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Why are people so against Suicide?


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#201

Arkalius
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Posted 04 June 2012 - 05:31 AM

View Postkrtshv, on 30 May 2012 - 05:47 AM, said:

Would be nice if people can let ourselves decide what we wish to do with out bodies, thanks.
After all, unlike smoking, there is no "second hand suicide", so it doesn't hurt you.. So shut up and let us decide what we wish to do with our lives.
Doesn't hurt anyone? What about the emotional anguish felt by the loved ones left behind? What about the shear amount of work and effort it takes to essentially shut down a person's life? My grandmother recently passed away, and my mom, on top of dealing with the heartache of losing her mother, has had to spend a lot of her time in the last months handling her estate, and it's no cake walk, believe me. When a person dies, by their own hand or otherwise, they don't just vanish from society, leaving no influence behind.

And the reason why people care in general is because we value life, and generally speaking, we all want others to live and enjoy their lives. The needless loss of a life is generally mourned, and when efforts can be made to prevent it, they often are.

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#202

fetusthebard
  • Location: In the womb, waiting...

Posted 04 June 2012 - 07:45 PM

View PostArkalius, on 04 June 2012 - 05:31 AM, said:

The needless loss of a life is generally mourned, and when efforts can be made to prevent it, they often are.
Look at the bold underlined italicized word. No loss of life is needless. This is what you people have to get inside of your heads. There is a reason, a cause, and oftentimes no solution. I have no solution, so I work to prevent suicide. It's why I'm still here. It is not always (and is actually rarely) a temporary problem. This entire debate is trying to dispel your way of thinking, trying to make you understand. It apparantly isn't working.

Also, my family would not care one way or the other. So whatever with all that family bullcrap.

Edit: I didn't see your post Dragon, sorry. But you want to chain someone down, keep them zombiefied and have someone under constant survalience for two years because there is a possibility that they might get better? That is cruel and unusual. How would you feel in that person's shoes?
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#203

AzemOcram
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Posted 04 June 2012 - 08:43 PM

People are against it because it ends a human life. Personally, I don't care.

--AzemOcram, I discovered signatures!
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Always do your best and you will always be better than the best in my eyes.

#204

nickrrr
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Posted 05 June 2012 - 06:48 AM

Hmm, i didn't make it all the way through all 11 pages however my thoughts so far:

It really depends on your views of life.
To me life has no value or meaning. Does that make me a nihilist? sure by definition, however it does not make me pessimistic or depressed.  I am curious how many of you have had suicidal thoughts, how often, and to what extent.

View PostDragonvoid, on 04 June 2012 - 05:12 AM, said:

What I want is for people to find a way to be happy and fulfilled in life.
Me too, However sadly i believe that is becoming harder and harder due to the evolution of society and man kind.

Of course much of this discussion is also based on your view on afterlife, spirituality and other influential subjects.
I am only annoyed by people who can not identify their own bias, for example: I would not discuss suicide in japan where it is often more honorable than life with a disgruntled teenager in suburbia. These two cultures are immensely different, just as religion and beliefs can dictate your opinions on topics. Although like many have said who am i to asses anything other than my own life and experiences.

Life is beautiful and no one should ever take their own life. However life is not so happy or perfect as we can perceive it.

Questions:

Thoughts on Euthanasia/Self-Assisted Suicide?
If one was to pass legally sane would you permit them to end their own life?

I had been thinking about this topic recently and you inspired me to read up a little bit on the history of suicide and the psychological aspects behind it.

#205

stuntdude
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Posted 05 June 2012 - 07:05 PM

View Postfetusthebard, on 04 June 2012 - 07:45 PM, said:

Also, my family would not care one way or the other. So whatever with all that family bullcrap.
People don't realize how much they need something until it's gone. Thinking your family doesn't care about you is a common delusion, and a common factor in suicide. But the fact is that it's just that; a delusion. People who commit suicide on a whim aren't stupid people, but they are BEING stupid. No one should make that choice until they've truly thought through all the factors.

And this isn't to anyone in particular, but I just have to say, people who call suicide "the coward's way out" are complete fucking morons. Who are you to say it's the coward's way out when it's the ONLY way out? If you can find me a "brave" way to exit life, I'll be amazed.

View PostOmegaLambda, on 18 January 2012 - 10:40 PM, said:

With science, evidence comes before explanation. With religion, explanation comes before evidence.

