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Regarding SMP "cheats" -- An updated policy


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#41

Crunkatog

Posted 11 April 2011 - 07:42 PM

I would still like to know who's using what. On our server, there's several people whom I actually wouldn't mind using X-ray or fly mod or whatever they want. Then there's the few idiots who are just this side of class-AAA griefers and shouldn't even be allowed around regular buckets.

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#42

death544
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Posted 11 April 2011 - 09:14 PM

Celsian said:

skiddyfisk said:

X-ray is also a wonderful tool for diagnosing buried redstone circuitry without digging everything up.

This.
One of the many reasons I'd like to see this mod remain available... Last night I was making an XOR gate that powered an iron double door and I wouldn't have figured out where the break in my line was without digging up the whole floor. Luckily, X-Ray mod let me hit my switch and see where the power stopped!

Well shit, then the mods shouldn't show you ores! Ruins the point of the game and makes it get boring really quick!

SkyPiercers!? said:

wumbledorf said:

It is sad how low one can become on the internet.
I agree.  I get sad staring into mirrors too.

#43

skiddyfisk

Posted 11 April 2011 - 10:06 PM

Crunkatog said:

Then there's the few idiots who are just this side of class-AAA griefers and shouldn't even be allowed around regular buckets.

Why haven't you banned them? If it's not your server, and the actual admin won't ban them, why are you still there?

#44

iiCriss
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Posted 12 April 2011 - 09:22 AM

I hate hacking :iapprove: But hacking doesnt mean "getting items"
Because minecraft doesnt have an objective.
But hacking means "GRIEFING NOTCH"
I Support all mods! ( even tho' they suck.)
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#45

Stuwik
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Posted 12 April 2011 - 11:34 AM

death544 said:

NewbyModder said:

Notch said:

If you've bought the game, you may play around with it and modify it. I'd appreciate it if you didn't use this for griefing, though, and remember not to distribute the changes.

Hmmmmm, last time I checked, X-ray, Zombe's mods, and all the others, were changes being distributed. Notch needs to clear this up nao!

Maybe he's a little vague, but the point is not to spread modified jar-files, or any jar-files for that matter. Files that make changes to existing jar-files are allowed. Huge difference, and quite easy to spot.
"You should never underestimate the predictability of stupidity."

#46

killaz916

Posted 12 April 2011 - 12:05 PM

Last time i checked, people still use texture packs to see stuff they shouldn't, but no one cares about that, they only care about people who x-ray lol. Funny Indeed!

#47

Al*
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Posted 12 April 2011 - 12:12 PM

this is whats right . some people do enjoy these 'hacks' and 'cheats' although i call them differently: 'tools.'
Helloooooooooooo, oo, ooooo, oo.
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Arneis said:

Too much gunpowder make thissss. Issss bad, m'kay.
You must leave nice everythingssss for ressst of usss to asplode. Isss called sharing."

#48

iamjagman
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Posted 12 April 2011 - 12:23 PM

BlueAgent said:

SniperXPX said:

[OC]Pik4chu said:

-quotesnip-
thats far from the point.
What I am saying is that no matter how much you want to control what mods the clients are using, you will never be able to accomplish it, even with the most sophisticated anti-cheat system. There are things that are client-side such as x-ray and they will always be able to work unless the games architecture changes entirely. Fly and speed on the other hand can be controlled server-side as it is the player positioning and the server can monitor that stuff.

It was easy to use a java class editor to change the string values for certain regular expressions inside Zombes Pack
From these:
if(msg.matches(".*\\Wz-fly(\\W|$).*")) modFlyAllowed = true;
if(msg.matches(".*\\Wz-cheat(\\W|$).*")) modCheatAllowed = true;

To these:
if(msg.matches(".*")) modFlyAllowed = true;
if(msg.matches(".*")) modCheatAllowed = true;

I think that there will always be possible for those x-rays mods to work but not be detected, especially since the server sends all the blocks regardless to the client, and so the client is just there to display the the data.
Anything cosmetic will be easy to change. Also, Java, is quite easy to decompile and recompile as compared to a program written in C that has been compiled (although it is still possible, how do you think companies reverse engineer programs???? Patents lol).

anti-cheat system? Good idea!
Some one could go fully crazy and makes a mod that uses a combination of the session ID of the player and the hash of the game files as a verification system to make sure no game files have been changed.
Then again, some one could just modify the mod to get the game files from somewhere else that has the original, umodifyied files...
Anti cheat, is kinda hard to do with minecraft as it is.

