I know I've mentioned this several times in this forum about how it would make more sense for apples to be dropped from an actual apple tree. Last time I checked you can't get apples from oak trees...
I would suggest a slight alteration to the idea; instead of generating leaf block with apples inside of them, why not generate apples that hang underneath the main canopy. The canopy would be at least 2 blocks above the ground, and wider than the average oak tree. The apples will regenerate like eggs, after at least 5 minutes, and before 10 minutes, maybe a bit longer. This would remove the need to have to remove leaf blocks or make use of a crafting table or inventory crafting square.
Not only this, but it would add a new type of wood to the world that would extend the diversity of wooden structures and builds. We know from the PC version that they have no issue adding new trees and woods to the game (Acacia), so would it be that much effort to add in an apple tree with hanging apples?
This idea would hopefully encourage players to establish an apple farm for growing a food source, rather than specifically a source of wood. For the players that like to make elaborate or decorative farms, what would be better than to add a large apple orchard.
As a side note - the main reason why I support this - I know Minecraft doesn't always incorporate logic into mechanics, blocks, and items, but apples being dropped by EVERY type of tree available has never sat well with me...
No, I think it would be better if the tree would regrow apples. It would make more sense and allow players to establish an orchard as a permanent feature to their worlds.
Each tree can have a maximum number of apples grown at a single time, and after being mined, a new leaf block is chosen at random to grow the next, after a preset period of time.
Okay, but you couldn't manually regrow the apples, they would just generate on the bottoms of oak trees after a while. And again, there should only be a few apples per tree (Usually one, but rarely two or three) becuase golden apples shouldn't be easy to get.
Personally, I prefer adding a new 'apple tree' to the game, and get rid of the ability to get apples from oak trees entirely. (apples don't grow on oak trees). It would allow for a new apple wood log/planks/stairs/slabs for building purposes too.
I like the hanging apple idea too, under the canopy of leaves... maybe make the bottom leaf height at 2-3 blocks, but the hanging apples allow the player to walk through that space (as with signs, carpet, torches, etc.). Maybe make it so that apples cannot grow within 4 blocks of another apple when they try to spawn in at the bottom of a specific apple leaf block, that should help to make them sufficiently rare per tree, and yet have that apple tree aesthetic (each tree might have between 0-3 apples at any given time).
No, I think it would be better if the tree would regrow apples. It would make more sense and allow players to establish an orchard as a permanent feature to their worlds.
Each tree can have a maximum number of apples grown at a single time, and after being mined, a new leaf block is chosen at random to grow the next, after a preset period of time.
Yeah I like his idea but I thoguht that too.
Perhaps have each tree only grow a maximum of 1-3 apples per tree and regenerate an apple every 5 minutes. Or the same rate chickens can lay eggs.
Ok, here's my rendition of the idea. There is a new type of tree called an apple tree. It has a unique color and texture of wood and leaves. An apple tree can sometimes generate with a single apple on the bottom, but each apple tree has the potential to grow up to 3 apples on the bottom. New apples will generate after 5-10 minutes. And finally, each tree will drop 0-1 saplings.
Apple's shouldn't become too easy to collect, otherwise golden apples will become too easy to get (They should stay rare). 1/20 trees in a forest will be apple trees makesng them somewhat uncommon.
What do you all think of this idea? Should anything change, or does this idea work?
Ok, here's my rendition of the idea. There is a new type of tree called an apple tree. It has a unique color and texture of wood and leaves. An apple tree can sometimes generate with a single apple on the bottom, but each apple tree has the potential to grow up to 3 apples on the bottom. New apples will generate after 5-10 minutes. And finally, each tree will drop 0-1 saplings.
Apple's shouldn't become too easy to collect, otherwise golden apples will become too easy to get (They should stay rare). 1/20 trees in a forest will be apple trees makesng them somewhat uncommon.
What do you all think of this idea? Should anything change, or does this idea work?
1. How is the game defining a "Tree" in terms of apple growth after it has spawned, especially when you have multiple trunks with a contiguous leaf canopy?
- This is why I proposed the idea of only spawns if there isn't another apple within 'x' blocks (this also helps to insure that your up to 3 apples don't all end up in a cluster on several trees.
2. Only drops 0-1 saplings: So if it drops on average of 0.5 saplings per tree that is cut down, then every time you cut an apple tree, you can expect to loose half of them permanently (without being able to respawn them), and players will not be able to grow an orchard effectively at that rate of loss/return. Plus, I believe, the drop chance is based on the individual leaf blocks, not defined by the tree itself. 0 - 2 is a 1:1 ratio which implies not likely for growth/loss, 0 - 2.5+ ratio will at least show a chance of being able to replace what is cut down.
