This is definitely one of the best posts I've ever read. It sums up just about everything I feel about this place. The only reason I still ever bother to visit here is to either find our more about new updates, or to find intelligent answers to questions that I may have that have already been asked. Sadly, the latter isn't normally something that's found here. Quite a frustrating forum to fish through, I've definitely experienced better. But I've just learned not to expect much decency from a forum that's full of children. Especially when the moderation isn't exactly up to par either...
Your characters are definitely realistic though because I tend to judge people based on the intelligence that they've shown in their posts and place them into similar categories accordingly, lol. That's why I loved this post.
Replying to post- Intellegent
Dealing with troll- Nuetural
Dealing with a gang of trolls- screemer then whiner
-
that's how I go on fourms... yep... So better not anger me... lol, who am I kidding?
So after replying to Gondile, I decided "Hey, what the hell, let's check out his thread." And that's when I encountered something that the Flood can't even hold a candle against. First I'll talk about my experience, then I'll talk about the many different posters in the forum game.
When I joined, I decided to start my welcome party off by starting a thread asking to "suckle the tit of Gondile." I was not greeted with straight arguments though, I encountered the worst of the worst. People who could be pissed off by a loose nail, people who QQed every chance they get, etc. After that thread died, I tried posting in different threads. I found some intelligent human beings, but most were composed of Elitists and AMP’D-Worshippers.
So, now that we got that out of the way, let's talk about the many terrible persons that don’t like Gondile.
The Intelligent Ones (Gondile, Me)
These are the few that dwell in this forum. They try to create meaningful threads and try to spur a discussion/debate. However, there is little of them, so there isn't much more information on them. Besides, they are mostly drowned out by the others.
The Worshippers of AMP’D’s Feet (Everyone who disagrees with me)
These vary wildly from having the most **** poor grammar on the planet to grammar resembling that of the” Everyone who disagrees with me”. Despite how they type, they all act the same. Their one true god is AMP’D and he is their master. Whatever choices he makes, they are right beside him. If a thread has ONE bad post by Gondile and someone complains or suggests differently to it, they will be showered upon with the FAWKIN FURY.
Be especially aware of this type of forum goer, as they travel in packs. **** off one, and you have awakened the bee hive. Prepare for a crapstorm.
The Whiners (People who disagree with me)
They will complain every chance they get. If AMP'D even lifts a finger in the wrong direction to their liking, they will go batcrap insane and throw a temper tantrum, crying their eyes out as they seek ass pats and "damn..."s from everyone. Do not feed this kind, it is better if they go extinct.
The Elitist (People who disagree with me)
These are very common in the wild, and it is best not to approach them. These dwell in many forums, but are normally only in the forums I don’t like. There, they will utter HILARIOUS CATCHPHRASES LIKE "I disagree with your opinion " and "Gondile, you’re points are illogical" Elitists are, however, able to be tamed. If you also own tenbux and tell them a ******** response, they most likely will crawl back to their hole.
Dear God. You're right! If you value your sanity (or what's left of it) stay away from the update discussions! And, for that matter, any of the fora. It's not worth it.
And... Flood. Capitalised. I think I see what you did there. Halo, right?
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
The physical embodiment of wrath and lust. Beware the wrathful succubus named Liara!
I read your thread just a few moments ago, and the hunger bar should be toggable (or how you would say it I don't know :smile.gif:) hhhmmm since I defend people (most of the time out of all the posting I did :smile.gif:) so what should I be!
myehhh, idk what category i fall in, cuz i like most any game i play, no matter what other people say, or regardless of what updates there are, i'm the kind of person who likes to change things up, or i get bored very easily because of repetitive things, minecraft is repetitive but it's really good and fun at the same time so it's one of the best games I've played.
So after replying to Gondile, I decided "Hey, what the hell, let's check out his thread." And that's when I encountered something that the Flood can't even hold a candle against. First I'll talk about my experience, then I'll talk about the many different posters in the forum game.
When I joined, I decided to start my welcome party off by starting a thread asking to "suckle the tit of Gondile." I was not greeted with straight arguments though, I encountered the worst of the worst. People who could be pissed off by a loose nail, people who QQed every chance they get, etc. After that thread died, I tried posting in different threads. I found some intelligent human beings, but most were composed of Elitists and AMP’D-Worshippers.
So, now that we got that out of the way, let's talk about the many terrible persons that don’t like Gondile.
The Intelligent Ones (Gondile, Me)
These are the few that dwell in this forum. They try to create meaningful threads and try to spur a discussion/debate. However, there is little of them, so there isn't much more information on them. Besides, they are mostly drowned out by the others.
The Worshippers of AMP’D’s Feet (Everyone who disagrees with me)
These vary wildly from having the most **** poor grammar on the planet to grammar resembling that of the” Everyone who disagrees with me”. Despite how they type, they all act the same. Their one true god is AMP’D and he is their master. Whatever choices he makes, they are right beside him. If a thread has ONE bad post by Gondile and someone complains or suggests differently to it, they will be showered upon with the FAWKIN FURY.
