me, though, and the general public is not going to be interested if the map doesn't look good. While it's great to have a map that's received well by the community, I don't think anyone is going to deny that we all strive for a bit wider attention, and for that, you need to work on your aesthetics. (Ignore Terra Restore; I think of it as a statistical anomaly.)
EDIT: As Fangride showed in his ninja-post, not all people even within the community are like me. Unless you're deliberately aiming for a "retro" look (which you shouldn't do, please don't do this), you need to at least put in some work on your aesthetics. It doesn't have to look like the most beautiful thing on earth; it just needs to give the impression that you tried your best.
Like I said you need good aesthetics if you want anyone to play your maps, but I personally am alright if the buildings are a bit blocky, but just having a bunch of cubes and calling it an area isn't okay. Once again this is only my opinion and I know everyone else has their own view on the matter.
Yea, In my opinion Aesthetics, Balance, and Originality are the 3 things you should focus on areas. I admit I wasn't lazy, I was just sorta excited per say (I use that too much) making an area that I used cubes. I have a new idea for the "main" attraction that hopefully isn't cublicar,
I think CTM maps shouldn't be held to be any more aesthetically-pleasing than Vanilla Minecraft. I'm not running around a server lobby, I'm getting frustrated and ragequitting (to possibly return later). There's no reason CTM maps have to be uber snazzy.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Hey there, all. I stream CTMs as well as other indie games, Minecraft servers and probably that's it. I'm your supreme overlord too so I command you to CHECK ME OUT: www.twitch.tv/techniclepanther
I think CTM maps shouldn't be held to be any more aesthetically-pleasing than Vanilla Minecraft. I'm not running around a server lobby, I'm getting frustrated and ragequitting (to possibly return later). There's no reason CTM maps have to be uber snazzy.
Understandable, but like Fangride said, looking at cube structures isnt the best on the eyes, and if you do die over and over again you'd rather look at eye-pleasing areas then a cube wasteland, atleast I would.
I think CTM maps shouldn't be held to be any more aesthetically-pleasing than Vanilla Minecraft. I'm not running around a server lobby, I'm getting frustrated and ragequitting (to possibly return later). There's no reason CTM maps have to be uber snazzy.
The aim of a CTM map is to improve upon vanilla Minecraft. The goal is mostly for gameplay, specifically make the map harder than vanilla survival, but also to allow the player to explore dungeons that look more aesthetically pleasing, are harder than the vanilla temples, longer, and have an overall goal.
You don't have to make areas that are aesthetically pleasing as lobbies in large public servers, because those builders are aiming ONLY for aesthetic design with no actual gameplay other than teleporting the player to minigames, survival worlds, etc. Also, those people are getting paid for that job so of course they'll probably put a ton more effort in that one area than any of us could on each area of a 3+ monument map.
What I am saying is that you should aim for a mix of the two. Make aesthetically pleasing landscapes with small buildings and a few larger buildings guarding a monument item.
Because it does not matter if a map is the most beautiful map out there, if the gameplay is non-existent it'll get boring and the player will not have a fun time but rather have the enjoyment of going to an art gallery.
On the other hand, unless the gameplay is new and innovative, you need to have at least a decent looking exterior.
The Super Hostile Series was such a success because Minecraft Survival maps were rarely as fair and hard as Vechs' creations back in the day even if the aesthetic does not hold up to today's standards because, for example, the tools he had for Legendary were not nearly as easy-to-use/accessible as the tools he used for Inferno Mines or Waking Up, which both look significantly better than his older maps.
I definitely don't think you need a ton of custom mobs in every area. In some maps having constant custom mobs makes them get old. "Yeah, another mushroom-wearing skelly, whatever." In Savage Realm for example, everything is a custom mob. And that gets boring. (I still like the map though.) I don't think no custom mobs is good either.
Custom loot, on the other hand: I love seeing lots of it. It shows effort and makes the map feel more finished.
On block combinations: I like the block-percentage thing as long as the blocks look good together.
And for the record, I think you need to put a little more detail into structures than "Hello, box here" in order to have really good aesthetics. I don't have Fangride or Sylf's gift for making huge, epic structures, and I struggle with that myself. I just think you need to put in a bit more effort to make a map look really good.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
I don't care about the Xs. You can call me Navarog. Or Nava if you really want to be a hipster. It's fine.
About custom items, my only problem with them is that they always take more levels that they ask for when you try to repair or combine them with anything, it's pretty annoying bug hopefully tbfixed in 1.9
News: Minecraft 1.9 Snapshot, Windows 10, Minecraft: Windows 10 Edition (Beta) are all scheduled to come out tomorrow.
