Imagine a game as a good meal. You get the bread with some soup at the start, after that you get the main course and you finish up with the desert.
With all the added contents in 1.8 and 1.9 it's like if Mojang is trying to serve us all of them at once even though there not completed.
what should have happen:
The entrée: Could have being the sprinting system, with the exp feature. (A perfect soup, that is not too complex, but good)
The meal: Could have been the NPC along with the village and mineshaft. (Beef with honey sauce, a little bit to salty)
The dessert: Could have been the stronghold and all the other details. (The cake would not be a lie)
Split them into 3 update and voila you got a good meal.
what really happen:
The entrée: Sprinting system, with beautiful green ball that fill a useless bar. (A soup that as clearly been water down)
The meal: NPC that are still in test stage, even in the real 1.9 they will probably have minimum interaction if any, village that still spawn in weird place, mineshaft that doesn't bring that much use and still problem with there spawning. (Beef is a little bit overcook, you can still taste it, but someone drop the salt box on it)
The dessert: Empty stronghold, useless thing and bugs. (You get told the cake is in the back alley next to "that" dark spot)
boom serve that all under 3 minutes, do you want a fries with that?
I hope you guys understand what I'm trying to say. If Mojang would focus on ONE thing at a time and deliver it, it would contain less bug and be way more fun. They keep adding incomplete stuff and I know some people will say well he split the update into pieces.
Well he should have split it like a real meal and not give me a bag of pre-made soup with hot water, a living cow with an hammer and a copy of portal 1.
/end of rant
ADD freaking new ores, it's been more than a year since we had an ore that was USEFUL in crafting. Hint: MINEcraft(last ore introduce is redstone, if you don't count the useless lapis)
/real end of rant
edit: French is my main language, I'm sorry if the grammar is bothering you :wink.gif:
Although, I do enjoy ALL of the updates put out so far. (1.8 and 1.9 included) In my opinion, it is more like Mojang flashing us (the community) things that Mojang wants in the game to see if the community likes them. Fully finished or not.
Then again, I do agree with you OP. It is bad that they have terrible organization habits, but some of their things are actually fine.
The bad things I only find are: NPCs & Villages, Strongholds, and... EXP.
That is it. Everything else is pretty sexy, just with those occasional bugs that come out of pre-releases and beta updates.
So yah.
Good Topic, OP.
PS.
New Ores?
Eh, we don't NEED them, but we WANT them. There is a difference.
Why should i "explain" everything u cry about since u're just another one of "them" out there?
A pic is more what needed to be told. If u can take it, go QQ in 1 of those thousand threads about "this stuff this, this stuff that"
I love your analogy, yet I hate how right you are.
If Mojang did focus on adding one thing at a time, perfecting one or 2 things at a time, there production rate would go up in terms of new features and community satisfaction.
Also, the only new ore I would really want is one that makes Nether tools, or ones ith unique properties.
And lapis does something, you can make blue blocks! D=<
I completely disagree, but I enjoyed your delivery. If we could replace the majority of the other threads with something like this, then we'd be making some progress.
Although, I do enjoy ALL of the updates put out so far. (1.8 and 1.9 included) In my opinion, it is more like Mojang flashing us (the community) things that Mojang wants in the game to see if the community likes them. Fully finished or not.
Then again, I do agree with you OP. It is bad that they have terrible organization habits, but some of their things are actually fine.
The bad things I only find are: NPCs & Villages, Strongholds, and... EXP.
That is it. Everything else is pretty sexy, just with those occasional bugs that come out of pre-releases and beta updates.
So yah.
Good Topic, OP.
PS.
New Ores?
Eh, we don't NEED them, but we WANT them. There is a difference.
Yes I know that some of the content is actully good, but it's sad to explore an empty village before getting the real thing, it remove that sense of first time wonder. Also the more content is add the more different the bug can be.
also about the ores, ya your right we don't really NEED them, but are you really that happy to find diamond anymore? I did so many time, I want something more.
Why should i "explain" everything u cry about since u're just another one of "them" out there?