Be especially aware of this type of forum goer, as they travel in packs. **** off one, and you have awakened the bee hive. Prepare for a crapstorm.
The Whiners (People who disagree with me)
They will complain every chance they get. If AMP'D even lifts a finger in the wrong direction to their liking, they will go batcrap insane and throw a temper tantrum, crying their eyes out as they seek ass pats and "damn..."s from everyone. Do not feed this kind, it is better if they go extinct.
The Elitist (People who disagree with me)
These are very common in the wild, and it is best not to approach them. These dwell in many forums, but are normally only in the forums I don’t like. There, they will utter HILARIOUS CATCHPHRASES LIKE "I disagree with your opinion " and "Gondile, you’re points are illogical" Elitists are, however, able to be tamed. If you also own tenbux and tell them a ******** response, they most likely will crawl back to their hole.
Yeahhh. I found your "Toggleable Hunger" thread, and where you describe the people in the thread as terrible and obnoxious etc., that is actually how you behave. When you have an OP as ridiculously childish and loudmouthed as your's, how can you expect people to take you seriously? And then you went on further down in the thread to act like a complete knob, and to top it all off you posted this.
Well done. I think you're just the icing on the delicious cake that is Hypocrisy.
I act like this because it's the only way this terrible community will listen. Don't believe me?
I stumbled upon this thread while trying to figure out why another thread had been locked (completely unrelated). It genuinely made me smile.
You won't see much of the truly smart and/or self-disciplined people participating in any kind of argument or discussion unless they can police themselves, which means: reread their own contribution to the discussion and edit it to remove any kind of voluntary attempt at:
Bitching
Hurting
Insulting
Belittling
Making fun of
Whining
Complaining
Patronizing
Variants of the aforementioned.
If any of the above manage to get to you (meaning, they get some kind of instant reaction from you that makes you feel like "OMG SOMEONE ON THE INTERNET IS WRONG!!!"), DON'T POST. If you are used to commenting in the above fashion, DON'T POST. Breathe, reread yourself; if you truly believe your contribution is that good, then it doesn't really need all the decoration of caps, or any coating of smarminess or self-superiority. If you doubt its worth, that could be your mind telling you that you're missing some information! Go back and read some more.
Keep it to facts as much as you can.
Distance yourself from it all. I'm betting you don't judge your self-worth by the contents of your posts (meaning you've done something more out of your life than post on forums)?? Yeah, so why get fiered up at a bunch of words from a stranger? Your posts are not your entire life.
The way in which the original post is laid out is kinda funny, granted. But it can also be interpreted as a pointy lashout at any number of people. So you'll always end up with the same reaction: people telling you you're wrong for having posted it, that you're no better than them, etc... Along with the people who'll think it's cool and such of course.
So it joins the flow of posts that "stir up" a community without really providing any new information at the end of the day, except maybe for the newcomers who haven't had the complete "forum experience" yet.
Any forum, any discussion group like this open to a wide range of people will probably end up like this until people wisen up because there's just too many conflicting opinions out there. The one way I see of getting out of it, is to not be so damn bothered by it all, and it'll settle down on its own.
Just my two cents in case anyone is interested! (and if you are not I'm sure I'll be told somehow, or not--but I'll still sleep just fine tonight. :smile.gif:
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
How to deal with ignorance (in life, and on forums): The Zen way... Stay cool and polite, treat people as you wish to be treated, rise above your impatience. Everyone is ignorant of something at any point in their lives, including you.
I stumbled upon this thread while trying to figure out why another thread had been locked (completely unrelated). It genuinely made me smile.
{snip}
Just my two cents in case anyone is interested! (and if you are not I'm sure I'll be told somehow, or not--but I'll still sleep just fine tonight. :smile.gif:
You can call it cliché or claim I'm just agreeing to agree, but I could not have said it better myself.
I read the what I believe is the OP's second thread on the hunger toggle and found this thread linked there. I read the entirety of the first post and while I agree with some things, I also disagree with others. I also honestly feel slightly offended by Gondle's tone. At time same time, I've been lurking in the 1.9 update discussion subforum since finding out 1.9 had been leaked and the overwhelming mass of rage posts about X feature is getting out of hand.
TL;DR: Gondle, I agree with you (mostly), but you're playing into it, effectively feeding the trolls. Just sayin'.
You have put users into accurate categories there. Well done.
The Minecraft Forums is a harsh, wild place.
If you fight the whiners, trolls, notch-cultists, and other vile users, they will just bring you down to their level of intelligence.
Don't let anyone make you angry, because if they do, they can control your emotions and, ultimately, you.
There are three words which will help you survive in the harshest areas of the forums:
Silence is Golden
Because obviously the OP is being silent and and doing a job well done?
Highly unlikely.
