Back before enchanting, potions, and all the magical parts of minecraft I wanted it to be a more industrial/scientific game. Now after they have added npc's, potions, enchanting, etc. I've come to a new conclusion.
I think that when you have started your basic game with a mine, house and all the basic components you should have to make a choice about the future of your game. You could go in two directions, magical or industrial.
New things would be added to the game like electric armor and tools, but you would need powerful machines to make them (similar to industrial craft). If you started your game by making things like xp farms, brewing stands, and enchantment tables then you wouldn't need to make industrial things because you would already have good magical things. If you started your game by making advanced machines and electric armor/tools you wouldn't need magical things because you would already have industrial things that were just as good. They key is to be balanced though.
TLDR
I think that minecraft should have two paths, magical and industrial. You would choose either build things like advanced machines or xp farms, brewing stands, and enchanting tables.
Soon I, and all of my creeper brethren, shall fully realize the power of magic. For what are pistons, and redstone and your pitiful contraptions, against the full power of the Arcane Arts! *Cue maniacal laughter."
Some of the final products I'm thinking about are electric tools and armor (drills, chainsaws etc.), tiers of electric swords, and probably one long range weapon (can't really think of any ideas but nothing too powerful like sniper rifles). You would have to build up to all these things by producing different machines and sources of power. If your interested then look up the industrial craft mod or the buildcraft mod, those are really good examples, but they take it to an extreme.
Here's a link to industrial craft 2, this mod takes my idea to an extreme.
And why exactly should magic and science be opposites? In the majority of fantasies the two are used together, why? Because that makes sense, if you have two methods of doing the same thing then the smart thing to do would be to combine them together. So, you'd use technomancy.
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No, there has never, ever been a sandbox game with a story or ending... except Grand Theft Auto... and Saints Row... and Red Dead Redemption... and Crack Down... and Assassins Creed...
I see what your saying IRC HACKER, but the idea is industrial things would be harder to enchant. Here's an example, if you made a handle out of steel/iron then it would be harder to enchant then something like a blaze rod. If you built a industrial thing you couldn't enchant it nearly as well, although you could still enchant it.
I see what your saying IRC HACKER, but the idea is industrial things would be harder to enchant. Here's an example, if you made a handle out of steel/iron then it would be harder to enchant then something like a blaze rod. If you built a industrial thing you couldn't enchant it nearly as well, although you could still enchant it.
And why couldn't you enchant it? Apart from the dumb logic of "Derr maj1c&syence r oposits" there's no logical reason for it to work that way.
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No, there has never, ever been a sandbox game with a story or ending... except Grand Theft Auto... and Saints Row... and Red Dead Redemption... and Crack Down... and Assassins Creed...
If anything, Minecraft shouldn't go in the direction of Industrial Craft. Electricity, nuclear reactors, nano swords, and mining lasers don't fit the game in my opinion. It should go towards the Better than Wolves direction, automation that fits into the style of Minecraft, and also blends the magic and industry sides of Minecraft.
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Minecraft makes me feel like I'm three. Playing with blocks and afraid of the dark.
Perhaps the magic side should start out like vanilla Minecraft's magical items, progressing to things like Thaumcraft and that one mod that lets you draw dust patterns with different effects. (can't remember its name) The technological side should start like Better Than Wolves, with higher level tech being something along the lines of Buildcraft, Computercraft, and Red Power. Both extra vanilla dimensions are available no matter which side you choose, and technological equipment grants you access to space or the moon.
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If anyone wants to port/remake this, feel free to do that! Or don't. It's up to you, really.
And why couldn't you enchant it? Apart from the dumb logic of "Derr maj1c&syence r oposits" there's no logical reason for it to work that way.
You can enchant industrial things, they're just less powerful when you enchant them because it would keep it balanced. Un-enchanted industrial things are better than un-enchanted magical things, but when you enchant magical things they become really good. If you could enchant industrial things as much as you could magical things then it would be un-balanced because industrial things would be twice as good (having both the good parts of industrial and magical).
Perhaps the magic side should start out like vanilla Minecraft's magical items, progressing to things like Thaumcraft and that one mod that lets you draw dust patterns with different effects. (can't remember its name) The technological side should start like Better Than Wolves, with higher level tech being something along the lines of Buildcraft, Computercraft, and Red Power. Both extra vanilla dimensions are available no matter which side you choose, and technological equipment grants you access to space or the moon.
If anything, Minecraft shouldn't go in the direction of Industrial Craft. Electricity, nuclear reactors, nano swords, and mining lasers don't fit the game in my opinion. It should go towards the Better than Wolves direction, automation that fits into the style of Minecraft, and also blends the magic and industry sides of Minecraft.
