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BARBARIANS! - A Nightmare of a Mob


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#1

Pizarro
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Posted 04 July 2010 - 11:33 PM

While I played, I began to have a nostalgic moment of old games I have played in the past, ranging from FPS games to strategy games and some of the more difficult ones out of the bunch, then something dawned on me: Why not introduce Barbarians into MC?

Lets run down basic information concerning Barbarians:
They were normally nomadic people who traveled either alone or in groups, settling wherever they could and raiding any other settlements nearest them. Other then weapons and money, they would also steal women and children to bolster their number and slaughter every man they saw, mostly to bolster their population.

How they could be used in the game:
Spiders, Creepers, Skeletons and Zombies are the only mobs available; they're slow, they don't hit hard and they're stupid, if you can trap them in a pit, they're not smart enough to either jump out so you can easily pick them off. Survival on this game is way too easy against monsters. I looked over my character and what you can do in the game and I figured: Why not make an NPC mob that can practically do EVERYTHING you can?

I was thinking 4 different Barbarians in the game which is a female Hostile Barbarian, male Hostile Barbarian, male Unhostile Barbarian and female Unhostile Barbarian. I'm going to explain their importance later in the suggestion.

Barbarian Mob Basics:
Like Vikings, I figured the Barbarians either hostile or unhostile will look like Vikings: Blonde or red hair, a small beard, blue eyes and their clothing would appear leather or some form of dark cloth.

Sometimes, they might wear equipment that DOES has an effect on the damage they'll receive and inflict to others. They always wear an outfit of the armor so its easy to recognize their strength. For instance, if you see a Barbarian wearing cloth armor, he'll more then likely have a wooden sword on him so you'll know the damage he could inflict. Take care, some might be carrying a bow instead.

They're capable of hunting animals for food, sheep for cloth to craft armor, chopping trees for building or crafting materials, digging dirt up to flatten land to build homes, mining stone and iron for better weapons, armor and building/crafting materials, anything you can do. They're able to build homes (but to be fair, they're limited to only making small 9x9x3 houses and have chests to protect their goods.

When in combat (either against you or a monster), they attack far differently. They have the same HP as you and the mobs. They move at 50% of your walking speed, but if they see an opponent from afar and he's not carrying a bow, he'll charge in a straight line in the target's direction, their speed jumping to 1.5x of your own. To be fair with this though, this "charge" is considered a berserk move so you can easily jump out of the way and let them keep charging and will not consider their land around them so its easy to lure them into a trap to kill them. If they're near death, they'll eat any food they managed to gather from hunting or simply run away and try to fight another day.

They're also more intelligent then the current mobs. If they get stuck somewhere such as a pit, while they're engaged in a fight with you or a monster, they'll try and find a way out or to get up at the same height as you are to continue the fight.

They're also a hardy people, wanting to prove their strength individually. If they fight you or a monster and there's more then 1 Barbarian, only one Barbarian will fight and die before the next one either steps in or wanders away.

They're capable of opening doors and climbing ladders, so it'd make iron doors even more important. They're also able to punch holes through walls, but its only to either get to their target or a chest to loot it. When they attack walls, they'll strike the wall as if they were not carrying any tools at all.

They also have an inventory exactly like the players' so that means they can't loot everything if they attack your base.

How they start off:
They would randomly spawn in at night, scattered randomly in the map like monsters do. They would wander aimlessly or fight you (if they're hostile) or other monsters or until they come across another Hostile or Unhostile Barbarian (ex, an unhostile barbarian runs into another unhostile barbarian). After that, no more will spawn in unless of course you manage to wipe out every single barbarian on the map.

After they start grouping up together, they begin to flatten the world around them, collecting building materials of either wood or stone. When they collect enough resources, they'll begin to make a large structure which will serve as a place to store all of their excess goods and weapons then build outward with small towers and houses. When enough houses are made to hold their original group (example, 6 hostile barbarians make 6 houses for themselves), they'll continue to expand, but only slower.