The OP purposely went out of his/her/its way to lash out at the community.
This thread has no purpose other than to injure other posters.
It doesn't advance any new ideas.
It doesn't build up or push a particular point, besides maybe the point that the OP dislikes practically everyone on these forums but the remarkable few.
It doesn't enact any responses but the responses of those who get hurt by the post and the responses of those who don't get hurt by the post.
As for why certain users get hurt by the post and others think it's funny, it may be because a disproportianate amount of people think they fall in the first group, which by judging/counting the amount of responses that say that the OP's post is 'cool' is the majority of people...
Which is highly unlikely, if the OP's post is actually, statistically true.
More likely than not, more than half of those that post how cool the OP's post is do not fall into the first category. If such logic was true then there would need to be some particular conditions that would need to be met.
1. Out of the millions of forum users here, only a select few actually are 'smart' and do not blindly succumb to some 'horrible' whim/fancy/childish fantasy.
Highly unlikely considering that even the OP's post is articulated in a particular smarmy/sarcastic form. If the OP intended merely to share information he/she/it wouldn't succumb to their 'ridiculous' fantasy and start scapegoating the community for their problems.
Every individual has their fantasy, their way of interpreting things, they whimsical fancy of the world that surrounds them and how it all fits together with the information they've just heard.
2. Once again, the likliehood of every user that has called the OP's post 'cool' being in the first class is highly unlikely.
At one point, the OP points out to one responder that lurking quietly and never saying anything until a particular point can be made or until one can derail a conversation that they deem 'trolling' is 'smart'.
Unfortunately, the term 'trolling' is highly subjective. How do we know that someone is trolling? How do we know that our information is correct? In more than enough cases someone is called a 'troll' when they simply offer a different rubric to understanding the situation.
I.E.: Speaker1:'That texture pack is the original, but it's HD.'
speaker2:'No, that's not the original texture pack. If it's 'HD' it can't be the original texture pack. For something to be HD in minecraft means it was a pack made by someone else."
speaker1:'No, what I mean is that those are the original textures, but updated/upgraded to be HD.'
speaker2:'There are no 'orginal' textures in that video. If they are 'HD' as you say then they are not the original textures. Go look up texturepacks on the Minecraft forums.'
speaker1:'You're just trolling me! I'm talking about how the texturepack in the video looks just like the original textures but more HD!'
speaker2:'You sir are a troll if you can't be botehred to understand how texture packs are used!'
And so on and so forth.
It's ridiculous. Both posters are right and both posters are wrong.
They are simply misunderstanding each other and focusing on different words/wmphasizing different points that the other.
(That conversation is in part taken from some comments I read on a Minecraft video some while ago. If I can find the actual comments/video I will post it here.)
How can anyone consider anyone else's post 'trolling'?
Based on what criteria does someone label someone a troll?
based on what standard or measurement?
the individual's on subjective desire to punch the other poster in the face?
The individual's interpretation of what the poster may or may not be saying?
No, responding to a true 'troll' is 1. bad. never feed a troll. 2. an awful idea, how do you actually know for a fact that the poster is purposefully trying to cause harm? 3. even if the poster is individually causing you harm and bother is there a need to point a finger at the person and start resoriting to name-calling/jabbing/de-railing of threads? How is the 'good' person in this example a good person if they're destroying the 'troll's' thread/handiwork/creation. if you truly intend to deal with someone in a wise manner, then talking is your friend. DO not jab at the poster or intend to harm them. Merely point out their weaknesses in their argument and hope that they can respond wisely as well.
If they can't, offer them the other cheek and then the first one again.
This is a forum after all. Why would anyone need to verbally harm another simply because we may misunderstand each other?
Another condition that is needed if it is assumed that everyone that said the OP's post is 'cool' are in the first ctategory is that the OP's post would need to be a logical, non-complaining post that actually lends itself to the 'smart' reader.
The OP's post is not in any fashion a 'smart' post. It lends itself to sarcasm and makes a mockery of practically everyone on the forum but those ignorant enough to think they fall into the first category.
Secondly, the OP's post makes up terms and in later posts the OP uses the excuse that he/she/it must communicate in such a fashion to communicate at all on the forums, which is quite the excuse.
If such an excuse is fashioned then we're heading into a Cold War crisis.
The debate/spectacle/argument/discontent cannot be diffused with the endless circle of spittle/poison/ridicule that each party thinks is necessary to communicate with the other.
To simply state that the only efficient way of getting across to another group of persons is to insult them into listening is ridiculous.
A quick check on the OP's posts will reliably show that ridiculing others does not spawn debate of the original topic so much as debate about each other.
Also, in order for the OP to make an actual statement about how he/she/it must use hurtful language to get a point across the OP must have at one point tried to communicate thoughtfully, peasefully, and without ridicule.
How many posts of the OP actually contain these assets? How long did the OP wait till he/she/it succumbed to relying on hurting other posters in order to communicate his/her/its opinion?