In reply to Greg Nelson:
1. Each tree might have 25 blocks on the bottom, there could be a limit of 3 apples for every 25 leaf exposed on the bottom.
-The apple per 'x' block could work too.
2. Small jungle trees will usually only drop one sapling. So the code for sapling drops from jungle leaves is probably very low. Lets say average apple tree has 64 leaves, then there could be a 1/64 chance of a sapling dropping.
In reply to Greg Nelson:
1. Each tree might have 25 blocks on the bottom, there could be a limit of 3 apples for every 25 leaf exposed on the bottom.
-The apple per 'x' block could work too.
2. Small jungle trees will usually only drop one sapling. So the code for sapling drops from jungle leaves is probably very low. Lets say average apple tree has 64 leaves, then there could be a 1/64 chance of a sapling dropping.
Your 1/64 out of 64 leaves still generates a 1:1 drop ratio. I can tell you from tree farming experience that I always end up with an abundance of saplings over time for all species, it is always above a 1:1 ratio.
A 1:1 ratio is just as likely to get a bigger population as it is to dissipate to extinction... and that is assuming that you pick up and plant each and every sapling that drops and don't miss even a single sapling. which pretty much guarantees that your trees will eventually die out if you are interested in farming them for their wood, because there will be saplings that you just miss, and the leaf blocks are still susceptible to shears, fire, explosions, etc. that will not cause saplings to drop at all when the leaf blocks are destroyed.
Saplings have a 1/20 chance of dropping when leaves are destroyed, except jungle saplings, which have a 1/40 chance of dropping.
============================================
Most trees will drop more than one sapling (four for giant jungle trees and dark oaks). The only exception is the small jungle tree, which will probably drop only one or even zero saplings. This means that to make a jungle tree farm, it is necessary to farm giant jungle trees.
I'm assuming that there is a 'large' jungle tree version to make apple tree farming more viable?
Your 1/64 out of 64 leaves still generates a 1:1 drop ratio. I can tell you from tree farming experience that I always end up with an abundance of saplings over time for all species, it is always above a 1:1 ratio.
I'm assuming that there is a 'large' jungle tree version to make apple tree farming more viable?
And as long as it would take a while to get a good orchard going, then it would be okay. And no, there shouldn't be a large apple tree version.
The apple trees should require some work to get, similar to pumpkin or melon farming. Without trading or a bonus chest, you need to explore an abandoned mineshaft before to get the seeds for pumpkins and melons. Apple farming should work in a similar way. So maybe you can only get apple tree saplings in an abandoned mineshaft, or in other loot chests. The apples trees wouldn't naturally generate.That way you, need to explore and work for the for them apples.
I think it should be its own tree type that has saplings which are found in strongholds and mine shafts. The whole concept of oak trees growing apples doesn't makes sense at all to me. They should be a completely different kind of tree with different leaves and different wood. Rather than an oak tree having a 1/200 chance of dropping an apple per leaf block, it should be 1/10 for these special trees.
And as long as it would take a while to get a good orchard going, then it would be okay. And no, there shouldn't be a large apple tree version.
The apple trees should require some work to get, similar to pumpkin or melon farming. Without trading or a bonus chest, you need to explore an abandoned mineshaft before to get the seeds for pumpkins and melons. Apple farming should work in a similar way. So maybe you can only get apple tree saplings in an abandoned mineshaft, or in other loot chests. The apples trees wouldn't naturally generate.That way you, need to explore and work for the for them apples.
I don't object to finding a few saplings here and there in random chests, but...
I don't know about you, but I find pumpkins in pumpkin patches on the ground, and expect that I will find watermelons similarly in Jungle Biomes in a future TU if the console version continues to follow the Java version that is played on PC's. You can't effectively 'grow' an orchard when there is a 1:1 (or less) drop rate of sapling to trees, especially when you have to consider terrain constrictions and loss of saplings due to destroyed leaf blocks or missed drops. It isn't that it is difficult, it is virtually impossible with those rates of diminishing returns.
I think it should be its own tree type that has saplings which are found in strongholds and mine shafts. The whole concept of oak trees growing apples doesn't makes sense at all to me. They should be a completely different kind of tree with different leaves and different wood. Rather than an oak tree having a 1/200 chance of dropping an apple per leaf block, it should be 1/10 for these special trees.
I agree that it should be its own tree type, and that it should replace the oak tree for apple drops... or heck, just rename 'oak' tree to 'apple' tree for all I care, but the drop rate of apples from leaf blocks shouldn't be higher than currently exists for the oak leaves.
