I wish people would at least read the first few pages of the thread before posting...
We didn't generate 33 pages of discussion on changing the ceiling of a mob trap to 2 blocks high.....
I feel that random uncontrollable picking up and moving of blocks by enderman should be removed. They should only move blocks when you aggro them/**** them off as random block moving has no purpose but to mess up the look of everything.
Their behavior should be changed so that when pissed off, they will move blocks that are blocking their path to you away at a somewhat significant speed.
This way their core functionality of moving blocks is maintained, but that functionality will actually serve a purpose and make the mob somewhat challenging.
Hide behind a wall or in your house? Not anymore because the enderman will rip a hole through it if you aggro them.
They should also get a health buff, they are REALLY easy to kill right now.
This way the builders cannot complain because if an enderman destroys their creations it is entirely their fault and the survivalists/fighters can be happy that the enderman are more powerful and will chase them down relentlessly, breaking through their walls. (adding a CHALLANGE)
You made a murdering machine. Your victims destroy it. Oh no. Now you have to fight. Bawwwwww. What would you even do with over 9000 gunpowder.
Precisely, you don't know what I'm doing with the 9,000 gunpowder items, but you don't have a problem judging that it's probably for nothing. There is a reason, and more, and some were stated in this thread.
The main point, though, is that I made the trap for itself. I'm interested in the mechanics of the game and how to use them toward a chosen goal. I have zero use for the hundreds of feathers and strings I now have. No use whatsoever, because the point wasn't to get all that, but to make a functional death factory. I've made automated wheat farms, and I have no use for wheat or bread, I just wanted to build something that had mechanics and systems, not just lifeless piles of blocks. I hope you can understand that.
I actually prefer the Endermen's ability to remove blocks. It also makes mob spawners obsolete like I predicted right when I heard that they could pick up blocks. I like that because it makes you actually have to survive and hunt for things rather then going afk at a spawner.
I also like how hunger makes you do this aw well.
Survival doesn't require hunting anything or gathering any of the items dropped by mobs. Punch a few blocks in the dirt, cover yourself, and you can survive for a hundred years.
This should prove that "surviving" was never the goal in Minecraft. It's survival for a night, and then you build and craft and explore.
Nobody listened to me! I told you it would amount to nothing more than a nuisance. I told you it would be simply irritating and serve no value to the gameplay. You all just called me a whiner and told me I didn't know how they would implement block destruction. Told me Notch wouldn't let this happen. You all had your full faith in Mojang on full display. Mojang would never let this happen, you said.
And yet I was exactly correct. Exactly correct.
No one listens to you? Yeah like you're the only one who thought of that. Stop being so full of yourself.
Yeah, I assumed they'd be only able to pick up generated blocks. Being able to pick up player-placed blocks is a terrible idea. They're basically AI griefers.
You should just go out and murder some mobs with a sword or at least a bow instead of building a multistory mob tower and complaining when removing one block = TOWER GO BOOM.
Why exactly? I've done that a million times in the past. It's not that fun, is it? And what I want to do is design death factories, not play an FPS game. Read carefully:
I want to design mob traps.
If I wanted to go hunt mobs, which I sometimes want to, I'd just go hunt mobs. If I want tons of TNT, though, a mobtrap is the only reasonable way.
I don't understand this obsession with forcing people not to use the game's potential. Do you want a Minecraft police that makes sure everyone plays the way someone else thinks the game should be played? I don't get it. If I wanted to build airports, you'd not mind, but just because mobtraps can actually be useful, then you're all mad. I'll give you all my feathers if you want, I have no use for them.
-Shift away from just mob traps to mob traps and aesthetics. Maybe link here, http://minecraft.worth1000.com/
and say virtually none of these builds are possible with the forum's "solutions" of slathering water and torches everywhere.
-Mob traps were supposed to be "ruined" by these mobs, but a slight alteration in design(like using half slabs) will come out rendering Endermen grindable like everything else. They don't even perform their "intended function", and mob grinders will only get slightly larger and uglier at worst. (Bad if you don't like looking at them.)