It doesn't seem to be very long.
I would not congratulate the OP on this hurtful and redundant post that offers no new information besides the fact that the OP doesn't understand how to communicate in a reasonable fashion with users of this forum and that the OP has felt hurt by the forum.
I would hope that the OP would respond to my post and I would hope that I can come to better understand the OP, but at this point I'm mostly concerned with what will be said back to me.
Will the OP find my post too long to read? Will I have smarm thrown back at me?
Will I have my argument torn apart piece by piece and then hurled back at me?
I sort of hope the latter is true! There is no need for smarm, hate, or sarcasm, dear OP.
I merely mean to point out that smarm will not win you many friends. It may cause a knee-jerk reaction and cause more poeple to respond... but are they actually responding thoughtfully?
Examing most of the posts to this thread I think not... most responses are about how cool your post is or about how much of an ass you are for posting such things.
I don't think you are eitehr cool or an ass, merely confused as to how to deal with users on this forum.
Anyway, I hope this was enlightening to at least someone and if it has harmed anyone, please, turn the other cheek. This is after all a tiny footprint in the numerical code of the Minecraft forum. A blip of existence that will soon fade away and be forgotten about as soon as you, the reader eats their breakfast or watches their daily program. My post is meant to be taken witha grain of salt. Yes, I probably am wrong somewhere. Yes, you don't have to agree with me or even like me. Yes, you can respond hatefully and disdainfully, I won't stop you.
Just remember that this really doesn't matter.
I just have free time and have chosen to spend it in this way.
Speaking about ideology and particular philosophies, subcultural and not.
Finally, to address the concept that arguing with someone 'brings you down to their level of intelligence'.
Does anyoen actuallybelieve in that concept? I am sure there are those that do, but it seems somewhat surprising to me.
Such a concept automatically places anyone that you argue with in a subhuman or lesser than thou category.
What gall, what elitism, what a draconic principle!
How can you expect to get along with anyone or not be bothered all the time if you are applying such a concept to others? Of course you're upset! of course everyone seems like a 'troll', of course you don't get along but with a few that seem to be 'smart'.
You don't even offer a chance to those that disagree with you. Yes, they may make rash decisions, yes they may argue in a very unpoetic manner, or their conception of morality may be much different than yours, but if you let such concepts push you into such a fervor for your own opinions that you say that you can't argue with them because their intelligence is lower than yours... and that arguing with them brings you down to their level... why... how are you any better than them? How are you being moral? Are these subhumans even worthy of letting on these forums? Maybe we should do something about them... hmm...
Basically, if such a concept is to be held true and followed it leads to extreme dogmatism.
Of course you need to 'meet to their level of intelligence'. I'm not saying that they are stupider than thou, dumber than thou, or even smarter than thou.
I am saying that in order to understand someone you need to understand why they are saying the things they are saying.
Therefore you need to meet them head to head, in the middle, in a discussion.
You have to listen to understand. You have to ask questions.
If you give up halfway through and say you don't care anymore... you still don't understand. You simply don't care anymore.
Getting angry or letting thinsg bug you is not being 'controlled' or 'manipulated'. In what fashion is someone controlling me if I get angry at their actions or words? They are... what? Making me cook my breakfast poorly beause I'm distracted by argument? They are... making me kill people? In what way does arguing on a forum and getting furstrated about things cause peopel to control you?
COntrol yourself.
Not even a murderer can use the excuse that he/she/it was so mad because of something the victim did.
In the end you control yourself, noone else.
As a closing statement, I choose to respond to DaBomb.
Silence is not golden.
Figuratively or literally.
To be silent is to let things happen around you. To be silent is to be oppressed. To be silent is to let things slide.
To be silent is to not stir the waters. To be silent is to not add to a discussion in any form. To be silent is foolish.
Do you have an opinion? Why not? Does it not apply to you?
Really?
It would seem that you have dealt with 'trolls'...
It would seem that you disagree with many a person and are quite frustrated at many people...
Why?
Do you not understand them?
Do you let them 'manipulate and control you'?
Do you actually, really care? Or not?
If you did, you would speak.
What is the action of one man but the future fo the world, eh?
Hah! One action would do nothing! How simplistic to think that any action done by any individual could actually change or influence anything in any way, shape, or form.
How silly of me to think that speaking up, saying something, anything at all would change things!
This is, of course, sarcasm.
Don't you understand, dear DaBomb?
Everything affects everything.
I'm currently staying up to type this. I have nothing to do tomorrow. I find this discussion interesting. I'll be musing over it before bed.
Those who read this post will be affected, they will make decisions on it.
Everything you do does cause affect. Whether it be minimal or huge is untold.
Silence is not golden. Silence is the naysayer of change, progress, adventure, and time.
For how can you tell one moment from the next without something affecting you, hm?