As a result, I am going to decide whether or not I want to still release my map on August 1st.
A few things can happen:
1.) Minecraft 1.9 has a lot of features I would want implemented into the map.
2.) Windows 10 takes forever to download and I lose a day of polishing the map before beta release.
3.) Windows 10 Edition somehow gives me a reason to not release the map in beta (I do not know how it could affect the map at the time, since I currently believe Windows 10 Edition is the same thing as current minecraft or that it might be similar to the Xbox edition where it is available on the Microsoft game market [or whatever it is called]).
News: Minecraft 1.9 Snapshot, Windows 10, Minecraft: Windows 10 Edition (Beta) are all scheduled to come out tomorrow.
As a result, I am going to decide whether or not I want to still release my map on August 1st.
A few things can happen:
1.) Minecraft 1.9 has a lot of features I would want implemented into the map.
2.) Windows 10 takes forever to download and I lose a day of polishing the map before beta release.
3.) Windows 10 Edition somehow gives me a reason to not release the map in beta (I do not know how it could affect the map at the time, since I currently believe Windows 10 Edition is the same thing as current minecraft or that it might be similar to the Xbox edition where it is available on the Microsoft game market [or whatever it is called]).
The people at Mojang have said that Windows 10 Edition will be entirely separate to the current Minecraft and will have features similar to the Pocket Edition.
They also said that the first snapshot would not contain all the planned 1.9 features so it still could (and most likely will) be a while before 1.9 is officially released.
That being said, as a beta tester, take as long as you need and I'll be sure to give plenty of feedback when the map is ready for download
Question to you all: Will you guys map make on 1.9 or Windows 10?
1.9. I can't do the Windows 10 since I have a Mac laptop.
Plus, I'm really looking forward to messing around with the 1.9 update, especially considering the new mobs, blocks, combat changes and all that stuff.
Plus, I had an idea for the second hand that I wanted to try and see if it could work: Accessories.
These would be items you'd equip in your other hand that would grant health boosts, speed increases, or other such effects.
Pros:
- Increased health, speed, attack, etc.
- Capable of gaining special effects (with some command block magic).
- More opportunity for unique loot and special crafting (if wanted).
Cons:
- Inability to block (may depend on item used)
- Takes up second-hand usage
This is only an idea for the time and could easily be more refined, but once the snapshot comes out tomorrow, I'm hoping to see if it'll work or not (Especially considering how we have no idea how the second-hand slot works in 1.9, this may not even be possible).
Alright, I think I have a totally original community question.
Does anyone think the amount of time someone spent on a map should factor into how good their map actually is?
For instance, if someone spends three years to make a mediocre map, should they be considered a worse mapmaker than someone who makes the same map in one year?
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Hey there, all. I stream CTMs as well as other indie games, Minecraft servers and probably that's it. I'm your supreme overlord too so I command you to CHECK ME OUT: www.twitch.tv/techniclepanther
Alright, I think I have a totally original community question.
Does anyone think the amount of time someone spent on a map should factor into how good their map actually is?
For instance, if someone spends three years to make a mediocre map, should they be considered a worse mapmaker than someone who makes the same map in one year?
This just in: Fang worst mapmaker ever. (just kidding Fang)
As a pretty fast mapmaker, I think speed is a very useful skill to have as a mapmaker. That being said, I don't think people who aren't fast are any worse though. Some people just take more time to do things. The final result is where things should be judged.
Alright, I think I have a totally original community question.
Does anyone think the amount of time someone spent on a map should factor into how good their map actually is?
For instance, if someone spends three years to make a mediocre map, should they be considered a worse mapmaker than someone who makes the same map in one year?
Alright, I think I have a totally original community question.
Does anyone think the amount of time someone spent on a map should factor into how good their map actually is?
For instance, if someone spends three years to make a mediocre map, should they be considered a worse mapmaker than someone who makes the same map in one year?
Alright, I think I have a totally original community question.
Does anyone think the amount of time someone spent on a map should factor into how good their map actually is?
For instance, if someone spends three years to make a mediocre map, should they be considered a worse mapmaker than someone who makes the same map in one year?
Not really. It mostly depends on the actual quality of the map. But it should only be taken into consideration if there is a set time limit, so basically it only matters when judging Strawberry Jam maps.
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Retired StaffStrongly agree with the first half. Custom mobs are necessary now. Gear tiers are often not well handled by map makers either, through loot, which means by the time a player hits the last few intersections, their gear barely scales up. This also means that mobs need to scale up which requires custom mobs. Without that, it's just a swarm of mobs which isn't fun and doesn't let the player progress meaningfully.
