Unfortunately, in the real world, even competence can be too much to ask for. I also did say "If you have a problem with the person you're paired up with, by all means talk to the teacher". I'm just pointing out that forced group work is not the problem, nor is forced group work with people you aren't best buddies with the problem. The problem is the unwillingness of some students to work, but schools need to get those students working rather than just leaving the already incredibly antisocial children of today's world in their happy little comfort zones where they can all work at their own pace with no interference, smell the flowers and hug bunny rabbits.
9 times out of 10, my teacher/professor has said something along the lines of 'deal with it.' However, one of my friend's instructors has a flawlesss system for group work by pairing people based on their grades (highest grades in the same group, lowest grades in the same group.) Complaints dropped immediately about group members doing nothing (except in the low scoring groups, but their complaint only came after they found out the day of presentations that their group members had done nothing).
The 1 of 10 times that they did switch groups for me was theoretically perfect - we had a guy in our group of four who did almost nothing, and another group of four had three people who did nothing, and my friend who sacrificed about forty hours per week to do labs. We finally got a switch negotiated for the final project, their group of three (one dropped out a day after the switch on the premise of having to do work since my friend wasn't doing the lab for them anymore) started their lab two days before the final presentation. We spent over two weeks testing, analyzing, writing, rewriting, researching (about 200 hours between all of us) and we nailed the presentation (where they got torn up).
......We got an 81. They got an 83. I'm beyond confused
Group work is absolutely necessary - but it also allows lazy people to breeze by and harder working people to get taken advantage of.
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And who are you, the proud lord said, that I must bow so low?
Only a cat of a different coat, that's all the truth I know.
In a coat of gold or a coat of red, a lion still has claws,
And mine are long and sharp, my lord, as long and sharp as yours.
And so he spoke, and so he spoke, that lord of Castamere,
But now the rains weep o'er his hall, with no one there to hear.
Yes now the rains weep o'er his hall, and not a soul to hear.
I wish people would stop complaining about 'forced' group work. If you have a problem with the person you're paired up with, by all means talk to the teacher, but don't dismiss the entire concept.
Sorry kids, in the real world you're gonna have to learn to work with other people, and those other people aren't always going to be your best friends. And the point of school is to teach you how to handle yourself in the real world. As much as I think it fails to do that in a lot of ways, forced group work is not one of them.
Wow that's not condescending or unnecessary at all. So if it's something we have to deal with? We can't complain about it?
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
The Unofficial Suggestion Guide - Everything you need to know to not make goofy mistakes in a suggestion! Honestly though, you should really go there.
Wow that's not condescending or unnecessary at all. So if it's something we have to deal with? We can't complain about it?
You're perfectly entitled to disagree with the system's opinions and talk about how you don't like them. But that just means I'm perfectly entitled to disagree with your opinions and talk about how I don't like them. There is a subtle irony here. I didn't make this thread so we could all rant, I made this thread so we can have a discussion.
You're perfectly entitled to disagree with the system's opinions and talk about how you don't like them. But that just means I'm perfectly entitled to disagree with your opinions and talk about how I don't like them. There is a subtle irony here. I didn't make this thread so we could all rant, I made this thread so we can have a discussion.
In threads titled "Things you hate about ______", there's absolutely no way you're not gonna have rants.
I had a fat 4th grade teacher who was an extreme feminazi. She even openly said that no matter what was happening between a boy and girl, it's "always the boys' fault no matter what." This led to a lot of guys being forced to apologize for things even though they were on the victimized side.
I had an 8th grade math teacher that was so incompetent at teaching that she rushed everything. The highest grade any kid had in her class was a C. She would break protocols and teach 2 chapters of something at once, which caused her to "double up" on homework. Because of my luck, she gets fired after the year I have her.
Teachers that seem to be more of bullies than almost any student. I get that you want to discipline a kid for not turning in his homework, but you don't need to push the issue so far that you verbally destroy him in front of everyone.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Yeah, that guy in the avatar is me. I'm *that* strange. It happens. Sometimes people act like that. Just go with it. I can offer help with suggestions even before you post them - NOT make your suggestions - but help you with them.
Teachers that seem to be more of bullies than almost any student. I get that you want to discipline a kid for not turning in his homework, but you don't need to push the issue so far that you verbally destroy him in front of everyone.