#206

MrRatermat

Posted 05 June 2012 - 07:17 PM

Suicide can be looked on at many different perspectives - for example:

One may suicide to relieve the pains of a permanent terminal or mental illness.


One may suicide because they feel they are 'sad' or 'forever alone'.



#207

Dragonvoid
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Posted 06 June 2012 - 03:40 AM

View Postfetusthebard, on 04 June 2012 - 07:45 PM, said:



Edit: I didn't see your post Dragon, sorry. But you want to chain someone down, keep them zombiefied and have someone under constant survalience for two years because there is a possibility that they might get better? That is cruel and unusual. How would you feel in that person's shoes?

If you are going to debate with me, I would appreciate if you would respond to my actual words and not invent things.  I never once suggested we force treatment on people.  However, I am certainly not going to encourage people to kill themselves, nor would I support physician assisted suicide for emotional problems.
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#208

fetusthebard
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Posted 06 June 2012 - 07:59 PM

View PostDragonvoid, on 06 June 2012 - 03:40 AM, said:

If you are going to debate with me, I would appreciate if you would respond to my actual words and not invent things.  I never once suggested we force treatment on people.  However, I am certainly not going to encourage people to kill themselves, nor would I support physician assisted suicide for emotional problems.
I would like to know how I took your words out of context. You specifically stated "They can hold on for two more years." Did you want me to believe that they could do that without being A. Strapped down B. Medicated C. Under surveillance? How would you regulate them being happy? The world is spitting on them.  
Your also making a misconception about encouragement for suicide. I am not encouraging anyone to commit suicide. Life is too beautiful for that. However, I want a more peaceful way out for those that have a reason to commit suicide. I don't want pills that make me a zombie, I don't want my brain to be tampered with, I want to be happy again. Ignorance is NOT bliss.
As per the last point, why? Is that really your decision? It's the individuals decision. Unless that person happens to land from their roof onto your car, which wouldn't happen in physician assisted suicide.
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#209

fetusthebard
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Posted 06 June 2012 - 08:04 PM

View Poststuntdude, on 05 June 2012 - 07:05 PM, said:

People don't realize how much they need something until it's gone. Thinking your family doesn't care about you is a common delusion, and a common factor in suicide. But the fact is that it's just that; a delusion.
Unless it's not and they literally do not give a damn. Then it's not a delusion.
My attempted suicide was not influenced by my family. At that point I didn't care anymore. The only person I did care about was my sister. And she was what stopped my the first time. In this case, the delusion would be believing that they cared.
Edit: Whoops, sorry for th double post. Just realized it.
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#210

FillyRarity
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Posted 06 June 2012 - 08:11 PM

Its just not a nice thing to do. A. You leave a corpse that some poor soul has to move and B. you leave all your loved ones behind with nothing but a note and a decaying body.

Fear me, for I am cheese.


#211

Megaboy088
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Posted 06 June 2012 - 08:21 PM

View PostFillyRarity, on 06 June 2012 - 08:11 PM, said:

Its just not a nice thing to do. A. You leave a corpse that some poor soul has to move and B. you leave all your loved ones behind with nothing but a note and a decaying body.
That is irrelevant and does not prevent anyone from being suicidal.  This topic isn't about discussing what's "nice" and what isn't.

#212

stuntdude
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Posted 06 June 2012 - 08:24 PM

View PostMegaboy088, on 06 June 2012 - 08:21 PM, said:

That is irrelevant and does not prevent anyone from being suicidal.  This topic isn't about discussing what's "nice" and what isn't.
I'm pretty sure the topic's not about trying to prevent suicide. There's another, separate thread for that.

View PostOmegaLambda, on 18 January 2012 - 10:40 PM, said:

With science, evidence comes before explanation. With religion, explanation comes before evidence.

#213

fetusthebard
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Posted 06 June 2012 - 08:31 PM

View Poststuntdude, on 06 June 2012 - 08:24 PM, said:

I'm pretty sure the topic's not about trying to prevent suicide. There's another, separate thread for that.
^^ My thread Posted Image

But Filly, that won't be what happens if physician assisted suicide was a reality. First off, your family would probably know. Second, the body wouldn't be ugly or decaying or anything, it would be just like putting dogs to sleep (so sad to see Posted Image ). Finally, the physician would probably have the body removed. But the person who removes the body would be used to it. Like the people that perform autopsies.
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#214

Apogle
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Posted 06 June 2012 - 09:44 PM

People hate suicide because it's a Permanent Action to "Solve" Temporary Problem. The one who committed it might be loved among others. You ALWAYS Have something to live for.

