The thing with Minecraft (or any other 64-bit game exe) is that it spends a lot of its time making decisions. It doesn't spend a lot of time looping through e.g. 50MB of data, performing one, single operation on each piece. 64-bit doesn't speed up code branches. Not in Java, or any other language.
Care to explain?
So what would, in theory, make MC run faster? From browsing these forums, I've seen people say a powerful CPU won't make it run faster, a powerful GPU won't make it run faster, 64-bit won't make it run faster...so what will?
It all comes down to bottlenecks really, like i said about CPU's most games take little advantage from a better CPU compared to say a better GPU. Minecraft is kinda weird in that regard though it needs a more even mix of CPU and GPU, if you really want to max performance get the highest clocked dual core or higher you can get, like my 2.2ghz quad core doesn't perform super well, i get 60 fps on every view setting except far, on far it can bounce up and down a bit, a 3.0 ghz would be vastly superior.
As for GPU, Minecraft isn't 'super high' on the GPU list, but it does need a relatively modern card, anything in the 100 dollar range would probably run the game fairly well with a high enough clocked CPU, the game just seems to bounce between performances levels as Notch screws with it. RAM can be a big bottleneck too, if you have atleast 3 GB you likely won't get any more performance higher then that with this game.
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It all comes down to bottlenecks really, like i said about CPU's most games take little advantage from a better CPU compared to say a better GPU. Minecraft is kinda weird in that regard though it needs a more even mix of CPU and GPU, if you really want to max performance get the highest clocked dual core or higher you can get, like my 2.2ghz quad core doesn't perform super well, i get 60 fps on every view setting except far, on far it can bounce up and down a bit, a 3.0 ghz would be vastly superior.
As for GPU, Minecraft isn't 'super high' on the GPU list, but it does need a relatively modern card, anything in the 100 dollar range would probably run the game fairly well with a high enough clocked CPU, the game just seems to bounce between performances levels as Notch screws with it. RAM can be a big bottleneck too, if you have atleast 3 GB you likely won't get any more performance higher then that with this game.
Well I'm hoping when ever my 4gb DDR3 arrives (****...if it EVER arrives!) that I'll be able to run it much more smoothly. My GPU seems up to date, and I've got a speedy little dual core, so hopefully this will eliminate my Minecraft bottleneck.
Wasted space? You remind me of people 10 years ago. "Who would ever need A FULL GIG of RAM?"
The only advantage to 64 vs 32 bit is not just "the numbers you can see". I have no idea where you're getting this information but I've posted multiple benchmark tests that blatantly show that 64 bit cpus and 64 bit applications are faster.
"The main disadvantage of 64-bit architectures is that relative to 32-bit architectures, the same data occupies more space in memory (due to swollen pointers and possibly other types and alignment padding). This increases the memory requirements of a given process and can have implications for efficient processor cache utilization"
"Converting application software written in a high-level language from a 32-bit architecture to a 64-bit architecture varies in difficulty" source
"Running some 32 bit applications on a 64 bit OS could actually be slower. The additional overheads in running 32 bit software in 64 bit mode could cause a slight degradation in performance. It will take some time for 64 bit software to become the norm." source
The point I was trying to make was that moving to 64bit in an application might make things a bit faster, it's that for minecraft it's not worth the effort at this time. And that the main reason for moving to 64bit is to make use of the larger address space for dealing with things like more then 4gb of ram or files.
Yes Notch could stop what he is doing and rewrite minecraft to take every advantage of a 64bit architecture as possible and we might see a few fps better performance.
Notch could continue to spend his time improving the logic in the game and make great improvements in performance. A good example of this is the leaf decay issues in the beta release. Some misbehaving code bogs the whole game down.
If minecraft was a mature application that had already been optimized logically as best as possible, then moving to a 64bit realm may be the last place to go to squeeze out that extra bit of performance, but there is a lot of effort in that and in most cases the effort isn't worth the gain. Plus you still would need to support 32bit systems as a lot of windows users are still running 32bit.
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Wasted space? You remind me of people 10 years ago. "Who would ever need A FULL GIG of RAM?"
The only advantage to 64 vs 32 bit is not just "the numbers you can see". I have no idea where you're getting this information but I've posted multiple benchmark tests that blatantly show that 64 bit cpus and 64 bit applications are faster.