If a female of their status is in the group (Example, 2 hostile female barbarian with 1-2 hostile male barbarians), their population will increase depending on how many females are present. To be fair and reduce rapid population growth, the groups will only accept females if there's less then half of them compared to barbarian men (example is 3 women and 6 men) and the outcome of new members being female is 50/50 just like reality. As the population grows, more buildings will be set up to hold them. Once it reaches its peak, a wall might be set up.

If you guys are still worried on rapid growth, perhaps make each group have a max of 20 men and 10 women. When their population is large enough, perhaps they'll make raiding parties to attack other Barbarian settlements of the opposite status. (example, 10 Hostile Barbarians stage to attack an unhostile Barbarian settlement) This way, it'll reduce population growth.

Hostile Barbarians:
Quite simply the worst sort you want to find. If you've read before, these mobs are capable of fighting you like you'd fight a monster and they might or might not carry equipment. Their sight range is 2x farther then any mob. They'll engage to fight or hunt anything in sight. Other then you, their enemies are the Unhostile Barbarians.

Unhostile Barbarians:
Pretty much the same as Hostile Barbarians, except they don't fight you unless you strike them first. Since they look exactly like Hostile Barbarians, you won't find out if they're good or bad until you're within sight. If you are, the unhostiles will not proceed to either charge at you or engage in any form of combat.

If you find an unhostile barbarian settlement, it would be wise to set your base in theirs to further protect the perimeter and keep monsters off your back. Be warned though, the hostiles will recognize your base as one of the unhostile's so they will attack, attempt to break down a portion of your wall and try and either kill you and/or take your stuff. It would also allow you to help protect the village if a raid against them comes into play. The unhostiles will not register you fighting so they'll help you fight off other Hostile Barbarians or mobs.

Deaths & Rewards:
The reward table is quite simple, if you find a barbarian and he didn't loot anything and he's carrying some armor, you'll get a random piece of the barbarian's armor or weapon. If he looted or hunted, you'll still get a random piece of his equipment, but he'll also drop 40-75% of all the stuff he looted, hunted or collected.

Why did I suggest this?
Its a TL;DR summary. Its because current mobs are boring as hell and would make SSP very fun to play long after SMP is released. The Barbarians are just an NPC mimicry of you, capable of doing anything you can in the game.

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#2

Fatalis
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Posted 04 July 2010 - 11:44 PM

It might be somewhat hard to code, but if Notch does add this, it would be damn fun.
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#3

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Posted 04 July 2010 - 11:51 PM

Start off these mob as a simple intelligent enemy, but then work it up, don't start muddling it up so soon because people would get confused.

Barbarians - Humanoid Mob that has a higher intelligence, and works within a group of other barbarians.

They can be a sorta event, that occurs randomly as you play the game maybe.
Only appears when you play any game that has a ocean (since they use a boat).

They should land on the coast with a big boat, which probably serves as their HQ.

They come out at night, and maintain a perimeter to patrol their territory.

They attack other mobs, excluding sheeps and pigs.

Can have 2 variety of warriors, 1 that shoots arrows, and 1 that uses axes.
* Warriors can be armored and tougher than normal mobs, also stronger and requires cunning and well refined armors and weapons to defeat.

They should not wander around or chase after you, but they can expand their perimeter each day, putting you at risk of being exposed and found out.

They spawn in groups of 5, 2 ranged and 3 melee, and patrols their perimeter.

+0~2 spawns to each day passed if not wiped out by the player or monster.

Can be attracted to torches set by players at night, as a mean of "curiosity" to discover, rather than monster's that avoid them because of the light. This is so you might end up running into one if you keep setting up torches on a path from your house to your mine, and if a barbarian intercepts it.

#4

Pizarro
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Posted 05 July 2010 - 01:46 AM

I would like to mention this as well, some of you can relate to this too...