A pic is more what needed to be told. If u can take it, go QQ in 1 of those thousand threads about "this stuff this, this stuff that"
Look I've been here for more than a year and I'm just saying my opinion, it may seem like complaining, but it's not really. I love this game, but I just wish they would learn to focus. If they do manage to give The Nether an update worth it on 1.9 it will only have taking them 1years to make the nether useful for something else than glowstone.
This is something I've been curious about lately. I love Minecraft, don't get me wrong, but seriously why release useless or half-functional systems in an update? Why release experience orbs that don't serve any purpose? Add a full experience system with skills and release the "Skill System Update". Why release NPC villages with no NPCs and then release bland NPCs with no interactions and no drops? Why not complete a full "Village Update" that sees the release of full NPC villages containing villagers that you can battle, befriend and trade with?
The OP pretty much hits the nail on the head with this one. Minecraft is awesome, but releasing half-finished features with each update just doesn't make much sense to me. Work on one system at a time, get it done right, and release it in a fully fleshed out update.
This is something I've been curious about lately. I love Minecraft, don't get me wrong, but seriously why release useless or half-functional systems in an update? Why release experience orbs that don't serve any purpose? Add a full experience system with skills and release the "Skill System Update". Why release NPC villages with no NPCs and then release bland NPCs with no interactions and no drops? Why not complete a full "Village Update" that sees the release of full NPC villages containing villagers that you can battle, befriend and trade with?
The OP pretty much hits the nail on the head with this one. Minecraft is awesome, but releasing half-finished features with each update just doesn't make much sense to me. Work on one system at a time, get it done right, and release it in a fully fleshed out update.
You gave a good summary of my general feeling :biggrin.gif:
We maybe tester in someway, but I don't know what test we can do about an empty village or non interacting npc.
Instead of creating a new topic, I will use this one.
How to you guys feel about the fact that mojang is creating a new game even tho Minecraft is technicly not out?
I've said it since 1.9 came out we are getting too many ideas that have little to no depth. The core concepts of are being left for dead while we get villagers who should be fleshed out NPC's. On a smaller scale we are getting snowmen instead and mushroom biomes instead of villagers who have some type of use. In the end even when villager comes out I'll find them and enjoy them for a week then go back and play minecraft like I did in 1.2.
We are getting more features that really don't make the game have any more longevity.
What you all know about beta games, hater!edit: notch can release what he wants to try it out and get feedback from community, and he dont need to release something finished, he just what he wants and see what he thinks is right, so stop saying "its not finish dont release it" actually he dont release it, because its a beta, and then its not finished, hater!.
Look I'm NOT a beta tester, I'm an Alpha tester, I've been here for more than a year and I can tell you it's not the first time they release something incomplete and take forever to complete it. The Nether in 1.9 may get a purpuse if it contain good item, but it took them about a year to do so. That's not the only thing they started and then gat side track. I'm just saying that if they were to concentrate on 1 thing at a time, the update would be better and less buggy.
Hey I actually loved the way you presented that, OP. It almost made me hungry !BUT ! You dare mock the Lapis Lazuli ! This is how I make my temple altars ! Therefore, I am not 100% pleased !
I'm sorry :sad.gif:
I love lapis, but when i'm saying useless, I'm not saying as a whole. Yes lapis can be use as a block or dye, but not as an ore. Reason why last not cosmetic ore introduce is the redstone in my eye :biggrin.gif:
Could you post a picture of your temple, you got me curious ^^
Perhaps they have multiple priorities? Such as trying to finish all of the terrain generation? With that in mind, adding mushroom biomes, strongholds, reworking mineshafts, nether content, and villagers makes sense. The reason he is adding incomplete villagers is so they will be present in the villages, and hence will be able to assume the new AI when it is released, and so you won't need to generate a fresh map to get new NPCs.