EDIT: I've +1'd your post DaBomb and OP because they got me to have fun thinking about things for an hour or so. While I disagree with both of you and while I found the OP's post to be a little on the sinister/hurtful side I have definitely spent a lot of time thinking because of them.
Okay... can you make your point without writing a whole book about it?
Its way too much to be able to take in just when I am casually forum'in.
Not to sound like a jerk or lazy or anything.
I can attempt to write another, shorter post, but it may take some time to condense what I said.
Might I suggest that you attempt to read what I said again?
Do you actually want to read what I have to say if you're merely, casually skimming through posts anyway?
I somewhat think not.
In order to respond to the things that I bring up in my post the reader would need to understand what I am saying.
It is the TLDR and the condensing of subject material that leads to so many of the misunderstandings on these forums.
We attempt to understand each other, but can't really be bothered to truly understand.
Nevertheless, I will attempt to make another post, but shorter, and more concise.
EDIT: As it is three in the morning and the long book-like post I made ( I admit is is quite long ) has tired me out, I will be coming back at a later time to write a more concise post if need still be, by that time. I hope you do not mind.
Oops. Thanks for pointing that out. I kind of contradicted myself there. You're right. Sorry
No need to be sorry, DaBomb.
I just meant to point out that there was a bit of contradiction going on with the way you were using that saying.
Though, I personally believe there is no place for such a saying, except maybe in the place of a heated argument with a loved one. There are times where, cooling down and being silent is good, but in the long run, being silent does not solve problems.
And I am certain I probably have a contradiction or two in my huge post.
I'll probably try to remedy that in my shorter, more concise post for Trippledot.
I'm just feeling particularly quizzical tonight.
EDIT: In fact, I found a contradiction already in my own post.
At one point I discuss how everything we do is important and will definitely effect something else, even in the tiniest of ways... but a paragraph or two before that I remark that what I'm doing right now doesn't matter... well... it does. Obviously what I'm doing matters to me enough that I'm spending inordinate amounts of time writing a post that will be quickly forgotten. And these posts will absorb someone's time and attention for at least a few moments. What I've done matters.
I guess what I meant was that the importance of what I'm doing is not very high.I don't expect a new culture or nation to be created because of my posts. Nor do I expect a war. I am only expecting some reading and maybe some simple discussion.
Your characters are definitely realistic though because I tend to judge people based on the intelligence that they've shown in their posts and place them into similar categories accordingly, lol. That's why I loved this post.
Dealing with troll- Nuetural
Dealing with a gang of trolls- screemer then whiner
-
that's how I go on fourms... yep... So better not anger me... lol, who am I kidding?
When I joined, I decided to start my welcome party off by starting a thread asking to "suckle the tit of Gondile." I was not greeted with straight arguments though, I encountered the worst of the worst. People who could be pissed off by a loose nail, people who QQed every chance they get, etc. After that thread died, I tried posting in different threads. I found some intelligent human beings, but most were composed of Elitists and AMP’D-Worshippers.
So, now that we got that out of the way, let's talk about the many terrible persons that don’t like Gondile.
The Intelligent Ones (Gondile, Me)
These are the few that dwell in this forum. They try to create meaningful threads and try to spur a discussion/debate. However, there is little of them, so there isn't much more information on them. Besides, they are mostly drowned out by the others.
The Worshippers of AMP’D’s Feet (Everyone who disagrees with me)
These vary wildly from having the most **** poor grammar on the planet to grammar resembling that of the” Everyone who disagrees with me”. Despite how they type, they all act the same. Their one true god is AMP’D and he is their master. Whatever choices he makes, they are right beside him. If a thread has ONE bad post by Gondile and someone complains or suggests differently to it, they will be showered upon with the FAWKIN FURY.
Be especially aware of this type of forum goer, as they travel in packs. **** off one, and you have awakened the bee hive. Prepare for a crapstorm.
The Whiners (People who disagree with me)
They will complain every chance they get. If AMP'D even lifts a finger in the wrong direction to their liking, they will go batcrap insane and throw a temper tantrum, crying their eyes out as they seek ass pats and "damn..."s from everyone. Do not feed this kind, it is better if they go extinct.
The Elitist (People who disagree with me)
These are very common in the wild, and it is best not to approach them. These dwell in many forums, but are normally only in the forums I don’t like. There, they will utter HILARIOUS CATCHPHRASES LIKE "I disagree with your opinion " and "Gondile, you’re points are illogical" Elitists are, however, able to be tamed. If you also own tenbux and tell them a ******** response, they most likely will crawl back to their hole.
THIS IS WHAT YOU SOUND LIKE
And... Flood. Capitalised. I think I see what you did there. Halo, right?
;'''
Straight from the Elitist breeding ground!
http://www.minecraftforum.net/topic/615431-hunger-doesnt-need-to-go-but-something-needs-to-be-done/page__p__8120037__fromsearch__1#entry8120037
And the thread slowly died.