[Got off topic here]
Like, for example, I've heard slabs cannot be picked up. The solution is to MC edit the mob trap and replace all dirt blocks (for example) with half slabs. Then expand the walls a little with an extra layer or two of slabs and cover over that outer layer with dirt for darkness. Now mob traps are Ender-proof and the Endermen have become useless griefers. Even better, for anyone complaining about the grinders looking ugly, they'll only get bulkier and uglier!
[/off topic]
-"Creative mode" doesn't solve the problem, they still spawn.
-Peaceful 24/7 turns the game into a sub-par 3D builder that can be replaced by superior programs like Blender or Second Life.
But you probably already got all that. Just some suggestions. Be sure to keep it as simple and short as possible, since most people don't seem to want to bother reading and understanding the issue. :sad.gif:
Two people have said make 2 block high roofs.
And yet you're STILL whining.
Who are you talking to? If me, then here goes. I was never whining in the first place I cannot be "still whining". Expressing facts and opinions aren't whining just because you happen to disagree. People will not always agree with you, learn to deal with it.
Moreover, we moved on from the mobtraps. Right now, I'm far more concerned about general landscape looking like a mess.
I wish people would at least read the first few pages of the thread before posting...
We didn't generate 33 pages of discussion on changing the ceiling of a mob trap to 2 blocks high.....
I feel that random uncontrollable picking up and moving of blocks by enderman should be removed. They should only move blocks when you aggro them/**** them off as random block moving has no purpose but to mess up the look of everything.
Their behavior should be changed so that when pissed off, they will move blocks that are blocking their path to you away at a somewhat significant speed.
This way their core functionality of moving blocks is maintained, but that functionality will actually serve a purpose and make the mob somewhat challenging.
Hide behind a wall or in your house? Not anymore because the enderman will rip a hole through it if you aggro them.
They should also get a health buff, they are REALLY easy to kill right now.
This way the builders cannot complain because if an enderman destroys their creations it is entirely their fault and the survivalists/fighters can be happy that the enderman are more powerful and will chase them down relentlessly, breaking through their walls. (adding a CHALLANGE)
if its survival, your supposed to make things to make your survival easier amirite?
so your mob grinder is basically so you can make your life easier
The mob trap was a goal in itself. I made it to make it. As to survival, that's a joke to me. You have infinite lives, you will never die, you cannot survive, you can only live forever and respawn infinitely. And like I said many times, if surviving was all there was to this game, you'd just dig a hole and bury yourself there and stay there forever. Survival ensured.
I think that is good. Mobtraps are too overpowered, if you are using a mobtrap, might as well install TooManyItems Mod and hack in an inventory full of bones, arrows, gunpowder, and feathers.
Except doing that is cheating, and building a mobtrap is not, since all it uses is legit and from the game was it was designed.
RedRain, You need to understand just who your responding to. Think of the average age of the people that are making the remarks I've seen above.
You're looking to do battle with someone who has no idea how to return fire. It's pointless.
I agree with your statement.
Some other annoyances that pose no real challenge;
The fact that I dig down 15-25 blocks ANYWHERE in the ground- and I will find a massive railroad system/mineshaft that leads to 6-10 different massive cave system, which leads to 4-10 dungeons, which leads to a stronghold. Literally in a matter of 10 minutes within starting to play 1.8, I found this, and after exploring around for about an hour, I had more than enough Iron/Gold/Diamond to do whatever the hell I wanted.
I was hoping 1.8 would bring some sort of revival to the game, instead, it's only made me want to play even less.
You are correct, I just tend to act towards everyone as if they were just like me. But they're not. My weakness.
The rest of your post is right on. I haven't played Minecraft since the enderman debacle and if I do it'll only be on peaceful. Problem is I need TNT to continue my big projects and now I can't have it, unless I spend my entire free time hunting mobs in the dark (becoming blind in the process), and then I'd only have enough TNT in 5 months.
You're not using your brain. Mob farms / death traps / all these things that take advantage of the fact that monsters spawn in dark areas and are killed by drowning (how do skeletons drown, anyway? That needs to be removed..) were created by someone else a long time ago. Doesn't matter if yours looks different, you didn't invent the concept, you copied it from someone else.
ok so just running around and hitting mobs is using your brain? moron
I think this is just Notch's way of making mob grinders a bit more tricky to set up. I think it's a good thing that Endermen do it.