And also:

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#215

BC_Programming
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Posted 07 June 2012 - 12:19 AM

View PostIsaac_x, on 18 May 2012 - 11:10 AM, said:

If someone wants to take their own life, then why is that bad or 'sick'? You can call them selfish or heroes, why do people insist on hating it?
Because it's final.

You cannot change your mind after you kill yourself, and if somebody commits suicide there is no way to know if they would have. Typically such thoughts are spurned on by emotional distress or trauma; or something similar.

Now if a person is really really old, I could understand it; say a 90 year old who needs constant dialysis and whatnot. In that case, they have already lived their life. However, at the same time, Usually when you get to be that age you "die when you want to" if that makes sense. Usually older married couples die within a relatively short time of one another, simply because the surviving spouse no longer really has a reason to live in most cases. It's all about mindset as much in that case as any other. The issue with younger people doing it is two things: Adolescent emotional stability that often inflates emotion to absurd degrees, and things like mid-life crises that do the same.


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Says everybody else is living a wonderful life and that you live an awful one
Life is what you make it. Some could argue for the idea that a person's "bad luck" could cause them to be homeless,  but usually the real factor is the person themselves or inaction. So many people spend their lives blaming other people for their mistakes and failures that they sometimes never realize that there is only one person that was there with them the entire time- themselves. These types of people usually spend their lives falling down a spiral staircase of loathing and self-doubt.

What we are saying is not that we should help these people break their neck on those stairs. We are suggesting that what they need is to be encouraged to grab the rail.

#216

fetusthebard
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Posted 07 June 2012 - 02:54 AM

View PostBC_Programming, on 07 June 2012 - 12:19 AM, said:

-snip-
You're funny, you know that? You are aware that there are unpreventable cases that we can not forsee, and have philosophies much like mine, but you have the exact opposite opinion. Lolwut?

The usually sometimes and almost always's in your post reflect that assisted suicide is useful in some cases, yet as far as I know you don't support it. Hm.

Apogle, please go and read through this post to see how badly you need to facepalm.
P.S, It's really bad.
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#217

Dragonvoid
  • Location: You can't enter heaven unless Jesus enters you.

Posted 07 June 2012 - 03:45 AM

View Postfetusthebard, on 06 June 2012 - 07:59 PM, said:

I would like to know how I took your words out of context. You specifically stated "They can hold on for two more years." Did you want me to believe that they could do that without being A. Strapped down B. Medicated C. Under surveillance? How would you regulate them being happy? The world is spitting on them.

You encourage them to live by showing love and support, and you encourage them to seek help.  People don't want to die; they just want to feel better.  Believe it or not, it is possible to change your own outlook on life and improve your mood just through your own will.

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don't want pills that make me a zombie, I don't want my brain to be tampered with, I want to be happy again. Ignorance is NOT bliss.

This sounds to me like you are encouraging suicide without trying all other options beforehand. There is nothing wrong with taking medication, and anti-depressants have be shown to regrow neurons.  I don't know what you mean by tampering with brains.  They don't do lobotomies anymore, though to treat a mental illness, by default you have to "tamper"  with the brain.


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As per the last point, why? Is that really your decision? It's the individuals decision. Unless that person happens to land from their roof onto your car, which wouldn't happen in physician assisted suicide.

It is my decision as a registered voter to support politicians and laws that reflect what I believe is correct, and I don't believe it is ever correct to assist someone in suicide for emotional reasons.  People should be encouraged to live, not die, because death is utterly final.
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#218

Scent_Tree
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Posted 07 June 2012 - 04:34 AM

Anti-depressants don't make you a "zombie", that sounds more like what depression does.

#219

Netherack Creeper

Posted 07 June 2012 - 04:36 AM

View PostApogle, on 06 June 2012 - 09:44 PM, said:

People hate suicide because it's a Permanent Action to "Solve" Temporary Problem. The one who committed it might be loved among others. You ALWAYS Have something to live for.

And also:

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Yolo?
Does that say Yolo?

#220

Yourself
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Posted 07 June 2012 - 04:36 AM

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Believe it or not, it is possible to change your own outlook on life and improve your mood just through your own will.

Not always.  It frequently takes the support of others or professional help to fix the problem.  In even more extreme cases medication may be required.
Never attribute to malice what can adequately be explained by incompetence.