Actually, just zapping Iron farms (all of them, not just AFK) would indeed create a substantial trade system. A lot of people actually like to mine, and accumulate vast quantities of excess iron. Likewise, others hate mining, but like building complex redstone systems. If the redstoners couldn't get even vaster amounts of iron from moderate-sized builds, then the miners would be trading their iron to the redstoners in return for redstone constructions and the things that *could* be automated (whatever they are). And that would be really cool.
No nerf to iron farms is ever going to impair a singleplayer's access to iron. Just /give after building whatever you think is appropriate.
You honestly, truly, simply do not understand the motivation behind building redstone constructions, do you? You really just like to mine, and can't understand the ones who just like to craft?
There wouldn't be trade.
Whatever you think it's worth to me to build you a structure that farms eggs, pumpkins, and sugarcane, sorts them all, and dispenses the proper quantities so that you can slap together pumpkin pie on demand, it's not. When I do build something with redstone, it's because this is a statement that I have truly conquered (at least a small part of) my little Survival world. There was certainly entertainment in the inherent risks of what I did, and I enjoyed the task itself as an intellectual challenge (I always try to tweak my own farm designs from the norm at least a little - mostly so that I know I understand how they work), but I'm not going to build a second one for you because you happen to have some stacks of iron that you don't care about. That's trading my time and effort for what you consider garbage, and you'd have to drown me in your trash for it to even be worth considering - after all, I can likely mine it myself in the time it would take to monotonously follow your whims on whatever it is you've decided you want but are too lazy to create.
Using the /give command is a cheat. I'm not cheating. I'm becoming a wizard by virtue of understanding the very core of my environment and knowing how to turn that to my purposes. And after I no longer worry about acquiring iron, I will move on to other Dangerous Exploits in Science.
Survival is about having limits. If anything, or even nearly anything is available, it doesn't mean anything.
Because falling to your death or a misplaced lava-block cooking you and destroying your many stacks of resources you're working with isn't immensely frustrating? One slip whilst making your latest redstone contraption can often be fatal.
This is what the miner-only folk are missing. The challenge isn't getting the resources. There's no actual challenge to that whilst mining. The challenge is in the limitations of your character, and the dangers of his surroundings - and those challenges remain whilst working on redstone contraptions. Heck, if you mine 'right', there's rarely any monsters to see as you stair down to bedrock and begin branch-mining with plenty of torches. It's arguable that simply building redstone contraptions on the surface is more dangerous, therefore more of a challenge.
It's very, very easy to ignore any resource in Minecraft; that's one of the big purposes of the command line. OTOH, it's difficult to impose a limit beyond what the game provides; in SSP it takes a lot of discipline to *never* take the easy way out and you always know the limit is kind of fake. In multiplayer, it's generally impossible to impose substantial additional restrictions.
In SSP, you start a world without cheats, and you live with it. It's not a fake limit any more than not getting the latest stealth mod to 'cheat' in multiplayer is.
You are, however, correct that it's hard to impose a limit the game doesn't provide - without mods - and thus you'll find that most the people who don't want their redstone contraptions destroyed are also okay with optional limitations for people to put on their servers and SSP games.The difference here is that the people opposed to having things broken for a false sense of 'balance' are also willing to admit that not everybody wants to play the exact way they do.
the amount of people that think OP is serious is astounding. As a redstoner, I wholeheartedly agree that automation is a good thing. I'd prefer a system to actually dig quarries, but hey, this works.
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Here is my signature. If you like it, I am amazed.
Guess people can't really see the joke in posts like these, heh.
What did you expect? Its minecraft forum, Sarcasm is a level 6 Intelligent while most people only have level 5 because they couldnt trade a book to the wizard which gives them the level up.
I want to add a poll to this topic, but the poll would just be doing something that I could be doing manually automatically, and that would be baaaaad.
Ridiculous.
As it stands I'm not seeing any reason to update at all. I wish they would just leave the 'game' alone, and quit breaking the toy that Minecraft is with 'improvements'.
This nerf in particular, and Jeb, show amateur game design skills. Half of the new additions seems to be inspired, or more accurately stolen from mods, or just futile nerfs to try to increase the length or complexity of the 'game', where mods already do literally everything better.
If mob drops from environmental damage kills were taken out of the game, personally I don't think I'd consider vanilla survival playable at all.