I see what you are saying, I had never actually heard of the better than wolves mod when I posted this. What I meant when I said industrial craft though was to head in the direction of industrial craft instead of actually add the exact content of it. Industrial/build-craft take this idea to an extreme, the better than wolves mod is much closer to what I actually mean by "industrial/scientific" things. Thanks, this is a much better example.
You can enchant industrial things, they're just less powerful when you enchant them because it would keep it balanced. Un-enchanted industrial things are better than un-enchanted magical things, but when you enchant magical things they become really good. If you could enchant industrial things as much as you could magical things then it would be un-balanced because industrial things would be twice as good (having both the good parts of industrial and magical).
You've completely missed the point. My question is: why are magic and industry two different 'paths'? It just doesn't make sense to so rigidly seperate them like people are suggesting, when any logical person would tell you to use them in tandem.
Also, your statement about enchantments makes no sense, as an unenchanted magical item is an industrial item
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No, there has never, ever been a sandbox game with a story or ending... except Grand Theft Auto... and Saints Row... and Red Dead Redemption... and Crack Down... and Assassins Creed...
You've completely missed the point. My question is: why are magic and industry two different 'paths'? It just doesn't make sense to so rigidly seperate them like people are suggesting, when any logical person would tell you to use them in tandem.
Also, your statement about enchantments makes no sense, as an unenchanted magical item is an industrial item
Keeping magic and science different paths keeps you trying new combinations, it makes it so there are more outcomes than one. If I could max enchant the best industrial item then that would be all I wanted for the rest of my game because nothing could possibly be better. An unenchanted magical item is technically an industrial item, but certain items would be better for enchanting than others. If I make a pick that has tons of potential for enchantment and magic then I call it a magical item even when the magic's not in it yet. When you make something like an electric drill then you call it an industrial item originally because it doesn't have as much potential for enchantment.
If you think about it, Minecraft's "industry" is just magic. Pulling a switch in real life does not activate the electric circuit in and of itself. It requires electricity from a source, and then pulling the switch connects the circuit.
Redstone is powered by kinetic energy, so it's clearly magical. In addition, redstone can be added to potions, making it even more magical. (would you want to drink an electric cable? No. Magic dust? sure!)
Water is highly magical in Minecraft (a self-replicating, static source of liquid? Reeks of magic!), and is the other main component of "industry" besides redstone. It's also magical in nature.
So the whole argument is flawed, because Minecraft is magical, not industrial. It's "technology" is just disguised magic.
@23232323: Excellent statements, sir. Why is it that you can have the +4 flaming demon-bane sword, but you can't have the +4 flaming demon-bane chainsaw? It never makes sense.
If you think about it, Minecraft's "industry" is just magic. Pulling a switch in real life does not activate the electric circuit in and of itself. It requires electricity from a source, and then pulling the switch connects the circuit.
Redstone is powered by kinetic energy, so it's clearly magical. In addition, redstone can be added to potions, making it even more magical. (would you want to drink an electric cable? No. Magic dust? sure!)
Water is highly magical in Minecraft (a self-replicating, static source of liquid? Reeks of magic!), and is the other main component of "industry" besides redstone. It's also magical in nature.
So the whole argument is flawed, because Minecraft is magical, not industrial. It's "technology" is just disguised magic.
@23232323: Excellent statements, sir. Why is it that you can have the +4 flaming demon-bane sword, but you can't have the +4 flaming demon-bane chainsaw? It never makes sense.
Why thank you, and yes, this pretty much sums up why rigidly separating magic and industry doesn't make sense.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
No, there has never, ever been a sandbox game with a story or ending... except Grand Theft Auto... and Saints Row... and Red Dead Redemption... and Crack Down... and Assassins Creed...
Why thank you, and yes, this pretty much sums up why rigidly separating magic and industry doesn't make sense.
The point of keeping magic and industry on different paths is to keep them balanced. You are both thinking of industry and magic in minecraft completely literally. I'm saying add industry on top of minecrafts laws right now, of course the industry will have magic because it's not completely realistic. When I say magic I mean the magic that you build up to like enchanting and xp; magic like redstone not connecting to the source but being powered anyway is in the original laws of minecraft; sure you are using magic to create industrial things but all I'm saying is to add more industrial things (or by your logic industrial/magical things).
Did you forget to read this? It clearly explains why magic and industry have to be on different paths. If I could max enchant a chainsaw then that would be the only tool of that type I would want to use for the rest of the game. You need to keep trying new combinations of tools otherwise the game wouldn't be nearly as fun.
Keeping magic and science different paths keeps you trying new combinations, it makes it so there are more outcomes than one. If I could max enchant the best industrial item then that would be all I wanted for the rest of my game because nothing could possibly be better. An unenchanted magical item is technically an industrial item, but certain items would be better for enchanting than others. If I make a pick that has tons of potential for enchantment and magic then I call it a magical item even when the magic's not in it yet. When you make something like an electric drill then you call it an industrial item originally because it doesn't have as much potential for enchantment.