If you've played old Single Player games that has multiplayer such as Diablo 2 or any of the Age of Empires games, you know as soon as you're able to play multiplayer, single player games get REAL boring, REAL fast. This Barbarian suggestion was supposed to imitate a sort of multiplayer feel in Single Player games so it doesn't become all but abandoned.

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#5

Carcanken

Posted 05 July 2010 - 02:31 AM

Fatalis said:

It might be somewhat hard to code, but if Notch does add this, it would be damn fun.

Yes, what he said.

#6

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Posted 05 July 2010 - 03:57 AM

Pizarro said:

They're capable of hunting animals for food, sheep for cloth to craft armor, chopping trees for building or crafting materials, digging dirt up to flatten land to build homes, mining stone and iron for better weapons, armor and building/crafting materials, anything you can do. They're able to build homes (but to be fair, they're limited to only making small 9x9x3 houses and have chests to protect their goods.

[..]

By the way, don't say its not possible, I've played all sorts of games that have an NPC intelligence similar to this.

Please give me an example of any game with AI even close to capable of doing all of these things autonomously in a world like Minecraft's three-dimensional and fully mutable world and then maybe I won't say it's not possible.

"Somewhat" hard is a huge understatement and I look forward to any attempts at AI like this.
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#7

Pizarro
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Posted 05 July 2010 - 06:29 AM

Droqen said:

Pizarro said:

They're capable of hunting animals for food, sheep for cloth to craft armor, chopping trees for building or crafting materials, digging dirt up to flatten land to build homes, mining stone and iron for better weapons, armor and building/crafting materials, anything you can do. They're able to build homes (but to be fair, they're limited to only making small 9x9x3 houses and have chests to protect their goods.

[..]

By the way, don't say its not possible, I've played all sorts of games that have an NPC intelligence similar to this.

Please give me an example of any game with AI even close to capable of doing all of these things autonomously in a world like Minecraft's three-dimensional and fully mutable world and then maybe I won't say it's not possible.

"Somewhat" hard is a huge understatement and I look forward to any attempts at AI like this.

Well not one game has done everything, but only one game came real close and it was in the form of a strategy-ish game. Tell me, ever heard of Black & White or Black & White 2?

In the games, you were a god who had virtually absolute control of your world except molding the world to how you wanted it. Why is this game important? Its the villagers you controlled!

The villagers were incredibly versatile and independent and were more then able to take care of themselves and their civilization without your divine intervention. Shortage in wood? Some villagers would automatically become Foresters to chop down a tree. Shortage in iron? A villager would automatically assign a miner status to themselves and go to any nearby iron rocks or mines to get iron. Its only in Black & White 2, and it was used mostly for military building, but also as a secondary resource needed for more advanced building such as temples. Have a population shortage? A villager would go out and have sex with an opposite gender (which Lionhead Studios disguised it as the couple giving each other a deep kiss and a tight hug then the female walking away, instantly pregnant) to repopulate the civilization. Not enough houses? Some villagers might automatically make a house foundation somewhere and assign themselves the task of being a builder. Food shortage? Some villagers would become a shepherd or farmer. And all of this could be done without you having to come in and make them permanent disciples in any of those areas, including Breeding (which in Lionhead studio is another way to say free prostitution :opblock: ).

Granted, many games may be a bit exhaggerated, but I'm sure this answers your question. :lol:

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#8

Pizarro
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Posted 06 July 2010 - 01:33 AM

dra6o0n said:

Start off these mob as a simple intelligent enemy, but then work it up, don't start muddling it up so soon because people would get confused.

Barbarians - Humanoid Mob that has a higher intelligence, and works within a group of other barbarians.

They can be a sorta event, that occurs randomly as you play the game maybe.
Only appears when you play any game that has a ocean (since they use a boat).

They should land on the coast with a big boat, which probably serves as their HQ.

They come out at night, and maintain a perimeter to patrol their territory.

They attack other mobs, excluding sheeps and pigs.