But look at my new one! It's reached over 20 pages and keeps on trucking.
You would think that considering you yourself are an elitist!
You won't see much of the truly smart and/or self-disciplined people participating in any kind of argument or discussion unless they can police themselves, which means: reread their own contribution to the discussion and edit it to remove any kind of voluntary attempt at:
If you are used to commenting in the above fashion, DON'T POST. Breathe, reread yourself; if you truly believe your contribution is that good, then it doesn't really need all the decoration of caps, or any coating of smarminess or self-superiority. If you doubt its worth, that could be your mind telling you that you're missing some information! Go back and read some more.
Keep it to facts as much as you can.
Distance yourself from it all. I'm betting you don't judge your self-worth by the contents of your posts (meaning you've done something more out of your life than post on forums)?? Yeah, so why get fiered up at a bunch of words from a stranger? Your posts are not your entire life.
The way in which the original post is laid out is kinda funny, granted. But it can also be interpreted as a pointy lashout at any number of people. So you'll always end up with the same reaction: people telling you you're wrong for having posted it, that you're no better than them, etc... Along with the people who'll think it's cool and such of course.
So it joins the flow of posts that "stir up" a community without really providing any new information at the end of the day, except maybe for the newcomers who haven't had the complete "forum experience" yet.
Any forum, any discussion group like this open to a wide range of people will probably end up like this until people wisen up because there's just too many conflicting opinions out there. The one way I see of getting out of it, is to not be so damn bothered by it all, and it'll settle down on its own.
Just my two cents in case anyone is interested! (and if you are not I'm sure I'll be told somehow, or not--but I'll still sleep just fine tonight. :smile.gif:
How to deal with ignorance (in life, and on forums): The Zen way... Stay cool and polite, treat people as you wish to be treated, rise above your impatience. Everyone is ignorant of something at any point in their lives, including you.
You can call it cliché or claim I'm just agreeing to agree, but I could not have said it better myself.
I read the what I believe is the OP's second thread on the hunger toggle and found this thread linked there. I read the entirety of the first post and while I agree with some things, I also disagree with others. I also honestly feel slightly offended by Gondle's tone. At time same time, I've been lurking in the 1.9 update discussion subforum since finding out 1.9 had been leaked and the overwhelming mass of rage posts about X feature is getting out of hand.
TL;DR: Gondle, I agree with you (mostly), but you're playing into it, effectively feeding the trolls. Just sayin'.
The Minecraft Forums is a harsh, wild place.
If you fight the whiners, trolls, notch-cultists, and other vile users, they will just bring you down to their level of intelligence.
Don't let anyone make you angry, because if they do, they can control your emotions and, ultimately, you.
There are three words which will help you survive in the harshest areas of the forums:
Silence is Golden
Ignorance is Bliss
I am here for you, Don't be afraid to send me a message.
That also works.
Because obviously the OP is being silent and and doing a job well done?
Highly unlikely.
The OP purposely went out of his/her/its way to lash out at the community.
This thread has no purpose other than to injure other posters.
It doesn't advance any new ideas.
It doesn't build up or push a particular point, besides maybe the point that the OP dislikes practically everyone on these forums but the remarkable few.
It doesn't enact any responses but the responses of those who get hurt by the post and the responses of those who don't get hurt by the post.
As for why certain users get hurt by the post and others think it's funny, it may be because a disproportianate amount of people think they fall in the first group, which by judging/counting the amount of responses that say that the OP's post is 'cool' is the majority of people...
Which is highly unlikely, if the OP's post is actually, statistically true.
More likely than not, more than half of those that post how cool the OP's post is do not fall into the first category. If such logic was true then there would need to be some particular conditions that would need to be met.
1. Out of the millions of forum users here, only a select few actually are 'smart' and do not blindly succumb to some 'horrible' whim/fancy/childish fantasy.
Highly unlikely considering that even the OP's post is articulated in a particular smarmy/sarcastic form. If the OP intended merely to share information he/she/it wouldn't succumb to their 'ridiculous' fantasy and start scapegoating the community for their problems.
Every individual has their fantasy, their way of interpreting things, they whimsical fancy of the world that surrounds them and how it all fits together with the information they've just heard.
2. Once again, the likliehood of every user that has called the OP's post 'cool' being in the first class is highly unlikely.
At one point, the OP points out to one responder that lurking quietly and never saying anything until a particular point can be made or until one can derail a conversation that they deem 'trolling' is 'smart'.
Unfortunately, the term 'trolling' is highly subjective. How do we know that someone is trolling? How do we know that our information is correct? In more than enough cases someone is called a 'troll' when they simply offer a different rubric to understanding the situation.