One thing to consider that I'm sure many haven't, is that the villager breeding change will actually destroy any hope of getting an iron golem farm running in a reasonable amount of time. Want an "iron trench"? Be prepared to dedicate multiple hours of trading just to breed enough villagers for it.
The primary issue for me is that as long as I *know* the game not only allows but encourages goofy, distorting things like Iron Golem grinders then the game is substantially less immersive. It's like the difference between solid gold and gilded; even if you don't scratch off the gilding, if you know the insides are imperfect it reduces enjoyment and value.
Well this is... bizarre. I mean I know that players can just /give themself whatever they want in this game. How is that not immersion breaking? You seriously want to ban farms just because their very existence annoys you? Personally I find all of the super modern looking Minecraft buildings that people make not in my taste either, but I would never seek to remove them. I can respect the effort and creativity that went into making them and then just not put them in my world. Life must be tough for you if you feel so annoyed at the existence of things that don't affect you in any way.
In addition, I'd like Minecraft to be a game that encourage player interaction more, and in particular trading. Right now there's not much trading, because an experienced player can basically produce unlimited amounts of almost anything they could want.
So I've never played on a server with a currency or trading before. It's not really something I'm interested in. On my extremely small server we all just share things. I can see how a currency would be useful on some large servers, but I was under the impression that these are implemented via mods? And I wasn't aware of any sort of trading mechanic in the vanilla game. I'm sure someone's designed a redstone contraption for safe trading, but it doesn't seem inheirently supported. Anyway, I get lots of player interaction on my server. Frankly I think the game sort of naturally lends itself that way. Some people on my server like to farm or mine or go exploring. We all help out with our various interests and contribute to the good of the group. I'm assuming things break down with more people, but until Mojang actually implements currency/trading the entire concept should reside in "unofficial" territory. If iron breaks your currency mod, find a new mod.
Just /give after building whatever you think is appropriate. Survival is about having limits.
I literally cannot understand how people cannot see the difference between an iron farm and the give command. One takes effort, time and resources to create and manipulates the existing game mechanics to reward the player and the other is literally cheating. I could setup a wheat farm, but since I know it's just going to give me wheat anyway why not /give myself some wheat and have done with it? They aren't the same at all. Have you used the /give command? Do you know how unsatisfying that is? However after you've setup your massive wheat farm or sugarcane farm or whatever farm you feel pride in what you've done. You've shaped your landscape, altered your destiny, provided a benefit to everyone who uses your machine. And yes, it will continue to run until a creeper blows part of it up or something. That's part of the reward. You wander off to build something else. Usually I've thought of 3 new projects before I'm halfway done with one. And most of the time those new projects require the mass amounts of resources that I'll receive from the farm I just built. That is playing the game. That is having fun. Typing /give iron 1000 isn't fun. Creating and making an iron farm that's efficient and well located is fun.
The whole idea of this thread makes no sense, everyone has the freedom to play however they want. Even mojang agrees, they made hoppers, droppers, lots of things to make automatic machines. Not everyone has your "way too much" free time to spend hours and hours a day mining. Some of us have to work, study and other things in real life to do and only have a few hours a week for the game. Please accept that and don't be selfish.
Ridiculous.
As it stands I'm not seeing any reason to update at all. I wish they would just leave the 'game' alone, and quit breaking the toy that Minecraft is with 'improvements'.
This nerf in particular, and Jeb, show amateur game design skills. Half of the new additions seems to be inspired, or more accurately stolen from mods, or just futile nerfs to try to increase the length or complexity of the 'game', where mods already do literally everything better.
If mob drops from environmental damage kills were taken out of the game, personally I don't think I'd consider vanilla survival playable at all.
One thing to consider that I'm sure many haven't, is that the villager breeding change will actually destroy any hope of getting an iron golem farm running in a reasonable amount of time. Want an "iron trench"? Be prepared to dedicate multiple hours of trading just to breed enough villagers for it.
+1 for you ... because I like your post, agree, and because you like Rainbow Dash =^.^=!
You guys want to know why I don't like to go mining for my resources?
I just spent hours on end branch-mining to find the two veins of diamond I need to make a pick (for obsidian) and an enchanting table to progress a new game.