"The main disadvantage of 64-bit architectures is that relative to 32-bit architectures, the same data occupies more space in memory (due to swollen pointers and possibly other types and alignment padding). This increases the memory requirements of a given process and can have implications for efficient processor cache utilization"
"Converting application software written in a high-level language from a 32-bit architecture to a 64-bit architecture varies in difficulty" source
"Running some 32 bit applications on a 64 bit OS could actually be slower. The additional overheads in running 32 bit software in 64 bit mode could cause a slight degradation in performance. It will take some time for 64 bit software to become the norm." source
The point I was trying to make was that moving to 64bit in an application might make things a bit faster, it's that for minecraft it's not worth the effort at this time. And that the main reason for moving to 64bit is to make use of the larger address space for dealing with things like more then 4gb of ram or files.
Yes Notch could stop what he is doing and rewrite minecraft to take every advantage of a 64bit architecture as possible and we might see a few fps better performance.
Notch could continue to spend his time improving the logic in the game and make great improvements in performance. A good example of this is the leaf decay issues in the beta release. Some misbehaving code bogs the whole game down.
If minecraft was a mature application that had already been optimized logically as best as possible, then moving to a 64bit realm may be the last place to go to squeeze out that extra bit of performance, but there is a lot of effort in that and in most cases the effort isn't worth the gain. Plus you still would need to support 32bit systems as a lot of windows users are still running 32bit.
Dear god...
As far as every test I can find (yes benchmarks, not something you copied from wikipedia) running 32-bit software on 64-bit hardware is still faster - not that benchmark tests mean anything to you kids on the forums.
Even if it wasn't it wouldn't pertain to me because all the software I'm using is 64-bit minus a few applications. The one's that aren't, I honestly don't notice a thing, nor do I even care enough to think about it.
I never proposed at any point that Notch should totally drop everything he's doing and immediately start coding the game for 64-bit, so I have no idea where you came up with that. Something to think about for the future? Yes.
It all comes down to bottlenecks really, like i said about CPU's most games take little advantage from a better CPU compared to say a better GPU. Minecraft is kinda weird in that regard though it needs a more even mix of CPU and GPU, if you really want to max performance get the highest clocked dual core or higher you can get, like my 2.2ghz quad core doesn't perform super well, i get 60 fps on every view setting except far, on far it can bounce up and down a bit, a 3.0 ghz would be vastly superior.
As for GPU, Minecraft isn't 'super high' on the GPU list, but it does need a relatively modern card, anything in the 100 dollar range would probably run the game fairly well with a high enough clocked CPU, the game just seems to bounce between performances levels as Notch screws with it. RAM can be a big bottleneck too, if you have atleast 3 GB you likely won't get any more performance higher then that with this game.
Well I'm hoping when ever my 4gb DDR3 arrives (****...if it EVER arrives!) that I'll be able to run it much more smoothly. My GPU seems up to date, and I've got a speedy little dual core, so hopefully this will eliminate my Minecraft bottleneck.
If not it's back to square one.
"The main disadvantage of 64-bit architectures is that relative to 32-bit architectures, the same data occupies more space in memory (due to swollen pointers and possibly other types and alignment padding). This increases the memory requirements of a given process and can have implications for efficient processor cache utilization"
"Converting application software written in a high-level language from a 32-bit architecture to a 64-bit architecture varies in difficulty"
source
"Running some 32 bit applications on a 64 bit OS could actually be slower. The additional overheads in running 32 bit software in 64 bit mode could cause a slight degradation in performance. It will take some time for 64 bit software to become the norm." source
The point I was trying to make was that moving to 64bit in an application might make things a bit faster, it's that for minecraft it's not worth the effort at this time. And that the main reason for moving to 64bit is to make use of the larger address space for dealing with things like more then 4gb of ram or files.
Yes Notch could stop what he is doing and rewrite minecraft to take every advantage of a 64bit architecture as possible and we might see a few fps better performance.
Notch could continue to spend his time improving the logic in the game and make great improvements in performance. A good example of this is the leaf decay issues in the beta release. Some misbehaving code bogs the whole game down.
If minecraft was a mature application that had already been optimized logically as best as possible, then moving to a 64bit realm may be the last place to go to squeeze out that extra bit of performance, but there is a lot of effort in that and in most cases the effort isn't worth the gain. Plus you still would need to support 32bit systems as a lot of windows users are still running 32bit.
Dear god...
As far as every test I can find (yes benchmarks, not something you copied from wikipedia) running 32-bit software on 64-bit hardware is still faster - not that benchmark tests mean anything to you kids on the forums.
Even if it wasn't it wouldn't pertain to me because all the software I'm using is 64-bit minus a few applications. The one's that aren't, I honestly don't notice a thing, nor do I even care enough to think about it.
I never proposed at any point that Notch should totally drop everything he's doing and immediately start coding the game for 64-bit, so I have no idea where you came up with that. Something to think about for the future? Yes.