The idea of a high tide and low tide in the game would be very cool, though i dont know how it would be implemented. During low tide, areas such as submerged cave could be explored. High tide would just be normal sea level becuase if it were to go any higher...well then it wouldnt be sea level and it could flood very fast. Scince the sun and the moon both change very frequently, the change from high to low tide (or low to high tide) would be very fast, this is the only problem i see with this.
OT: I don't really know... Sounds pretty impossible with day and night are changing so fast.
yah, thats that thing....
notch would have to change things just to add another, but many things could come from this idea.
also, i just realized that it would be hard to determine what is an ocean and what isnt. could just be a very big lake...
No, I agree that this couldn't work like real tides.
How about this: the tide changes by one block a day. So, if the range between high and low tide is six blocks (high = +3, low = -3) then the entire cycle (normal, high, normal, low, normal) would take twelve days.
Full Cycle.............12 Minecraft Days.....4 hours
High to Low *...........6 Minecraft Days.....2 hours
Normal to High **......3 Minecraft Days.....1 hour
*This is also "Normal to Normal".
**This is also "Normal to Low", "High to Normal" and "Low to Normal".
A range of six blocks seems a huge distance though. That is three times the hight of the player. Even a range of four blocks (high = +2, low = -2) is twice the hight of the player and still large.
I thought a range of two blocks (high = +1, low = -1) would be more realistic, but this is Minecraft. Do we want realistic?
How about we let people choose. Tide amplitude could be toggled with a slider bar. They could pick the tide ranging from zero (high = 0, low = 0) to six (high = +3, low = -3). And not only would they pick the amplitude of the tide, but the duration of the entire cycle as well. If they wanted they could make a two block tide take 12 days or a six block tide take four.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
This...all of this...is just....wonky!
---Some excellent MC mods: Better Than Wolves Mod, OptiFine, Solar Apocalypse, ModLoader --- Best Maps Ever: VECHS' SUPER HOSTILE SERIES
--Create a second type of water (small bodies of water are not effected by tides, such as ponds, puddles, wells, irrigation, etc)
--Figure out how the two types of water interact (what happens if your irrigation connected to the ocean?)
--Figure out how one type of water turns into the other (a bucket of "ocean" water should not be affected by the tides when dumped elsewhere)
--Figure out how the water flows when rising after having fallen (if one-block-deep water drops, it becomes nothing. When the water rises again, there's nothing left to rise into that newly empty spot)
--Completely change where each type of water spawns when generating a map (how would the game know where to generate each type of water?)
And all just to make the water change height a little.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Quote from Berginator94 »
I'm almost 100% positive that this have been suggested before but i'll suggest it again anyways
--Create a second type of water (small bodies of water are not effected by tides, such as ponds, puddles, wells, irrigation, etc)
--Figure out how the two types of water interact (what happens if your irrigation connected to the ocean?)
--Figure out how one type of water turns into the other (a bucket of "ocean" water should not be affected by the tides when dumped elsewhere)
--Figure out how the water flows when rising after having fallen (if one-block-deep water drops, it becomes nothing. When the water rises again, there's nothing left to rise into that newly empty spot)
--Completely change where each type of water spawns when generating a map (how would the game know where to generate each type of water?)
And all just to make the water change height a little.
Well...
None of these sound like earth shattering problems.
I think the result would be a more immersive and more dynamic Minecraft. It would change the way people think about exploring and where and how to settle.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
This...all of this...is just....wonky!
---Some excellent MC mods: Better Than Wolves Mod, OptiFine, Solar Apocalypse, ModLoader --- Best Maps Ever: VECHS' SUPER HOSTILE SERIES
--Create a second type of water (small bodies of water are not effected by tides, such as ponds, puddles, wells, irrigation, etc)
--Figure out how the two types of water interact (what happens if your irrigation connected to the ocean?)
--Figure out how one type of water turns into the other (a bucket of "ocean" water should not be affected by the tides when dumped elsewhere)
--Figure out how the water flows when rising after having fallen (if one-block-deep water drops, it becomes nothing. When the water rises again, there's nothing left to rise into that newly empty spot)
--Completely change where each type of water spawns when generating a map (how would the game know where to generate each type of water?)