Have fun with anti cheat

EDIT: DId not understand what you meant at first. Never mind. Disregard this post.

Blagob said:

This is awesome. Now if only I could understand what the hell it all means.
Spoiler:

#49

skiddyfisk

Posted 12 April 2011 - 02:02 PM

killaz916 said:

Last time i checked, people still use texture packs to see stuff they shouldn't, but no one cares about that, they only care about people who x-ray lol. Funny Indeed!


To be fair, texture packs are nowhere near as useful as x-ray mods.

#50

fghjconner

Posted 12 April 2011 - 03:57 PM

A relatively simple and efective anti x-ray mod could just send players exposed blocks, making x-ray mods no better than texture packs.

#51

Grugsy
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Posted 12 April 2011 - 07:25 PM

this whole argument is easily solved. if you run a server and don't use an anti grief mod that protects user placed blocks, don't bitch..it's your own fault for not protecting your server against greifers.. I run my server in a smart way and don't need admins to always be there because I set it up properly to only allow certain ranks to be able to do certain things, and yes I can block flying if I need to.(or ban people that use it.) plain and simple, if you run an open public server and don't take precautions against these problems you deserve what you get.

and don't ask me about server mods to block things...do what I did and find them yourself.
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#52

skiddyfisk

Posted 13 April 2011 - 12:37 AM

Grugsy said:

this whole argument is easily solved. if you run a server and don't use an anti grief mod that protects user placed blocks, don't bitch..it's your own fault for not protecting your server against greifers.. I run my server in a smart way and don't need admins to always be there because I set it up properly to only allow certain ranks to be able to do certain things, and yes I can block flying if I need to.(or ban people that use it.) plain and simple, if you run an open public server and don't take precautions against these problems you deserve what you get.

and don't ask me about server mods to block things...do what I did and find them yourself.


Christ, not enough people have this much sense. Is there a thread for your server?

#53

theshaneman

Posted 13 April 2011 - 01:43 AM

Hey, think about this, anyone who is playing an old version of minecraft (1.3_01 during the period of 1.4_01) is technically griefing Notch's latest implementations. ;D

And now some unrelated troll-logic.

:DBlock: + :--+: = {SMILIES_PATH}/flintnsteel.png
{SMILIES_PATH}/flintnsteel.png - :--+: = :Iron:
:Iron: = Useless.

#54

killaz916

Posted 13 April 2011 - 04:17 AM

skiddyfisk said:

killaz916 said:

Last time i checked, people still use texture packs to see stuff they shouldn't, but no one cares about that, they only care about people who x-ray lol. Funny Indeed!
To be fair, texture packs are nowhere near as useful as x-ray mods.

Nowhere near as useful. Seems you don't know about the X-ray Texture Packs, where they show ores,  and outlines of blocks so you can still play and everythying, also the textures can easy be swapped out and everything. Hell, The base of x-raying came from texture pack modifying.

#55

Kane_Hart
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Posted 13 April 2011 - 07:02 AM

citricsquid said:

Hi,

Early last week I coordinated the introduction of a new policy to disallow the posting and promotion of smp "cheat" mods, mods designed to "hack" the game in ways which could disrupt Minecraft servers.

I contacted Mojang at the time and eventually heard back a few days ago, they stated that they believe it should be up to server operators to decide which mods are allowed and as we want to follow what Mojang want from this forum we are following their decision.

From today you are now allowed to post smp "hacks" and "cheat" mods, although any that are specifically designed for griefing will still be removed.

Thanks for your patience and sorry for the inconvenience. If you had a mod removed please provide me or any of the moderators of Mapping and Modding with the name and we will return the thread to this section.

You should be ashamed. If I could reverse time I would have not supported you guys. I really thought you were a better company then this. You guys sold out to Curse and now your allowing hacks. At least make an option where they don't work in SMP unless the admin allows it aka with a plugin server side or allow a plugin for a kill switch.

This just ruins SMP servers and no way to police this at all...

This is pretty much like sure rape people as long as you don't get caught....

Should be ashamed and notch is a two faced liar too who changed his corporate ways over the many months.. 6 Months ago he would have told you to not allow such things.
xxxxxx

#56

killaz916

Posted 13 April 2011 - 08:29 AM

If You cared to Read, All of these Mods Were Allowed Beforehand, than were removed, and re-allowed, because Mojang said do it.

The Mod's That were the problem was X-Ray, Texture Packs were never touched, FlyMod got touched the last day of the enforcement, Every Mod has a KillSwitch/Enabler/Disabler.