It isn't tricky: you just make sure no ceilings are higher than two blocks. If mobtraps weren't hundreds of square meters, I would have done it in an instant and wouldn't care.
That said, the REAL PROBLEM isn't about mob traps, it's the landscape and everything else.
My personal opinion as a normal player is: they can get annoying, but are no real danger, i have to adapt, i will manage it, and i will keep going.
As for Mob Farms: i won't use them, not my style, i want to work for every block in the game.
And now for my opinion as a Server owner: i love them! they are the best mobs in the game, destroying the buildings of the players, esepcially ugly mob grinder blocks in the middle of the landscape that let me puke whenever i see em. Sure, it's a hassle for the players on my Server and myself too, but it adds a new dimension of teamwork to get the buildings endermen-safe. It's a great addition to SMP in my eyes. And a good way to say "begone ugly blocks, we don't need you anymore!". Now, flying mobs would be great, as well as mobs which go directly after your buildings so you have to find a solution about those and have to work to really keep your structures safe in survival, that's what the game is about in this mode, managing to get some nice looking things under harder circumstances, so you can get the feeling of achievement when you see it.
If you don't need this feeling you can as well play creative mode, the reason you played survival is so you need to work for your stuff, or?
About the point that they are awful when building really big or complex buildings: my current SMP project is a railsystem to get to every single nicely build structure in the whole server, it uses around 200k cobblestone, same amount of sandstone, 400k planks, and not to say the thousands of iron and gold and redstone for the rails and circuits, and i still manage to pull it off without playing 24/7 and still keeping my sanity without ever using a single TNT-block.
It works people, believe me, and the achievement to do it this way is greater then putting huge holes into the ground which are uglier then the endermans weird "structures", and since you WILL repair stuff a lot of the time on a server because people tend to make creepers go boom it's not that much of a difference. Especialliy since creepers sadly explode randomly sometimes, not often, but they do whenever you walk around at night, some stupid skeleton will shoot one and boom it goes.
I know the are a hassle at the beginning, but the thread itself went to more complaining then constructive stuff, so it is mostly useless, and for the last part what can be done:
-mob-options: beeing able to say which mobs can spawn, how many can spawn max, and controllign their abilities (like creepers don't explode blocks, or endermans only pick up dirt and gravel etc.)
-a simple option to turn specific mobs on or off.
-tweaking their block taking rate
-tweaking their spawning conditions
Not that hard to program, especially since some mods have that already implemented (mo'creatures for instance)
i think my 2 cents went up to get a whole dollar, so, see ya around, play nice, and make some awesome stuff.
Kulzertor
You want to work for every block in the game? Are you implying my death factory made itself and I had nothing to do with it? Or that I made it just to get blocks? Wrong on all counts. The time invested in my factory would have gotten me more items if I had spent it hunting with a sword; it just so happens that 40 hours of hunting is not fun, while devising death factories was.
Also, if you want to work for every block, I sure hope you never used pickaxes or shovels, because that's "cheating", following your logic. And I sure hope you never used diamond to make more efficient tools, because that's not "working for every block". Enjoy punching rock forever.
mobtraps = tools
It's exactly the same: it allows you to work more efficiently, if you don't like mobtraps, you shouldn't like any tool either.
Difference being, my mobtrap took over 40 hours to get, your diamond pickaxe didn't.
I wouldn't have answered you - since I was told to do this just about 500 times already - but since you're a gentleman, I'll respond.
It's currently 4 blocks high, designed that way because I was under the impression that head space improved spawning rates. It's what I read somewhere. Yes, I could add blocks and make it 2 high, but by God, we're talking over 600 blocks, which I'll have to dig by hand. That won't be fun, and it'll take forever.
Sorry about repeating someone else's comment. :/ I saw that others had posted the same idea after I finally got the time to read through the rest of the replies. From one gentlemen to another thanks for the compliment!
i hope they never change it, if anythign the endermen is a minor nusence. and im glad we havea block disrupting mob. its stuposed to be survival, learn to adapt.
as far as breaking mob grinders, Notch has stated he may make them cease to work by requiring player kills to get items, endermen does this to a lesser exstent by breaking the grinders, which are better then his other alternitive.
