The way I see it you have to be really self-entitled to complain about optional content. If you don't like horses, then don't ride them.
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"Strong Pokémon. Weak Pokémon. That is only the selfish perception of people. Truly skilled Trainers should try to win with the Pokémon they love best."
The way I see it you have to be really self-entitled to complain about optional content. If you don't like horses, then don't ride them.
"The debate usually ends when one side says "if you do not like what he adds do not use it" This will be impossible for the horse. Even if a player does not chose to use it those who do have an advantage over them, and the Minecraft I know and love does not disadvantage it's players!"
And there's the self-entitlement. Just because you don't want horses you want nobody to have them.
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"Strong Pokémon. Weak Pokémon. That is only the selfish perception of people. Truly skilled Trainers should try to win with the Pokémon they love best."
"The debate usually ends when one side says "if you do not like what he adds do not use it" This will be impossible for the horse. Even if a player does not chose to use it those who do have an advantage over them, and the Minecraft I know and love does not disadvantage it's players!"
I'd love for you to read what I and Mathy said, you don't even know what horses will do. How do you know that horses have an advantage over pigs?
Logic? That wouldn't work because Minecraft doesn't follow that stuff.
I agree with the OP on this one. And yes, I see the arguements of "But look at zombies, so many other games have zombies, that's not unique", and I personally dont really think it's about being "unique", but it's about things having a POINT. Zombies in this game have a point: They're basically the Goombas of the game, the weak, easily clobbered enemy that can still technically kill you if you do something really stupid around it (just like Goombas). Not to mention they can obliterate all of your villagers if you dont protect them well enough. The same goes with all of the other hostiles, they each DO something different than other ones. Even something like spiders VS cave spiders is plenty of difference to make sure that the cave spiders have a point, as their smaller size and nasty, nasty poison make them very different indeed than their larger cousins. Same with zombies VS wither skeletons; they're both the "collide with you to do damage" sort, but the wither skeletons RUN at you, and hit you with a nasty and draining effect.
The horse, however..... well, it's true that we know little about it right now, but really.... it's a blasted HORSE. What CAN it do? Horses.... you ride them, you breed them..... you dont really do much else with them. Way way way too much like what pigs are right now. You breed them, you can ride them, and you can kill them for their drops (which may or may not be doable with the horse, dunno yet if it'll drop anything). In concept, there's just very little difference. Why would I use the horses when I already have pigs? What's the point? What, exactly, do they add to the gameplay? What is the DIFFERENCE between them and pigs, besides possible drops? The only difference I can think of would be controlling them WITHOUT needing a carrot on a stick, but..... I'd really rather just use the pigs the way they are, thanks.
Even when playing with the Mo' Creatures mod, horses were always the one mob in that that I tended to just ignore all the time. I already had pigs (recently, anyway; they did have a point back before the carrot on a stick), and I never cared about breeding different colors of horses or anything like that (though the flying ones were somewhat neat I guess).
That being said, I dont think it's an advantage/disadvantage thing either. A horse would have to go pretty bloody fast in order to give a player a total advantage over those that dont use them; there's lots of options in the game for very fast travel. Nether portals (which are my preferred method), speed potions (and the second level ones are very fast indeed), pigs (again, very darned fast once they get going), minecarts, Ender Pearls.... I do not need to have a horse to get around at high speeds.
All in all, while I'm excited for new mobs in the game..... horses are kinda like bats to me. No real point, and I'm likely to just ignore and or kill them, rather than do much with them. The only exception would be if I'm trying to set up in an area that doesnt really have pigs around.
Zombies aren't unique. So are trees. And air. And clouds. And dirt. And hell. And bricks. And clay. And lava. And water. And skeletons. And cows. And pigs. And bats. And coal. and diamonds. And books. And villages. And the trading system. And pistons. And slimes. And grass. And ladders. And pumpkins. And melons. And stone. And vines. And ice. And potatoes.
But lapis lazuli is pretty unique, I haven't seen that in any other game
I agree with the OP on this one. And yes, I see the arguements of "But look at zombies, so many other games have zombies, that's not unique", and I personally dont really think it's about being "unique", but it's about things having a POINT. Zombies in this game have a point: They're basically the Goombas of the game, the weak, easily clobbered enemy that can still technically kill you if you do something really stupid around it (just like Goombas). Not to mention they can obliterate all of your villagers if you dont protect them well enough. The same goes with all of the other hostiles, they each DO something different than other ones. Even something like spiders VS cave spiders is plenty of difference to make sure that the cave spiders have a point, as their smaller size and nasty, nasty poison make them very different indeed than their larger cousins. Same with zombies VS wither skeletons; they're both the "collide with you to do damage" sort, but the wither skeletons RUN at you, and hit you with a nasty and draining effect.