If the problem is that you want apple production to be more work in generating the orchard, then just make finding apple trees that much harder in game (rather than gimp the sapling drop rate to impracticable levels). Such as, there is only a 1/64 chance of an oak tree being an apple tree during world generation.
Of course, that would make finding apples much harder to find at begin game, and easier at end game (when it largely doesn't matter that much anymore)
Apple trees are a new type of tree, new woods, new leaves etc. But the trees don't grow naturally. You can only get the sapling through loot chests, bonus chests or trading with farmer villagers. They grow normally when planted, but will have no apples on the bottoms of leaf blocks when grown. Apples will start to grow on the bottom of leaf blocks (when exposed to air) after around 10-15 minutes. They start out small and green (When broken, they will drop nothing), abut will grow to full size after around 5 minutes. When the red and fully grown apple's are broken, they will drop one apple. Bone meal does not affect growth. There is no limit to how many apples can grow per tree.
Sounds nice , couldn't we all make golden apples (Nugget version) easily then ? By making a semi-automated farm (until hoppers/droppers come) . Even though the nugget version is very weak.
Yeah, the nugget versions would be easy to get, but the gold block version is still harder to get, because of the gold. You could have tons of apples, but since you woundn't have tons of gold, notch apples would still take time to get.
So what color should the wood planks be? And what about the logs and leave?
They should have a yellow tint to them. I was splitting some kind of fruit tree logs in my yard just today and they are like bright yellow inside. Fruit trees are either reddish or yellowish.
I think that apple trees should be added as well as the leaf, wood and plank.
However what if the apple that dropped from other trees previously was changed to a stick and instead of adding a new sapling the player left triggers a grass block to plant an apple
Ok, here's my rendition of the idea. There is a new type of tree called an apple tree. It has a unique color and texture of wood and leaves. An apple tree can sometimes generate with a single apple on the bottom, but each apple tree has the potential to grow up to 3 apples on the bottom. New apples will generate after 5-10 minutes. And finally, each tree will drop 0-1 saplings.
Apple's shouldn't become too easy to collect, otherwise golden apples will become too easy to get (They should stay rare). 1/20 trees in a forest will be apple trees makesng them somewhat uncommon.
What do you all think of this idea? Should anything change, or does this idea work?
Pretty much to a tee what this tree should be if it got added.
Apple trees are a new type of tree, new woods, new leaves etc. But the trees don't grow naturally. You can only get the sapling through loot chests, bonus chests or trading with farmer villagers. They grow normally when planted, but will have no apples on the bottoms of leaf blocks when grown. Apples will start to grow on the bottom of leaf blocks (when exposed to air) after around 10-15 minutes. They start out small and green (When broken, they will drop nothing), abut will grow to full size after around 5 minutes. When the red and fully grown apple's are broken, they will drop one apple. Bone meal does not affect growth. There is no limit to how many apples can grow per tree.
Personally, I'd rather they just rename oak tree as apple tree and just leave it as is. I applaud your effort to make it excruciatingly difficult to acquire apples at all, but this no longer seems to be a really viable option to me, IMO.
I think they should just two kinds of leaves on them. Leaves with apples and leaves with none. They would be randomly placed on trees with a 50% chance of a leaf block spawning as one or the other. The leaves with apples will drop between one and four apples, and the leaves with none will just drop saplings. What do you guys think of the new Minecraft Forum? Honestly, I liked the old one better.
^ Agreed this is basically what I wanted to say
Okay, but you couldn't manually regrow the apples, they would just generate on the bottoms of oak trees after a while. And again, there should only be a few apples per tree (Usually one, but rarely two or three) becuase golden apples shouldn't be easy to get.
I like the hanging apple idea too, under the canopy of leaves... maybe make the bottom leaf height at 2-3 blocks, but the hanging apples allow the player to walk through that space (as with signs, carpet, torches, etc.). Maybe make it so that apples cannot grow within 4 blocks of another apple when they try to spawn in at the bottom of a specific apple leaf block, that should help to make them sufficiently rare per tree, and yet have that apple tree aesthetic (each tree might have between 0-3 apples at any given time).
Huh not bad
Yeah I like his idea but I thoguht that too.
Perhaps have each tree only grow a maximum of 1-3 apples per tree and regenerate an apple every 5 minutes. Or the same rate chickens can lay eggs.
Apple's shouldn't become too easy to collect, otherwise golden apples will become too easy to get (They should stay rare). 1/20 trees in a forest will be apple trees makesng them somewhat uncommon.
What do you all think of this idea? Should anything change, or does this idea work?
1. How is the game defining a "Tree" in terms of apple growth after it has spawned, especially when you have multiple trunks with a contiguous leaf canopy?