I think the only punishment you can put on a student for not doing their homework is simply a bad grade for not doing it. You don't need to do anything hasty, the student will struggle to get a good grade because they simply do not care, and they will eventually learn from that. At least that's how it works in my school, and you have no idea how many people get bad grades for not doing work.
Teachers that seem to be more of bullies than almost any student. I get that you want to discipline a kid for not turning in his homework, but you don't need to push the issue so far that you verbally destroy him in front of everyone.
I had teachers who would get very angry if kids didn't turn in their homework. She would go on a rant on how disrespectful they are being. But before class, she would just sit around in the hallway, completely oblivious to what kids were doing. Kids would make youtube videos and do crazy stunts.
There was one teacher who was usually really nice, but any little thing and she will erupt into a boiling rage. I didn't have pencil so I wrote in pen, then she went insane and started screaming at me. When ever I walk into the class, I see her collection animal skeletons, snakes and reptiles; so she might really be insane.
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Let me know if my posts are helpful or if you like them. That's what I'm here for.
I am currently lurking more than I am posting. I haven't gone anywhere.
"This one kid here is disrupting the class, so I'm gonna punish the whole class by giving you all more homework because of just one person!"
Thanks Mr. Nonthinker, you're a very rational teacher. I mean you couldn't just punish the one kid? Augh, I swear I never understand the thought process set up for themselves.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Yeah, that guy in the avatar is me. I'm *that* strange. It happens. Sometimes people act like that. Just go with it. I can offer help with suggestions even before you post them - NOT make your suggestions - but help you with them.
I know this have been dead for over a year now, but I need to mention this.
In my school, we had co-curiculum(at least that's what I though it's spelled) after our school session only on Tuesday. This "programme" isn't that bad, but guess what?
Since my school has several different clubs dedicated to different role, of course the teachers had to randomize which club we must be in. Why this? If I am capable of patching up wounds better than those in Young Doctor Club, why must I be in a club completely related to my own country which consists of mainly dumb people when I 100% rightfully deserves to be in Young Doctor Club. You aren't even allowed to change, except for after a year.
Also, I'm still already interested in that club. Of course, I had to join in a club that I completely dislike. It also barely taught me anything. The only thing I learned is how to waste your time in a boring way, while those in Young Doctor Club, including some of my ally/friends and that one and only girl that I like(other girl, I find them annoying) get to learn epic stuff such as how to take good care of your health, infections, and even looking at some sample of microorganism!
Heck, the worst that my school could do and still not waste my time is to at least do some epic activity only to realize it was pointless. Heck, at least you are rewarded with you being "exercising."
And to make those matter worse, why this elementary school had to randomize students? Because there's like 700+ student? Guess what? The closest middle school has over thousand of student, yet you still get to choose? Why that?
The fact that it doesn't prepare you for life and changes facts to fit a narrative.
I Wouldn't generalize,some knowledge found there is indeed useful, but schools should achieve to make the students learn how was that knowledge obtained and the implications and foundations on said methodology.
The problem is that education is filled with political issues that most of the time make he students unable of developing a good judgement of things.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Doesn't matter what the press says. Doesn't matter what the politicians or the mobs say. Doesn't matter if the whole country decides that something wrong is something right. This nation was founded on one principle above all else: the requirement that we stand up for what we believe, no matter the odds or the consequences. When the mob and the press and the whole world tell you to move, your job is to plant yourself like a tree beside the river of truth, and tell the whole world — "No, you move
Now, I've been homeschooled my entire life, so I can only guess what public school is like from Boy Scout camps and what people tell me. But I can assume at least someone else has experienced this:
Were you ever interested in a certain subject, and wanted to get good grades in it for either a helpful reward in your education (a scholarship, or a merit badge in this case) or you just wanted to learn the subject for fun? But, sadly, everyone else forced into the classroom wants to work against you?
My Boy Scout troop actually teaches the First Aid merit badge to scouts with nothing better to do every 3 months or so, and I was tired of listening to people teach it to me, so I decided to take First Aid at my Boy Scout summer camp. However, little did I know that another troop decided it was a smart plan to put all of the young scouts who were uninterested in the subject into the First Aid class.
Calling them immature would have been an understatement. The teacher, who I feel sorry for, having to teach a bunch of young, immature, pre-pubescent kids all day, taught us by telling us a story where someone got physically injured somehow, and asked questions on how we would help him. But the kids were less interested in answering the questions so as to get the Merit Badge, instead they were interested in making the story as physically violent as possible. (I assume that these people are the audience of the Michael Bay Transformers movies...)