While some might think it's fun to go trawling through rock for hours on end for the 'prize' of two barely-too-small deposits of rare material, I don't. The new rock-types made it a hair less monotonous at first, but the novelty wore off before I found what I was after. I've done my time at the bottom of the world, and have no plans on going back in that realm any time soon. Other stuff made out of diamonds? I've already got swords and axes unlocked as trades at the village I started the mine from.
Ridiculous.
As it stands I'm not seeing any reason to update at all. I wish they would just leave the 'game' alone, and quit breaking the toy that Minecraft is with 'improvements'.
This nerf in particular, and Jeb, show amateur game design skills. Half of the new additions seems to be inspired, or more accurately stolen from mods, or just futile nerfs to try to increase the length or complexity of the 'game', where mods already do literally everything better.
If mob drops from environmental damage kills were taken out of the game, personally I don't think I'd consider vanilla survival playable at all.
One thing to consider that I'm sure many haven't, is that the villager breeding change will actually destroy any hope of getting an iron golem farm running in a reasonable amount of time. Want an "iron trench"? Be prepared to dedicate multiple hours of trading just to breed enough villagers for it.
Yes it is a video game, not a sarcastic or figurative ''game'' or toy. How can this be called amateurish development when he gets payed to work on Minecraft, and most mods use ideas from the original game too.
Not everyone uses farms and mods.
Well all I have to say is that I am not one to normally build those large auto-farms, though I have built a couple. I greatly enjoyed building them and felt great pride that I had been able to do it. But I like the farming aspect of minecraft so I have not been building those auto-farms lately.
With the nerfed Iron golem farm, If I was to try and build one it would lag my lap top to the point I would no longer be able to play that world. that is if I did not stand there punching the golems and went out to harvest or build. The first and only Iron golem farm I ever build did not effect me at all and when I need a little bit of iron to make a new hoe or pick I went back to the Iron golem farm to find a bit had been collected.
All in all Just because I do not build or use the auto-farms that much does not mean that the ability to build and use them should be limited for others.
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I am not a coder or texture maker. I am just your average minecrafter with my own ideas on how to improve my own minecraft experience and maybe others (if they like them) as well.
People like to play in Survival yet they want the convenience of Creative mode.
For me the fun is in building those huge autofarms in survival. It's all about the challenge of building it.
Greetings,
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Author of RFTools, RFTools Control, RFTools Dimensions, Deep Resonance, Immersive Craft, CombatHelp, NICE, Aqua Munda, Ariente, XNet, Interaction Wheel, The Lost Cities, Lost Souls, Need To Breathe, EFab, The One Probe and co-author of Not Enough Wands and RF Lux.
For me the fun is in building those huge autofarms in survival. It's all about the challenge of building it.
Greetings,
I'm a builder and when I bought the game I made a Creative world, but I watched Mindcrack videos and they build cool stuff in vanilla Minecraft, so I tried and fell in love with it, but I like the sense of accomplishment when you worked really hard on something and it turns out great.
Minecraft was intended to be a Sandbox game that encompasses the idea that you can do WHAT EVER YOU WANT, and Mojang is only adding content to stretch the envelope of possibility. You play the game how ever YOU want to play it! No one should judge who is doing the right thing or the wrong thing. Do what YOU enjoy and have fun with it weather your making an intricate machine that intelligently farms resources or do things the old fashion way by mining.
The whole idea of this thread makes no sense, everyone has the freedom to play however they want. Even mojang agrees, they made hoppers, droppers, lots of things to make automatic machines. Not everyone has your "way too much" free time to spend hours and hours a day mining. Some of us have to work, study and other things in real life to do and only have a few hours a week for the game. Please accept that and don't be selfish.
Yes, I agree with this, this is pretty much what I wanted to say. Plus, minecraft is mean't to be that way, its quite possible to play without doing any off that and just ignore the people doing it, I very rarely use anything related to redstone, but I still don't mind when other people do, its not my business is it. People can play minecraft however they want, because that's how it was made to be.
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'All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to us.' - Gandalf the Grey
To me, farming things(especially building blocks) is boring. It's like all those idling games where you get more and build more. Where's the pride of exploration?
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Modest Texturer, Modeler, and Idea Provider. Can someone buy me Terraria, Borderlands 2, Goat Simulator, or Dead Island? Check my Profile for my contents, which includes a(n outdated) texture pack and a mod request! OcD Simple Add-On!