- Zombe's FlyMod has a MOTD DIsabler, and the famous NoCheat bukkit plugin that controls it.
- NewbyModders X-Ray has a Disabler Bukkit Plugin that Kills it, when you Installed it.
- CJBok X-Ray/Minimap has a Enabler Bukkit Plugin, The X-Ray will not work, and Show Mob/Players for Minimap won't work if the Bukkit Plugin isn't installed.

Note: As you May Know Texture Packs can not be blocked, oh wait, yes they can. There is a few methods to prevent x-ray even if the mod don't have a kill switch or if its private. A Public Anti-X-Ray plugin was released a little awhile ago, This might be good for shitty servers, because it changes them to stone, so you cant see them, but when you actually put light on it, it will turn back. It is an excellent Plugin.

There are Private Anti-X-Ray mods as well, and a few concepts that have not been coded yet, but from i have seen everything can be controlled. Yet no one wants to share, thats the issue! They use it was a way of making money, getting players, or just advertising that they have one.

#57

Donixs
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Posted 13 April 2011 - 10:51 AM

Kane_Hart said:

You should be ashamed. If I could reverse time I would have not supported you guys. I really thought you were a better company then this. You guys sold out to Curse and now your allowing hacks. At least make an option where they don't work in SMP unless the admin allows it aka with a plugin server side or allow a plugin for a kill switch.

This just ruins SMP servers and no way to police this at all...

This is pretty much like sure rape people as long as you don't get caught....

Should be ashamed and notch is a two faced liar too who changed his corporate ways over the many months.. 6 Months ago he would have told you to not allow such things.

I'm glad you like to think that corporate decisions that you don't agree with are equal to raping people.

And I don't get how this was ever the forums decision in the first place. How did they sold out to Curse if they contacted Mojang and Mojang said "Dude, we never said that, let them put their shit back up."

The fact that they allow modders to share their mods is a blessing, because they have told players before that mods redistribute files, but they won't do anything against it because it's the only way right now to mod the game.

I think you are just raging about the fact that they changed their policy on switching from free updates to payed for the beta buyers.
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#58

killaz916

Posted 13 April 2011 - 11:03 AM

Not to mention GodCraft the server that guy operates, charges players to be on the whitelist, before they are even accepted as a matter of fact, and if not allowed a refund is given.

Seriously Kane, your one to talk about Two-Faced, When your making money off of Mojang, which is disgusting.

#59

anagog
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Posted 13 April 2011 - 11:30 AM

killaz916 said:

Not to mention GodCraft the server that guy operates, charges players to be on the whitelist, before they are even accepted as a matter of fact, and if not allowed a refund is given.

Seriously Kane, your one to talk about Two-Faced, When your making money off of Mojang, which is disgusting.


He might not be making money of Mojang what is more likely is that the moeny goes toward either the cost for upkeeping the server or making it better, possibly both. I know P2P proberly isnt the best way to do it as people like your self (people who lets say... slightly below the average inteligence for monkies...) will flame them and think they keep all the money for them selves rather than use it to make the server the players use better.


EDIT: typos <.<
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#60

Grugsy
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Posted 13 April 2011 - 07:29 PM

Kane_Hart said:

You should be ashamed. If I could reverse time I would have not supported you guys. I really thought you were a better company then this. You guys sold out to Curse and now your allowing hacks. At least make an option where they don't work in SMP unless the admin allows it aka with a plugin server side or allow a plugin for a kill switch.

This just ruins SMP servers and no way to police this at all...

This is pretty much like sure rape people as long as you don't get caught....

Should be ashamed and notch is a two faced liar too who changed his corporate ways over the many months.. 6 Months ago he would have told you to not allow such things.

I don't usually quote myself..but this time it's worth it... learn to read before you make yourself look stupid.

Grugsy said:

this whole argument is easily solved. if you run a server and don't use an anti grief mod that protects user placed blocks, don't bitch..it's your own fault for not protecting your server against greifers.. I run my server in a smart way and don't need admins to always be there because I set it up properly to only allow certain ranks to be able to do certain things, and yes I can block flying if I need to.(or ban people that use it.) plain and simple, if you run an open public server and don't take precautions against these problems you deserve what you get.

and don't ask me about server mods to block things...do what I did and find them yourself.

and to whoever asked me about a thread for my server..no..it's private and will never be posted for the public..made that mistake with my first server. (even though players can invite, and griefers be griefin)
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