The original plan was to release this all as one update, so their development order reflected what they wanted to add more than what makes sense to deleiver to the player. They then changed it to multiple updates. 1.8 as a result was partially done. 1.9 pre-release is also partially done, but it is focused on the map generation. There are some things added that don't strictly add to the current needs, like snowmen, but you have to allow them some room to just add something because they feel like it. However, because 1.9 is mainly trying to fix the huge problems with 1.8 and wrap up the map generation, other things still get pushed back to 1.10.
Perhaps they have multiple priorities? Such as trying to finish all of the terrain generation? With that in mind, adding mushroom biomes, strongholds, reworking mineshafts, nether content, and villagers makes sense. The reason he is adding incomplete villagers is so they will be present in the villages, and hence will be able to assume the new AI when it is released, and so you won't need to generate a fresh map to get new NPCs.
The original plan was to release this all as one update, so their development order reflected what they wanted to add more than what makes sense to deleiver to the player. They then changed it to multiple updates. 1.8 as a result was partially done. 1.9 pre-release is also partially done, but it is focused on the map generation. There are some things added that don't strictly add to the current needs, like snowmen, but you have to allow them some room to just add something because they feel like it. However, because 1.9 is mainly trying to fix the huge problems with 1.8 and wrap up the map generation, other things still get pushed back to 1.10.
Like a said a big reason why 1.9 is fixing lot's of bug that came from 1.8 is because they multitask to much in 1.8.
If they wanted to split they update they should not have done it in a way that players cannot test every thing.
If village would have been the only thing release people could have talk about that, but with all the contain, the complain, bug and little fix get drown into the variation. Imagine if the village spawn are bad and stronghold float in the sky, do you think that the fact that water glitch in some rare situation will have more chance of being seen, reported and seen by Mojang? Too much contain = less accurate report.
Like a said a big reason why 1.9 is fixing lot's of bug that came from 1.8 is because they multitask to much in 1.8.
If they wanted to split they update they should not have done it in a way that players cannot test every thing.
If village would have been the only thing release people could have talk about that, but with all the contain, the complain, bug and little fix get drown into the variation. Imagine if the village spawn are bad and stronghold float in the sky, do you think that the fact that water glitch in some rare situation will have more chance of being seen, reported and seen by Mojang? Too much contain = less accurate report.
What do you expect to happen when you cut an update in half? It really should have been 1 update. We wouldn't have feautres lacking the proper other features to work. We wouldn't have xp bars that don't allow you to level, we woudln't have persistent animals without breeding, we wouldn't have strongholds without bosses, we wouldn't have villages without villagers, etc. It was all designed to work togther, and then people are surprised when half of it doesn't function properly.
What do you expect to happen when you cut an update in half? It really should have been 1 update. We wouldn't have feautres lacking the proper other features to work. We wouldn't have xp bars that don't allow you to level, we woudln't have persistent animals without breeding, we wouldn't have strongholds without bosses, we wouldn't have villages without villagers, etc. It was all designed to work togther, and then people are surprised when half of it doesn't function properly.
I expect them to make smaller update so they don't have to cut it in haft. Normal they can't find all the bug and glitch if they work on 20 thing at once. If they would only work on 2-3 things and release those. (Just like in secret friday update) The beta tester could test the new added content more and reduce the bugs more.
There's not much to see, that temple goes back to 1.2 Halloween Update, where Lapis was so rare (it dropped only 1 chunk) and me and my friend weren't really good at building stuff. Still it did the job. Do you want a picture of the altar ? http://img148.imageshack.us/img148/6061/20110926223554.png
or the whole temple system ? In that case you'd be better off coming to my server to have a look.
Ya i remember when Lapis first came out it was sooooo rare, I was one of the first to make a post about them.
They spawn as much as diamond, but in a zone bigger than diamond. Basically there were the rarest, even if I didn't needed them it was so fun finding new ores XD
What's your server maybe I can come and check it out?
I expect them to make smaller update so they don't have to cut it in haft. Normal they can't find all the bug and glitch if they work on 20 thing at once. If they would only work on 2-3 things and release those. (Just like in secret friday update) The beta tester could test the new added content more and reduce the bugs more.