The horse, however..... well, it's true that we know little about it right now, but really.... it's a blasted HORSE. What CAN it do? Horses.... you ride them, you breed them..... you dont really do much else with them. Way way way too much like what pigs are right now. You breed them, you can ride them, and you can kill them for their drops (which may or may not be doable with the horse, dunno yet if it'll drop anything). In concept, there's just very little difference. Why would I use the horses when I already have pigs? What's the point? What, exactly, do they add to the gameplay? What is the DIFFERENCE between them and pigs, besides possible drops? The only difference I can think of would be controlling them WITHOUT needing a carrot on a stick, but..... I'd really rather just use the pigs the way they are, thanks.
I can't argue very well with you because no one knows what the horses are going to do. It's assume good thing will happen vs assume bad thing will happen. You're also expecting too little of horses, they can easily have some unexpected feature, like how you can ride pigs.
Maybe the horses will be able to wear armor, And will last much longer than the pig. Maybe adding horseshoes to the horse will increase it's speed. Maybe adding a spike to it's helmet will allow you to Ram enemies.
The fact is, we won't know what the horses will do until they are released, or in a future snapshot. I don't see why people are complaining when there are still possibilities with the horse.
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Maybe the horses will be able to wear armor, And will last much longer than the pig. Maybe adding horseshoes to the horse will increase it's speed. Maybe adding a spike to it's helmet will allow you to Ram enemies.
The fact is, we won't know what the horses will do until they are released, or in a future snapshot. I don't see why people are complaining when there are still possibilities with the horse.
I complain because I do not know what they do. If Mojang gives them stuff that is neat I may rethink my opinion about them. But now all I know is that they add a, from our point of knowledge, redundant mob that has no point, for you do NOT know if the horse will be different from the pig at all.
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Would you like to know the atomic structure of a piece of bread?
I complain because I do not know what they do. If Mojang gives them stuff that is neat I may rethink my opinion about them. But now all I know is that they add a, from our point of knowledge, redundant mob that has no point, for you do NOT know if the horse will be different from the pig at all.
This.
And really, while I love Mojang.... they make some really damn odd design decisions sometimes, and quite frequently, they'll START on a concept.... but never quite finish it, never quite take it where it COULD (often rather easily) go. Look at the Witch. It's a very creative mob; it can smack you with various nasty potions, and can even heal itself! And yet is balanced enough, since just like with every other mob, it has weaknesses (bow/arrow). It's a pretty good mob.
....but it may as well not exist. I play this game pretty darn frequently, and I have yet to see even a single Witch. Not even one. Oh, I've found their HUTS, but they never spawn there (bug, dunno if it's fixed or not). And even if they did.... all it does is make a potentially dangerous and interesting mob into one that's super-predictable (because they ONLY spawn in their huts). They're a mob that needs the chance to get the drop on you in order to be a real threat most of the time. But they never show, regardless. Or how about my all-time favorite example, the damn Beacon? Of all of the items ever added to the game, it's easily the most useless, considering it's absolutely monstrous cost, and the best example of a concept that got STARTED.... but was never finished, and no attempt to even balance the horrid thing was made. Even back when it was just Notch working on the game alone, this sort of thing was still pretty frequent. Anyone remember when gold had absolutely no use whatsoever? Remember how bloody long it took for it to finally have a purpose? Yeah. Those sorts of really wonky design issues are a big part of why I'm definitely not excited for this particular mob. It COULD be interesting and neat.... and I'd sure like it to be.... but I'm not getting my hopes up. Mostly, I'm just hoping that their other mob ideas are more interesting to begin with.
....not to mention that the horse just seems a strange choice. Not just because of the pigs, but because there's so many other obvious ideas that just make more sense. Like more water mobs.... there's only ONE, the squid, and it's completely passive and not very useful. And it's literally the only mob that exists in Minecraft's often-vast oceans or lakes or whatever. They could add sharks or a giant octopus or maybe some new Nether mobs that dont ONLY spawn in forts, or.... there's alot of ideas that are not redundant. Instead.... horse. Oh well. I look forward to the update nonetheless, one way or another it's bound to have at least some cool stuff in it just like most every update, even if it contains a few bizarre "meh" or "why does this exist" ones as well.