And all just to make the water change height a little.
Well...
None of these sound like earth shattering problems.
I think the result would be a more immersive and more dynamic Minecraft. It would change the way people think about exploring and where and how to settle.
Changing almost every aspect of the coding for one of the core features of Minecraft geography doesn't seem like a problem to you?
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Quote from Berginator94 »
I'm almost 100% positive that this have been suggested before but i'll suggest it again anyways
--Create a second type of water (small bodies of water are not effected by tides, such as ponds, puddles, wells, irrigation, etc)
--Figure out how the two types of water interact (what happens if your irrigation connected to the ocean?)
--Figure out how one type of water turns into the other (a bucket of "ocean" water should not be affected by the tides when dumped elsewhere)
--Figure out how the water flows when rising after having fallen (if one-block-deep water drops, it becomes nothing. When the water rises again, there's nothing left to rise into that newly empty spot)
--Completely change where each type of water spawns when generating a map (how would the game know where to generate each type of water?)
And all just to make the water change height a little.
Well...
None of these sound like earth shattering problems.
I think the result would be a more immersive and more dynamic Minecraft. It would change the way people think about exploring and where and how to settle.
Changing almost every aspect of the coding for one of the core features of Minecraft geography doesn't seem like a problem to you?
Hold on.
First let me admit I am no programmer.
It's just the logic seems pretty straight forward and most of these elements already exist in the game in one form or another.
--Create a second type of water (small bodies of water are not effected by tides, such as ponds, puddles, wells, irrigation, etc)
This is Minecraft. We create another block type and call it "Ocean". So, we have "Water" and "Ocean". "Water" continues to behave the same. "Ocean" will need a more aggressive form of flooding like the water in Classic, but (and I don't know how big this but is) it will also have to be able to increase and decrease in volume.
--Figure out how the two types of water interact (what happens if your irrigation connected to the ocean?)
--Figure out how one type of water turns into the other (a bucket of "ocean" water should not be affected by the tides when dumped elsewhere)
This idea actually already exists rather well in the form of redstone wire. "Ocean" is redstone wire "on" and "Water" is redstone wire "off". We would never see "Ocean" in our inventory, because when we pick it up in a bucket it gets disconnected and turns "off".
--Figure out how the water flows when rising after having fallen (if one-block-deep water drops, it becomes nothing. When the water rises again, there's nothing left to rise into that newly empty spot)
Simply put, it doesn't. When "Ocean" high tide flows into a previously non-flooded area the area will flood with "Ocean" blocks. When the tide goes out a pool of "Water" is left when the connection to "Ocean" is broken, and it will cease having tides until connection with "Ocean" is reestablished.
--Completely change where each type of water spawns when generating a map (how would the game know where to generate each type of water?)
Well, surely Notch didn't back himself into a corner where he cannot add any new types of blocks. I mean for carps sake he figured out how to implement a volumetric density field to randomly generate terrain. This is the guy who brought you Minecraft.
It can be even simpler than that. If we continue to follow the redstone wire analogy we could have a "Tide block". The map generator could place a "Tide block" at the bottom of any "large enough" body of "Water" (redstone wire "off") activating it into "Ocean" (redstone wire "on").
So, if you really wanted you could go find a "Tide stone" and give tides to the little lake you created on top of the mountain. Of course I see issues with flooding of the entire landscape in this scenario, but that is just tweaking the rules of "Ocean".
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
This...all of this...is just....wonky!
---Some excellent MC mods: Better Than Wolves Mod, OptiFine, Solar Apocalypse, ModLoader --- Best Maps Ever: VECHS' SUPER HOSTILE SERIES
Hahahah, what if I place a block of water by my house, and after 3 days my house is full of water :ohmy.gif:
Just kidding lol, good idea if notch(or jeb) can make a good system for it!
See, I think this could work. Right now in survival mode the only environmental threats are lava and falling (I don't consider mobs environmental). Tides could add an extra environmental danger.