- This is why I proposed the idea of only spawns if there isn't another apple within 'x' blocks (this also helps to insure that your up to 3 apples don't all end up in a cluster on several trees.
2. Only drops 0-1 saplings: So if it drops on average of 0.5 saplings per tree that is cut down, then every time you cut an apple tree, you can expect to loose half of them permanently (without being able to respawn them), and players will not be able to grow an orchard effectively at that rate of loss/return. Plus, I believe, the drop chance is based on the individual leaf blocks, not defined by the tree itself. 0 - 2 is a 1:1 ratio which implies not likely for growth/loss, 0 - 2.5+ ratio will at least show a chance of being able to replace what is cut down.
1. Each tree might have 25 blocks on the bottom, there could be a limit of 3 apples for every 25 leaf exposed on the bottom.
-The apple per 'x' block could work too.
2. Small jungle trees will usually only drop one sapling. So the code for sapling drops from jungle leaves is probably very low. Lets say average apple tree has 64 leaves, then there could be a 1/64 chance of a sapling dropping.
Your 1/64 out of 64 leaves still generates a 1:1 drop ratio. I can tell you from tree farming experience that I always end up with an abundance of saplings over time for all species, it is always above a 1:1 ratio.
A 1:1 ratio is just as likely to get a bigger population as it is to dissipate to extinction... and that is assuming that you pick up and plant each and every sapling that drops and don't miss even a single sapling. which pretty much guarantees that your trees will eventually die out if you are interested in farming them for their wood, because there will be saplings that you just miss, and the leaf blocks are still susceptible to shears, fire, explosions, etc. that will not cause saplings to drop at all when the leaf blocks are destroyed.
I'm assuming that there is a 'large' jungle tree version to make apple tree farming more viable?
And as long as it would take a while to get a good orchard going, then it would be okay. And no, there shouldn't be a large apple tree version.
The apple trees should require some work to get, similar to pumpkin or melon farming. Without trading or a bonus chest, you need to explore an abandoned mineshaft before to get the seeds for pumpkins and melons. Apple farming should work in a similar way. So maybe you can only get apple tree saplings in an abandoned mineshaft, or in other loot chests. The apples trees wouldn't naturally generate.That way you, need to explore and work for the for them apples.
I don't object to finding a few saplings here and there in random chests, but...
I don't know about you, but I find pumpkins in pumpkin patches on the ground, and expect that I will find watermelons similarly in Jungle Biomes in a future TU if the console version continues to follow the Java version that is played on PC's. You can't effectively 'grow' an orchard when there is a 1:1 (or less) drop rate of sapling to trees, especially when you have to consider terrain constrictions and loss of saplings due to destroyed leaf blocks or missed drops. It isn't that it is difficult, it is virtually impossible with those rates of diminishing returns.
I agree that it should be its own tree type, and that it should replace the oak tree for apple drops... or heck, just rename 'oak' tree to 'apple' tree for all I care, but the drop rate of apples from leaf blocks shouldn't be higher than currently exists for the oak leaves.
If the problem is that you want apple production to be more work in generating the orchard, then just make finding apple trees that much harder in game (rather than gimp the sapling drop rate to impracticable levels). Such as, there is only a 1/64 chance of an oak tree being an apple tree during world generation.
Of course, that would make finding apples much harder to find at begin game, and easier at end game (when it largely doesn't matter that much anymore)
Apple trees are a new type of tree, new woods, new leaves etc. But the trees don't grow naturally. You can only get the sapling through loot chests, bonus chests or trading with farmer villagers. They grow normally when planted, but will have no apples on the bottoms of leaf blocks when grown. Apples will start to grow on the bottom of leaf blocks (when exposed to air) after around 10-15 minutes. They start out small and green (When broken, they will drop nothing), abut will grow to full size after around 5 minutes. When the red and fully grown apple's are broken, they will drop one apple. Bone meal does not affect growth. There is no limit to how many apples can grow per tree.
Yeah, the nugget versions would be easy to get, but the gold block version is still harder to get, because of the gold. You could have tons of apples, but since you woundn't have tons of gold, notch apples would still take time to get.
So what color should the wood planks be? And what about the logs and leave?
However what if the apple that dropped from other trees previously was changed to a stick and instead of adding a new sapling the player left triggers a grass block to plant an apple
Pretty much to a tee what this tree should be if it got added.
Personally, I'd rather they just rename oak tree as apple tree and just leave it as is. I applaud your effort to make it excruciatingly difficult to acquire apples at all, but this no longer seems to be a really viable option to me, IMO.
And I also prefer the old forum to this one.