The way I see it you have to be really self-entitled to complain about optional content. If you don't like horses, then don't ride them.
That's like saying, if you don't like iron, then don't use it. It's a necessity that's useful for getting diamond, redstone, and gold, and plenty other things. Likewise horse riding will be a necessity if it has a bigger advantage over pig riding. Sure, riding a pig will be possible, but it'll be far more ideal to ride a horse - rendering the pig riding almost redundant.
I don't think this is about whether horses are a unique and original idea. Unless they throw something unexpected in, they probably aren't. Instead, this is about whether horses will add anything to the game that we don't already have (with pigs). The argument is that horses aren't different enough from pigs, so there's no point in adding them, since we already have pigs for riding.
So, explain logic to me: Why do we need four different colors of wood? What's the point of having two different colors of fences? What's the difference between cobblestone and moss stone? How about the three types of sandstone, the four types of stone bricks, and the three types of quartz blocks? And what about charcoal?
I don't think these things are bad; I'm just saying they don't serve any unique purposes, just like horses might. Four colors of wood simply adds more choices.
By the way, exactly how are horse riders advantaged over pig riders, if there's no difference?
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That's like saying, if you don't like iron, then don't use it. It's a necessity that's useful for getting diamond, redstone, and gold, and plenty other things. Likewise horse riding will be a necessity if it has a bigger advantage over pig riding. Sure, riding a pig will be possible, but it'll be far more ideal to ride a horse - rendering the pig riding almost redundant.
This has nothing to do with iron... You DON'T need iron to advance in the game... all u need is diamonds. You can get them with tnt, or chests in villages, temples. duh. But horses are completly optional. You don't need them to get to the end. You dont need them to survive. You don't need them for anything except entertainment, and maybe adventure. Think again kid...
Zeel
There are mods for more mobs. Any one can use them. Try Mo-creatures.
Rowkey
Cows give milk, leather and beef. These are all unique to cows. Unlike having two mobs that do the same thing.
If I wanted to play with mods I wouldn't be hanging around this section of the forum. Nothing beats vanilla implementation, no mod is ever as good as a real feature. That's simply how it is.
How about, we take the pig riding out completely! then its wont be redundant! And don't whine about "oh it will make minecraft less unique..." well guess what??? It has a whole lot of non-unique stuff. And don't blame jeb on this. We have un-unique things including :
grass
stone
glass
sand
trees
dirt
cobble
sand
Must I go on...
If you want minecraft unique, ask jeb to turn minecraft out of survival and creative and make something that doesn't even make sense. Almost every idea has been used already. Yes there are a few things like creepers and blazes, but that's a small portion.
I don't really like the idea of horses. I don't know why, but I just don't like them.
If you want horses, you could easily install Mo' Creatures.
Simple.
This has nothing to do with iron... You DON'T need iron to advance in the game... all u need is diamonds. You can get them with tnt, or chests in villages, temples. duh. But horses are completly optional. You don't need them to get to the end. You dont need them to survive. You don't need them for anything except entertainment, and maybe adventure. Think again kid...
You don't NEED iron. But iron makes things a heck of a lot easier, including being the only way to get into the nether (flint and steel for portal lighting). You'd be stupid or searching for a major challenge not to use iron. But you're not getting my point. The addition of horses will render pig riding impractical. Again. Unless they manage to balance horse/pig riding in a pros/cons scenario, then that's how it will be. I think horses would be pretty cool, but only if implemented right.
P.S. You don't need diamonds either. You can get obsidian in village chests.
We have only 30 mobs.
You people call that enough?
If we want more mobs, and we definitely should because 30 mobs gets really dull, then the mobs will end up serving purposes that existing mobs already carry or somewhat carry.
You don't NEED iron. But iron makes things a heck of a lot easier, including being the only way to get into the nether (flint and steel for portal lighting). You'd be stupid or searching for a major challenge not to use iron. But you're not getting my point. The addition of horses will render pig riding impractical. Again. Unless they manage to balance horse/pig riding in a pros/cons scenario, then that's how it will be. I think horses would be pretty cool, but only if implemented right.
P.S. You don't need diamonds either. You can get obsidian in village chests.
just wait for lightning to hit the portal. Or build the portal around lava and place a bunch of flammable blocks and presto! a nether portal!