Can have 2 variety of warriors, 1 that shoots arrows, and 1 that uses axes.
* Warriors can be armored and tougher than normal mobs, also stronger and requires cunning and well refined armors and weapons to defeat.

They should not wander around or chase after you, but they can expand their perimeter each day, putting you at risk of being exposed and found out.

They spawn in groups of 5, 2 ranged and 3 melee, and patrols their perimeter.

+0~2 spawns to each day passed if not wiped out by the player or monster.

Can be attracted to torches set by players at night, as a mean of "curiosity" to discover, rather than monster's that avoid them because of the light. This is so you might end up running into one if you keep setting up torches on a path from your house to your mine, and if a barbarian intercepts it.

That could work too, but only in a basic way. I'm hoping if they're added, Notch would come back to this every now and then to upgrade their intelligence to what I'm hoping they'll be.

.:pizarro:.
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#9

gordenfreechmen

Posted 06 July 2010 - 02:51 AM

The problem is, they're too intelligent. Dirt huts are more common then fortresses, many with basic defenses like the old "Dirt above air" door. Them randomly spawning is like meeting a zombie that is more efficient in every way (speed, strength, etc.). Be aware this means they will chase you when you're weaponless and still punching trees to begin a basic shack.

#10

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Posted 06 July 2010 - 05:12 AM

Whoops! Now where did my post go?

I played Black & White and I think I played the sequel. I made a bigger post but I'll shorten it this time.

B&W villagers
They interact with the world in very simple ways (go up to tree and activate 'cut tree down', set up blueprint and activate 'start building timer' etc.), they interact with the world in effectively two dimensions (at any given x/y point there is only one z-point at which a villager can stand -- plus, villagers can't jump), and they never have to directly deal with human players (they only fight against other villagers).

Minecraft Barbarians
They interact with the world in complicated ways -- trees must be taken down block by block. Same with mining, and building houses.
They interact with a fully three-dimensional world -- this means hell for pathfinding, especially if they actually need to intelligently go out and find resources and good building locations and mines etc.
Their main purpose would be to interact directly with human players, meaning in comparison their cognitive power will appear to lack even more.
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#11

Pizarro
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Posted 06 July 2010 - 05:53 AM

Droqen said:

Whoops! Now where did my post go?

I played Black & White and I think I played the sequel. I made a bigger post but I'll shorten it this time.

B&W villagers
They interact with the world in very simple ways (go up to tree and activate 'cut tree down', set up blueprint and activate 'start building timer' etc.), they interact with the world in effectively two dimensions (at any given x/y point there is only one z-point at which a villager can stand -- plus, villagers can't jump), and they never have to directly deal with human players (they only fight against other villagers).

Minecraft Barbarians
They interact with the world in complicated ways -- trees must be taken down block by block. Same with mining, and building houses.
They interact with a fully three-dimensional world -- this means hell for pathfinding, especially if they actually need to intelligently go out and find resources and good building locations and mines etc.
Their main purpose would be to interact directly with human players, meaning in comparison their cognitive power will appear to lack even more.

Well I would understand pathfinding to be a obstruction in the making of these mobs, true, but I don't think it'd be difficult for them to gather certain resources. Something along the line of "If NPC spots [Object # for tree trunks], destroy object, gather item, process into planks."

There's also the problem concerning construction which I think I can solve: When there's at least a 6x6x3 around the NPC, and NPC is carrying at least 19 [Onject # for plank cube]s, stop and build one layer of blocks around NPC. If NPC spots 1 wood or stone block within 6x6x3 of NPC, build 2 more on top of it. If there's wood/stone blocks that are 3 cubes above ground upon which NPC is standing on, and is within 6x6x3 of their immediate area, place blocks horizontally adjacent to one another within 6x6x3 area. When border of 6x6x3 area has been covered in blocks, place center of area as hotspot for NPC.

But I do understand mining would be a major pain in the ass, so perhaps they won't mine, but they will still have varying gear on them to look like they did.