Tides would also make coastal and island exploration dramatically different.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
This...all of this...is just....wonky!
---Some excellent MC mods: Better Than Wolves Mod, OptiFine, Solar Apocalypse, ModLoader --- Best Maps Ever: VECHS' SUPER HOSTILE SERIES
To prevent and accidental (or intentional) flooding of the entire Minecraft world "Ocean" blocks can only exist/activate at sea level or below. Then it wouldn't matter where "Tide stones" are placed.
(Nuh-uh! Shut up! This isn't a bump!)
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
This...all of this...is just....wonky!
---Some excellent MC mods: Better Than Wolves Mod, OptiFine, Solar Apocalypse, ModLoader --- Best Maps Ever: VECHS' SUPER HOSTILE SERIES
This is Minecraft. We create another block type and call it "Ocean". So, we have "Water" and "Ocean". "Water" continues to behave the same. "Ocean" will need a more aggressive form of flooding like the water in Classic, but (and I don't know how big this but is) it will also have to be able to increase and decrease in volume.
You still need to handle a few more cases.
Case 1: When do "water" become "ocean", and "ocean" become "water"?
Case 2: How do you determine what's "ocean" and what's "water"? (In short, the question is similar to case 1, what kind of logic can you use to describe whether a block of water should be an "ocean" or just "water").
Remember, what's intuitive for you isn't always so for computer (without incurring a massive performance penalty).
This is Minecraft. We create another block type and call it "Ocean". So, we have "Water" and "Ocean". "Water" continues to behave the same. "Ocean" will need a more aggressive form of flooding like the water in Classic, but (and I don't know how big this but is) it will also have to be able to increase and decrease in volume.
You still need to handle a few more cases.
Case 1: When do "water" become "ocean", and "ocean" become "water"?
Case 2: How do you determine what's "ocean" and what's "water"? (In short, the question is similar to case 1, what kind of logic can you use to describe whether a block of water should be an "ocean" or just "water").
Remember, what's intuitive for you isn't always so for computer (without incurring a massive performance penalty).
Well...I did...
I just explained them earlier, further up the page.
I actually thought I handled those cases quite nicely.
Edit/I was wrong. I explained it further down that post from which you quoted.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
This...all of this...is just....wonky!
---Some excellent MC mods: Better Than Wolves Mod, OptiFine, Solar Apocalypse, ModLoader --- Best Maps Ever: VECHS' SUPER HOSTILE SERIES
Thoughts? ideas?
yah, thats that thing....
notch would have to change things just to add another, but many things could come from this idea.
also, i just realized that it would be hard to determine what is an ocean and what isnt. could just be a very big lake...
No, I agree that this couldn't work like real tides.
How about this: the tide changes by one block a day. So, if the range between high and low tide is six blocks (high = +3, low = -3) then the entire cycle (normal, high, normal, low, normal) would take twelve days.
Full Cycle.............12 Minecraft Days.....4 hours
High to Low *...........6 Minecraft Days.....2 hours
Normal to High **......3 Minecraft Days.....1 hour
*This is also "Normal to Normal".
**This is also "Normal to Low", "High to Normal" and "Low to Normal".
A range of six blocks seems a huge distance though. That is three times the hight of the player. Even a range of four blocks (high = +2, low = -2) is twice the hight of the player and still large.
I thought a range of two blocks (high = +1, low = -1) would be more realistic, but this is Minecraft. Do we want realistic?
How about we let people choose. Tide amplitude could be toggled with a slider bar. They could pick the tide ranging from zero (high = 0, low = 0) to six (high = +3, low = -3). And not only would they pick the amplitude of the tide, but the duration of the entire cycle as well. If they wanted they could make a two block tide take 12 days or a six block tide take four.
---Some excellent MC mods: Better Than Wolves Mod, OptiFine, Solar Apocalypse, ModLoader --- Best Maps Ever: VECHS' SUPER HOSTILE SERIES
--Create a second type of water (small bodies of water are not effected by tides, such as ponds, puddles, wells, irrigation, etc)
--Figure out how the two types of water interact (what happens if your irrigation connected to the ocean?)