But anyways. Pigs are kinda useless as it is. All they do is drop meat (and are rid able but guess what? Cows drop food. Chicken drop food. Zombies drop food. Zombie pig men drop food. Oak trees drop food. And lets face it. Pigs are hard to control. Turning is a bear. Its hard for them to get up 1 block. I doubt many people even rid pigs. Its an inconvenience. But if horses are added, with what people say they should have, guess what? Pigs will the the useless mob! BURN! YOU HORSE HATERS JUST GOT BURNED! XD
With cows dropping the same amount of food as a pig, and horses being rid able, pigs are the booger in the punch bowl. And dont say "pigs can be ridden and eaten!" yes you are right but, its either one or the other. You cant ride a pork chop and u cant eat a pig that you want to use for riding.
Talking serious, I don't care if they add horses, anyway I don't usually travel in my world, and I don't use pigs for take a ride.
"The debate usually ends when one side says "if you do not like what he adds do not use it" This will be impossible for the horse. Even if a player does not chose to use it those who do have an advantage over them, and the Minecraft I know and love does not disadvantage it's players!"
And there's the self-entitlement. Just because you don't want horses you want nobody to have them.
I'd love for you to read what I and Mathy said, you don't even know what horses will do. How do you know that horses have an advantage over pigs?
Logic? That wouldn't work because Minecraft doesn't follow that stuff.
The horse, however..... well, it's true that we know little about it right now, but really.... it's a blasted HORSE. What CAN it do? Horses.... you ride them, you breed them..... you dont really do much else with them. Way way way too much like what pigs are right now. You breed them, you can ride them, and you can kill them for their drops (which may or may not be doable with the horse, dunno yet if it'll drop anything). In concept, there's just very little difference. Why would I use the horses when I already have pigs? What's the point? What, exactly, do they add to the gameplay? What is the DIFFERENCE between them and pigs, besides possible drops? The only difference I can think of would be controlling them WITHOUT needing a carrot on a stick, but..... I'd really rather just use the pigs the way they are, thanks.
Even when playing with the Mo' Creatures mod, horses were always the one mob in that that I tended to just ignore all the time. I already had pigs (recently, anyway; they did have a point back before the carrot on a stick), and I never cared about breeding different colors of horses or anything like that (though the flying ones were somewhat neat I guess).
That being said, I dont think it's an advantage/disadvantage thing either. A horse would have to go pretty bloody fast in order to give a player a total advantage over those that dont use them; there's lots of options in the game for very fast travel. Nether portals (which are my preferred method), speed potions (and the second level ones are very fast indeed), pigs (again, very darned fast once they get going), minecarts, Ender Pearls.... I do not need to have a horse to get around at high speeds.
All in all, while I'm excited for new mobs in the game..... horses are kinda like bats to me. No real point, and I'm likely to just ignore and or kill them, rather than do much with them. The only exception would be if I'm trying to set up in an area that doesnt really have pigs around.
But lapis lazuli is pretty unique, I haven't seen that in any other game
I can't argue very well with you because no one knows what the horses are going to do. It's assume good thing will happen vs assume bad thing will happen. You're also expecting too little of horses, they can easily have some unexpected feature, like how you can ride pigs.
The fact is, we won't know what the horses will do until they are released, or in a future snapshot. I don't see why people are complaining when there are still possibilities with the horse.
My Github ด้้้้้็็็็็้้้้้็็็็็้้้้้็็็็็้้้้้็็็็็้้้้้็็็็็้้้้้็็็็็้้้้้็็็็็้้้้้дด็็็็็้้้้้็็็็้้้้้็็็็็้้้้้็็็็็้้้้้็็็็็้้้้้
I complain because I do not know what they do. If Mojang gives them stuff that is neat I may rethink my opinion about them. But now all I know is that they add a, from our point of knowledge, redundant mob that has no point, for you do NOT know if the horse will be different from the pig at all.
TT2000, you are genius.
This.
And really, while I love Mojang.... they make some really damn odd design decisions sometimes, and quite frequently, they'll START on a concept.... but never quite finish it, never quite take it where it COULD (often rather easily) go. Look at the Witch. It's a very creative mob; it can smack you with various nasty potions, and can even heal itself! And yet is balanced enough, since just like with every other mob, it has weaknesses (bow/arrow). It's a pretty good mob.