You know, I try not to get too far into discussions on this subject, as both sides are prone to turning off all mental functions when they argue, but I am just gonna point out that Mojang is nor against automation and have never claimed to be. Jeb simply wants automation to be by design and not by (he used unclear, but I am choosing a word that I feel fits better) ambiguous spawning mechanics. Which I kind of agree with. All of the automation in this game is because mob spawn requirements are rather unspecific.
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The problem with the truth, is that it never lies.
You honestly, truly, simply do not understand the motivation behind building redstone constructions, do you? You really just like to mine, and can't understand the ones who just like to craft?
There wouldn't be trade.
Whatever you think it's worth to me to build you a structure that farms eggs, pumpkins, and sugarcane, sorts them all, and dispenses the proper quantities so that you can slap together pumpkin pie on demand, it's not. When I do build something with redstone, it's because this is a statement that I have truly conquered (at least a small part of) my little Survival world. There was certainly entertainment in the inherent risks of what I did, and I enjoyed the task itself as an intellectual challenge (I always try to tweak my own farm designs from the norm at least a little - mostly so that I know I understand how they work), but I'm not going to build a second one for you because you happen to have some stacks of iron that you don't care about. That's trading my time and effort for what you consider garbage, and you'd have to drown me in your trash for it to even be worth considering - after all, I can likely mine it myself in the time it would take to monotonously follow your whims on whatever it is you've decided you want but are too lazy to create.
Using the /give command is a cheat. I'm not cheating. I'm becoming a wizard by virtue of understanding the very core of my environment and knowing how to turn that to my purposes. And after I no longer worry about acquiring iron, I will move on to other Dangerous Exploits in Science.
Because falling to your death or a misplaced lava-block cooking you and destroying your many stacks of resources you're working with isn't immensely frustrating? One slip whilst making your latest redstone contraption can often be fatal.
This is what the miner-only folk are missing. The challenge isn't getting the resources. There's no actual challenge to that whilst mining. The challenge is in the limitations of your character, and the dangers of his surroundings - and those challenges remain whilst working on redstone contraptions. Heck, if you mine 'right', there's rarely any monsters to see as you stair down to bedrock and begin branch-mining with plenty of torches. It's arguable that simply building redstone contraptions on the surface is more dangerous, therefore more of a challenge.
In SSP, you start a world without cheats, and you live with it. It's not a fake limit any more than not getting the latest stealth mod to 'cheat' in multiplayer is.
You are, however, correct that it's hard to impose a limit the game doesn't provide - without mods - and thus you'll find that most the people who don't want their redstone contraptions destroyed are also okay with optional limitations for people to put on their servers and SSP games.The difference here is that the people opposed to having things broken for a false sense of 'balance' are also willing to admit that not everybody wants to play the exact way they do.
What did you expect? Its minecraft forum, Sarcasm is a level 6 Intelligent while most people only have level 5 because they couldnt trade a book to the wizard which gives them the level up.
As it stands I'm not seeing any reason to update at all. I wish they would just leave the 'game' alone, and quit breaking the toy that Minecraft is with 'improvements'.
This nerf in particular, and Jeb, show amateur game design skills. Half of the new additions seems to be inspired, or more accurately stolen from mods, or just futile nerfs to try to increase the length or complexity of the 'game', where mods already do literally everything better.
If mob drops from environmental damage kills were taken out of the game, personally I don't think I'd consider vanilla survival playable at all.
One thing to consider that I'm sure many haven't, is that the villager breeding change will actually destroy any hope of getting an iron golem farm running in a reasonable amount of time. Want an "iron trench"? Be prepared to dedicate multiple hours of trading just to breed enough villagers for it.
I make textures and stuff.
Current maintainer of the 3x texture pack.
Abandonware artist of Manely Little Horses.
Well this is... bizarre. I mean I know that players can just /give themself whatever they want in this game. How is that not immersion breaking? You seriously want to ban farms just because their very existence annoys you? Personally I find all of the super modern looking Minecraft buildings that people make not in my taste either, but I would never seek to remove them. I can respect the effort and creativity that went into making them and then just not put them in my world. Life must be tough for you if you feel so annoyed at the existence of things that don't affect you in any way.