I.E.: Speaker1:'That texture pack is the original, but it's HD.'
speaker2:'No, that's not the original texture pack. If it's 'HD' it can't be the original texture pack. For something to be HD in minecraft means it was a pack made by someone else."
speaker1:'No, what I mean is that those are the original textures, but updated/upgraded to be HD.'
speaker2:'There are no 'orginal' textures in that video. If they are 'HD' as you say then they are not the original textures. Go look up texturepacks on the Minecraft forums.'
speaker1:'You're just trolling me! I'm talking about how the texturepack in the video looks just like the original textures but more HD!'
speaker2:'You sir are a troll if you can't be botehred to understand how texture packs are used!'
And so on and so forth.
It's ridiculous. Both posters are right and both posters are wrong.
They are simply misunderstanding each other and focusing on different words/wmphasizing different points that the other.
(That conversation is in part taken from some comments I read on a Minecraft video some while ago. If I can find the actual comments/video I will post it here.)
How can anyone consider anyone else's post 'trolling'?
Based on what criteria does someone label someone a troll?
based on what standard or measurement?
the individual's on subjective desire to punch the other poster in the face?
The individual's interpretation of what the poster may or may not be saying?
No, responding to a true 'troll' is 1. bad. never feed a troll. 2. an awful idea, how do you actually know for a fact that the poster is purposefully trying to cause harm? 3. even if the poster is individually causing you harm and bother is there a need to point a finger at the person and start resoriting to name-calling/jabbing/de-railing of threads? How is the 'good' person in this example a good person if they're destroying the 'troll's' thread/handiwork/creation. if you truly intend to deal with someone in a wise manner, then talking is your friend. DO not jab at the poster or intend to harm them. Merely point out their weaknesses in their argument and hope that they can respond wisely as well.
If they can't, offer them the other cheek and then the first one again.
This is a forum after all. Why would anyone need to verbally harm another simply because we may misunderstand each other?
Another condition that is needed if it is assumed that everyone that said the OP's post is 'cool' are in the first ctategory is that the OP's post would need to be a logical, non-complaining post that actually lends itself to the 'smart' reader.
The OP's post is not in any fashion a 'smart' post. It lends itself to sarcasm and makes a mockery of practically everyone on the forum but those ignorant enough to think they fall into the first category.
Secondly, the OP's post makes up terms and in later posts the OP uses the excuse that he/she/it must communicate in such a fashion to communicate at all on the forums, which is quite the excuse.
If such an excuse is fashioned then we're heading into a Cold War crisis.
The debate/spectacle/argument/discontent cannot be diffused with the endless circle of spittle/poison/ridicule that each party thinks is necessary to communicate with the other.
To simply state that the only efficient way of getting across to another group of persons is to insult them into listening is ridiculous.
A quick check on the OP's posts will reliably show that ridiculing others does not spawn debate of the original topic so much as debate about each other.
Also, in order for the OP to make an actual statement about how he/she/it must use hurtful language to get a point across the OP must have at one point tried to communicate thoughtfully, peasefully, and without ridicule.
How many posts of the OP actually contain these assets? How long did the OP wait till he/she/it succumbed to relying on hurting other posters in order to communicate his/her/its opinion?
It doesn't seem to be very long.
I would not congratulate the OP on this hurtful and redundant post that offers no new information besides the fact that the OP doesn't understand how to communicate in a reasonable fashion with users of this forum and that the OP has felt hurt by the forum.
I would hope that the OP would respond to my post and I would hope that I can come to better understand the OP, but at this point I'm mostly concerned with what will be said back to me.
Will the OP find my post too long to read? Will I have smarm thrown back at me?
Will I have my argument torn apart piece by piece and then hurled back at me?
I sort of hope the latter is true! There is no need for smarm, hate, or sarcasm, dear OP.
I merely mean to point out that smarm will not win you many friends. It may cause a knee-jerk reaction and cause more poeple to respond... but are they actually responding thoughtfully?
Examing most of the posts to this thread I think not... most responses are about how cool your post is or about how much of an ass you are for posting such things.
I don't think you are eitehr cool or an ass, merely confused as to how to deal with users on this forum.
Anyway, I hope this was enlightening to at least someone and if it has harmed anyone, please, turn the other cheek. This is after all a tiny footprint in the numerical code of the Minecraft forum. A blip of existence that will soon fade away and be forgotten about as soon as you, the reader eats their breakfast or watches their daily program. My post is meant to be taken witha grain of salt. Yes, I probably am wrong somewhere. Yes, you don't have to agree with me or even like me. Yes, you can respond hatefully and disdainfully, I won't stop you.
Just remember that this really doesn't matter.
I just have free time and have chosen to spend it in this way.
Speaking about ideology and particular philosophies, subcultural and not.
Finally, to address the concept that arguing with someone 'brings you down to their level of intelligence'.
Does anyoen actuallybelieve in that concept? I am sure there are those that do, but it seems somewhat surprising to me.
Such a concept automatically places anyone that you argue with in a subhuman or lesser than thou category.
What gall, what elitism, what a draconic principle!
