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Potions and Distillation - 1.9-pre4 Reference Guide(Pics/Videos/Information!)


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#1

Satharis
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Posted 30 September 2011 - 12:20 AM

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Potions & Distillation
Potion/Brewing thread to the max. Most of the information here is from my experiments, some of the good people from #risucraft, and a few forum snippets.


New layout courtesy of OCD Solaria poking.


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♦ The Future of Brewing ♦
So Jeb hopped on IRC for a bit, gave us a few tidbits about the new potion system. Below are some of the important bits.

Quote

[04:26] <Satharis> guess they totally nerfed potions if there's really 8700-14500 current unique potions
[04:30] <+jeb> Satharis: i removed duplicate potions and potions that can't be made in less than 6 steps

[04:31] <@Risugami> so 1.9 official will keep this overcomplex system? some of us enjoy this lol
[04:33] <@Risugami> I think most of us want an input queue with a preview, in a gui
[04:34] <+jeb> Risugami: i'm not sure... i've remade the brewing stuff with a GUI
[04:35] <+jeb> but it's still annoying since you can have many potions that look the same, but can't be stacked because of hidden auxValue differences

[05:00] <+jeb> i'm not planning to do more potion effects or types, because i want potions to have their specific range of uses
[05:01] <+jeb> i mean, i don't want to make an explosive potion, because in that case it would make more sense to simply add a hand grenade

[05:02] <Satharis> jeb if you don't mind me asking, is there any plan to umm.. weaponize potions somehow? or are the negative effects just to hurt the user in exchange for the buff?
[05:02] <Satharis> that's been kind of a point of contempt
[05:03] <+jeb> the initial idea of the negative buffs was simply to make it harder to create a "clean" potion
[05:03] <+jeb> but in the long term these potions could be used for other things






◘ Videos
Below I've linked a few videos on the topic of brewing, thanks to the video authors for their work!
Spoiler:

◘ Brewing Stands
Brewing stands are the new block for potion brewing, similar to a furnace at first glance, they feature similar mixing techniques to the old cauldron system.
Spoiler:


◘ Basic Distillation
The actual process of distilling potions is a simple yet complex art.
Spoiler:


◘ Potion Ingredients
Below is a complete list of all the ingredients that may be used in potion distillation.
Spoiler:


◘ Potion Effects(Edited a bit, original is courtesy of Mouzi)-semi outdated
This is a list of all the physical effects that potions may cause to a player.
Spoiler:

◘ Technical Trickery-outdated
Due to popular request I'll be listing a little technical information about the potion code.
Spoiler:






Ye Olde Potion F.A.Q.
Read these before asking anything.

Quote

Q: How do I get brewing stands!?!
-A: Craft them on a workbench! The recipe is listed above, but, the short version is, three cobblestone on the bottom, then a Blaze Rod in the middle!

Q: How many potions are there?
-A: We aren't sure of the max amount any more, Jeb has tweeted that in pre-release there is only something like 150 potions until they add every ingredient in, at which point there will be over 2500. Early reports seem to show these may not be every ingredient in the list, or potions were trimmed down much more, it seems to be rather challenging to even get 150 combos right now.

Q: Do you have a list of every potion?
-A: Not at the moment, this may change soon.

Q: Are these brewing stands the final version?
-A: I'm assuming not, for the reasons listed above, but I haven't been able to get any comments by Jeb(he's very busy!) That said, the issue is up in the air at the moment, it is a PRE-RELEASE, so they likely have changes to be made before final release.

Q: Do you really talk to Jeb?
-A: Sometimes, yes, he does talk to some people on IRC but he is a very busy person thus I only rarely get to ask him questions regarding releases. I don't wish to come off as rude either, he already gets followed around like a movie star would, much the same as Notch.

◘ Old Cauldron Mod Download
This mod is outdated, pre-release 2 only! If you still have this version you're welcome to try cauldrons out, links are still below! Simple edit that adds cauldrons into the game as a craftable potion brewing block.
Spoiler:

Will add more information as I find it!
(PS: Sorry about stretching images in the thread, spoiler tags seem to break the auto-resize!)
That one dragon coding thingy.

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#2

Rafe
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Posted 30 September 2011 - 12:23 AM

Wow cool!
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#3

GorgeousTaylor
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Posted 30 September 2011 - 12:30 AM

Thank you for listing the different ingredients and their basic effects.

Although, I'm skeptical that spider eyes have purely negative effects.
Fermentation requires sugar and mushrooms, after all.
Shouldn't that amount to something?

#4

Davideesk
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Posted 30 September 2011 - 12:30 AM

Wow! this is awesome :D

#5

renadi
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Posted 30 September 2011 - 12:30 AM

Do you personally think it should be included this way or is it too complex, basically I'm wondering if it's half as amazing as it seems and if I should be upset if jens cuts it down.

#6

Shirosuki1
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Posted 30 September 2011 - 12:31 AM

Thats pretty awesome!!
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#7

Mouzi
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Posted 30 September 2011 - 12:33 AM

Nice! And thanks for sharing.
By the way, how hard would it be to figure out how the potions are calculated? I don't understand those "!10 & !4 & 5*2+0 & >1 | !7 & !4 & 5*2+0 & >1" things. All I know is it uses prime numbers to make looping redundant.

Oh, and I updated my thread a bit since I did some more testing, so that's probably the old one.

#8

Satharis
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Posted 30 September 2011 - 12:34 AM

View Postrenadi, on 30 September 2011 - 12:30 AM, said:

Do you personally think it should be included this way or is it too complex, basically I'm wondering if it's half as amazing as it seems and if I should be upset if jens cuts it down.