So I've never played on a server with a currency or trading before. It's not really something I'm interested in. On my extremely small server we all just share things. I can see how a currency would be useful on some large servers, but I was under the impression that these are implemented via mods? And I wasn't aware of any sort of trading mechanic in the vanilla game. I'm sure someone's designed a redstone contraption for safe trading, but it doesn't seem inheirently supported. Anyway, I get lots of player interaction on my server. Frankly I think the game sort of naturally lends itself that way. Some people on my server like to farm or mine or go exploring. We all help out with our various interests and contribute to the good of the group. I'm assuming things break down with more people, but until Mojang actually implements currency/trading the entire concept should reside in "unofficial" territory. If iron breaks your currency mod, find a new mod.
I literally cannot understand how people cannot see the difference between an iron farm and the give command. One takes effort, time and resources to create and manipulates the existing game mechanics to reward the player and the other is literally cheating. I could setup a wheat farm, but since I know it's just going to give me wheat anyway why not /give myself some wheat and have done with it? They aren't the same at all. Have you used the /give command? Do you know how unsatisfying that is? However after you've setup your massive wheat farm or sugarcane farm or whatever farm you feel pride in what you've done. You've shaped your landscape, altered your destiny, provided a benefit to everyone who uses your machine. And yes, it will continue to run until a creeper blows part of it up or something. That's part of the reward. You wander off to build something else. Usually I've thought of 3 new projects before I'm halfway done with one. And most of the time those new projects require the mass amounts of resources that I'll receive from the farm I just built. That is playing the game. That is having fun. Typing /give iron 1000 isn't fun. Creating and making an iron farm that's efficient and well located is fun.
wikipedia.org/wiki/Sarcasm
+1 for you ... because I like your post, agree, and because you like Rainbow Dash =^.^=!
I just spent hours on end branch-mining to find the two veins of diamond I need to make a pick (for obsidian) and an enchanting table to progress a new game.
While some might think it's fun to go trawling through rock for hours on end for the 'prize' of two barely-too-small deposits of rare material, I don't. The new rock-types made it a hair less monotonous at first, but the novelty wore off before I found what I was after. I've done my time at the bottom of the world, and have no plans on going back in that realm any time soon. Other stuff made out of diamonds? I've already got swords and axes unlocked as trades at the village I started the mine from.
Yes it is a video game, not a sarcastic or figurative ''game'' or toy. How can this be called amateurish development when he gets payed to work on Minecraft, and most mods use ideas from the original game too.
Not everyone uses farms and mods.
Enderdragon Roar in the Overworld
Rollercoaster
With the nerfed Iron golem farm, If I was to try and build one it would lag my lap top to the point I would no longer be able to play that world. that is if I did not stand there punching the golems and went out to harvest or build. The first and only Iron golem farm I ever build did not effect me at all and when I need a little bit of iron to make a new hoe or pick I went back to the Iron golem farm to find a bit had been collected.
All in all Just because I do not build or use the auto-farms that much does not mean that the ability to build and use them should be limited for others.
I would like comments (good or bad) to help me adjust my ideas so that hopefully some one will help me bring them to life.
If you like my Ideas check out my others at http://www.minecraftforum.net/topic/2177041-request-looking-for-modders/
For me the fun is in building those huge autofarms in survival. It's all about the challenge of building it.
Greetings,
Author of RFTools, RFTools Control, RFTools Dimensions, Deep Resonance, Immersive Craft, CombatHelp, NICE, Aqua Munda, Ariente, XNet, Interaction Wheel, The Lost Cities, Lost Souls, Need To Breathe, EFab, The One Probe and co-author of Not Enough Wands and RF Lux.
YouTube Channel: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCYMg1JQw3syJBgPeW6m68lA?view_as=subscriber
Support me at my Patreon page (http://www.patreon.com/McJty) or directly on my Paypal account ([email protected]). Thanks
I'm a builder and when I bought the game I made a Creative world, but I watched Mindcrack videos and they build cool stuff in vanilla Minecraft, so I tried and fell in love with it, but I like the sense of accomplishment when you worked really hard on something and it turns out great.
Yes, I agree with this, this is pretty much what I wanted to say. Plus, minecraft is mean't to be that way, its quite possible to play without doing any off that and just ignore the people doing it, I very rarely use anything related to redstone, but I still don't mind when other people do, its not my business is it. People can play minecraft however they want, because that's how it was made to be.
OcD Simple Add-On!
Citation needed.