How can you expect to get along with anyone or not be bothered all the time if you are applying such a concept to others? Of course you're upset! of course everyone seems like a 'troll', of course you don't get along but with a few that seem to be 'smart'.
You don't even offer a chance to those that disagree with you. Yes, they may make rash decisions, yes they may argue in a very unpoetic manner, or their conception of morality may be much different than yours, but if you let such concepts push you into such a fervor for your own opinions that you say that you can't argue with them because their intelligence is lower than yours... and that arguing with them brings you down to their level... why... how are you any better than them? How are you being moral? Are these subhumans even worthy of letting on these forums? Maybe we should do something about them... hmm...
Basically, if such a concept is to be held true and followed it leads to extreme dogmatism.
Of course you need to 'meet to their level of intelligence'. I'm not saying that they are stupider than thou, dumber than thou, or even smarter than thou.
I am saying that in order to understand someone you need to understand why they are saying the things they are saying.
Therefore you need to meet them head to head, in the middle, in a discussion.
You have to listen to understand. You have to ask questions.
If you give up halfway through and say you don't care anymore... you still don't understand. You simply don't care anymore.
Getting angry or letting thinsg bug you is not being 'controlled' or 'manipulated'. In what fashion is someone controlling me if I get angry at their actions or words? They are... what? Making me cook my breakfast poorly beause I'm distracted by argument? They are... making me kill people? In what way does arguing on a forum and getting furstrated about things cause peopel to control you?
COntrol yourself.
Not even a murderer can use the excuse that he/she/it was so mad because of something the victim did.
In the end you control yourself, noone else.
As a closing statement, I choose to respond to DaBomb.
Silence is not golden.
Figuratively or literally.
To be silent is to let things happen around you. To be silent is to be oppressed. To be silent is to let things slide.
To be silent is to not stir the waters. To be silent is to not add to a discussion in any form. To be silent is foolish.
Do you have an opinion? Why not? Does it not apply to you?
Really?
It would seem that you have dealt with 'trolls'...
It would seem that you disagree with many a person and are quite frustrated at many people...
Why?
Do you not understand them?
Do you let them 'manipulate and control you'?
Do you actually, really care? Or not?
If you did, you would speak.
What is the action of one man but the future fo the world, eh?
Hah! One action would do nothing! How simplistic to think that any action done by any individual could actually change or influence anything in any way, shape, or form.
How silly of me to think that speaking up, saying something, anything at all would change things!
This is, of course, sarcasm.
Don't you understand, dear DaBomb?
Everything affects everything.
I'm currently staying up to type this. I have nothing to do tomorrow. I find this discussion interesting. I'll be musing over it before bed.
Those who read this post will be affected, they will make decisions on it.
Everything you do does cause affect. Whether it be minimal or huge is untold.
Silence is not golden. Silence is the naysayer of change, progress, adventure, and time.
For how can you tell one moment from the next without something affecting you, hm?
EDIT: I've +1'd your post DaBomb and OP because they got me to have fun thinking about things for an hour or so. While I disagree with both of you and while I found the OP's post to be a little on the sinister/hurtful side I have definitely spent a lot of time thinking because of them.
I can attempt to write another, shorter post, but it may take some time to condense what I said.
Might I suggest that you attempt to read what I said again?
Do you actually want to read what I have to say if you're merely, casually skimming through posts anyway?
I somewhat think not.
In order to respond to the things that I bring up in my post the reader would need to understand what I am saying.
It is the TLDR and the condensing of subject material that leads to so many of the misunderstandings on these forums.
We attempt to understand each other, but can't really be bothered to truly understand.
Nevertheless, I will attempt to make another post, but shorter, and more concise.
EDIT: As it is three in the morning and the long book-like post I made ( I admit is is quite long ) has tired me out, I will be coming back at a later time to write a more concise post if need still be, by that time. I hope you do not mind.
No need to be sorry, DaBomb.
I just meant to point out that there was a bit of contradiction going on with the way you were using that saying.
Though, I personally believe there is no place for such a saying, except maybe in the place of a heated argument with a loved one. There are times where, cooling down and being silent is good, but in the long run, being silent does not solve problems.
And I am certain I probably have a contradiction or two in my huge post.
I'll probably try to remedy that in my shorter, more concise post for Trippledot.
I'm just feeling particularly quizzical tonight.
EDIT: In fact, I found a contradiction already in my own post.
At one point I discuss how everything we do is important and will definitely effect something else, even in the tiniest of ways... but a paragraph or two before that I remark that what I'm doing right now doesn't matter... well... it does. Obviously what I'm doing matters to me enough that I'm spending inordinate amounts of time writing a post that will be quickly forgotten. And these posts will absorb someone's time and attention for at least a few moments. What I've done matters.
I guess what I meant was that the importance of what I'm doing is not very high.I don't expect a new culture or nation to be created because of my posts. Nor do I expect a war. I am only expecting some reading and maybe some simple discussion.
The first one makes no sense.