Honestly I think it is a bit complex, on the one hand it does give literally the ability to adds hundreds of ingredients to keep changing the way a potion works, there are problems though. The biggest problems are probably: A. It's just unneeded complexity, B. Potions will almost never be brewed past the say, 20 ingredient combo mark, especially when people start listing the formulas to create the best all positive effect potions. Nobody will really want to chuck 20 pieces of sugar in unless you can get like, level III of a few effects.

I can definitely see where jeb_ finds the interface unwieldy right now, you literally have to sample the potion after each ingredient and write down the combo, but yes, on a complexity level it is interesting but might be a bit much.
That one dragon coding thingy.

#9

Unit7
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Posted 30 September 2011 - 12:34 AM

Oh wow that looks incredible. Not sure if I will ever be a great potion master. But its a really cool thing. I also like that it seems that some of the better potions atleast will have some sort of downside to it.

Really cool addition. :)

#10

AudioFreak

Posted 30 September 2011 - 12:35 AM

I can't even begin to imagine the usage of potions in adventure or super hostile maps.... HA

#11

Frootloops

Posted 30 September 2011 - 12:37 AM

FUCK YEAR.

This is exactly what Minecraft needs. Simple in the short run, complex in the long run.

However, I imagine that after a while you'll hoard potions that you don't want to use in favor of better ones. Hopefully you can do something with them aside from chuckin em in lava.

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Others ask, "What if?" We ask, "Why if."


#12

GorgeousTaylor
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Posted 30 September 2011 - 12:37 AM

Wait a minute... This means... Reed farms are USEFUL now! :D

#13

renadi
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Posted 30 September 2011 - 12:39 AM

View PostSatharis, on 30 September 2011 - 12:34 AM, said:

Honestly I think it is a bit complex, on the one hand it does give literally the ability to adds hundreds of ingredients to keep changing the way a potion works, there are problems though. The biggest problems are probably: A. It's just unneeded complexity, B. Potions will almost never be brewed past the say, 20 ingredient combo mark, especially when people start listing the formulas to create the best all positive effect potions. Nobody will really want to chuck 20 pieces of sugar in unless you can get like, level III of a few effects.

I can definitely see where jeb_ finds the interface unwieldy right now, you literally have to sample the potion after each ingredient and write down the combo, but yes, on a complexity level it is interesting but might be a bit much.

hah, I guess I was just super excited, I think a system like this could be really neat, just because there would be these well known 4 ingredient potions but then there'd be the 20 ingredient super potions(assuming maybe we can get higher than III.)

I'm fine with some potions being really obscure or difficult to make, maybe somebody would find out a way to make a better version of it with less/easier to get ingredients, it'd be a major scientific discovery within the community, maybe someone keeps a potion secret that they found out how to make, and the chances of someone replicating it would be very slim, I think it's just such a neat idea. lol

--Forgot a parenthesis.

Edited by renadi, 30 September 2011 - 12:40 AM.


#14

Satharis
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Posted 30 September 2011 - 12:39 AM

View PostMouzi, on 30 September 2011 - 12:33 AM, said:

Nice! And thanks for sharing.
By the way, how hard would it be to figure out how the potions are calculated? I don't understand those "!10 & !4 & 5*2+0 & >1 | !7 & !4 & 5*2+0 & >1" things. All I know is it uses prime numbers to make looping redundant.

Oh, and I updated my thread a bit since I did some more testing, so that's probably the old one.

If you mean the OP i just re-copied it with whatever updates you made.

As for the numbers, I'm really not sure how it works, it seems to be some kind of mathematical formula involving the bits of the integer, I'm not sure what the exact combinations are to craft potions, the code itself seems to equate to what someone described to me as a mini-language for describing how to form potions. It's actually all very creative though, maybe a bit too much.
That one dragon coding thingy.

#15

Theuberelite

Posted 30 September 2011 - 12:40 AM

I'm gonna laugh so hard when jeb sees this.
But seriously, this is incredible.

#16

Holly_Short

Posted 30 September 2011 - 12:40 AM

I think it shouldn't show the effects, and be able to hand them to mobs.
A HUGGY POTION?
:SSSS:
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#17

chrid97
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Posted 30 September 2011 - 12:42 AM

When I was playing the pre release 2 I was wondering what all this crap was, then you cane along :D

#18

Mouzi
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Posted 30 September 2011 - 12:44 AM

Alright, another question: do you think it's possible to brew IV level potions since that's the last level described in the code after which it just turns to potion.potency.5? I haven't seen any yet myself at least.

#19

renadi
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Posted 30 September 2011 - 12:44 AM

View PostTheuberelite, on 30 September 2011 - 12:40 AM, said:

I'm gonna laugh so hard when jeb sees this.
But seriously, this is incredible.
I tweeted to him that I support this system xD it's just, it's possible to make simple potions, but it's also possible to make incredibly complex ones, and eventually with different effects there could seriously be super rare potions only one person has access to because they figured out how to design them/got extremely lucky.

#20

Satharis
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Posted 30 September 2011 - 12:46 AM

View PostMouzi, on 30 September 2011 - 12:44 AM, said:

Alright, another question: do you think it's possible to brew IV level potions since that's the last level described in the code after which it just turns to potion.potency.5? I haven't seen any yet myself at least.

Honestly I haven't been able to get past effect III on any of my potions, but I did notice if a ram a ton of ingredients into a potion the value seems to stack, I had timers going up to 8 minutes and such. I think the language itself describing the potions actually does reward more ingredients with higher effect numbers in general, that may mean it is possible to get a V effect but that make take 100 ingredients or something. Definitely will prove to be a massive community challenge to figure out the best brewing strategies if it is really implemented like that, and stays in this form.

This is all just educated guessing though.
That one dragon coding thingy.