....but it may as well not exist. I play this game pretty darn frequently, and I have yet to see even a single Witch. Not even one. Oh, I've found their HUTS, but they never spawn there (bug, dunno if it's fixed or not). And even if they did.... all it does is make a potentially dangerous and interesting mob into one that's super-predictable (because they ONLY spawn in their huts). They're a mob that needs the chance to get the drop on you in order to be a real threat most of the time. But they never show, regardless. Or how about my all-time favorite example, the damn Beacon? Of all of the items ever added to the game, it's easily the most useless, considering it's absolutely monstrous cost, and the best example of a concept that got STARTED.... but was never finished, and no attempt to even balance the horrid thing was made. Even back when it was just Notch working on the game alone, this sort of thing was still pretty frequent. Anyone remember when gold had absolutely no use whatsoever? Remember how bloody long it took for it to finally have a purpose? Yeah. Those sorts of really wonky design issues are a big part of why I'm definitely not excited for this particular mob. It COULD be interesting and neat.... and I'd sure like it to be.... but I'm not getting my hopes up. Mostly, I'm just hoping that their other mob ideas are more interesting to begin with.
....not to mention that the horse just seems a strange choice. Not just because of the pigs, but because there's so many other obvious ideas that just make more sense. Like more water mobs.... there's only ONE, the squid, and it's completely passive and not very useful. And it's literally the only mob that exists in Minecraft's often-vast oceans or lakes or whatever. They could add sharks or a giant octopus or maybe some new Nether mobs that dont ONLY spawn in forts, or.... there's alot of ideas that are not redundant. Instead.... horse. Oh well. I look forward to the update nonetheless, one way or another it's bound to have at least some cool stuff in it just like most every update, even if it contains a few bizarre "meh" or "why does this exist" ones as well.
That's like saying, if you don't like iron, then don't use it. It's a necessity that's useful for getting diamond, redstone, and gold, and plenty other things. Likewise horse riding will be a necessity if it has a bigger advantage over pig riding. Sure, riding a pig will be possible, but it'll be far more ideal to ride a horse - rendering the pig riding almost redundant.
So, explain logic to me: Why do we need four different colors of wood? What's the point of having two different colors of fences? What's the difference between cobblestone and moss stone? How about the three types of sandstone, the four types of stone bricks, and the three types of quartz blocks? And what about charcoal?
I don't think these things are bad; I'm just saying they don't serve any unique purposes, just like horses might. Four colors of wood simply adds more choices.
By the way, exactly how are horse riders advantaged over pig riders, if there's no difference?
This has nothing to do with iron... You DON'T need iron to advance in the game... all u need is diamonds. You can get them with tnt, or chests in villages, temples. duh. But horses are completly optional. You don't need them to get to the end. You dont need them to survive. You don't need them for anything except entertainment, and maybe adventure. Think again kid...
If I wanted to play with mods I wouldn't be hanging around this section of the forum. Nothing beats vanilla implementation, no mod is ever as good as a real feature. That's simply how it is.
grass
stone
glass
sand
trees
dirt
cobble
sand
Must I go on...
If you want minecraft unique, ask jeb to turn minecraft out of survival and creative and make something that doesn't even make sense. Almost every idea has been used already. Yes there are a few things like creepers and blazes, but that's a small portion.
If you want horses, you could easily install Mo' Creatures.
Simple.
You don't NEED iron. But iron makes things a heck of a lot easier, including being the only way to get into the nether (flint and steel for portal lighting). You'd be stupid or searching for a major challenge not to use iron. But you're not getting my point. The addition of horses will render pig riding impractical. Again. Unless they manage to balance horse/pig riding in a pros/cons scenario, then that's how it will be. I think horses would be pretty cool, but only if implemented right.
P.S. You don't need diamonds either. You can get obsidian in village chests.
You people call that enough?
If we want more mobs, and we definitely should because 30 mobs gets really dull, then the mobs will end up serving purposes that existing mobs already carry or somewhat carry.
just wait for lightning to hit the portal. Or build the portal around lava and place a bunch of flammable blocks and presto! a nether portal!
But anyways. Pigs are kinda useless as it is. All they do is drop meat (and are rid able but guess what? Cows drop food. Chicken drop food. Zombies drop food. Zombie pig men drop food. Oak trees drop food. And lets face it. Pigs are hard to control. Turning is a bear. Its hard for them to get up 1 block. I doubt many people even rid pigs. Its an inconvenience. But if horses are added, with what people say they should have, guess what? Pigs will the the useless mob! BURN! YOU HORSE HATERS JUST GOT BURNED! XD
With cows dropping the same amount of food as a pig, and horses being rid able, pigs are the booger in the punch bowl. And dont say "pigs can be ridden and eaten!" yes you are right but, its either one or the other. You cant ride a pork chop and u cant eat a pig that you want to use for riding.