But if a player's goal is to create death factories, not gather items, then this won't change anything. They'll be useless, so not as rewarding, but we could still do it. Building beautiful things doesn't drop anything, but I still do it.
That said, if I want hundreds of TNT blocks legally, how do I do? Spend 500 hours hunting creepers in the dark and ruin my eyesight? I understand you don't care for mobtraps if you don't care for TNT, but my plans require tons of it.
no crap, why do you think everyone got so bored of Minecraft that fast?
Its because of all you lamers and your monster farms.
Whats fun about getting free items and sitting on your ass while they collect themselves.
If all Enderman was designed to do is wreck monster farms, then good, its about time something was done about item farming.
So, my building mobtraps made the game boring for you? How does that work...
I built mobtraps precisely because I was bored with the game; doing so enabled me to do things I could never do before, such as using extensive TNT for various projects. Still no idea how what I do in the privacy of my world affects you.
I wish people would at least read the first few pages of the thread before posting...
We didn't generate 33 pages of discussion on changing the ceiling of a mob trap to 2 blocks high.....
I feel that random uncontrollable picking up and moving of blocks by enderman should be removed. They should only move blocks when you aggro them/**** them off as random block moving has no purpose but to mess up the look of everything.
Their behavior should be changed so that when pissed off, they will move blocks that are blocking their path to you away at a somewhat significant speed.
This way their core functionality of moving blocks is maintained, but that functionality will actually serve a purpose and make the mob somewhat challenging.
Hide behind a wall or in your house? Not anymore because the enderman will rip a hole through it if you aggro them.
They should also get a health buff, they are REALLY easy to kill right now.
This way the builders cannot complain because if an enderman destroys their creations it is entirely their fault and the survivalists/fighters can be happy that the enderman are more powerful and will chase them down relentlessly, breaking through their walls. (adding a CHALLANGE)
just my $0.02
Times a million. I have suggested something just like this elsewhere on the forum. Making the enderman more dangerous to the player while removing their ability to grief when you haven't even noticed them is the way to go.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
When no one was looking, the Endermen took forty blocks.
They took 40 blocks. That’s as many as four tens. And that’s horrible.
I spent my evening reading and responding, but I have to go to bed now. I work tomorrow.
I wanted to say the following:
- enderman's ability to move blocks adds very little, but it takes away a lot
Let's see if it's worth it:
Pros: blocks are moved, some people find this frightening and enjoy the thrill; structures are altered and need to be repaired (if you like repairing stuff)
Cons: the landscape will inevitably turn to crap with time, sophisticated structures will become useless within minutes unless every single block is lit up or somehow protected, which will make the game 90% protection and 10% creation, if that, and don't get me started on survival, that's just a title beyond the first night
Summing up: enderman doesn't add much. If you have just a small hut, then you don't care if endermen move blocks around. It's mildly amusing, but it's not much. And if you do have structures, then it becomes a major pain. In other words, when enderman is positive, it's a very small touch of positive addition, but when it's negative, it's a world of frustration.
Summing up: enderman doesn't add much. If you have just a small hut, then you don't care if endermen move blocks around. It's mildly amusing, but it's not much. And if you do have structures, then it becomes a major pain. In other words, when enderman is positive, it's a very small touch of positive addition, but when it's negative, it's a world of frustration.
An accurate summation. It's not a well balanced monster. The amount of trouble (not danger, but frustration and annoyance) it causes in not worth having it in the environment.
The closest thing we can compare the endermen to are creepers, which on a fundamental level cause the same kinds of problems. The problem with endermen is that we can't do anything to stop them from "exploding," they do it all the time. If creepers exploded regardless of proximity (just did it randomly every so often) they would be unbearable, which is nearly what endermen are capable of with time.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
More Ocean Life: Kelp, Coral, Crabs and Jellyfish; Coconut Palm trees for beaches and islands. Terrain Generation Changes: Which biomes and world-building features are most in need of change?
We didn't generate 33 pages of discussion on changing the ceiling of a mob trap to 2 blocks high.....