And that is what they are reverting to. The idea of the adventure update sounded good on paper. release a lot of intraconnected content at once, limit how often people need to make new maps, allow the release to operate balanced from the start, offer a shift in the gameplay all at once. People just didn't respond well to the long delay, so they decided to change tact mid-stream, which is really the source of most of these problems. They tried a different approach, and it didn't work out as well as they hoped. It happens.
Indeed it happen, I just wish they learn from the Halloween update. I guess it will all depend on HOW they fix all the problem they have created. After that will see. I swear as soon as the beta tag comes off, all the excuse of "this is beta" will be gone and i don't know who will be able to hold back the troll and flammer :ohmy.gif:
Because having these features split up into even more bite-sized updates wouldn't exacerbate the feeling of incompleteness and being "watered down soup" you complain about in your first post? I'm sure the update that added nothing but a useless exp bar would have really addressed your concerns.
The real problem is that Mojang is trying to balance adding substantial content with providing regular and early updates, and adjusting their plans on the fly to try to do this. Which has sub-optimal results. If they'd stop trying to please the people who want "main courses" but that are also bite-sized and bug free, then they'd stop having to do the impossible and we'd all be better off.
With all the added contents in 1.8 and 1.9 it's like if Mojang is trying to serve us all of them at once even though there not completed.
what should have happen:
The entrée: Could have being the sprinting system, with the exp feature. (A perfect soup, that is not too complex, but good)
The meal: Could have been the NPC along with the village and mineshaft. (Beef with honey sauce, a little bit to salty)
The dessert: Could have been the stronghold and all the other details. (The cake would not be a lie)
Split them into 3 update and voila you got a good meal.
what really happen:
The entrée: Sprinting system, with beautiful green ball that fill a useless bar. (A soup that as clearly been water down)
The meal: NPC that are still in test stage, even in the real 1.9 they will probably have minimum interaction if any, village that still spawn in weird place, mineshaft that doesn't bring that much use and still problem with there spawning. (Beef is a little bit overcook, you can still taste it, but someone drop the salt box on it)
The dessert: Empty stronghold, useless thing and bugs. (You get told the cake is in the back alley next to "that" dark spot)
boom serve that all under 3 minutes, do you want a fries with that?
I hope you guys understand what I'm trying to say. If Mojang would focus on ONE thing at a time and deliver it, it would contain less bug and be way more fun. They keep adding incomplete stuff and I know some people will say well he split the update into pieces.
Well he should have split it like a real meal and not give me a bag of pre-made soup with hot water, a living cow with an hammer and a copy of portal 1.
/end of rant
ADD freaking new ores, it's been more than a year since we had an ore that was USEFUL in crafting. Hint: MINEcraft(last ore introduce is redstone, if you don't count the useless lapis)
/real end of rant
edit: French is my main language, I'm sorry if the grammar is bothering you :wink.gif:
Then again, I do agree with you OP. It is bad that they have terrible organization habits, but some of their things are actually fine.
The bad things I only find are: NPCs & Villages, Strongholds, and... EXP.
That is it. Everything else is pretty sexy, just with those occasional bugs that come out of pre-releases and beta updates.
So yah.
Good Topic, OP.
PS.
New Ores?
Eh, we don't NEED them, but we WANT them. There is a difference.
A pic is more what needed to be told. If u can take it, go QQ in 1 of those thousand threads about "this stuff this, this stuff that"
If Mojang did focus on adding one thing at a time, perfecting one or 2 things at a time, there production rate would go up in terms of new features and community satisfaction.
Also, the only new ore I would really want is one that makes Nether tools, or ones ith unique properties.
And lapis does something, you can make blue blocks! D=<
Yes I know that some of the content is actully good, but it's sad to explore an empty village before getting the real thing, it remove that sense of first time wonder. Also the more content is add the more different the bug can be.
also about the ores, ya your right we don't really NEED them, but are you really that happy to find diamond anymore? I did so many time, I want something more.
Look I've been here for more than a year and I'm just saying my opinion, it may seem like complaining, but it's not really. I love this game, but I just wish they would learn to focus. If they do manage to give The Nether an update worth it on 1.9 it will only have taking them 1years to make the nether useful for something else than glowstone.