Come to think of it, I think I only needed to get CPR certified and fully prepare a first-aid kit after doing a First Aid teaching session in my Troop to actually get the Merit Badge, and I was just too lazy to get either of those done again. I'm not really sure why I thought going to my camp to do exactly what my troop does would help me.
(I'll also note that this took place a year ago, I was 14 and most of the kids there were around 11. So I imagine unless you were a mature 12 year-old, you probably didn't have to deal with this too much in a school that splits you up into age groups.)
But anyway, that's my slightly-school related story, seeing as Boy Scout summer camp is one of the closest things to school to me.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
My avatar is a texture from a small block game I made in Python. It's not very good and it probably won't work if you install it.
I'm very alone in my Minecraft worlds as I don't have a very good internet connection to run a server. If you're like me, you might be interested in my Posse mod suggestion.
9 times out of 10, my teacher/professor has said something along the lines of 'deal with it.' However, one of my friend's instructors has a flawlesss system for group work by pairing people based on their grades (highest grades in the same group, lowest grades in the same group.) Complaints dropped immediately about group members doing nothing (except in the low scoring groups, but their complaint only came after they found out the day of presentations that their group members had done nothing).
The 1 of 10 times that they did switch groups for me was theoretically perfect - we had a guy in our group of four who did almost nothing, and another group of four had three people who did nothing, and my friend who sacrificed about forty hours per week to do labs. We finally got a switch negotiated for the final project, their group of three (one dropped out a day after the switch on the premise of having to do work since my friend wasn't doing the lab for them anymore) started their lab two days before the final presentation. We spent over two weeks testing, analyzing, writing, rewriting, researching (about 200 hours between all of us) and we nailed the presentation (where they got torn up).
......We got an 81. They got an 83. I'm beyond confused
Group work is absolutely necessary - but it also allows lazy people to breeze by and harder working people to get taken advantage of.
And who are you, the proud lord said, that I must bow so low?
Only a cat of a different coat, that's all the truth I know.
In a coat of gold or a coat of red, a lion still has claws,
And mine are long and sharp, my lord, as long and sharp as yours.
And so he spoke, and so he spoke, that lord of Castamere,
But now the rains weep o'er his hall, with no one there to hear.
Yes now the rains weep o'er his hall, and not a soul to hear.
Wow that's not condescending or unnecessary at all. So if it's something we have to deal with? We can't complain about it?
The Unofficial Suggestion Guide - Everything you need to know to not make goofy mistakes in a suggestion! Honestly though, you should really go there.
You're perfectly entitled to disagree with the system's opinions and talk about how you don't like them. But that just means I'm perfectly entitled to disagree with your opinions and talk about how I don't like them. There is a subtle irony here. I didn't make this thread so we could all rant, I made this thread so we can have a discussion.
In threads titled "Things you hate about ______", there's absolutely no way you're not gonna have rants.
Revive.
I had a fat 4th grade teacher who was an extreme feminazi. She even openly said that no matter what was happening between a boy and girl, it's "always the boys' fault no matter what." This led to a lot of guys being forced to apologize for things even though they were on the victimized side.
I had an 8th grade math teacher that was so incompetent at teaching that she rushed everything. The highest grade any kid had in her class was a C. She would break protocols and teach 2 chapters of something at once, which caused her to "double up" on homework. Because of my luck, she gets fired after the year I have her.
Teachers that seem to be more of bullies than almost any student. I get that you want to discipline a kid for not turning in his homework, but you don't need to push the issue so far that you verbally destroy him in front of everyone.
Yeah, that guy in the avatar is me. I'm *that* strange. It happens. Sometimes people act like that. Just go with it. I can offer help with suggestions even before you post them - NOT make your suggestions - but help you with them.
Unofficial Suggestions Guide (2.0) - by Theriasis
Unofficial Critics Guide - by yoshi9048
I think the only punishment you can put on a student for not doing their homework is simply a bad grade for not doing it. You don't need to do anything hasty, the student will struggle to get a good grade because they simply do not care, and they will eventually learn from that. At least that's how it works in my school, and you have no idea how many people get bad grades for not doing work.
I had teachers who would get very angry if kids didn't turn in their homework. She would go on a rant on how disrespectful they are being. But before class, she would just sit around in the hallway, completely oblivious to what kids were doing. Kids would make youtube videos and do crazy stunts.