I think that when you have started your basic game with a mine, house and all the basic components you should have to make a choice about the future of your game. You could go in two directions, magical or industrial.
New things would be added to the game like electric armor and tools, but you would need powerful machines to make them (similar to industrial craft). If you started your game by making things like xp farms, brewing stands, and enchantment tables then you wouldn't need to make industrial things because you would already have good magical things. If you started your game by making advanced machines and electric armor/tools you wouldn't need magical things because you would already have industrial things that were just as good. They key is to be balanced though.
TLDR
I think that minecraft should have two paths, magical and industrial. You would choose either build things like advanced machines or xp farms, brewing stands, and enchanting tables.
Possibly a good idea, but not nearly specific enough for me to decide on supporting or not.
Here's a link to industrial craft 2, this mod takes my idea to an extreme.
http://wiki.industrial-craft.net/index.php?title=Recipes_and_Resources
Thanks for the comments.
And why couldn't you enchant it? Apart from the dumb logic of "Derr maj1c&syence r oposits" there's no logical reason for it to work that way.
If anyone wants to port/remake this, feel free to do that! Or don't. It's up to you, really.
Oh wait! There is!
You can enchant industrial things, they're just less powerful when you enchant them because it would keep it balanced. Un-enchanted industrial things are better than un-enchanted magical things, but when you enchant magical things they become really good. If you could enchant industrial things as much as you could magical things then it would be un-balanced because industrial things would be twice as good (having both the good parts of industrial and magical).
That's a great idea, thanks.
I see what you are saying, I had never actually heard of the better than wolves mod when I posted this. What I meant when I said industrial craft though was to head in the direction of industrial craft instead of actually add the exact content of it. Industrial/build-craft take this idea to an extreme, the better than wolves mod is much closer to what I actually mean by "industrial/scientific" things. Thanks, this is a much better example.
You've completely missed the point. My question is: why are magic and industry two different 'paths'? It just doesn't make sense to so rigidly seperate them like people are suggesting, when any logical person would tell you to use them in tandem.
Also, your statement about enchantments makes no sense, as an unenchanted magical item is an industrial item
Keeping magic and science different paths keeps you trying new combinations, it makes it so there are more outcomes than one. If I could max enchant the best industrial item then that would be all I wanted for the rest of my game because nothing could possibly be better. An unenchanted magical item is technically an industrial item, but certain items would be better for enchanting than others. If I make a pick that has tons of potential for enchantment and magic then I call it a magical item even when the magic's not in it yet. When you make something like an electric drill then you call it an industrial item originally because it doesn't have as much potential for enchantment.
Not everyone wants Tekkit in vanilla.
Just download Tekkit.
But this is very much scaled down from tekkit just like they added enchanting and not the whole EE mod.
Redstone is powered by kinetic energy, so it's clearly magical. In addition, redstone can be added to potions, making it even more magical. (would you want to drink an electric cable? No. Magic dust? sure!)
Water is highly magical in Minecraft (a self-replicating, static source of liquid? Reeks of magic!), and is the other main component of "industry" besides redstone. It's also magical in nature.
So the whole argument is flawed, because Minecraft is magical, not industrial. It's "technology" is just disguised magic.
@23232323: Excellent statements, sir. Why is it that you can have the +4 flaming demon-bane sword, but you can't have the +4 flaming demon-bane chainsaw? It never makes sense.
Why thank you, and yes, this pretty much sums up why rigidly separating magic and industry doesn't make sense.
The point of keeping magic and industry on different paths is to keep them balanced. You are both thinking of industry and magic in minecraft completely literally. I'm saying add industry on top of minecrafts laws right now, of course the industry will have magic because it's not completely realistic. When I say magic I mean the magic that you build up to like enchanting and xp; magic like redstone not connecting to the source but being powered anyway is in the original laws of minecraft; sure you are using magic to create industrial things but all I'm saying is to add more industrial things (or by your logic industrial/magical things).
Did you forget to read this? It clearly explains why magic and industry have to be on different paths. If I could max enchant a chainsaw then that would be the only tool of that type I would want to use for the rest of the game. You need to keep trying new combinations of tools otherwise the game wouldn't be nearly as fun.
Keeping magic and science different paths keeps you trying new combinations, it makes it so there are more outcomes than one. If I could max enchant the best industrial item then that would be all I wanted for the rest of my game because nothing could possibly be better. An unenchanted magical item is technically an industrial item, but certain items would be better for enchanting than others. If I make a pick that has tons of potential for enchantment and magic then I call it a magical item even when the magic's not in it yet. When you make something like an electric drill then you call it an industrial item originally because it doesn't have as much potential for enchantment.