I feel that random uncontrollable picking up and moving of blocks by enderman should be removed. They should only move blocks when you aggro them/**** them off as random block moving has no purpose but to mess up the look of everything.
Their behavior should be changed so that when pissed off, they will move blocks that are blocking their path to you away at a somewhat significant speed.
This way their core functionality of moving blocks is maintained, but that functionality will actually serve a purpose and make the mob somewhat challenging.
Hide behind a wall or in your house? Not anymore because the enderman will rip a hole through it if you aggro them.
They should also get a health buff, they are REALLY easy to kill right now.
This way the builders cannot complain because if an enderman destroys their creations it is entirely their fault and the survivalists/fighters can be happy that the enderman are more powerful and will chase them down relentlessly, breaking through their walls. (adding a CHALLANGE)
just my $0.02
Precisely, you don't know what I'm doing with the 9,000 gunpowder items, but you don't have a problem judging that it's probably for nothing. There is a reason, and more, and some were stated in this thread.
The main point, though, is that I made the trap for itself. I'm interested in the mechanics of the game and how to use them toward a chosen goal. I have zero use for the hundreds of feathers and strings I now have. No use whatsoever, because the point wasn't to get all that, but to make a functional death factory. I've made automated wheat farms, and I have no use for wheat or bread, I just wanted to build something that had mechanics and systems, not just lifeless piles of blocks. I hope you can understand that.
Survival doesn't require hunting anything or gathering any of the items dropped by mobs. Punch a few blocks in the dirt, cover yourself, and you can survive for a hundred years.
This should prove that "surviving" was never the goal in Minecraft. It's survival for a night, and then you build and craft and explore.
No one listens to you? Yeah like you're the only one who thought of that. Stop being so full of yourself.
Yeah, I assumed they'd be only able to pick up generated blocks. Being able to pick up player-placed blocks is a terrible idea. They're basically AI griefers.
Why exactly? I've done that a million times in the past. It's not that fun, is it? And what I want to do is design death factories, not play an FPS game. Read carefully:
I want to design mob traps.
If I wanted to go hunt mobs, which I sometimes want to, I'd just go hunt mobs. If I want tons of TNT, though, a mobtrap is the only reasonable way.
I don't understand this obsession with forcing people not to use the game's potential. Do you want a Minecraft police that makes sure everyone plays the way someone else thinks the game should be played? I don't get it. If I wanted to build airports, you'd not mind, but just because mobtraps can actually be useful, then you're all mad. I'll give you all my feathers if you want, I have no use for them.
I have a few recommendations for the first post:
-Shift away from just mob traps to mob traps and aesthetics. Maybe link here, http://minecraft.worth1000.com/
and say virtually none of these builds are possible with the forum's "solutions" of slathering water and torches everywhere.
-Mob traps were supposed to be "ruined" by these mobs, but a slight alteration in design(like using half slabs) will come out rendering Endermen grindable like everything else. They don't even perform their "intended function", and mob grinders will only get slightly larger and uglier at worst. (Bad if you don't like looking at them.)
[Got off topic here]
Like, for example, I've heard slabs cannot be picked up. The solution is to MC edit the mob trap and replace all dirt blocks (for example) with half slabs. Then expand the walls a little with an extra layer or two of slabs and cover over that outer layer with dirt for darkness. Now mob traps are Ender-proof and the Endermen have become useless griefers. Even better, for anyone complaining about the grinders looking ugly, they'll only get bulkier and uglier!
[/off topic]
-"Creative mode" doesn't solve the problem, they still spawn.
-Peaceful 24/7 turns the game into a sub-par 3D builder that can be replaced by superior programs like Blender or Second Life.
But you probably already got all that. Just some suggestions. Be sure to keep it as simple and short as possible, since most people don't seem to want to bother reading and understanding the issue. :sad.gif:
Who are you talking to? If me, then here goes. I was never whining in the first place I cannot be "still whining". Expressing facts and opinions aren't whining just because you happen to disagree. People will not always agree with you, learn to deal with it.
Moreover, we moved on from the mobtraps. Right now, I'm far more concerned about general landscape looking like a mess.
This times a thousand.