There was one teacher who was usually really nice, but any little thing and she will erupt into a boiling rage. I didn't have pencil so I wrote in pen, then she went insane and started screaming at me. When ever I walk into the class, I see her collection animal skeletons, snakes and reptiles; so she might really be insane.
"This one kid here is disrupting the class, so I'm gonna punish the whole class by giving you all more homework because of just one person!"
Thanks Mr. Nonthinker, you're a very rational teacher. I mean you couldn't just punish the one kid? Augh, I swear I never understand the thought process set up for themselves.
Yeah, that guy in the avatar is me. I'm *that* strange. It happens. Sometimes people act like that. Just go with it. I can offer help with suggestions even before you post them - NOT make your suggestions - but help you with them.
Unofficial Suggestions Guide (2.0) - by Theriasis
Unofficial Critics Guide - by yoshi9048
I know this have been dead for over a year now, but I need to mention this.
In my school, we had co-curiculum(at least that's what I though it's spelled) after our school session only on Tuesday. This "programme" isn't that bad, but guess what?
Since my school has several different clubs dedicated to different role, of course the teachers had to randomize which club we must be in. Why this? If I am capable of patching up wounds better than those in Young Doctor Club, why must I be in a club completely related to my own country which consists of mainly dumb people when I 100% rightfully deserves to be in Young Doctor Club. You aren't even allowed to change, except for after a year.
Also, I'm still already interested in that club. Of course, I had to join in a club that I completely dislike. It also barely taught me anything. The only thing I learned is how to waste your time in a boring way, while those in Young Doctor Club, including some of my ally/friends and that one and only girl that I like(other girl, I find them annoying) get to learn epic stuff such as how to take good care of your health, infections, and even looking at some sample of microorganism!
Heck, the worst that my school could do and still not waste my time is to at least do some epic activity only to realize it was pointless. Heck, at least you are rewarded with you being "exercising."
And to make those matter worse, why this elementary school had to randomize students? Because there's like 700+ student? Guess what? The closest middle school has over thousand of student, yet you still get to choose? Why that?
The End of my nasty story.
I Wouldn't generalize,some knowledge found there is indeed useful, but schools should achieve to make the students learn how was that knowledge obtained and the implications and foundations on said methodology.
The problem is that education is filled with political issues that most of the time make he students unable of developing a good judgement of things.
Now, I've been homeschooled my entire life, so I can only guess what public school is like from Boy Scout camps and what people tell me. But I can assume at least someone else has experienced this:
Were you ever interested in a certain subject, and wanted to get good grades in it for either a helpful reward in your education (a scholarship, or a merit badge in this case) or you just wanted to learn the subject for fun? But, sadly, everyone else forced into the classroom wants to work against you?
My Boy Scout troop actually teaches the First Aid merit badge to scouts with nothing better to do every 3 months or so, and I was tired of listening to people teach it to me, so I decided to take First Aid at my Boy Scout summer camp. However, little did I know that another troop decided it was a smart plan to put all of the young scouts who were uninterested in the subject into the First Aid class.
Calling them immature would have been an understatement. The teacher, who I feel sorry for, having to teach a bunch of young, immature, pre-pubescent kids all day, taught us by telling us a story where someone got physically injured somehow, and asked questions on how we would help him. But the kids were less interested in answering the questions so as to get the Merit Badge, instead they were interested in making the story as physically violent as possible. (I assume that these people are the audience of the Michael Bay Transformers movies...)
Come to think of it, I think I only needed to get CPR certified and fully prepare a first-aid kit after doing a First Aid teaching session in my Troop to actually get the Merit Badge, and I was just too lazy to get either of those done again. I'm not really sure why I thought going to my camp to do exactly what my troop does would help me.
(I'll also note that this took place a year ago, I was 14 and most of the kids there were around 11. So I imagine unless you were a mature 12 year-old, you probably didn't have to deal with this too much in a school that splits you up into age groups.)
But anyway, that's my slightly-school related story, seeing as Boy Scout summer camp is one of the closest things to school to me.
My avatar is a texture from a small block game I made in Python. It's not very good and it probably won't work if you install it.
I'm very alone in my Minecraft worlds as I don't have a very good internet connection to run a server. If you're like me, you might be interested in my Posse mod suggestion.