The OP pretty much hits the nail on the head with this one. Minecraft is awesome, but releasing half-finished features with each update just doesn't make much sense to me. Work on one system at a time, get it done right, and release it in a fully fleshed out update.
You gave a good summary of my general feeling :biggrin.gif:
We maybe tester in someway, but I don't know what test we can do about an empty village or non interacting npc.
How to you guys feel about the fact that mojang is creating a new game even tho Minecraft is technicly not out?
Do you think there trying to multitask again?
We are getting more features that really don't make the game have any more longevity.
Look I'm NOT a beta tester, I'm an Alpha tester, I've been here for more than a year and I can tell you it's not the first time they release something incomplete and take forever to complete it. The Nether in 1.9 may get a purpuse if it contain good item, but it took them about a year to do so. That's not the only thing they started and then gat side track. I'm just saying that if they were to concentrate on 1 thing at a time, the update would be better and less buggy.
I'm sorry :sad.gif:
I love lapis, but when i'm saying useless, I'm not saying as a whole. Yes lapis can be use as a block or dye, but not as an ore. Reason why last not cosmetic ore introduce is the redstone in my eye :biggrin.gif:
Could you post a picture of your temple, you got me curious ^^
edit: Would be nice to have them in the vanilla tho :ohmy.gif:
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Curse PremiumThe original plan was to release this all as one update, so their development order reflected what they wanted to add more than what makes sense to deleiver to the player. They then changed it to multiple updates. 1.8 as a result was partially done. 1.9 pre-release is also partially done, but it is focused on the map generation. There are some things added that don't strictly add to the current needs, like snowmen, but you have to allow them some room to just add something because they feel like it. However, because 1.9 is mainly trying to fix the huge problems with 1.8 and wrap up the map generation, other things still get pushed back to 1.10.
Like a said a big reason why 1.9 is fixing lot's of bug that came from 1.8 is because they multitask to much in 1.8.
If they wanted to split they update they should not have done it in a way that players cannot test every thing.
If village would have been the only thing release people could have talk about that, but with all the contain, the complain, bug and little fix get drown into the variation. Imagine if the village spawn are bad and stronghold float in the sky, do you think that the fact that water glitch in some rare situation will have more chance of being seen, reported and seen by Mojang? Too much contain = less accurate report.
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Curse PremiumWhat do you expect to happen when you cut an update in half? It really should have been 1 update. We wouldn't have feautres lacking the proper other features to work. We wouldn't have xp bars that don't allow you to level, we woudln't have persistent animals without breeding, we wouldn't have strongholds without bosses, we wouldn't have villages without villagers, etc. It was all designed to work togther, and then people are surprised when half of it doesn't function properly.
I expect them to make smaller update so they don't have to cut it in haft. Normal they can't find all the bug and glitch if they work on 20 thing at once. If they would only work on 2-3 things and release those. (Just like in secret friday update) The beta tester could test the new added content more and reduce the bugs more.
Ya i remember when Lapis first came out it was sooooo rare, I was one of the first to make a post about them.
They spawn as much as diamond, but in a zone bigger than diamond. Basically there were the rarest, even if I didn't needed them it was so fun finding new ores XD
What's your server maybe I can come and check it out?
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Curse PremiumAnd that is what they are reverting to. The idea of the adventure update sounded good on paper. release a lot of intraconnected content at once, limit how often people need to make new maps, allow the release to operate balanced from the start, offer a shift in the gameplay all at once. People just didn't respond well to the long delay, so they decided to change tact mid-stream, which is really the source of most of these problems. They tried a different approach, and it didn't work out as well as they hoped. It happens.
The real problem is that Mojang is trying to balance adding substantial content with providing regular and early updates, and adjusting their plans on the fly to try to do this. Which has sub-optimal results. If they'd stop trying to please the people who want "main courses" but that are also bite-sized and bug free, then they'd stop having to do the impossible and we'd all be better off.