The mob trap was a goal in itself. I made it to make it. As to survival, that's a joke to me. You have infinite lives, you will never die, you cannot survive, you can only live forever and respawn infinitely. And like I said many times, if surviving was all there was to this game, you'd just dig a hole and bury yourself there and stay there forever. Survival ensured.
Except doing that is cheating, and building a mobtrap is not, since all it uses is legit and from the game was it was designed.
You are correct, I just tend to act towards everyone as if they were just like me. But they're not. My weakness.
The rest of your post is right on. I haven't played Minecraft since the enderman debacle and if I do it'll only be on peaceful. Problem is I need TNT to continue my big projects and now I can't have it, unless I spend my entire free time hunting mobs in the dark (becoming blind in the process), and then I'd only have enough TNT in 5 months.
ok so just running around and hitting mobs is using your brain? moron
It isn't tricky: you just make sure no ceilings are higher than two blocks. If mobtraps weren't hundreds of square meters, I would have done it in an instant and wouldn't care.
That said, the REAL PROBLEM isn't about mob traps, it's the landscape and everything else.
You want to work for every block in the game? Are you implying my death factory made itself and I had nothing to do with it? Or that I made it just to get blocks? Wrong on all counts. The time invested in my factory would have gotten me more items if I had spent it hunting with a sword; it just so happens that 40 hours of hunting is not fun, while devising death factories was.
Also, if you want to work for every block, I sure hope you never used pickaxes or shovels, because that's "cheating", following your logic. And I sure hope you never used diamond to make more efficient tools, because that's not "working for every block". Enjoy punching rock forever.
mobtraps = tools
It's exactly the same: it allows you to work more efficiently, if you don't like mobtraps, you shouldn't like any tool either.
Difference being, my mobtrap took over 40 hours to get, your diamond pickaxe didn't.
Sorry about repeating someone else's comment. :/ I saw that others had posted the same idea after I finally got the time to read through the rest of the replies. From one gentlemen to another thanks for the compliment!
But if a player's goal is to create death factories, not gather items, then this won't change anything. They'll be useless, so not as rewarding, but we could still do it. Building beautiful things doesn't drop anything, but I still do it.
That said, if I want hundreds of TNT blocks legally, how do I do? Spend 500 hours hunting creepers in the dark and ruin my eyesight? I understand you don't care for mobtraps if you don't care for TNT, but my plans require tons of it.
So, my building mobtraps made the game boring for you? How does that work...
I built mobtraps precisely because I was bored with the game; doing so enabled me to do things I could never do before, such as using extensive TNT for various projects. Still no idea how what I do in the privacy of my world affects you.
Times a million. I have suggested something just like this elsewhere on the forum. Making the enderman more dangerous to the player while removing their ability to grief when you haven't even noticed them is the way to go.
They took 40 blocks. That’s as many as four tens. And that’s horrible.
I wanted to say the following:
- enderman's ability to move blocks adds very little, but it takes away a lot
Let's see if it's worth it:
Pros: blocks are moved, some people find this frightening and enjoy the thrill; structures are altered and need to be repaired (if you like repairing stuff)
Cons: the landscape will inevitably turn to crap with time, sophisticated structures will become useless within minutes unless every single block is lit up or somehow protected, which will make the game 90% protection and 10% creation, if that, and don't get me started on survival, that's just a title beyond the first night
Summing up: enderman doesn't add much. If you have just a small hut, then you don't care if endermen move blocks around. It's mildly amusing, but it's not much. And if you do have structures, then it becomes a major pain. In other words, when enderman is positive, it's a very small touch of positive addition, but when it's negative, it's a world of frustration.
That's not worth it in my opinion.
An accurate summation. It's not a well balanced monster. The amount of trouble (not danger, but frustration and annoyance) it causes in not worth having it in the environment.
The closest thing we can compare the endermen to are creepers, which on a fundamental level cause the same kinds of problems. The problem with endermen is that we can't do anything to stop them from "exploding," they do it all the time. If creepers exploded regardless of proximity (just did it randomly every so often) they would be unbearable, which is nearly what endermen are capable of with time.
Terrain Generation Changes: Which biomes and world-building features are most in need of change?