As for the other though I disagree, though for similar reasons to above - we have the capability to do things that look nice and please the eye, so take that time to do it. I see a boxy map and instead of thinking about loot or anything, I immediately feel like they were either lazy, or didn't care about their user experience enough to create something one could find visually pleasing. The worse it is, the lower my opinion of the map drops, honestly. It doesn't need to be god-tier decorated, but actually showing some effort goes a long, long way.
I guess I agree with this. Block variation is a good idea to avoid making everything look bland and "same-y"; however, if you're going to make an area out of randomized blocks, then for the love of god, use blocks with low contrast. For example, I use a combination of stone and andesite for the majority of my (still not finished >.>) minimap, Pinnacle; my area in Titan's Revolt uses obsidian, black stained clay, and coal blocks. (Yes, this makes gathering coal trivial for the rest of the map. I see this as a good thing; forcing the player to grind excessively for basic materials is not something that I think should happen.) The point is, from a distance, the player probably shouldn't even notice that you're using multiple different blocks. Block variation is something you use to provide texture; variations with a lot of colors of blocks are almost literally painful to look at.
Custom mobs, as of now, are the best way to increase the difficulty of a map without resorting to mob-spam. Vanilla mobs simply aren't dangerous enough for late-game dungeons. It is possible to ramp up the difficulty by using environmental features, but it's hard to pull off in a way that's actually entertaining. I've seen a lot of situations where a dungeon has some sort of environmental gimmick that has just made the area annoying. Vanilla mobs are good enough for early areas, but when there are so many tools for creating custom mobs that it's an easy task, there's very little excuse for not doing so.
I definitely agree with the point about aesthetics; I care very little about how a map looks, and much more about how a map plays. This is why I like (a good number of) Vechs' maps; they may not look great, but they (mostly) play well. Not all people are like me, though, and the general public is not going to be interested if the map doesn't look good. While it's great to have a map that's received well by the community, I don't think anyone is going to deny that we all strive for a bit wider attention, and for that, you need to work on your aesthetics. (Ignore Terra Restore; I think of it as a statistical anomaly.)
EDIT: As Fangride showed in his ninja-post, not all people even within the community are like me. Unless you're deliberately aiming for a "retro" look (which you shouldn't do, please don't do this), you need to at least put in some work on your aesthetics. It doesn't have to look like the most beautiful thing on earth; it just needs to give the impression that you tried your best.
Like I said you need good aesthetics if you want anyone to play your maps, but I personally am alright if the buildings are a bit blocky, but just having a bunch of cubes and calling it an area isn't okay. Once again this is only my opinion and I know everyone else has their own view on the matter.
Yea, In my opinion Aesthetics, Balance, and Originality are the 3 things you should focus on areas. I admit I wasn't lazy, I was just sorta excited per say (I use that too much) making an area that I used cubes. I have a new idea for the "main" attraction that hopefully isn't cublicar,
Returned to the community. :3
I think CTM maps shouldn't be held to be any more aesthetically-pleasing than Vanilla Minecraft. I'm not running around a server lobby, I'm getting frustrated and ragequitting (to possibly return later). There's no reason CTM maps have to be uber snazzy.
Hey there, all. I stream CTMs as well as other indie games, Minecraft servers and probably that's it. I'm your supreme overlord too so I command you to CHECK ME OUT: www.twitch.tv/techniclepanther
Understandable, but like Fangride said, looking at cube structures isnt the best on the eyes, and if you do die over and over again you'd rather look at eye-pleasing areas then a cube wasteland, atleast I would.
Returned to the community. :3
The aim of a CTM map is to improve upon vanilla Minecraft. The goal is mostly for gameplay, specifically make the map harder than vanilla survival, but also to allow the player to explore dungeons that look more aesthetically pleasing, are harder than the vanilla temples, longer, and have an overall goal.
You don't have to make areas that are aesthetically pleasing as lobbies in large public servers, because those builders are aiming ONLY for aesthetic design with no actual gameplay other than teleporting the player to minigames, survival worlds, etc. Also, those people are getting paid for that job so of course they'll probably put a ton more effort in that one area than any of us could on each area of a 3+ monument map.
What I am saying is that you should aim for a mix of the two. Make aesthetically pleasing landscapes with small buildings and a few larger buildings guarding a monument item.
Because it does not matter if a map is the most beautiful map out there, if the gameplay is non-existent it'll get boring and the player will not have a fun time but rather have the enjoyment of going to an art gallery.
On the other hand, unless the gameplay is new and innovative, you need to have at least a decent looking exterior.