--Figure out how one type of water turns into the other (a bucket of "ocean" water should not be affected by the tides when dumped elsewhere)
--Figure out how the water flows when rising after having fallen (if one-block-deep water drops, it becomes nothing. When the water rises again, there's nothing left to rise into that newly empty spot)
--Completely change where each type of water spawns when generating a map (how would the game know where to generate each type of water?)
And all just to make the water change height a little.
Well...
None of these sound like earth shattering problems.
I think the result would be a more immersive and more dynamic Minecraft. It would change the way people think about exploring and where and how to settle.
---Some excellent MC mods: Better Than Wolves Mod, OptiFine, Solar Apocalypse, ModLoader --- Best Maps Ever: VECHS' SUPER HOSTILE SERIES
Changing almost every aspect of the coding for one of the core features of Minecraft geography doesn't seem like a problem to you?
Hold on.
First let me admit I am no programmer.
It's just the logic seems pretty straight forward and most of these elements already exist in the game in one form or another.
This is Minecraft. We create another block type and call it "Ocean". So, we have "Water" and "Ocean". "Water" continues to behave the same. "Ocean" will need a more aggressive form of flooding like the water in Classic, but (and I don't know how big this but is) it will also have to be able to increase and decrease in volume.
This idea actually already exists rather well in the form of redstone wire. "Ocean" is redstone wire "on" and "Water" is redstone wire "off". We would never see "Ocean" in our inventory, because when we pick it up in a bucket it gets disconnected and turns "off".
Simply put, it doesn't. When "Ocean" high tide flows into a previously non-flooded area the area will flood with "Ocean" blocks. When the tide goes out a pool of "Water" is left when the connection to "Ocean" is broken, and it will cease having tides until connection with "Ocean" is reestablished.
Well, surely Notch didn't back himself into a corner where he cannot add any new types of blocks. I mean for carps sake he figured out how to implement a volumetric density field to randomly generate terrain. This is the guy who brought you Minecraft.
It can be even simpler than that. If we continue to follow the redstone wire analogy we could have a "Tide block". The map generator could place a "Tide block" at the bottom of any "large enough" body of "Water" (redstone wire "off") activating it into "Ocean" (redstone wire "on").
So, if you really wanted you could go find a "Tide stone" and give tides to the little lake you created on top of the mountain. Of course I see issues with flooding of the entire landscape in this scenario, but that is just tweaking the rules of "Ocean".
---Some excellent MC mods: Better Than Wolves Mod, OptiFine, Solar Apocalypse, ModLoader --- Best Maps Ever: VECHS' SUPER HOSTILE SERIES
Just kidding lol, good idea if notch(or jeb) can make a good system for it!
Tides would also make coastal and island exploration dramatically different.
---Some excellent MC mods: Better Than Wolves Mod, OptiFine, Solar Apocalypse, ModLoader --- Best Maps Ever: VECHS' SUPER HOSTILE SERIES
To prevent and accidental (or intentional) flooding of the entire Minecraft world "Ocean" blocks can only exist/activate at sea level or below. Then it wouldn't matter where "Tide stones" are placed.
(Nuh-uh! Shut up! This isn't a bump!)
---Some excellent MC mods: Better Than Wolves Mod, OptiFine, Solar Apocalypse, ModLoader --- Best Maps Ever: VECHS' SUPER HOSTILE SERIES
You still need to handle a few more cases.
Case 1: When do "water" become "ocean", and "ocean" become "water"?
Case 2: How do you determine what's "ocean" and what's "water"? (In short, the question is similar to case 1, what kind of logic can you use to describe whether a block of water should be an "ocean" or just "water").
Remember, what's intuitive for you isn't always so for computer (without incurring a massive performance penalty).
Well...I did...
I just explained them earlier, further up the page.
I actually thought I handled those cases quite nicely.
Edit/I was wrong. I explained it further down that post from which you quoted.
---Some excellent MC mods: Better Than Wolves Mod, OptiFine, Solar Apocalypse, ModLoader --- Best Maps Ever: VECHS' SUPER HOSTILE SERIES