.:pizarro:.
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#12

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Posted 06 July 2010 - 06:28 AM

Interesting idea to human mobs:
- What if they are smart enough to take 5 seconds to dig out a piece of dirt nearby, and use it as a ramp to get where they want to go?

Probably want to make this a low chance occurance in the AI, but always possible for it to build it's own ramp as a way of path finding.

#13

Pizarro
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Posted 06 July 2010 - 08:12 AM

dra6o0n said:

Interesting idea to human mobs:
- What if they are smart enough to take 5 seconds to dig out a piece of dirt nearby, and use it as a ramp to get where they want to go?

Probably want to make this a low chance occurance in the AI, but always possible for it to build it's own ramp as a way of path finding.

It should always happen, otherwise its pretty much the same as the current mobs where they're too stupid to find a way out of some pit, making you able to kill them off easily.

On topic though, the dirt digging to make ramp idea is a pretty sound idea for pathfinding. :Sheep:

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#14

Pizarro
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Posted 06 July 2010 - 05:52 PM

gordenfreechmen said:

The problem is, they're too intelligent. Dirt huts are more common then fortresses, many with basic defenses like the old "Dirt above air" door. Them randomly spawning is like meeting a zombie that is more efficient in every way (speed, strength, etc.). Be aware this means they will chase you when you're weaponless and still punching trees to begin a basic shack.

Yeah, I kind of figured that too and considered them spawning a good distance from your character when they spawn in to prevent encounters when you begin.

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#15

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Posted 06 July 2010 - 06:58 PM

Posted Image
And maybe non-hostiles could spawn as friendly in peaceful. Friendlies wouldn't attack you if you attacked one of their members, only the one you attacked and they wouldn't raid you. So something similar to a duel. And that way you could live with them.
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#16

faleidel

Posted 06 July 2010 - 07:03 PM

barbarians = player style

in smp barbarians will be player who act like barbarians....

I d'ont think its a bad suggestions but...
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#17

Pizarro
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Posted 06 July 2010 - 07:39 PM

faleidel said:

barbarians = player style

in smp barbarians will be player who act like barbarians....

I d'ont think its a bad suggestions but...

Well that is what I'm trying to get across, to keep SSP addictive long after SMP comes out. Good for if you can't get back online for quite a long time and you'll still have plenty of fun things you can do.

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#18

gordenfreechmen

Posted 06 July 2010 - 08:35 PM

Pizarro said:

faleidel said:

barbarians = player style

in smp barbarians will be player who act like barbarians....

I d'ont think its a bad suggestions but...

Well that is what I'm trying to get across, to keep SSP addictive long after SMP comes out. Good for if you can't get back online for quite a long time and you'll still have plenty of fun things you can do.

.:pizarro:.
So you mean like, a bot who represents a dick from multiplayer.

#19

Pizarro
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Posted 06 July 2010 - 08:44 PM

gordenfreechmen said:

Pizarro said:

faleidel said:

barbarians = player style

in smp barbarians will be player who act like barbarians....

I d'ont think its a bad suggestions but...

Well that is what I'm trying to get across, to keep SSP addictive long after SMP comes out. Good for if you can't get back online for quite a long time and you'll still have plenty of fun things you can do.

.:pizarro:.
So you mean like, a bot who represents a dick from multiplayer.

No, that'd be a Barbarian NPC made to completely destroy your house for no reason or loot your chest and destroy the contents.

This suggestion for hostile barbarians would be PKers, killing you for your stuff thats in your inventory as well as being able to take your stuff to use or stash for later.

If you don't like them, we could only allow hostiles to appear only in Hard difficulty while unhostiles appear in all settings.

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#20

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Posted 06 July 2010 - 09:13 PM

And my Friendlies in Peaceful.
I am a Wizard, I haven't got to explain anything to some mundane asking 'Why' or 'How'. Have fun being a fish with legs.
My Pathfinder Campaign for the denizens of MCF: http://www.minecraft...r-campaign-ooc/