The Super Hostile Series was such a success because Minecraft Survival maps were rarely as fair and hard as Vechs' creations back in the day even if the aesthetic does not hold up to today's standards because, for example, the tools he had for Legendary were not nearly as easy-to-use/accessible as the tools he used for Inferno Mines or Waking Up, which both look significantly better than his older maps.
Rant Over
OK, my input on this:
I definitely don't think you need a ton of custom mobs in every area. In some maps having constant custom mobs makes them get old. "Yeah, another mushroom-wearing skelly, whatever." In Savage Realm for example, everything is a custom mob. And that gets boring. (I still like the map though.) I don't think no custom mobs is good either.
Custom loot, on the other hand: I love seeing lots of it. It shows effort and makes the map feel more finished.
On block combinations: I like the block-percentage thing as long as the blocks look good together.
And for the record, I think you need to put a little more detail into structures than "Hello, box here" in order to have really good aesthetics. I don't have Fangride or Sylf's gift for making huge, epic structures, and I struggle with that myself. I just think you need to put in a bit more effort to make a map look really good.
I don't care about the Xs. You can call me Navarog. Or Nava if you really want to be a hipster. It's fine.
About custom items, my only problem with them is that they always take more levels that they ask for when you try to repair or combine them with anything, it's pretty annoying bug hopefully tbfixed in 1.9
Anyone hyped for snapshot tomorrow?
News: Minecraft 1.9 Snapshot, Windows 10, Minecraft: Windows 10 Edition (Beta) are all scheduled to come out tomorrow.
As a result, I am going to decide whether or not I want to still release my map on August 1st.
A few things can happen:
1.) Minecraft 1.9 has a lot of features I would want implemented into the map.
2.) Windows 10 takes forever to download and I lose a day of polishing the map before beta release.
3.) Windows 10 Edition somehow gives me a reason to not release the map in beta (I do not know how it could affect the map at the time, since I currently believe Windows 10 Edition is the same thing as current minecraft or that it might be similar to the Xbox edition where it is available on the Microsoft game market [or whatever it is called]).
The people at Mojang have said that Windows 10 Edition will be entirely separate to the current Minecraft and will have features similar to the Pocket Edition.
They also said that the first snapshot would not contain all the planned 1.9 features so it still could (and most likely will) be a while before 1.9 is officially released.
That being said, as a beta tester, take as long as you need and I'll be sure to give plenty of feedback when the map is ready for download
Question to you all: Will you guys map make on 1.9 or Windows 10?
Returned to the community. :3
Like I just posted, Windows 10 will be entirely separate to Minecraft PC as we know it, so it will lack the tools of Minecraft as we know it...
So for the foreseeable future I'm going to map on 1.9 and whatever other updates Mojang has in store for us
Ah. my apologizes missed your comment. xD
Returned to the community. :3
1.9. I can't do the Windows 10 since I have a Mac laptop.
Plus, I'm really looking forward to messing around with the 1.9 update, especially considering the new mobs, blocks, combat changes and all that stuff.
Plus, I had an idea for the second hand that I wanted to try and see if it could work: Accessories.
These would be items you'd equip in your other hand that would grant health boosts, speed increases, or other such effects.
Pros:
- Increased health, speed, attack, etc.
- Capable of gaining special effects (with some command block magic).
- More opportunity for unique loot and special crafting (if wanted).
Cons:
- Inability to block (may depend on item used)
- Takes up second-hand usage
This is only an idea for the time and could easily be more refined, but once the snapshot comes out tomorrow, I'm hoping to see if it'll work or not (Especially considering how we have no idea how the second-hand slot works in 1.9, this may not even be possible).
Alright, I think I have a totally original community question.
Does anyone think the amount of time someone spent on a map should factor into how good their map actually is?
For instance, if someone spends three years to make a mediocre map, should they be considered a worse mapmaker than someone who makes the same map in one year?
Hey there, all. I stream CTMs as well as other indie games, Minecraft servers and probably that's it. I'm your supreme overlord too so I command you to CHECK ME OUT: www.twitch.tv/techniclepanther
This just in: Fang worst mapmaker ever. (just kidding Fang)
As a pretty fast mapmaker, I think speed is a very useful skill to have as a mapmaker. That being said, I don't think people who aren't fast are any worse though. Some people just take more time to do things. The final result is where things should be judged.
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Retired StaffNot really, no.
First Question: Yeah
Second: Not at all.
Not really. It mostly depends on the actual quality of the map. But it should only be taken into consideration if there is a set time limit, so basically it only matters when judging Strawberry Jam maps.